# Grand Prix of Spain****SPOILER****



## berford (Sep 10, 2002)

I guess it's time to think about following the events at Circuit de Catalunya, Barcelona, Spain, now that the San Marino issues are resolved.

Word has it that Lucky Strike will not figure prominently in the on-track advertising, but does anyone know if 20 machines will be on the track?


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## WILLIA///M (Apr 15, 2002)

I thought I had read that if BAR had gotten the full year ban Bernie said that the other teams would not be expected to field extra cars to get to 20 so I'd assume it's the same with the 2 race ban and they'll run with 18. Haven't read that confirmed anywhere though.


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## F1Crazy (Dec 11, 2002)

Who cares about BAR, I wanna know if Ferrari can beat Renault? Is McLaren for real?


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

Alexander Wurz sent Montoya a text message yesterday and asked him to go and get his 3rd place trophy from San Marino (from BAR Honda).  

A Finnish reporter asked Räikkönen if he thinks that he is out of the fight for the driver's championship. Kimi said no, many races left and so on. The reporter then asked if someone should ask Alonso to play tennis and hope that he also gets injured for a few races (as a joke). Kimi suggested instead that Alonso try motocross riding ... :eeps: 


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

Not a good start for Williams. Valve train problems (new engines for both cars) mean that Heidfeld's qualifying position will drop 10 places. Webber is not even able to drive today, and he will not drop down the grid. Webber was getting a new engine for this race anyway.

The new engines will not be delivered to Barcelona until tomorrow morning.


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## F1Crazy (Dec 11, 2002)

Button and his hottie fiancee have apparently broken up. This is what I call the news! :bigpimp: 
Even better is the story that Jenson was on a wild night out last Saturday with DC, the last playboy in F1.

Who wants to get in line?


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## F1Crazy (Dec 11, 2002)

Patrick, I just read that JPM crashed heavily, hear anything?


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

Yes, it was a major shunt. The car is completely ruined, but Montoya was able to walk away. It came at the end of the second practice session.

I will see the video in about an hour.

I think that Ron should let de la Rosa drive the race - just look at his times for today.

BTW, speaking of ex-GFs, Alonso is having trouble with his! She is stalking him and won't leave him alone.  


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## berford (Sep 10, 2002)

Patrick said:


> I think that Ron should let de la Rosa drive the race - just look at his times for today.
> 
> BTW, speaking of ex-GFs, Alonso is having trouble with his! She is stalking him and won't leave him alone.
> 
> .


Yup.

and

What do you suppose the renewed interest might be? :doh:


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## F1Crazy (Dec 11, 2002)

Patrick said:


> Yes, it was a major shunt. The car is completely ruined, but Montoya was able to walk away. It came at the end of the second practice session.
> 
> I will see the video in about an hour.
> 
> ...


My DVR recorded the practice up to the point where you see JPM's car destroyed with the right rear side completely ripped apart and Montoya still inside. I have no clue what part of the track it was but it must've been some fast bend to do so much damage. I hope he's OK.

De La Rosa did OK so did Wurz but I don't think either one is as quick as Montoya. JPM has to get his focus back. He had too many distractions lately, changing teams, marriage, fatherhood and this stupid injury, it doesn't help. He looked like a future champion but now I'm not so sure, he has to mature and put it together. There are only 3 drivers I see as winning championship in near future and it's Schumacher, Alonso and Kimi, not necessarily in that order.


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

de la Rosa was on fire in Bahrain. 

This is his home Grand Prix. 

Montoya has been out (for whatever reason you like best), and was slow today. 

McLaren needs constructor points.

Seems pretty simple to me!


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## berford (Sep 10, 2002)

For the US contingent, please note that the race *will not be on SPEED channel this weekend.* It will aire at 11:30 Central time Sunday. Set your taping accordingly, if need be.


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

Hmmm. Montoya injured his right arm/hand in the crash.

No info on how bad.

Pedro?


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## berford (Sep 10, 2002)

Patrick said:


> Hmmm. Montoya injured his right arm/hand in the crash.
> 
> No info on how bad.
> 
> ...


It was reported here that he lost in on corner 13, which is a wide expanse. It was said that he was examined and found to be fine.

Edit...elsewhere it was reported as turn 9, which is a bit more understandable.


