# When should I wash/wax a new car?



## two-five boy (Jul 26, 2010)

I just took delivery of an X5 a couple of days ago. From what I know the car completed production on 8/27, or less than 10 days ago. So when is it safe for me to wash and apply a coat of wax on it? Thanks


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## dvon (Jun 27, 2010)

Someone correct me if I'm wrong but I believe factory paint has been cured through a heating process so it's fine to wax/seal immediately.


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## djfitter (Sep 12, 2007)

two-five boy said:


> I just took delivery of an X5 a couple of days ago. From what I know the car completed production on 8/27, or less than 10 days ago. So when is it safe for me to wash and apply a coat of wax on it? Thanks


Do it now and don't forget to do the clay bar. It's amazing how smooth the paint gets.

dj


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## guaping (Dec 27, 2009)

djfitter said:


> Do it now and don't forget to do the clay bar. It's amazing how smooth the paint gets. dj


+1. I clayed and applied Zaino since Day 1. Don't forget to use Dawn to remove whatever wax your dealer applied (I told my dealer then NOT to detail it when I took delivery).


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## Envious Eric (Dec 2, 2009)

dawn wash a couple times to remove the oils/glazes that might be on it.
clay it with a light clay bar and plenty of clay lube.
(I would polish it at this point, as claying will scuff and mar the finish)
do an alcohol wipedown everywhere on the car
seal it with your favorite sealant


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## DetailDan (Jul 3, 2007)

Asap.


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## Bill-SD (Feb 18, 2002)

Envious Eric said:


> dawn wash a couple times to remove the oils/glazes that might be on it.
> clay it with a light clay bar and plenty of clay lube.
> (I would polish it at this point, as claying will scuff and mar the finish)
> do an alcohol wipedown everywhere on the car
> seal it with your favorite sealant


Why do you think clay would mar the finish? Clay should never mar when used correctly (ample lubricant).


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## AndrewBigA (Jun 11, 2009)

Bill-SD said:


> Why do you think clay would mar the finish? Clay should never mar when used correctly (ample lubricant).


because clay is an abraisave. same reason why you shouldnt wash & clay bar a car without at least giving it a nice coat of wax afterwords.



two-five boy said:


> I just took delivery of an X5 a couple of days ago. From what I know the car completed production on 8/27, or less than 10 days ago. So when is it safe for me to wash and apply a coat of wax on it? Thanks


give me a call & i can take care of the new car prep this week. ill look at the paint & tell you if it needs a polish or just a nice coat of wax. i suggest wash, clay, sealant, wax. for the glass & wheels i would give you some Rejex.

1Z Einszett topped with Adams Americana

Rejex on wheels & glass

for your interior i would just give it a nice vac, wipe it down & make sure theres no dust anywhere. we can treat your dash & door cards with 303. leather can be conditioned as well after a light cleaning. for the carpet i can spot clean whatever light stains might be on your floor mats, the carpets should be fine. carpet & mats treated with 3M Scotchguard.

give me a call or send me a pm.

-Andrew

p.s. my shop is in whtestone, queens.

:thumbup:

congrats on the car!


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## Envious Eric (Dec 2, 2009)

clay mars the finish on every car. whether lots of clay lube or a little, it will still instill light maring. Hence the reason I dont offer a wash, clay, wax...only a wash and wax, or a wash clay polish wax package. personal preference, maybe borderline ocd, but the results are always better when you polish after claying...
research clay and you will see that it is in fact abrasive, even though some people seem to think its not....


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## Bill-SD (Feb 18, 2002)

Envious Eric said:


> clay mars the finish on every car. whether lots of clay lube or a little, it will still instill light maring. Hence the reason I dont offer a wash, clay, wax...only a wash and wax, or a wash clay polish wax package. personal preference, maybe borderline ocd, but the results are always better when you polish after claying...
> research clay and you will see that it is in fact abrasive, even though some people seem to think its not....


