# 39.2 Software out for ZHP



## MicahO (Apr 19, 2004)

salvo said:


> How do you know its a hardware problem?


Because I read, and I post this from time to time, and no one else seems to read it, or make the connection.

There is a planned disruption in airflow at 4100 RPM. It is unavoidable in our dual-runner intakes. Without it, you would have less power in either the upper or lower RPM range. It's an engineering compromise, and the physical evidence is A) more useable power across the bulk of the engine's powerband, and B) a very minor dip in production of power, at a very specific engine speed. That's your hardware problem.

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showpost.php?p=938056

(from Andy's ZHP Dyno thread.)


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## stylinexpat (May 23, 2004)

*I'm not sure about that as other cars have this same air-flow*

and I also tried running the car with the Union 76 Racing Fuel which is higher Octane at about 100. I mixed about 25% of this fuel and the rest with Super Unleaded. Guess what.? Half of the Power Dip Vanished.... It has something to do with the Fuel and Software I believe, I could be wrong but I'm quite sure.. Mechanically these inline suxes are quite good and well engineered. This car has some Windows Bug in it  Maybe we need Norton to help?? :angel:


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## salvo (Feb 28, 2004)

I understand the mechanical explanation, but ultimately the computer software controls the opening and closing...correct?

e.g. "The resonance system provides increased engine torque at low RPM,as well as additional power at high RPM. Both of these features are obtained by using a resonance flap (in the intake manifold)controlled by the ECM."-page 38

Therefore, the ECM, if reprogrammed (sorry I was just distracted by some dude dressed as a pink bunny...holy crap this company takes Halloween too seriously, anyways)...maybe some cars have it worse than others...because I think that my dip is too noticeable, too variable...not normal...does this make sense?


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## stylinexpat (May 23, 2004)

*If Opening and closing was the problem....*

The disconnecting the device would cure the problem as the thing would remain open the whole time. We tried that already, still the same dip oocurs at 4000 RPMS, it is a bit better but it is not the whole or main problem. That part is easy to disconnect, if this was true then after disconnecting it the problem would vanish but it doesn't..


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## MicahO (Apr 19, 2004)

I do think quality of fuel matters a LOT with these engines - the tank I'm currently running is a fill up from Dutchess County NY, and the pump noted that it was 10% ethanol. The thing is sputtering and bucking quite a bit - this is the low-RPM stall problem for which there should be a software fix available. Good fuel quality makes it less present.

Fuel quality may also help the motor compensate for other items.

As far as the opening or closing of the resonance flap - it's either open or closed, and there is an engine speed at which it opens, and an engine speed at which it closes. It does not appear to be (from the description) a graduated opening/closing process. Further, from other documents regarding the M54 family, the engine speed at which the flap opens and closes may vary from model to model, i.e. the X5 3.0's resonance flap may be programmed to open at a somewhat different speed than the e46. So yes, the software can change to a different engine speed for the open or the close.

Nevertheless - it's open, or it's closed, and when it opens, there is a disturbance in airflow as the two streams of air mix. That's the hardware problem - there is a flap that is open or closed, period.

The hardware solution is the variable length runner system found on the latest generation of engines. Yes, there is software that controls these new systems, but that software cannot make our two-stage intake anything more than a two stage system. What we feel is the boundary between the two stages.


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## salvo (Feb 28, 2004)

Is this problem more prevalent with those states (like CA) that are highly regulated by the EPA?? 93 octane is the highest octane rating because of all the alcholol additives... 
Damn tree huggers!


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## stylinexpat (May 23, 2004)

*You are correct..*



MicahO said:


> I do think quality of fuel matters a LOT with these engines - the tank I'm currently running is a fill up from Dutchess County NY, and the pump noted that it was 10% ethanol. The thing is sputtering and bucking quite a bit - this is the low-RPM stall problem for which there should be a software fix available. Good fuel quality makes it less present.
> 
> Fuel quality may also help the motor compensate for other items.
> 
> ...


It is either open or closed, so if one was to disconnect it to leave it open why does it dip while opened at 4000 RPM'S? :eeps:


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## brkf (May 26, 2003)

salvo said:


> Is this problem more prevalent with those states (like CA) that are highly regulated by the EPA?? 93 octane is the highest octane rating because of all the alcholol additives...
> Damn tree huggers!


