# Phoenix International Raceway -- Oct 9-10



## SergioK (Aug 14, 2002)

The Roadrunner Chapter  is holding a driving school at Phoenix International Raceway on Oct 9 & 10. The track is 1.5 miles long, with 11 turns and should be pretty cool since with such a short course, each session should provide for quite a few laps. Anyone here going?? :dunno:


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## Stuka (Jul 17, 2002)

Me me me!!! :bigpimp: 

And this time, I really AM going to take the 325is. :thumbup: 

Something about striking the iron when hot... And yes Hack, I am actually going to drive a track what has an oval section.  

Let's see, this year I got:

03/04 Sears Point
04/04 Button Willow
05/04 Vegas
06/04 Button Willow
08/04 Thunder Hill
09/04 Button Willow
10/04 Phoenix
11/04 Sears Point

So, who else is going? :drive:


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## doeboy (Sep 20, 2002)

Wow man... 8 in a year.... :yikes:

and I thought 6 in a year was a lot... :eeps:

I don't think I'm going to this one.


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## SergioK (Aug 14, 2002)

doeboy said:


> I don't think I'm going to this one.


See, that's your problem, you're thinking about it. Don't think, just do it! :thumbup:


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## doeboy (Sep 20, 2002)

SergioK said:


> See, that's your problem, you're thinking about it. Don't think, just do it! :thumbup:


Can't.


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## Stuka (Jul 17, 2002)

The application has been dropped in the mail. :banana: :drive:


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## Raffi (May 18, 2002)

:eeps: :eeps: Tempting... :eeps: :eeps: 400 miles door-to-door.... :yikes:

So if I leave at 3:30 from work, I should be there by 10:30... :eeps:


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## Raffi (May 18, 2002)

Sergio, who do I e-mail to volunteer?


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## SergioK (Aug 14, 2002)

Raffi said:


> Sergio, who do I e-mail to volunteer?


Bill Bentzen... I'll email you his email addy.


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## Raffi (May 18, 2002)

SergioK said:


> Bill Bentzen... I'll email you his email addy.


 Done! :banana:


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## Raffi (May 18, 2002)

Here's the current tally:

Yours truly
Stuka
SergioK
liuk3

Who else is going? Interlocker? Lee? Ralph? Any AZ festers going?


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## Interlocker (Jun 27, 2003)

Raffi said:


> Here's the current tally:
> 
> Who else is going? Interlocker? Lee? Ralph? Any AZ festers going?


No can do for me. I was about to send in my confirmation that I would go, but then I got an invite to share a car in the 3-hour enduro going on at Buttonwillow that weekend. 

I'm willing to bet Lee's stuck working, but I think he really needs to get his priorities straight. 

Interlock!
http://www.x-rep.com
Dedicated to Your Physical Transformation


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## SergioK (Aug 14, 2002)

Interlocker said:


> ...I got an invite to share a car in the 3-hour enduro going on at Buttonwillow that weekend.


Well, if you really are dead set on driving at Phoenix, I can always give up my spot and take yours at BW that weekend.  :angel:



Interlocker said:


> I'm willing to bet Lee's stuck working, but I think he really needs to get his priorities straight.


 Agreed!


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## Raffi (May 18, 2002)

Interlocker said:


> I'm willing to bet Lee's stuck working, but I think he really needs to get his priorities straight.


 I'll be working too, but I'll get to work at 7 a.m. so I can leave around 3.


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## Stuka (Jul 17, 2002)

Raffi said:


> I'll be working too, but I'll get to work at 7 a.m. so I can leave around 3.


Now that the air conditioning is fixed in my 325is, I am taking it to PIR. I am going to beed to draft one of you guys' more aerodynamically sound E46's to be able to keep up. :thumbup:

Oh, did I mention the CD player is in too? Blasting Rammstein in the 325is while trying to keep up with the rest of the yellow shirt gang. :eeps:


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## liuk3 (May 3, 2004)

I told my boss that I would try to get off around 1PM. I''m gonna try to get out of town before the l.a. rush hour traffic that friday. 

Ken


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## Raffi (May 18, 2002)

Stuka said:


> Now that the air conditioning is fixed in my 325is, I am taking it to PIR. I am going to beed to draft one of you guys' more aerodynamically sound E46's to be able to keep up. :thumbup:
> 
> Oh, did I mention the CD player is in too? Blasting Rammstein in the 325is while trying to keep up with the rest of the yellow shirt gang. :eeps:


 :bustingup Drafting SCTS style!


