# Detailing for a newbie / How to



## sali80 (Jun 20, 2011)

Hi there,

I have a 2011 535 sapphire black. I have light swirl marks all over the car due to a bad hand car wash place.

I am thinking of following steps and I would appreciate any tips/corrections/suggestions.

1. Hand wash the car using 2 bucket system. Use Meguiar gold car wash and Meguiar mitt (might use sheepskin instead).
2. Do not dry the car. Use Meguiar's smooth clay kit and make sure there is plenty of lubrication. (saw plenty of youtube tutorials).
3. Rince off the car again. Dry the car using microfiber towels.

I am confused about the next step. Should I use paint sealent like Wolfgang or liquid wax like 3M? Which one is safe for a newbie? 

Is it possible to remove light swirls by hand as I'm afraid of using orbital machines? If so, which brand?

Thank you,


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## Ilovemycar (Feb 19, 2010)

1. I've used Megs GC, it gets the job done, but I prefer my other washes like Optimum and Griot's. But like they say, it's not so much the product as it is the technique. I also have Megs mitts, but exclusively use sheepskin on my BMWs metal panels (the plastic stuff, it depends on the day). I would be fine w/ MF on my paint too, however, the one thing I might advise is getting multiple mitts. Hey, they're cheap. I'd say the MFs grab the most so to speak. Supposedly grout sponges release contamination the easiest. I've used both on the lowest panels, and/or other cars. Lastly, and very importantly IMO, there can be a really big big difference between sheepskin mitts. You don't have to go crazy on a wookie fist or something, but don't go too cheap. Mother's is supposed the be decent. 

2. Personally, I'd dry off first to avoid water spotting. I also say this because at least on my BMW, I will polish if I'm going to clay (possible micromarring; if it's dirty enough to clay, then it's almost certainly time to polish for me). I like my ONR for lube (I like it for many reasons). 

3. Might look into a cheap leaf blower first. Hit leftover spots with a VERY NICE microfiber towel (cheap hot wire cut Costco is a no no in my book for this), and don't drag, but BLOT dry, and even better perhaps is to mist a little ONR into the towel for that lil bit of lube (yes I do this for drying, counterintuitive as it may seem). 

IMO, almost all sealants and waxes are newbie friendly. You can pretty much do all of these by hand. 

Removing swirls by hand is insane to me, but I have had a lot of luck with M105 by hand for things like scratch removal, fingernail scratches at door handles, stuff like that. (For scratches on panels, I'd still probably follow up with finishing polish w/machine just for good measure).


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## sali80 (Jun 20, 2011)

Thanks for your help. So, I guess I can skip removing the swirls and simply polish and wax the car then. I will get it professionally detailed in 3-4 months to remove the swirls.


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## heathtx (Apr 24, 2010)

I think you are on the right track, Ive recently gotten the detailing urge, but water restrictions are a real hindrance.

My advice:
Megs gold class is fine, I use a foam gun and MF mitt. Use a separate mitt for wheelwells and bottom 1 foot of car.
Sonax for wheels.
I like Griot's clay and speedshine for a new car. It's a very mild clay. For an older car, I use a more aggressive brand of clay.
Since my car is a daily driver, I use Wolfgang's sealant and top it off with Collinite 845 wax.

Don't be afraid of an orbital. I bought a PC, didn't really like it, returned it after I bought a Griot's. The Griot's fit my hand better and has more power. I published a summary of the two in this forum. With an orbital, the sealant/waxing bit gets very easy, you do not have to press hard. With foam pads and dealant/waxes, you really would have to TRY to screw up.

Good luck


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## Alpine300ZHP (Jan 31, 2007)

Ilovemycar said:


> 1. I've used Megs GC, it gets the job done, but I prefer my other washes like Optimum and Griot's. But like they say, it's not so much the product as it is the technique. I also have Megs mitts, but exclusively use sheepskin on my BMWs metal panels (the plastic stuff, it depends on the day). I would be fine w/ MF on my paint too, however, the one thing I might advise is getting multiple mitts. Hey, they're cheap. I'd say the MFs grab the most so to speak. Supposedly grout sponges release contamination the easiest. I've used both on the lowest panels, and/or other cars. Lastly, and very importantly IMO, there can be a really big big difference between sheepskin mitts. You don't have to go crazy on a wookie fist or something, but don't go too cheap. Mother's is supposed the be decent.
> 
> 2. Personally, I'd dry off first to avoid water spotting. I also say this because at least on my BMW, I will polish if I'm going to clay (possible micromarring; if it's dirty enough to clay, then it's almost certainly time to polish for me). I like my ONR for lube (I like it for many reasons).
> 
> ...


Forgive my ignorance, but what is M105? I have some light scratch marks that were on the car from sitting on the lot and trying to figure out how to best remove them. I like Pinnacle products, but Pinnacle Paintwork Cleansing Lotion did not remove the scratches (made them lighter). I too have black sapphire.


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## omgboost (Nov 22, 2011)

Is it ok to use a polisher from Harbor Freight tools such as this? http://www.harborfreight.com/power-tools/polishers/7-inch-electronic-polisher-66615.html

Thanks.


