# Another warning for no front plate



## uncle ken (Feb 3, 2007)

Boraxo said:


> If you are law abiding you should have nothing to fear. The front plates are required so that red light cameras can take your photo if you violate the law. Redlight running causes more accidents in the city than just about any other violation.
> 
> I suppose you would have a good argument if you only drive on rural roads. But otherwise - deal with it.
> 
> I don't like these cameras any more than the next person but I like red light runners even less.


Red light cameras have little to do with safety and everything to do with money.
http://www.motorists.org/photoenforce/home/nma-objections-to-photo-enforcement/#prevent

Apologies for the thread drift.

pkr


----------



## Boraxo (Sep 6, 2005)

uncle ken said:


> Red light cameras have little to do with safety and everything to do with money.
> http://www.motorists.org/photoenforce/home/nma-objections-to-photo-enforcement/#prevent
> 
> Apologies for the thread drift.
> ...


No question that the primary motivation for installation is to create additional revenue.

But statistically they do have a measurable effect on red light running and the # of accidents. And that is a good thing, particularly if your BMW is the first one through an intersection after your light turns green.


----------



## Vornado (Feb 20, 2006)

Bombay Jay said:


> So now I know to avoid donut shops in the morning and underpasses when it is raining. I guess the cops have been living under the underpasses in Texas for the last month or so from what I hear.


LOL. Yeah, I've been taking a different route now. I can't even begin to tell you how many corvettes, bmw's and other makes and models i see running around with no front plates. I wonder how many of them get stopped. Or maybe they just go after certain makes.



uncle ken said:


> Red light cameras have little to do with safety and everything to do with money.
> http://www.motorists.org/photoenforce/home/nma-objections-to-photo-enforcement/#prevent
> 
> Apologies for the thread drift.
> ...


Completely agree there. In Shenandoah TX (North of Houston/Spring), the cops do absolutely nothing except sit by the side of the freeway in their dodge chargers and go after speeders all day long. When they finish writing one ticket, they'll go after the next speeder. They have very nice cars, equipment, and a very nice station. It's all about revenue. But that is also one place I always stick to the speed limits going through.


----------



## ProRail (May 31, 2006)

Vornado said:


> LOL. Yeah, I've been taking a different route now. I can't even begin to tell you how many corvettes, bmw's and other makes and models i see running around with no front plates. I wonder how many of them get stopped. Or maybe they just go after certain makes.
> 
> Completely agree there. In Shenandoah TX (North of Houston/Spring), the cops do absolutely nothing except sit by the side of the freeway in their dodge chargers and go after speeders all day long. When they finish writing one ticket, they'll go after the next speeder. They have very nice cars, equipment, and a very nice station. It's all about revenue. But that is also one place I always stick to the speed limits going through.


Absolutely. I'm shocked...SHOCKED..... at the widespread failure of the police to enforce the laws enacted by the designated representatives of the citizens of this country. I'm so glad so many folks on this board share this concern.


----------



## Vornado (Feb 20, 2006)

ProRail said:


> Absolutely. I'm shocked...SHOCKED..... at the widespread failure of the police to enforce the laws enacted by the designated representatives of the citizens of this country. I'm so glad so many folks on this board share this concern.


Dont get me started on the laws that they should be enforcing.


----------



## jman103099 (Jun 10, 2006)

I'm in Illinois... havent had a front plate on my X3 since I got it (8 months) but it is the "law" here. So far, I havent been pulled over. To me, the car looks much better with the dang thing off there. Its worth the ticket.


----------



## uncle ken (Feb 3, 2007)

ProRail said:


> Absolutely. I'm shocked...SHOCKED..... at the widespread failure of the police to enforce the laws enacted by the designated representatives of the citizens of this country. I'm so glad so many folks on this board share this concern.


But mon ami, they ARE enforcing the law - the Law Of Economics!

Shenandoah is a very small place, the courthouse is the biggest structure there. They have relatively low property taxes compared to their neighbors in the Woodlands. Vornado is right: when passing through Shenandoah just get out and push the car, anything faster will get you an 'official greeting'.

ken
Houston


----------



## obmd1 (Jan 17, 2005)

ProRail said:


> Absolutely. I'm shocked...SHOCKED..... at the widespread failure of the police to enforce the laws enacted by the designated representatives of the citizens of this country. I'm so glad so many folks on this board share this concern.