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## Lee (Aug 27, 2003)

Interlocker said:


> I'm willing to bet Lee's stuck working, but I think he really needs to get his priorities straight.


Yeah--work's been kicking my azz lately. Not sure if I'll have to work that weekend though, things seem to be settling down.

Either way, no PIR for me. More likely I'll make a quick trip to Buttonwillow to watch Interlocker lap the field. That, or do the million things that have accumulated around the house.

Party on,
Lee


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## Interlocker (Jun 27, 2003)

Lee said:


> Either way, no PIR for me. More likely I'll make a quick trip to Buttonwillow to watch Interlocker lap the field. That, or do the million things that have accumulated around the house.
> 
> Party on,
> Lee


Yeah, come on out if you can... should be fun. Won't be any field lapping by me unless there's a Spec Yugo class, but we'll be having fun either way.  You should sign up for the HPDE 3 or 4 to get in some laps during the day too.

As an aside, and just so I can vent a bit... Some S*O*B stole ALL of my friggen tools last night. I would've loved to have seen this guy walking down the street with my big yellow tool box when I was getting home. Oh well... Looks like Sears will be making another few hundered smackers off of me tomorrow. DOH!!!!

Interlock!
http://www.x-rep.com
Dedicated to Your Physical Transformation


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## Raffi (May 18, 2002)

Interlocker said:


> As an aside, and just so I can vent a bit... Some S*O*B stole ALL of my friggen tools last night. I would've loved to have seen this guy walking down the street with my big yellow tool box when I was getting home. Oh well... Looks like Sears will be making another few hundered smackers off of me tomorrow. DOH!!!!


 :violent: Were your tools stolen from home, garage, car, ...??? :thumbdwn:


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## doeboy (Sep 20, 2002)

Interlocker said:


> As an aside, and just so I can vent a bit... Some S*O*B stole ALL of my friggen tools last night. I would've loved to have seen this guy walking down the street with my big yellow tool box when I was getting home. Oh well... Looks like Sears will be making another few hundered smackers off of me tomorrow. DOH!!!!


Bummer! 

If you catch them you'll just have to Interlock him...  Teach him a lesson.


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## liuk3 (May 3, 2004)

Interlocker said:


> Some S*O*B stole ALL of my friggen tools last night. I would've loved to have seen this guy walking down the street with my big yellow tool box when I was getting home. Oh well... Looks like Sears will be making another few hundered smackers off of me tomorrow. DOH!!!!
> 
> Interlock!
> http://www.x-rep.com
> Dedicated to Your Physical Transformation


I just had same thing happen to me about two weeks ago. They stole it out of my garage. How do you think I know about the torque wrenches on sale at sears? Unfortunately, I missed this huge sale they were having over labor day weekend on all of their giant tool sets.


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## Interlocker (Jun 27, 2003)

liuk3 said:


> I just had same thing happen to me about two weeks ago. They stole it out of my garage. How do you think I know about the torque wrenches on sale at sears? Unfortunately, I missed this huge sale they were having over labor day weekend on all of their giant tool sets.


DOH!!! I wish there was a holiday weekend this weekend. Mine were taken from the garage too. It's a complex garage, but it's got locked doors and is gated. Someone snuck in at some point (probably while the gate was closing) and stole someone's garage door opener. Bastiges!!!

Interlock!
http://www.x-rep.com
Dedicated to Your Physical Transformation


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## liuk3 (May 3, 2004)

Interlocker said:


> DOH!!! I wish there was a holiday weekend this weekend. Mine were taken from the garage too. It's a complex garage, but it's got locked doors and is gated. Someone snuck in at some point (probably while the gate was closing) and stole someone's garage door opener. Bastiges!!!
> 
> Interlock!
> http://www.x-rep.com
> Dedicated to Your Physical Transformation


Yeah. Same thing here. Someone must have walked into the gate to my complex and took mine as well. I usually keep some cheap stuff down there like old parts, but one day I was lazy and took my tools out of my trunk and left them there in the garage. Well, I'm off to Sears today to buy somemore tools.