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## Ilovemycar (Feb 19, 2010)

Alpine300ZHP said:


> Forgive my ignorance, but what is M105? I have some light scratch marks that were on the car from sitting on the lot and trying to figure out how to best remove them. I like Pinnacle products, but Pinnacle Paintwork Cleansing Lotion did not remove the scratches (made them lighter). I too have black sapphire.


M105 is a very popular compound by Meguiar's. It has a quite a lot of cut (but "cut" is multifactorial; think pad type, pad size, machine chosen, machine/hand speed, pressure exerted, etc), and is "non-diminshing", or as they brand it, SMAT. I find that a surgical/huck cloth works very well for fingernail scratches when using the M105. I would try it for a scratch here or there, but if it's swirling of any pervasive nature, I really would just go ahead and get a machine.

Your Pinnacle has as close to zero cut without being zero, so to speak. Here is a nice little "aggressiveness chart", and you'll see your Pinnacle rated at the minimum "1".

http://www.auto-geek.net/charts/wax-cut-chart-master.htm


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## Ilovemycar (Feb 19, 2010)

omgboost said:


> Is it ok to use a polisher from Harbor Freight tools such as this? http://www.harborfreight.com/power-tools/polishers/7-inch-electronic-polisher-66615.html
> 
> Thanks.


In a word, no. Try starting with a DA/RO first (look up Dual Action, or Random Orbital, to me they are the same thing, but I haven't been around so long), such as the Griot's, Meguiar's, or Porter Cable. I have the PC (and a Flex), which serves me well, but if I did it all over again, I'd probably try the Griot's instead. I've seen it go for $80 or so a couple of times in the last year. I wouldn't hold your breath, but if you really count every dollar, maybe you can be lucky with patience.


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## Alpine300ZHP (Jan 31, 2007)

Ilovemycar said:


> M105 is a very popular compound by Meguiar's. It has a quite a lot of cut (but "cut" is multifactorial; think pad type, pad size, machine chosen, machine/hand speed, pressure exerted, etc), and is "non-diminshing", or as they brand it, SMAT. I find that a surgical/huck cloth works very well for fingernail scratches when using the M105. I would try it for a scratch here or there, but if it's swirling of any pervasive nature, I really would just go ahead and get a machine.
> 
> Your Pinnacle has as close to zero cut without being zero, so to speak. Here is a nice little "aggressiveness chart", and you'll see your Pinnacle rated at the minimum "1".
> 
> http://www.auto-geek.net/charts/wax-cut-chart-master.htm


Wow...now I see why the Pinnacle did not help much. I have spent some time reading through post after post and it seems the following is what I need to do...tell me if you guys agree (I am doing by hand because I do not own a buffer right now):

1) Wash car with dawn
2) Use straight white vinegar on water spots to dissolve calcium. Water spots should eventually come off
3) Wash car with dawn again
4) Clay bar the whole car
5) Wash car again to get any clay residue off
6) Polish scratches with M105
7) Polish scratches with M205
8) Wax car with Pinnacle Souveran

It sounds like this method will get rid of the dealer's abuse and render me a pefect finish. The car does not have a bunch of swirls...it is mostly fine scratches and water spots from lot abuse/neglect. The sides of the car look perfect. It is the top parts of the car that show the marks. Lastly, what is a surgical/huff cloth? I have been strictly using microfiber towels for everything.


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## Ilovemycar (Feb 19, 2010)

1) I recommend Chemical Guys Citrus Wash instead, even if many people are happy with Dawn. The former is supposed to strip wax all the better, and poses no risk as far as drying out rubber trim. 

2) A good idea, you can also soak a towel for longer dwell. If the deposits are instead "etching", you will need to polish to remove. 

3) see #3, but I don't rewash like many others do. 

4) Good.

5) I don't see the need to. Then again, I use ONR as my lube, and that's sort of a cleaner already. 

6) Sounds good. Now with the 105, and really really with the 205, well they have these stubborn oils that can be difficult to remove. My advice is to remove often/quickly, in the shade, and have some IPA or chemical paint cleaner on hand to possibly help out. 

7) I honestly don't know how much 205 will do for you by hand only. I mean would it be a truly minimal amount of cut, where the effort is not worth it? I don't know.

8) Sounds good. 

Look for the blue cloths when you google huck cloths. This has a nice bite to it I find, for hand polishing certain things, and it's also my favorite thing to use when cleaning plastic exterior trim with Klasse AIO. (Though sometimes I'll use toothbrushes for hard to reach spots).


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## POof540i (Aug 17, 2007)

Alpine300ZHP said:


> 6) Polish scratches with M105


M105 to the entire car by hand? :nono: M105 is an awesome compound, but it's very finicky. If you've never used it before, you may end up hating it. It's best used with a DA or rotary.


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## TOGWT (May 26, 2004)

You may find these as useful reference information - TOGWT® Autopia Detailing Wiki


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## Alpine300ZHP (Jan 31, 2007)

POof540i said:


> M105 to the entire car by hand? :nono: M105 is an awesome compound, but it's very finicky. If you've never used it before, you may end up hating it. It's best used with a DA or rotary.