This is the first I've heard anyone say this. It certainly has not been my experience. My dark paint seems to mar just by looking at it the wrong way, yet I have never marred it using clay. I am pretty OCD myself and detail my cars under halogen lights. Trust me, clay does not mar my paint. I use fine grade clay, so maybe that's it. Possibly a more aggressive grade would be different? But for most folks here fine grade should do. I agree that polishing is a good next step, but not a required one. I'm just speaking from my personal experience, and what I have read on detailing boards over the years. You guys are the experts


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## Envious Eric (Dec 2, 2009)

Now dont take it the wrong way...not saying that you dont know what you are talking about...your last comment has me thinking thats what you are thinking. 

I know a few other respected detailers who think and work the same way as me. Personal preference but ill always clay and polish...never one without the other


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## dvon (Jun 27, 2010)

Envious Eric said:


> Now dont take it the wrong way...not saying that you dont know what you are talking about...your last comment has me thinking thats what you are thinking.
> 
> I know a few other respected detailers who think and work the same way as me. Personal preference but ill always clay and polish...never one without the other


I guess I've always thought of it this way:

Clay is used when you really want to start from square one. If you are pulling out fine embedded bids from the paint then there's no way it's perfect anymore so it likely it needed a polish before you started claying. I've never heard clay be referred to as an abrasive either. To me I'd never clay without polishing after because if I'm going to go through the work of claying I'm def going to polish also before I seal/wax.


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## POof540i (Aug 17, 2007)

From my experience, clay has marred paint before. Not significantly, but it has. Some believe clay is an abrasive while others don't.

A titan in the detailing world, Mike Philips, believes if used correctly, clay will not mar paint.

So it seems your mileage may vary.


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## AndrewBigA (Jun 11, 2009)

so eric you wash & then apply a wax over dirty paint? some customers just want a wash, clay & wax & that is what you have to give them. you can only get away with waxing a car without the clay bar if its a garage queens & doesnt see every day driving.

clay is an abraisave as eric said before. that is a known fact.


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## Envious Eric (Dec 2, 2009)

nope, i upsell!!! I show them the difference! I dont do a lot of little detail work. I mainly do correction work with at least one polish step, so every car gets clayed from me. However, I will wax a car if its maintained by me weekly or monthly.


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## dboy11 (Mar 6, 2006)

Clay comes in a few different grades, depending on what you are doing to the car is the one that you will use. The kits that you buy at the auto parts stores are very mild for removing surface contaminants, they are not abrasive and will not mar the paint, if used correctly. However there are grades of clay that are for removing paint over-spray that can mar the surface, those are purchased at detail suppliers and require polishing after to correct the marring


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## 335i Driver (Nov 29, 2006)

Can some of you self proclaimed detailing experts tell me why you think you need to wash with Dawn? Claying will easily remove any old wax and polishing certainly will. Dawn is not made to wash cars, it does not have the lubricants that a good car wash has. Washing with Dawn CAN cause marring and scratching. Why even take the chance when it's absolutely not necessary?


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## dboy11 (Mar 6, 2006)

335i Driver said:


> Can some of you self proclaimed detailing experts tell me why you think you need to wash with Dawn? Claying will easily remove any old wax and polishing certainly will. Dawn is not made to wash cars, it does not have the lubricants that a good car wash has. Washing with Dawn CAN cause marring and scratching. Why even take the chance when it's absolutely not necessary?


The Zaino site suggests washing the car with Dawn to strip all the old product.

I agree that its not the right product for washing a car


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## dvon (Jun 27, 2010)

335i Driver said:


> Can some of you self proclaimed detailing experts tell me why you think you need to wash with Dawn? Claying will easily remove any old wax and polishing certainly will. Dawn is not made to wash cars, it does not have the lubricants that a good car wash has. Washing with Dawn CAN cause marring and scratching. Why even take the chance when it's absolutely not necessary?


The general theory (I don't do it btw) is that if you're going to start from scratch that it removes any product on the paint quickly. Any minor marring would be fixed by the polishing step if you were doing a full correction.