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## Strom (Aug 24, 2004)

So would anyone from the L.A. or Orange County area like to caravan to this event? Ill be taking my new J-stock E30 M3, and while its in tip-top shape im not super comfortable driving it across those nice long stretches of nothing.

Brett Strom


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## SergioK (Aug 14, 2002)

Strom said:


> So would anyone from the L.A. or Orange County area like to caravan to this event? Ill be taking my new J-stock E30 M3, and while its in tip-top shape im not super comfortable driving it across those nice long stretches of nothing.
> 
> Brett Strom


I know Raffi's going to be leaving in the early afternoon. I'll be leaving in the late morning, hopefully.

What time are you planning on leaving?


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## Strom (Aug 24, 2004)

Thats actually the problem, I won't be able to leave until about 3:00 or 3:30 because I have a midterm in one of my classes. I doubt anyone else will be leaving that late (not to mention the miserable traffic at that time), but I just wanted to check.


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## Stuka (Jul 17, 2002)

Strom said:


> So would anyone from the L.A. or Orange County area like to caravan to this event? Ill be taking my new J-stock E30 M3, and while its in tip-top shape im not super comfortable driving it across those nice long stretches of nothing.
> 
> Brett Strom


PM me...


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## liuk3 (May 3, 2004)

I am planning on leaving around 1PM. If anyone wants to hook up, my e-mail address is [email protected] I live/work in Brentwood off of the 405.

Another question, given that I am a newbie and a D driver, should it be okay to just continue using my OEM brake pads on my 530 until they're dead? I don't want to have to shell out extra cash for track or better brake pads until I have to.

Thanks,
Ken


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## doeboy (Sep 20, 2002)

liuk3 said:


> I am planning on leaving around 1PM. If anyone wants to hook up, my e-mail address is [email protected] I live/work in Brentwood off of the 405.
> 
> Another question, given that I am a newbie and a D driver, should it be okay to just continue using my OEM brake pads on my 530 until they're dead? I don't want to have to shell out extra cash for track or better brake pads until I have to.
> 
> ...


I'm a C/B-ish driver I guess... and I'm still using my stockers... although I'm starting to feel that maybe I should be swapping pads... :eeps: Been using the stock pads for about hmm... 7 schools now...


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## liuk3 (May 3, 2004)

doeboy said:


> I'm a C/B-ish driver I guess... and I'm still using my stockers... although I'm starting to feel that maybe I should be swapping pads... :eeps: Been using the stock pads for about hmm... 7 schools now...


Thanks for the response. I've just been reading about people swapping pads, and then I talked to a guy who races and sells the pads. They were telling me to swap out the OEM, but I think that they forget that I am a newbie and not as hard on the brakes as more advanced drivers would be. I don't want to screw up my brake and rotors, but if I don't have to swap them I would rather save the money for when I get more advanced. Sounds like the OEM pads have been fine for you. If you've been using them for 7 schools, the OEM should absolutely be fine for me. Thanks.


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## Strom (Aug 24, 2004)

liuk3 said:


> I am planning on leaving around 1PM. If anyone wants to hook up, my e-mail address is [email protected] I live/work in Brentwood off of the 405.
> 
> Another question, given that I am a newbie and a D driver, should it be okay to just continue using my OEM brake pads on my 530 until they're dead? I don't want to have to shell out extra cash for track or better brake pads until I have to.
> 
> ...


Yeah, your stock pads should be totally fine. I don't know if you will ever need to upgrade in a car like a 530 even though it is a bit heavy. Plus unless you take your car to the track a lot, track pads will be slightly annoying to use on the street (more noise, more brake dust, don't stop as well when cold).


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## doeboy (Sep 20, 2002)

liuk3 said:


> Thanks for the response. I've just been reading about people swapping pads, and then I talked to a guy who races and sells the pads. They were telling me to swap out the OEM, but I think that they forget that I am a newbie and not as hard on the brakes as more advanced drivers would be. I don't want to screw up my brake and rotors, but if I don't have to swap them I would rather save the money for when I get more advanced. Sounds like the OEM pads have been fine for you. If you've been using them for 7 schools, the OEM should absolutely be fine for me. Thanks.


Yeah they've been fine for me... for the most part. I think it depends on how well you can sense/adjust to changing conditions in the car. On certain tracks I can feel that I was beginning to get pad fade so I would have to start extending my braking zone and braking earlier to compensate for it. That's when the stock pads begin to show that maybe they're reaching their limits.