Signed,

The guy in the left lane doing 55


----------



## Hammerwerfer (Aug 8, 2003)

A bit of insurance for those running without front plates in states where they are required might be this: In Mass. I used to go to the Registry of Motor Vehicles and explain that I lost a plate. They would charge me for a new one, and issue a permit that allowed me to drive without a front plate until the new plate arrived. 

I would keep that permit handy in the glove box for when I would get stopped. No problems!


----------



## tlm999 (Feb 8, 2006)

Texas is now making millions by installing red light cameras everywhere. No chance they will let someone get away with no front plate.

I wonder how long before those states that don't require front plates start to realize how much money they are missing out on.


----------



## uncle ken (Feb 3, 2007)

tlm999 said:


> Texas is now making millions by installing red light cameras everywhere. No chance they will let someone get away with no front plate.
> 
> I wonder how long before those states that don't require front plates start to realize how much money they are missing out on.


I don't know why. The red light cameras shoot from behind after the car passes. Red light cameras lower red light transgressions but increase rear end collisions. http://www.miamiherald.com/news/miami_dade/story/287893.html

It's all about money.


----------



## kc5 (Aug 9, 2004)

uncle ken said:


> I don't know why. The red light cameras shoot from behind after the car passes. Red light cameras lower red light transgressions but increase rear end collisions. http://www.miamiherald.com/news/miami_dade/story/287893.html
> 
> It's all about money.


Yep, it is all about the money. It is not about safety. Bastard greedy politicians.


----------



## srecko711 (Jul 17, 2007)

I'm amazed that not displaying a front license plate on a car is so important to many of us. Is it really worth the bother? I know if I am going somewhere and I want to be on time, it is less important to me that my car looks cool than it is to risk being late because a cop stopped me.


----------



## tlm999 (Feb 8, 2006)

uncle ken said:


> I don't know why. The red light cameras shoot from behind after the car passes. Red light cameras lower red light transgressions but increase rear end collisions. http://www.miamiherald.com/news/miami_dade/story/287893.html
> 
> It's all about money.


That's good to know. Chalk this up to another misleading news story on the local news out of Houston. Every picture they showed was of the front end of vehicles shot from cameras across the intersection.

I do agree with the higher rear end accident rate. I've had to nearly lock up my brakes several times because of a light turning yellow when in that questionable 'can I make it?' zone.


----------



## uncle ken (Feb 3, 2007)

srecko711 said:


> I'm amazed that not displaying a front license plate on a car is so important to many of us. Is it really worth the bother? I know if I am going somewhere and I want to be on time, it is less important to me that my car looks cool than it is to risk being late because a cop stopped me.


Speaking personally, it's as much about one more unneeded regulation as it is the car looking cool. There are twenty (20) states with no front plate. To my knowledge this particular group of states has never been shown to have more unsolved bank robberies, etc. just because the getaway cars lack front plates. But then, don't ask me: I'm just another independent SOB from Texas that doesn't enjoy being told what to do by the distant, unelected minions of an overweening nanny-state bureaucracy. I'm prone to tearing tags off mattresses and worse...I drink wine with sulfites and all kinds of other things too delicate to mention here.


----------



## Titanium330 (Dec 30, 2006)

uncle ken said:


> I'm just another independent SOB from Texas that doesn't enjoy being told what to do by the distant, unelected minions of an overweening nanny-state bureaucracy. I'm prone to tearing tags off mattresses and worse...I drink wine with sulfites and all kinds of other things too delicate to mention here.


:thumbup: I hear ya...


----------



## ua549 (Oct 22, 2007)

A front plate is virtually useless since the police only see the posterior of a vehicle making a getaway. There are almost no traffic cameras allowed in Florida and half the drivers do not bother to stop for a red light when turning right - a real issue. In addition there are many counter measures to prevent the photographing of auto tags from any angle.

In Florida a white light is placed on the top of lights in high violation areas so that police can see from 360° if a light is red when a vehicle passes it.


----------



## dihedral (Jun 27, 2007)

Vornado said:


> I'm supposed to be the sarcastic bastard..


Am I supposed to agree or disagree?


----------



## dihedral (Jun 27, 2007)

ua549 said:


> A front plate is virtually useless since the police only see the posterior of a vehicle making a getaway. There are almost no traffic cameras allowed in Florida and half the drivers do not bother to stop for a red light when turning right - a real issue. In addition there are many counter measures to prevent the photographing of auto tags from any angle.
> 
> In Florida a white light is placed on the top of lights in high violation areas so that police can see from 360° if a light is red when a vehicle passes it.