Never had a single engine problem with my zhp...well except that it has little power, but I think that's just a general problem with their inline 6s.


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## salvo (Feb 28, 2004)

How do you know that you really disconnected it? Are you a mechanic? I'm not questioning your ability...it's the simple explanation. It sounds like an integral part of the engine...strange you could toggle it on or off with such ease. :dunno:


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## MicahO (Apr 19, 2004)

stylinexpat said:


> It is either open or closed, so if one was to disconnect it to leave it open why does it dip while opened at 4000 RPM'S? :eeps:


You're sure about what you disconnected?

I feel the hesitation, sometimes, when I really get on it. I see it on paper as well, it's evidenced on nearly every dyno chart I've seen on these motors. I just don't know what everyone is so worked up about, or why so much energy gets expended on such a trivial item.

Would people be happier if BMW did NOT have this sort of system affixed? If there was NOT a hesitation, but there was less available power as a result of having a 'normal' one-stage intake?

Oh well - that's enough of my time.


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## swchang (Oct 5, 2003)

blueguydotcom said:


> Never had a single engine problem with my zhp...well except that it has little power, but I think that's just a general problem with their inline 6s.


Have you driven an M3?


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## stylinexpat (May 23, 2004)

*The part on the side is easy to disconnect*



salvo said:


> How do you know that you really disconnected it? Are you a mechanic? I'm not questioning your ability...it's the simple explanation. It sounds like an integral part of the engine...strange you could toggle it on or off with such ease. :dunno:


There is also a plug on the side. If you unplug it, it stays open. To make sure you can take it apart and see that when the car is turned off it is open. Unplug it while the car is off and it stays open. Give it gas and listen to see if the flap opens or closes and you hear nothing. Plug it back in and listen again. It will open and close as you rev the engine.


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## brkf (May 26, 2003)

swchang said:


> Have you driven an M3?


No. I'm talking about the 2.5 and 3.0 which I've found to be wanting. Give the torque numbers on the 3.2 and the stratospheric redline, I can't say I have a good feeling about it either. I'll drive one eventually. Odds are good though, I'll just abandon BMW when my lease is up (or god willing, someone steals my ZHP).


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## MicahO (Apr 19, 2004)

stylinexpat said:


> There is also a plug on the side. If you unplug it, it stays open. To make sure you can take it apart and see that when the car is turned off it is open. Unplug it while the car is off and it stays open. Give it gas and listen to see if the flap opens or closes and you hear nothing. Plug it back in and listen again. It will open and close as you rev the engine.


The idle control valve is in the same vicinity - that may have been what you were unplugging?

Were you actually revving the car at the curb past 4100 rpm to see if it would open and close, and could you actually hear something over all that engine noise at 4100 rpm? :yikes:


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## stylinexpat (May 23, 2004)

*Can be heard and felt with your ear right by it*

if you have someone in the drivers side reving the engine. I don't think that this is the full cause of the problem, I maybe wrong but I don't think that this is the cause of the problem.


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## salvo (Feb 28, 2004)

Took the car in for an oil change and mentioned the 4k problem and service bulletin for upgrade...they told me...cant find the bulletin and your software is up to date. I must say, that the lull is not as pronounced as before...whatever...  

By the way, BMW of SF was pretty good...I would go back to them. My SA was Chris Lullman. :thumbup:


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## apar330i (Aug 19, 2002)

salvo said:


> Took the car in for an oil change and mentioned the 4k problem and service bulletin for upgrade...they told me...cant find the bulletin and your software is up to date. I must say, that the lull is not as pronounced as before...whatever...
> 
> By the way, BMW of SF was pretty good...I would go back to them. My SA was Chris Lullman. :thumbup:


Same here. I mentioned 39.2 and the SA said he had nothing on it.


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## missing23 (Feb 1, 2002)

apar330i said:


> Same here. I mentioned 39.2 and the SA said he had nothing on it.


Taking my car in Wednesday (N. Scottsdale) for 39.2 and fuel gauge fix...