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## Bill-SD (Feb 18, 2002)

dboy11 said:


> Clay comes in a few different grades, depending on what you are doing to the car is the one that you will use. The kits that you buy at the auto parts stores are very mild for removing surface contaminants, they are not abrasive and will not mar the paint, if used correctly. However there are grades of clay that are for removing paint over-spray that can mar the surface, those are purchased at detail suppliers and require polishing after to correct the marring


This makes sense. I have not used aggressive grade clay, but I can see where that may cause some marring (but I'm guessing not too bad?). I may have used medium grade, but usually buy fine. That has never caused any marring on any car I've used it on. BTW - I never said clay was not abrasive, I just said it didn't mar. I concede that some clay can mar. I hope this conversation doesn't scare some folks away from trying clay, because it's an easy and safe way to take your paint to the next level.


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## Envious Eric (Dec 2, 2009)

335i Driver said:


> Can some of you self proclaimed detailing experts tell me why you think you need to wash with Dawn? Claying will easily remove any old wax and polishing certainly will. Dawn is not made to wash cars, it does not have the lubricants that a good car wash has. Washing with Dawn CAN cause marring and scratching. Why even take the chance when it's absolutely not necessary?


dawn or degreaser or a citrus wash used at a higher dilution ratio will remove the oils and grease from the paint BETTER than clay will, allowing the clay to do more work on the embedded contaminants IN the paint rather than having to break through the oils and grease and leave some of the debris behind.

you want to prep the next step with the previous step...kind of like claying before polishing to remove the dirt from the paint so you dont polish dirt in, or using a paintwork cleanser/alcohol wipedown so the sealant wax will bond to the paint instead of the previous polishing oils left over, or compounding away oxidation so you can polish healthy paint and restore max gloss.

ITS ALL IN THE PREP :thumbup:

now dawn for a regular washing = not good! thats where you want a regular car wash soap with high lubricity.


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## Envious Eric (Dec 2, 2009)

have you ever tried to polish over a freshly waxed car....you dont get as good results because you are "hydroplaning" over the wax before you actually get to the paint...


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## 335i Driver (Nov 29, 2006)

Envious Eric said:


> have you ever tried to polish over a freshly waxed car....you dont get as good results because you are "hydroplaning" over the wax before you actually get to the paint...


Not when I use a high quality polish like Menzerna. Removes old wax so easily it's like it's not even there even if I don't clay first.

However, scratches induced by improper washing are much harder to remove. I'll skip the Dawn and stick with a high quality car wash soap.


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## Envious Eric (Dec 2, 2009)

i can tell you are set on your point and cant see someone else's point/opinion...its unfortunate, but whatever.

by the way, I use menzerna too...

and its not the dawn that causes the scratches, its the wash media and drying media. Dawn seems to suds better than some car wash soaps. However, the effects of dawn on the car are quite different than a car wash soap in the fact that Dawn is designed to cut through grime and grease (albeit on pots and pans, but it works the same on cars).


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## dboy11 (Mar 6, 2006)

335i Driver said:


> Not when I use a high quality polish like Menzerna. Removes old wax so easily it's like it's not even there even if I don't clay first.
> 
> However, scratches induced by improper washing are much harder to remove. I'll skip the Dawn and stick with a high quality car wash soap.





Envious Eric said:


> i can tell you are set on your point and cant see someone else's point/opinion...its unfortunate, but whatever.
> 
> by the way, I use menzerna too...
> 
> and its not the dawn that causes the scratches, its the wash media and drying media. Dawn seems to suds better than some car wash soaps. However, the effects of dawn on the car are quite different than a car wash soap in the fact that Dawn is designed to cut through grime and grease (albeit on pots and pans, but it works the same on cars).


I'm going to agree with Eric on removing the old protection on the car before starting with new polish. It may appear that you are cutting threw / removing the old product but what is really happening is that you are mixing the two together as the product heats up, that's if you are using a rotary or orbital..if you are doing this all by hand then you are just planing over the top of the old product.