What about the LEO standing at the anterior of the car??


----------



## dihedral (Jun 27, 2007)

uncle ken said:


> Speaking personally, it's as much about one more unneeded regulation as it is the car looking cool. There are twenty (20) states with no front plate. To my knowledge this particular group of states has never been shown to have more unsolved bank robberies, etc. just because the getaway cars lack front plates. But then, don't ask me: I'm just another independent SOB from Texas that doesn't enjoy being told what to do by the distant, unelected minions of an overweening nanny-state bureaucracy. I'm prone to tearing tags off mattresses and worse...I drink wine with sulfites and all kinds of other things too delicate to mention here.


Do what others do:

1. Leave front tag off.
2. Explain to children that they do not need to adhere to laws that they do not like.

Problem solved. New generation can then change laws if they like or dislike them.


----------



## uncle ken (Feb 3, 2007)

dihedral said:


> Do what others do:
> 
> 1. Leave front tag off.
> 2. Explain to children that they do not need to adhere to laws that they do not like.
> ...


For those who have not been there, Arkansas is one of the twenty enlightened states with no front plate. I have travelled the beautiful highways of AR many times, and have yet to see large piles of dead motorists beside the roadway as a result of this oversight.

I explained to my children that they should use their common sense, and be responsible for their actions, and the next time they saw a sign saying "Walking On Grass Forbidden" - ask themselves how the sign got there.


----------



## Andrew*Debbie (Jul 2, 2004)

Vornado said:


> I'm supposed to be the sarcastic bastard..


Move to Georgia. The only front tag you are likely to see here is the old state flag.


----------



## obmd1 (Jan 17, 2005)

dihedral said:


> Do what others do:
> 
> 1. Leave front tag off.
> 2. Explain to children that they do not need to adhere to laws that they do not like.
> ...


"Daddy, why is everyone honking at us....?"
"Because we're driving the speed limit, sweetheart."

Next time you drive 30 in a 25, remind me how important it is to be law abiding. puhleeeze


----------



## ua549 (Oct 22, 2007)

dihedral said:


> What about the LEO standing at the anterior of the car??


That is what switchable, polarized LED tag covers are for.

However, I never let a LEO get close to my car, let alone stand behind it.

I drive at a safe speed, not necessarily the legal speed, all the time.


----------



## boriska00 (Sep 24, 2006)

rkx3: 

I used to live in Milwaukee for a long time. As far as I remember, WI does not require front plates. IL does, but Chicago area cops have other things to worry about


----------



## tsg59_steve (Aug 14, 2007)

I've gotten a warning for no front plate, never pulled over for it though. I was going through an alcohol check-point and they pulled me over because I had accidently left my current insurance card at home. Decided to slap the warning on there as well.


----------



## spoolin spec v (Nov 3, 2007)

In Missouri we have a front license plate law. It kinda sucks, we live in a city about 30-45 min north of K.C. so we are in a small town, in the country, so if you get pulled over once with out it, the next time, you will get a ticket.

I have had a few of them in my red car. They are more of an annoyance than anything else.


----------



## Nordic_Kat (Aug 5, 2009)

Vornado said:


> My office is literally 30 seconds from the freeway service road, and I usually do a u-turn through the underpass to get to the other side of the freeway where my office is. Well, as soon as I pull under I see 2 police cars with their lights flashing (mind you, it's pouring rain this whole time).


Where was this? I-10, I-45 or US-59? I'm running without my front plate as well. Need to know where the LEO's are lurking. BF never put the front plate on his car (2001) and has never been stopped for it.


----------



## happyparrot (Aug 26, 2007)

I was pulled over for no front plate in my driveway. It was 3am, and the cop raced through the neighborhood to pull me over. This happened while I was backing into my garage. 

I didn't get a ticket or anything... but I had to wait in my driveway for 5 minutes while he checked everything out.


----------



## Nordic_Kat (Aug 5, 2009)

Nordic_Kat said:


> Where was this? I-10, I-45 or US-59? I'm running without my front plate as well. Need to know where the LEO's are lurking. BF never put the front plate on his car (2001) and has never been stopped for it.





Vornado said:


> Completely agree there. In Shenandoah TX (North of Houston/Spring), the cops do absolutely nothing except sit by the side of the freeway in their dodge chargers and go after speeders all day long. When they finish writing one ticket, they'll go after the next speeder. They have very nice cars, equipment, and a very nice station. It's all about revenue. But that is also one place I always stick to the speed limits going through.