I actually was only going to use the M105 to remove about 5 light scratches that are on the finish. Here is my concern guys...if I use it to just spot remove scratches is it going to leave a cloudy finish behind? I do not want to remove scratch to find a cloudy finish because I do not have a buffer to polish it back to gloss. I doubt it will be hard to get the scratches out...they are fairly light (of the fingernail variety) and are in a few isolated spots. My biggest problem is paint contaimination (ie:clay bar) and water spots on the hood and trunk from rainwater sitting on the car while on the lot. The sides are pristine.


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## Alpine300ZHP (Jan 31, 2007)

Ilovemycar said:


> 1) I recommend Chemical Guys Citrus Wash instead, even if many people are happy with Dawn. The former is supposed to strip wax all the better, and poses no risk as far as drying out rubber trim.
> 
> 2) A good idea, you can also soak a towel for longer dwell. If the deposits are instead "etching", you will need to polish to remove.
> 
> ...


I figure Pinnacle Paintwork Cleansing Lotion would work well to remove those oils. Agree? If not what do you suggest as I am not doing the whole car...just spot treating. The car is new so it just has some isolated issues.


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## aray (Mar 8, 2005)

Slightly alternative opinion..... take FWIW, I am generally an incredibly risk-adverse person when it comes to my cars.

If you don't own a PC/Random Orbit, don't own any of these products already, you don't have any experience with compounds, AND you have a nice new 2011 vehicle... you might want to consider hiring a pro to come do the polishing for you.

Washing and claying - no problem, low risk. Light, "least agressive" cleaners like Klasse AIO, no problem. Highly abrasive compounds by hand....eh....not so sure. As mentioned, 99% of those compounds are designed to be machine applied. So you're kind of out on a limb here with a $50k+ car. 

My gut says you're going to spend $75 on detailing products and 4-6 hours of hard labor, risk adding more scratches to the paint, and still possibly not get the result you want.

If I were in your shoes, I would wash/clay, and MAYBE try one of the medium consumer focused products designed to be applied by hand like Meguair's Scratch-X on a small test area. Then apply Klasse AIO. If that doesn't deliver the result you want, I'd go pro.


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## Ilovemycar (Feb 19, 2010)

Alpine300ZHP said:


> I figure Pinnacle Paintwork Cleansing Lotion would work well to remove those oils. Agree? If not what do you suggest as I am not doing the whole car...just spot treating. The car is new so it just has some isolated issues.


No, I don't think so anyway. "Paint cleaners" are like many things, where we don't really know what we are getting. For instance, I picked up some Sonax paint cleaner I think it's called, because there was a $5 sale on it at Amazon once (usually $20). I'm pretty sure it contains carnauba, and so I sort of wish they called it something else besides paint cleaner, oh well.

Something like the PC is pretty safe IMO. You can take a gold/red/blue/black pad, put it at moderate/low speed, turn it on and put it right against your hand, and it won't even get warm. The whole idea of the DA makes paint correction safer for us, and we are talking entry level here. My PC usually takes too much elbow grease compared to my Flex with forced action, huge 8mm throw/stroke, and I think getting up there close to 10K orbits/min, I think maybe it's 9,600 OPM. We're still not even talking about MF pads, let alone rotaries with wool pads, etc.

Anyway, a PC with a light cut pad such as a white pad perhaps, as long as you keep it flush, you'll probably be fine. Just use common sense, I think. I bet before you long, you'll start moving up to more aggressive pads to get better results, depending on the condition of the paint.

The problem with Klasse AIO to finish up is that the acrylic protection is so fleeting. You would be advised to choose something else as LSP.

Anyway here is an example of some fingernail scratches I removed earlier this year, using M105 and a huck cloth. It's clearly indicated on the bottle, with a picture of a hand too I think, that it's ok to use by hand. Another reason you may not need M205 is that some detailers claim they can finish off pretty well with the M105 by itself; I suppose this entails knocking down speed and pressure of course. I'm sure they don't claim it finishes as well as 85RD or something, but perhaps enough for +95% of the world.


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## Alpine300ZHP (Jan 31, 2007)

Guys. I did my car over the weekend and ended up just washing, claying and waxing it. The clay got off a ton of surface dirt and removed the water spots. My problem is that I have some hazing in different spots. It may have been from the claying as I picked a medium aggressive clay in hopes it would remove the water spots, which it did. What do you guys suggest I use to get rid of haze. Guy at the Drivers Seat suggested Pinnacle Finishing Polish and rewax.


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## AndrewBigA (Jun 11, 2009)

:angel:hi guiys!


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## Alpine300ZHP (Jan 31, 2007)

Andrew. Any tips on best product to get rid of the haze marks that came from claying? I have to get product that works by hand.


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## AndrewBigA (Jun 11, 2009)

Alpine300ZHP said:


> Andrew. Any tips on best product to get rid of the haze marks that came from claying? I have to get product that works by hand.


what type of clay bar did you use? at least a light polish, depends how bad the haze is.


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