Just be aware of how your car should feel and if you feel that it's starting to not stop quite as well as before, start adjusting your braking zone back. Have a safe and fun time at Phoenix and stay Shiny side up! :thumbup:


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## liuk3 (May 3, 2004)

This dude was telling me to swap out the front brake pads for track pads every time I hit the track and then swap the fronts back to street pads afterwards. 

Strom, I agree with you that my 530 is probably too underpowered to get up any sort of real speed, but I did worry that since it was heavier I might stress the brakes. 

Doeboy, in the case of brake fade and all that, I don't think that I am so concerned about that as much since at my level, I can't really notice it that much. Also, if I can't stop in time, I'll just brake harder or earlier. 

I was only worried that I would somehow screw up my rotors, since I have heard that if the pads hit a temperature above their optimal limits, they can leave residue on the rotors and thus damage the braking ability of the car when you go back to driving on the street. But it sounds like you guys have been fine with street pads on the track, and certainly you guys are much more advanced than myself in terms of track time.

Thanks again,
Ken


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## SergioK (Aug 14, 2002)

liuk3 said:


> I don't want to screw up my brake and rotors


I've posted quite a bit on this topic.

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showpost.php?p=884118&postcount=18


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## doeboy (Sep 20, 2002)

liuk3 said:


> This dude was telling me to swap out the front brake pads for track pads every time I hit the track and then swap the fronts back to street pads afterwards.
> 
> Strom, I agree with you that my 530 is probably too underpowered to get up any sort of real speed, but I did worry that since it was heavier I might stress the brakes.
> 
> ...


Ideally yeah but we're talkin budget minded here as well... which is a category I fall into at this point too... 

I'd opt for braking earlier if you're experiencing pad fade.... braking harder in that situation may not help things...

Like Sergio said... I have to agree... the stock pads are less than optimal.... but they are okay if you take care of them... like making sure you do proper cooldown laps to give the brakes time to cool, never parking the car with the brakes engaged after a session, never stopping the car so the pad freezes to the rotor when hot (unless absolutely necessary of course), etc....


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## Strom (Aug 24, 2004)

In regard to the residue on the rotors this has happened to me (especially at the last Buttonwillow event). I actually managed to melt the stock pads all over the rotors...however, this was after 20 minutes of repeated braking from speeds of up to 125mph in an E46 M3; not to mention it was about 105 degrees. I htink it might also have been related to my brother going off track and then sitting there for 5 minutes with no chance for cool down for the brakes. Anyway I just think you will never have a problem in D or C group as you tend to get held up a lot.

Strom


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## liuk3 (May 3, 2004)

Doeboy, you're sentiment and thoughts are exactly along the lines of my thinking. 

Strom, it sounds like you are a waaay more advanced driver than myself in a much, much more powerful car and are thus stressing your brakes to a higher degree.

I know that I may be cheaping out right now, but I think that I would like to wait until I become a more advanced driver before I start going through the exercise of swapping out street pads for track pads each time I go to the track. I do have the pads to swap, but I would like to save them until I feel like I am qualified to start using them. If this sounds like a bad idea, please let me know. Thanks again for the advice.


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## Raffi (May 18, 2002)

liuk3 said:


> Thanks for the response. I've just been reading about people swapping pads, and then I talked to a guy who races and sells the pads. They were telling me to swap out the OEM, but I think that they forget that I am a newbie and not as hard on the brakes as more advanced drivers would be. I don't want to screw up my brake and rotors, but if I don't have to swap them I would rather save the money for when I get more advanced. Sounds like the OEM pads have been fine for you. If you've been using them for 7 schools, the OEM should absolutely be fine for me. Thanks.


 You're perfectly fine in D with stock pads. Save your ca$h and reinvest it in other schools! :bigpimp:


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## Stuka (Jul 17, 2002)

SergioK said:


> I know Raffi's going to be leaving in the early afternoon. I'll be leaving in the late morning, hopefully.
> 
> What time are you planning on leaving?