Asked and Answered???? 
looks like West Houston is a little more immune.


----------



## z06bigbird (Aug 25, 2008)

Vornado said:


> Here I was, driving to work.. running a little late but I was checking my speed to make sure I wouldn't draw any attention from Johnny Law. I passed several cruisers through town, even saw one in the speedy stop where I get my breakfast taco's, nodded hello and went on my way. My office is literally 30 seconds from the freeway service road, and I usually do a u-turn through the underpass to get to the other side of the freeway where my office is. Well, as soon as I pull under I see 2 police cars with their lights flashing (mind you, it's pouring rain this whole time).
> 
> I figure they pulled someone over, so I proceed to go around. One officer is out directing people around, and starts to direct me around when he looks at the front of my car and motions me to pull over. So I do so, sitting very calm and relaxed and hand him my license & insurance. He looks them over and mentions that the reason he stopped me was because I have no front plate. I agree with him and jokingly mention that my boss was just pulled over for this very thing 2 nights ago in his 335i by the DPS. He wasn't mean, but said he was just warning me about it. So he ran my license to see if i had any warrants & came back, handed it back to me and told me they were just sitting under there because it was raining like hell, told me to drive safe and sent me on my way.
> 
> Now, I'm normally a law-abiding citizen, but I think this front license plate law is just absurd. I've been driving around without one for 2 years, and in the last 6 months i've been stopped 3 times (including today) for this very thing. I'm just about to the point to where I'm going to put the plate on just to stop them from pulling me over for that very reason.  I've never gotten a ticket, but I don't want to get a warning from the same officer twice, you know? :tsk:


Write your congressman. Besides, he needs something to do while he is at Levinworth.


----------



## 87vert (May 15, 2008)

move to a state where it is not needed....


----------



## spydrz (Oct 1, 2004)

That's why my car is registered in South Cackalacky.


----------



## BarrowJon (Apr 13, 2002)

While living in Illinois, stopped first time got a warning, second time received a $50 ticket. Then started carrying my front plate under driver's seat, whenever I was being pulled over would reach under seat and throw plate on the dash. In one occasion, when officer walked up to my door, saw the plate, he just said go ahead, nothing more. Whenever asked why plate was not mounted, would merely say that I have a new plate holder on order, which has not come in yet.


----------



## 87vert (May 15, 2008)

BarrowJon said:


> While living in Illinois, stopped first time got a warning, second time received a $50 ticket. Then started carrying my front plate under driver's seat, whenever I was being pulled over would reach under seat and throw plate on the dash. In one occasion, when officer walked up to my door, saw the plate, he just said go ahead, nothing more. Whenever asked why plate was not mounted, would merely say that I have a new plate holder on order, which has not come in yet.


reaching under the seat when getting pulled over is not really the best thing to do. Cop could think you are reaching for a weapon.


----------



## bmw3302001 (Jun 28, 2004)

thats why i love Pennsylvania no front plate needed


----------



## ProRail (May 31, 2006)

For those who are so opposed to front plates, ther ARE things you can do. You can phone and write your representatives and explain why you feel there is no justification for the front-plate requirement. You can also point out that it costs money and resources to enforce this (to the extent it's being enfoerced) and it costs money to make the extra plates. Perhaps someone in your state legislature will accept your arguments and propose a change in the law. After the initial expense of getting a repeal passed, your state will probably save money (beginning around 2020.)


----------



## ProRail (May 31, 2006)

obmd1 said:


> Signed,
> 
> The guy in the left lane doing 55


Nope. I only use the left lane while paaing.


----------



## vern (Apr 19, 2002)

ProRail said:


> For those who are so opposed to front plates, ther ARE things you can do. You can phone and write your representatives and explain why you feel there is no justification for the front-plate requirement. You can also point out that it costs money and resources to enforce this (to the extent it's being enfoerced) and it costs money to make the extra plates. Perhaps someone in your state legislature will accept your arguments and propose a change in the law. After the initial expense of getting a repeal passed, your state will probably save money (beginning around 2020.)


Do a search, this was posted about no front plate in NJ
cheers
vern


----------



## docedkin (Apr 21, 2009)

NYS Trooper friend of mine suggested that leaving the front plate off not only keeps the lines of car cleaner, it also gives an LEO a good ticket to write instead of the 15 over you actually earned. A couple of Vet owners I know have actually experienced this benefit.


----------