Next time you do this do a panel cut in half one with clay and they other with just straight polishing as you are doing now...then check the results you will see that one is slightly cleaner and smoother the side that was clayed


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## AndrewBigA (Jun 11, 2009)

lol, sometimes theres an argument ya cant win Eric. we all know that dawn or joy soap isnt suggested for every time the car is washed but.........there are many detailers that use it for a prep wash because it cleans the paint better. its only ok to use it for machine polishing or for a hand wax but not a hand wash. prep washing with either of these soaps will prolong the life of your clay bars as well. there will be obviously less dirt to be pulled up from the paint. 

washing with dawn DOES NOT cause marring & scratching. its the wash mit, microfiber or sponge that is used improperly that will cause light damage after washing. isnt this elementary level of detailing class 101? 

there is so much wrong information all over the internet. newbs or guys that like to do it themselves think they know better than professional guys with years & years of experience. just because they read it on a detailing forum they think thats the correct way of doing things. how can someone that maybe details his own car a few times a year try to compare knowledge with someone that does this for a living & all day long, all week long?

you learn from experience, not from reading off detailing forums. you can not obtain the same kind of knowledge unless you are applying anything that you are "reading" to actual detail work. 

DAWN or JOY for prep wash soap is FTW when used properly!

i personally prefer Joy for its pleasant lemon scent that hits the back of my nostrills from a nice long hard whiff!

i agree with everything that eric said so are we both wrong?


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## 335i Driver (Nov 29, 2006)

"washing with dawn DOES NOT cause marring & scratching. its the wash mit, microfiber or sponge that is used improperly that will cause light damage after washing."

Really, no &*^%!! What will you do next, tell me it wasn't the vegetable oil that caused the cam lobe to scratch, it was the metal to metal contact? Wow, you're such a genius.

Also, I really struggled to even read your reply. The fact that you can't even type proper grammar tells me all I need to know about your competence and intelligence.

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=482388
fminus did a complete correction here. Do you see any dish soaps listed as a product he used?
http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=477941
phil did a complete correction here. Do you see any dish soaps listed as a product he used?

BTW, both these guys have been posting here a long time and aren't afraid to show their excellent work. I can assure you neither one would ever touch a car with dish soap. I can also assure you if I'm ever in NY I won't be doing business with Little A.

http://www.autogeek.net/washing.html
(What you don't want to do is use any soap-dish soap included-that is not specifically for car paint.)

http://www.superiorcarcare.net/how-to-wash-car.html
2. No Hope with Dish Soap. Save the dish soap for your dishes.

http://www.thecarguy.com/articles/washtips.htm
Never use a kitchen or household liquid detergent to wash your car as these products can damage your car's paint finish.

http://www.autopia-carcare.com/how-to-wash-your-car-detailing-101.html
Dish soap is designed to eat away grease and food oils and works great for that purpose but we need to keep it in the kitchen! The same attributes causes it to wreak havoc on car wax, plastic moldings and can dry out your rubber seals!

http://www.edmunds.com/ownership/howto/articles/43777/article.html
Normal dish soap, laundry soap and household cleaners are a big no-no

I could go on and on!!


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## Envious Eric (Dec 2, 2009)

As mentioned before...for a one time, start from scratch detail, washing with dawn is ok. Washing it it all the time and not detailing it after is where people go wrong. It will strip the oils and grease off whatever it comes in contact with so that is why you have to condition the tires, trim, and polish and wax the car. It will strip wax as well leaving your car unprotected. Its a cheaper alternative to chemical guys citrus wash or the like. You wouodnt use citrus wash and clear at the protection stripping dilution all the time wouod you? I mean that is a dedicated car wash soap as well....


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## Envious Eric (Dec 2, 2009)

Think about cleaning the plastic on something like a nissan xterra. You would use a degreaser or all purpose cleaner to clean them right. Then you would follow that up with the appropriate condition or uv protection. Well, dawn is the same in theory for the paint.


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## Bill-SD (Feb 18, 2002)

: popcorn:


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## dboy11 (Mar 6, 2006)

Bill-SD said:


> : popcorn:


I was thinking the same thing Bill, you know its soming...lol


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## Envious Eric (Dec 2, 2009)

doesnt have to be any need for the popcorn...it shouldnt get that far, its discussion


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