We have the caravan lined up with four cars, are you sure you want to go by yourself? We are leaving the Valley at 3 on Friday, it's not THAT late. :dunno:

Besides, don't you need someone to keep you inline of your um, 22348b provisions? :nono: :bustingup


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## liuk3 (May 3, 2004)

After this past weekend with you guys, I finally broke down and ordered the Valentine One. I have been completely on the fence over the past year about whether to spend the dough on this mod for the car. I still can't get over how early we were able to get back from Phoenix using the V1s. Downside is that my credit card is now melting from the purchase.  

I didn't get the concealed display and have been toying with the idea of the StealthOne.


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## doeboy (Sep 20, 2002)

liuk3 said:


> After this past weekend with you guys, I finally broke down and ordered the Valentine One. I have been completely on the fence over the past year about whether to spend the dough on this mod for the car. I still can't get over how early we were able to get back from Phoenix using the V1s. Downside is that my credit card is now melting from the purchase.
> 
> I didn't get the concealed display and have been toying with the idea of the StealthOne.


Hehe... the V1 damn near sells itself after someone gets to see it in action. I know some people who bought theirs after seeing mine work.

StealthOne.... :thumbup:


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## liuk3 (May 3, 2004)

doeboy said:


> StealthOne.... :thumbup:


Yeah, I saw your post in the archives and noticed you had the StealthOne. Seems like you are pretty happy with it. I haven't been able to find someone who has hooked it into the 5-series though and am concerned about the interface. I just worry that all the kinks haven't been worked out with this relatively new product. Do you know anyone who has put into an e39?


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## doeboy (Sep 20, 2002)

liuk3 said:


> Yeah, I saw your post in the archives and noticed you had the StealthOne. Seems like you are pretty happy with it. I haven't been able to find someone who has hooked it into the 5-series though and am concerned about the interface. I just worry that all the kinks haven't been worked out with this relatively new product. Do you know anyone who has put into an e39?


Unfortunately no... don't know anyone personally in the area who has it in their E39. But your MID display does work much better than the radio display I have to use. Makes me wish the E46s also had the MID display too... 

BTW... Mine's been pretty quirk free since I updated the firmware.


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## liuk3 (May 3, 2004)

doeboy said:


> Unfortunately no... don't know anyone personally in the area who has it in their E39. But your MID display does work much better than the radio display I have to use. Makes me wish the E46s also had the MID display too...
> 
> BTW... Mine's been pretty quirk free since I updated the firmware.


Doeboy,
u got mail.
Ken


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## Raffi (May 18, 2002)

liuk3 said:


> After this past weekend with you guys, I finally broke down and ordered the Valentine One. I have been completely on the fence over the past year about whether to spend the dough on this mod for the car. I still can't get over how early we were able to get back from Phoenix using the V1s.


 The V1 saved my butt twice today on my way back from Court in San Diego! Definitely worth its weight in gold.


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## doeboy (Sep 20, 2002)

Raffi said:


> The V1 saved my butt twice today on my way back from Court in San Diego! Definitely worth its weight in gold.


Some people complain the V1 is too sensitive and falses too much.

I say... the more info about possible threats the better... and I love having early warning....  Came in handy a number of times and I was completely safe because of such early warning.... :angel:

After all... which would you rather have... a v1 bleeping at you... or several colored blinking lights from the car behind you? :rofl:


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## Raffi (May 18, 2002)

doeboy said:


> After all... which would you rather have... a v1 bleeping at you... or several colored blinking lights from the car behind you? :rofl:


 Hmmm, let me think about that one.


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## doeboy (Sep 20, 2002)

Raffi said:


> Hmmm, let me think about that one.


Yeah... that's how I explained it to some... but they just don't seem to get it. :dunno:


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## Raffi (May 18, 2002)

doeboy said:


> Yeah... that's how I explained it to some... but they just don't seem to get it. :dunno:


 They'll get it when they get a ticket!


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## liuk3 (May 3, 2004)

Doeboy,
I took your advice and posted on the StealthOne forum regarding compatibility of StealthOne with an '01 e39. I think that from 2001 to 2002 there was a change in the instrument cluster on my car. I actually do not have the 20 digit text display below the speedo and tach. Thus, I think that the output for the s1/v1 display would be like on your e46 mid where the radio is. How do you like the s1 display? How long did it take you to install it and did you think that it was worth it?
Thanks,
Ken


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## doeboy (Sep 20, 2002)

liuk3 said:


> Doeboy,
> I took your advice and posted on the StealthOne forum regarding compatibility of StealthOne with an '01 e39. I think that from 2001 to 2002 there was a change in the instrument cluster on my car. I actually do not have the 20 digit text display below the speedo and tach. Thus, I think that the output for the s1/v1 display would be like on your e46 mid where the radio is. How do you like the s1 display? How long did it take you to install it and did you think that it was worth it?
> Thanks,
> Ken


Hmm... but your Radio still has a 20 char MID on it... right?