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## RSPDiver (Jul 14, 2004)

I received the, "You have no active campaigns on your car, so there is no software identified..." line from my SA. Supposedly, from his view on the "system" he couldn't search for updates (which I gave him the number of.) A tech was there, too, and it almost seemed like was biting his tongue when I mentioned that this is a pretty significant issue, and lots of folks are taking about it on BMW onlie forums. He sure is pleasant, which is probably a good thing. He said to call him in a week. Maybe I'll call time & temperature instead for lip service, and then lodge a more formal complaint to him.


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## missing23 (Feb 1, 2002)

RSPDiver said:


> I received the, "You have no active campaigns on your car, so there is no software identified..." line from my SA. Supposedly, from his view on the "system" he couldn't search for updates (which I gave him the number of.) A tech was there, too, and it almost seemed like was biting his tongue when I mentioned that this is a pretty significant issue, and lots of folks are taking about it on BMW onlie forums. He sure is pleasant, which is probably a good thing. He said to call him in a week. Maybe I'll call time & temperature instead for lip service, and then lodge a more formal complaint to him.


Sounds like he doesn't know jack...call the dealership and ask to speak with the Technical Service Manager...he will know all about SW39.


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## wheel-man (Sep 28, 2004)

sorry i haven't gotten beck sooner to y'all.

impressions after 200miles with 39.2 upgrade... no rough idle after initial start-up and engine warm-up. haven't broken the engine in yet so can't comment on the 4k rpm dip, but based on the design of the manifold, there should be no difference.

car seems it has a little more zip at lower rpm, but the engine is breaking in so can't really judge if its from the 39.2 upgrade.

although, my baby seems a little more tempermental with cooler temps. anyone else experience this?

will be scheduling to have my winter tires put on and will ask about the bulletin for the 39.2 software.

cheers.


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## salvo (Feb 28, 2004)

Can someone produce this darn bulletin? :dunno: 
My SA told me to print it out and bring it with me...


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## MicahO (Apr 19, 2004)

salvo said:


> Can someone produce this darn bulletin? :dunno:
> My SA told me to print it out and bring it with me...


Ditto that!!!



wheel-man said:


> car seems it has a little more zip at lower rpm, but the engine is breaking in so can't really judge if its from the 39.2 upgrade.
> 
> although, my baby seems a little more tempermental with cooler temps. anyone else experience this?


You'll keep noticing it breaking in - I noticed a big loosening between 1500 and 2000 miles, and again just around 4500. One helluva motor.....

I noticed the temperamental difference as soon as the 'winter' gas (oxygenated and 10% ethanol) hit the local tanks. Sucks eggs.


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## stylinexpat (May 23, 2004)

*Service Managr said there isn't a fix out yet that*

was meant to address the 4000 RPM Dip problem


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## apar330i (Aug 19, 2002)

greginaz1 said:


> Taking my car in Wednesday (N. Scottsdale) for 39.2 and fuel gauge fix...


I guess I'll have to get with them again. What happened to your fuel gauge?


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## missing23 (Feb 1, 2002)

apar330i said:


> I guess I'll have to get with them again. What happened to your fuel gauge?


It implies that I have a perpetually full tank...if only it were true...first thing to go wrong with this car though...23K miles...


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## Solid (Feb 3, 2003)

I got a appoitment with BMW Seattle for v39.23 which they have on site. They also said it does address the 4k power dip.


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## JAWJr (May 4, 2004)

I didn't notice any rough idling with mine in Europe, but while flooring it after a toll booth I would feel the "step" just after 4K rpm. I wonder if mine came with the update? It was a first week September build.


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## Solid (Feb 3, 2003)

I think v39.2 just came out, so you probably don't have it.



JAWJr said:


> I didn't notice any rough idling with mine in Europe, but while flooring it after a toll booth I would feel the "step" just after 4K rpm. I wonder if mine came with the update? It was a first week September build.


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## wheel-man (Sep 28, 2004)

Solid said:


> I think v39.2 just came out, so you probably don't have it.


no it came out 1d prior to starting this thread and i've had it now since. will be going in next week for my snow wheels and will get a copy of the bulletin for 39.2 and post it. when i called they were too busy to get me the info.