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## Mr. E (Dec 19, 2001)

berford said:


> For the US contingent, please note that the race *will not be on SPEED channel this weekend.* It will aire at 11:30 Central time Sunday. Set your taping accordingly, if need be.


(on CBS).



F1Crazy said:


> My DVR recorded the practice up to the point where you see JPM's car destroyed with the right rear side completely ripped apart and Montoya still inside.


:stupid:
Judging by the damage I saw expect he'll need a new car AND a new engine. Will that drop him ten places down the grid, or are there "extenuating circumstances" in the one engine clause? Man, this one engine rule is completely :jack:


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## mrbelk (Dec 5, 2003)

I think that if you start the weekend with a particular powerplant and you change it for whatever reason, you lose 10 spots. That's why Webber didn't run today. BMW is shipping 2 new motors and if Webber (who was due for a new motor this week anyway) had started with his "old" new motor and subsequently changed to his "new" new motor, he would have had a 10 spot penalty.

Even last year, with the one engine per one weekend rule, _any_ engine change dropped you 10 places on the grid. If you crashed in practice and your car was sufficiently beat up that you had to run the "spare" car, that meant that effectively you changed engines and lost 10 spots; unless they were able to "transplant" the old engine into the spare car.

Happened to Ralf S. at Monaco last year. He qualified on the pole, but lost 10 spots due to an engine change in practice (not from a wreck, though).

-MrB


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## berford (Sep 10, 2002)

Mr. E said:


> (on CBS).
> 
> :stupid:
> Judging by the damage I saw expect he'll need a new car AND a new engine. Will that drop him ten places down the grid, or are there "extenuating circumstances" in the one engine clause? Man, this one engine rule is completely :jack:


Yes, CBS. Sorry I left out that information.

Nobody knows for sure...every question has to be decided at court in Paris. In all seriousness, though, if you have entered any practice session, that engine must be used throughout the event or there is a 10 grid position penalty. So, yes, if the engine has to be changed, he goes down ten places from his qualifying speed.


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## WILLIA///M (Apr 15, 2002)

Better pace than I expected from the Williams boys in Q1. 2 tenths back, not bad. Webber needs to get a good race in now with what looks like will probably be a third row start. Perhaps he was overhyped coming in but he looks kind of average during the races so far IMO.


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

Damn, that was tight! :thumbup: 

Way to go TOYOTA!

Lets see how it works out tomorrow for the second qualifying, but there is nothing between P1 and P4. I like it!


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## AC (Apr 28, 2002)

So many lost their time in the last sector....anyone want to venture guesses as to why that was?


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

:thumbup: Kimi!


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

I am trying to figure out my bets for the F1 Super Double (P1 and P2).

Any thoughts?  

Betting is open for another 1.5 hours.

Alonso - Räikkönen
Räikkönen - Alonso
Alonso - Trulli
Alonso - Spoonface

:dunno: 


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

Way to go Minardi ...  

I have no clue why they (FIA) even let them race. Friesacher was 11.38 seconds off Kimi's qualifying pace.


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## bob lindquist (Jul 6, 2002)

F1Crazy said:


> My DVR recorded the practice up to the point where you see JPM's car destroyed with the right rear side completely ripped apart and Montoya still inside. I have no clue what part of the track it was but it must've been some fast bend to do so much damage. I hope he's OK.
> 
> .


I had the same recorder problem. Now I record the program following the race also incase the broadcast runs over. Hope that helps.


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

Question: HOW long will Kimi's McLaren last? :dunno: 

Maybe 10 laps?  


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## bob lindquist (Jul 6, 2002)

berford said:


> For the US contingent, please note that the race *will not be on SPEED channel this weekend.* It will aire at 11:30 Central time Sunday. Set your taping accordingly, if need be.


The quality of my CBS signal for San Marino was real poor. The Ferrari's looked pink. Hope its better this race.

Speedchannel coverage rules. Whats up with this CBS involvement. Like delayed Qual on sunday?


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

bob lindquist said:


> The quality of my CBS signal for San Marino was real poor. The Ferrari's looked pink. Hope its better this race.
> 
> Speedchannel coverage rules. Whats up with this CBS involvement. Like delayed Qual on sunday?