Took several hours to do the V1 hardwire and S1 install because we decided to go behind the glovebox instead of just tapping power up in the ceiling and other stuff like that. Harder work, but cleaner install IMO.


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## liuk3 (May 3, 2004)

doeboy said:


> Hmm... but your Radio still has a 20 char MID on it... right?
> 
> Took several hours to do the V1 hardwire and S1 install because we decided to go behind the glovebox instead of just tapping power up in the ceiling and other stuff like that. Harder work, but cleaner install IMO.


Yeah, I think that I am going to hold off on the s1. Thanks for the feedback.


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## liuk3 (May 3, 2004)

*Continuing Car Saga from PIR*

For those of you familiar with my engine problems from this past weekend at PIR, I took the car to a BMW/Dinan dealership. They have diagnosed the problem, as you guys had surmised, to the camshaft positioning sensor. Now, BMW and Dinan are arguing who is going to pay for the work since the DME also needs to be re-programmed to Dinan's specification. My Service Advisor is trying to sort out the political mess of responsibility between BMW and Dinan since the car is covered under both of their warranties. I thought it would be a lot simpler. 

On the bright side, I'm glad that I was able to drive home albeit at less power.

I am praying to get my car back fixed with no money leaving my wallet. Wish me luck.


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## SergioK (Aug 14, 2002)

Which dealer did you take it to?


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## Raffi (May 18, 2002)

liuk3 said:


> I am praying to get my car back fixed with no money leaving my wallet. Wish me luck.


 Either Dinan or BMW will pick up the tab, so you shouldn't have to pay anything.


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## SergioK (Aug 14, 2002)

Raffi said:


> Either Dinan or BMW will pick up the tab, so you shouldn't have to pay anything.


Agreed, I just find it odd that they are going back and forth trying to find 'who's liable'. When I had this fixed on my car at Long Beach BMW it wasn't even an issue. In fact, they were like, oh yeah, that problem, fixed, done.


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## liuk3 (May 3, 2004)

SergioK said:


> Which dealer did you take it to?


I had originally made an appointment at Long Beach BMW since it seemed like they had really good feedback on the boards. People seemed to have really good things to say about their service. However, they couldn't get me in until next week. I made the appointment but looked on the dinan site for other authorized BMW dealers. Beverly Hills BMW had an opening on wednesday, and they are 3 miles from where I work, so I just dumped it there this past week and canceled my Long Beach appointment. I know that it seems like there has been a lot of negative feedback about both Santa Monica BMW and Beverly Hills BMW. I am trying to bank on the fact that my problem is not very complicated and that Beverly Hills BMW will not screw it up. I also told them that I had just moved into the area and that this was my first experience with the dealership. I hope that they will try to do a good first time job for me. Speaking with the Service Advisor today, he concurred that they had figured out the problem and that it was pretty simple to fix the cam positioning sensor. They just need to get the software from Dinan since they need to reprogram the computer. They were also able to give a ride back to work and will pick me up when I need to pick up my car. Long Beach BMW wouldn't give me a loaner car and wanted to charge me $70/day for a rental.


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## liuk3 (May 3, 2004)

Raffi said:


> Either Dinan or BMW will pick up the tab, so you shouldn't have to pay anything.


Yeah, the Service Advisor just told me late today that they will pick up the tab for everything except the $50 deductible you have to pay for CPO warranty. Can't wait to get my baby back!


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## Stuka (Jul 17, 2002)

liuk3 said:


> Yeah, the Service Advisor just told me late today that they will pick up the tab for everything except the $50 deductible you have to pay for CPO warranty. Can't wait to get my baby back!


Sears Point!!!! :drive: :bigpimp:

Believe it or not, because of the positive experience at PIR with my 325is with regards to some of the cars with higher HP's, I am actually contemplating on taking the 325is again to Sears Point. :eeps: :dunno:

Oh, and shutup Raffi.  :angel:


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