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## apar330i (Aug 19, 2002)

greginaz1 said:


> It implies that I have a perpetually full tank...if only it were true...first thing to go wrong with this car though...23K miles...


That would be nice. So far my only problem was with the moonroof clips breaking. I only have 5K miles so I would hope there isn't much going wrong.


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## BavarianDoc (Apr 23, 2003)

Is that for ZHP coupes too or just for ZHP sedans?


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## azurribaggio (Dec 29, 2003)

I've got a non zhp 330ci and experience the problem as well.


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## missing23 (Feb 1, 2002)

OK, just got SW version 39.2 loaded on my 03 ZHP and I have to say it 'feels' SOLID!

The idle and path to redline is MUCH smoother. There is no 4K power drop (which I had experienced before sporatically), in fact the car actually feels like it has gained some HP/torque. Keep in mind I only drove it for about 20 miles after the reprogram but I should have a pretty good feel for this car as I had 23K miles on it under the old DME software.

I HIGHLY recommend getting this software loaded.


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## Rich_Jenkins (Jul 12, 2003)

[email protected]: I was driving Master Wingspan home tonight (I'd burned him a CD with Blur's "Song #2" and he had it going full blast, but that's another story...) so I decided to see if I still had the association of lousy idle with turning the A/C off and rolling down the windows.

Well, I turned off the A/C and opened the windows/roof, and not only was the idle really rough all the way home, but it actually died on me once :eeps:

1) anyone have an actual copy/link to this service bulletin describing 39.2?
2) anyone else prove/disprove the theory that its associated with the A/C somehow?


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## missing23 (Feb 1, 2002)

wingspan said:


> [email protected]: I was driving Master Wingspan home tonight (I'd burned him a CD with Blur's "Song #2" and he had it going full blast, but that's another story...) so I decided to see if I still had the association of lousy idle with turning the A/C off and rolling down the windows.
> 
> Well, I turned off the A/C and opened the windows/roof, and not only was the idle really rough all the way home, but it actually died on me once :eeps:
> 
> ...


Why don't you just go get 39.2 loaded?


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## RSPDiver (Jul 14, 2004)

wingspan said:


> 2) anyone else prove/disprove the theory that its associated with the A/C somehow?


I have experienced it after very brief spirited romps followed abruptly by a stoppage of traffic (sudden red light). Tach dances all over the 500-1200 RPM range. I've had it die twice after the fuel-light fill-up, and once or twice at a normal stop to join traffic. I rarely use the AC, so no real data there; just similar issues w/out AC involved.


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## Rich_Jenkins (Jul 12, 2003)

greginaz1 said:


> Why don't you just go get 39.2 loaded?


Greg - Yup, on the list, just really crazy busy at work right at the minute (my crew is planning a major release for our IT system in November, followed by another release in December.)


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## azurribaggio (Dec 29, 2003)

wingspan said:


> Greg - Yup, on the list, just really crazy busy at work right at the minute (my crew is planning a major release for our IT system in November, followed by another release in December.)


Excuses Excuses....


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## stylinexpat (May 23, 2004)

*Savage BMW Dealership Service Manager*

Claims that there is no 39.2 Software out and says he has a 39.1 Software version out to address Idle and stall problem. :tsk: He also claims he has no idea about the Power dip problem as he hasn't heard of it before :yikes: :dunno: I asked him if anyone brought there car in with this problem and he said no and it wasn't brought to his attention. He was kind enough to return calls and answer questions but claims that he hasn't heard of this issue or problem and says that he doesn't know of a Software update from BMW of North America for this as the Bulletin in 39.1 did not mention this problem and he doesn't have 39.2 as if BMW had one they would have received it :tsk:


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## Ashe too (Dec 22, 2001)

Took my car in for 1st oil service today at 13,333 miles. I mentioned the idle and stall problem and showed the service writer this thread. When I picked up the car, the service writer and the tech who did the work took me to the bay where they performed the DME upgrade to 39.1. They showed me that 39.1 was the latest thing they had, and they gave me a tech bulletin referencing this issue (which I'll post when I get home to my scanner). The tech said he's have a couple of these come in and the 39.1 fix has worked. He also mentioned that before 39.1 (which is probably the 2nd iteration in the 39.x family...39.0 then 39.1), they had to ship out the DME to be reprogrammed. So, it sounded to me like he was familiar with the issue and the fix. So far, no stumbles at idle, rough idles or stalls.