I missed Berford's post on this ... :eeps:

The race is NOT being shown LIVE? WTF? :dunno:

It is already 08:15 EST for crying out loud!

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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

:yikes: 


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

Where the hell is everyone? :dunno: :dunno: 

Once I read Bob's post quoting Berford's about the lack of live coverage in the USA/NA, I have been silent.

I am waiting for you ...  


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## WILLIA///M (Apr 15, 2002)

Total domination by Kimi. Pretty boring race as a result. Webber again put in a lackluster race performance after starting on the front row. Not a good year to be a Williams fan I'm afraid. They appear to be mid pack at best.


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## SteveT (Dec 22, 2001)

I'd question the choice of not having Heidfeld do a qualifying lap. If he gets a top five (maybe a top 2) he's that much further ahead when they put him 10 places back. 

BTW, these engine rules suck.

I'll modify my statement about the tactics, but the engine rule is amazing. Heidfeld would have taken a 20 place drop because of 2 engine changes. How stupid!


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

SteveT said:


> I'll modify my statement about the tactics, but the engine rule is amazing. Heidfeld would have taken a 20 place drop because of 2 engine changes. How stupid!


LOL. There were only 18 cars in the race as well.

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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

WILLIA///M said:


> Total domination by Kimi. Pretty boring race as a result.


I totally agree.

I have no idea what caused this, but it was a yawner at front.

The best racing may have been between the TOYOTA cars.

I am surprised that Alonso made it the full race distance - his rear left tire was shreaded.

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## AC (Apr 28, 2002)

SteveT said:


> I'd question the choice of not having Heidfeld do a qualifying lap. If he gets a top five (maybe a top 2) he's that much further ahead when they put him 10 places back.
> 
> BTW, these engine rules suck.
> 
> I'll modify my statement about the tactics, but the engine rule is amazing. Heidfeld would have taken a 20 place drop because of 2 engine changes. How stupid!


 I agree, I did not get that at all, same with Rubens

and yes these engine rules really suck... and did I mention the tire rules?


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## SteveT (Dec 22, 2001)

AC said:


> I agree, I did not get that at all, same with Rubens
> 
> and yes these engine rules really suck... and did I mention the tire rules?


Right Rubens too. The engine rule though is worse because it's so arbitrary. I can see a one engine per weekend rule, but two weekends? What's it prove?

To make it worse, look at how many teams hardly run at all on Friday. That means if you go to the race, you don't see the cars running very much. I've been saying this for a while because single lap qualifying might be exciting, but you don't see the cars on track enough. Now they are conserving engine life and tire wear. The FIA has gotta do better.


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## F1Crazy (Dec 11, 2002)

The rules as they stand now are stupid and they suck. The engine rule doesn't cut costs at all, most engine builders make few engines anyway and then pick one that looks most reliable. Qualifying is so borig that I don't even bother to watch it live, I just record it and fast forward to the last 5 cars. I don't have anything against one tire per weekend rule but only because I'm for a return of spec tire anyway.


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

As you may recall, that turd Mosley said (at the time that he was ramrodding these rule changes through) that these changes must be made in the name of safety. In his opinion, the cars were too fast.

The fastest lap yesterday (Fisichella) was almost 2 seconds faster than Spoonface's fastest lap last year.

The engine rules suck.

However, I would argue that the tires rules do make things more interesting - and more dangerous.

Rule changes made in the name of safety? No way.


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## AC (Apr 28, 2002)

I think what the tire rule has acccomplished is change the perfomance equasion away from the car to the tire. 
:dunno:


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## AC (Apr 28, 2002)

Patrick said:


> As you may recall, that turd Mosley said (at the time that he was ramrodding these rule changes through) that these changes must be made in the name of safety. In his opinion, the cars were too fast.
> 
> The fastest lap yesterday (Fisichella) was almost 2 seconds faster than Spoonface's fastest lap last year.
> 
> ...


The latest quote I heard from, I can't remember if Mosely or Whiting, when asked about premature wear and the danget of punctures he suggested the teams "slow down"

:eeps:


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

AC said:


> The latest quote I heard from, I can't remember if Mosely or Whiting, when asked about premature wear and the danget of punctures he suggested the teams "slow down"
> 
> :eeps:


 :rofl:

Brilliant. Mosley truly is an enlightened human being.

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