As for the infamous 4000 rpm dip, after 30 years of driving, I can't say that I've ever owned a car that didn't have variations or fluctuations in the torque and power curves at different points along the powerband. To me, at something just over 4000 rpm, it's more like the car surges with a bit more power rather than like it was loosing power and then came back strong. It feels a little like when the secondaries open up on a 4 barrel carburetor. At the lower RPM, it's fairly torquey, then the VANOS and variable intake runners work their magic to let it really breath up high in the rev range. My point is that I don't think there's a fix for the problem because the slightly stepped torque/power curve doesn't mean that it's a problem. The engine is doing exactly what it's supposed to and this is the way a small displacement motor feels when variable valve timing and variable intake technologies are at work.

If you think this car is torqueless, drive a pre-vanos BMW and notice that there is almost nothing below 3500 rpm but the increase in power feels more seamless as revs climb. I'll take the gutsier low end and stepped power/torque curve any day over the gutless low-end and too peaky high-end of the older engines.


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## MicahO (Apr 19, 2004)

Ashe too said:


> It feels a little like when the secondaries open up on a 4 barrel carburetor.


Excellent comparison - can't beleive I hadn't thought of it that way myself. I had a 1983 Mustang GT long ago, the last of the carbureted 5.0's. It had a vacuum-secondary Holley on it - the secondaries looked like flush toilets compared to the primaries. When those opened up, you knew it, and no one complained about it. And there's no 'fix' to that sort of fact of physics in a mechanical, dual-stage system.

(WOT - what a car that was - last of the carburetors, last of the 4 speed sticks. Cam, 1-3/4 headers and no egr, was running around 300hp, and ate Corvettes and Grand Nationals. 2.73 posi rear, thing did 75 in second gear, and got 27mpg at 75mph. And my 15 year old brother totalled it 7 hours after I left for basic training...... :bawling: )


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## Ashe too (Dec 22, 2001)

WOT2 - I had a '69 Pontiac GTO with a 400 H.O. that had a vacuum operated Rochester spread bore 4 bbl. I put Ansa split duals on it - nice Italian exhaust on an American hot rod! What a great car that was. Another car I had that exhibited a stepped power band was a '97 gen 5 Honda Prelude with the VTEC engine. At 5900 RPM, the variable valve technology changed the valve timing as well as lift and duration. It pulled nicely to 5900, then it just screamed to 7500 RPM. It was a much more pronounced difference than the BMW 3.0 with dual VANOS. Point is that I just don't think of it as being a design defect as much as it is just a characterisic of the motor.


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## RSPDiver (Jul 14, 2004)

I kind of use the 4k "pause" as a "stop now or the party begins" indicator. It sure was useful during breakin, but mildly annoying if your upshift puts you at about 3800 RPMs and you expect a nice smooth run up from there.


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## Eduardo (Jul 13, 2004)

wingspan said:


> 1) anyone have an actual copy/link to this service bulletin describing 39.2?
> 2) anyone else prove/disprove the theory that its associated with the A/C somehow?


I've been looking for the actual 39.2 Service bulletin...could this elusive service bulletin be a BMW urban myth???? :rofl: :eeps:


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## stylinexpat (May 23, 2004)

*4000 RPM Supposed to have power Surge*

Like when the 4 Barrels open up on a 4 Barrel Carb! There should not be a dip or any decrease but instead there should be a major power increase! We get the opposite :yikes: :tsk:


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## MicahO (Apr 19, 2004)

stylinexpat said:


> Like when the 4 Barrels open up on a 4 Barrel Carb! There should not be a dip or any decrease but instead there should be a major power increase! We get the opposite :yikes: :tsk:


So yesterday in a parking lot I saw one of my old GT's. Not exactly - this one was an '82, different body, but the same Pinto underneath. 4 speed stick, V8 under the hood, front brakes smaller than any rears I've seen on any road car lately, rear drums were like little ice-cream dishes. Single exhaust (I had upgraded on mine) and those horrible TRX 390 wheels and tires (I had upgraded to 15" on mine, if 15" was much of an upgrade!).

Lordy - it's been a long time since I saw one of those POS's. I've often thought of tracking one down and putting it in the barn for old-time's sake. NO CHANCE! Cars, and I, have come a long long way. But when I was young, it was a great damn car. Looking at the brakes it is no surprise I had that one off-road excursion. I can't believe that thing could stop at all....


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## Solid (Feb 3, 2003)

I just got the 39.2 DME upgrade this Saturday from BMW Seattle. It fixed my idle problems and the 4k power dip. :thumbup: 

I noticed before when the rpm's went under 1k the needle would move pretty fast down to 500-600 rpms. Now, once the needle goes below 1k rpms it moves allot slower and once at idle the needle doesn't move up and down (between 500-600 rpms) like it use to.

As for the power dip, It's completly eliminated, there is absolutely no signs of power loss. Prior to the upgrade is was VERY noticable.


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## MicahO (Apr 19, 2004)

Solid said:


> I just got the 39.2 DME upgrade this Saturday from BMW Seattle. It fixed my idle problems and the 4k power dip. :thumbup:
> 
> I noticed before when the rpm's went under 1k the needle would move pretty fast down to 500-600 rpms. Now, once the needle goes below 1k rpms it moves allot slower and once at idle the needle doesn't move up and down (between 500-600 rpms) like it use to.
> 
> As for the power dip, It's completly eliminated, there is absolutely no signs of power loss. Prior to the upgrade is was VERY noticable.


  You're running the factory software......

....with a blower?

At the very least I'd call you a less-than-perfect test sample. Not that I don't envy the power.... 

--Micah


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## stylinexpat (May 23, 2004)

*Glad to hear that yours went away but*



Solid said:


> I just got the 39.2 DME upgrade this Saturday from BMW Seattle. It fixed my idle problems and the 4k power dip. :thumbup:
> 
> I noticed before when the rpm's went under 1k the needle would move pretty fast down to 500-600 rpms. Now, once the needle goes below 1k rpms it moves allot slower and once at idle the needle doesn't move up and down (between 500-600 rpms) like it use to.
> 
> As for the power dip, It's completly eliminated, there is absolutely no signs of power loss. Prior to the upgrade is was VERY noticable.


Dealer here told me that the software was not addressed to solve the 4000 RPM power Dip. That is good news for you though? Which Blower you running on your 330?


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## Solid (Feb 3, 2003)

Running ASA SK1 on my ZHP.

MicahO:
Yup, Stock ECU adapts fine to the kit. It's actually a very good test for the dip, since the power loss i use to get is magnafied by the blower. It was very noticable.



stylinexpat said:


> Dealer here told me that the software was not addressed to solve the 4000 RPM power Dip. That is good news for you though? Which Blower you running on your 330?


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## IndyMike (Dec 19, 2001)

Took my '04 in for the one year anniversary oil change at 5348 miles :eeps: Told the SA to hook me up with whatever latest DME they were pushing. When he turned it back over to me he said the techie had upgraded it to v39 point deuce.

As a data point previously I'd had one misfire that was diagnosed as having occured in cylinder #3 while in Nurburg, Germany, during ED. After 10 minutes of shut down time it somehow cured itself. :dunno:

I've also had 4 or 5 idle fluctuations, and 3 complete stalls (all idling at a red light). 

On the 25 mile road home after the 'blood' transfusion and the software upgrade it felt noticeably stronger, like it had been injected with steroids. I've got some time off this week so I plan to really hustle it on some nice, curvy backroads in the vicinity of Bloomington. If I can manage to keep it out of somebody's cornfield I hope to report back with some positive preliminary info.


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## stylinexpat (May 23, 2004)

*Called up Service manager at Shelly BMW and got*

no reply back from him. Left him 2-3 messages but he never called back. That's what I call customer service for people dropping over $40K on a car :thumbup: Dealership hires people that don't get back with their customers :tsk: Called up BMW of North America and Bryan says he doesn't have access to any software updates on our cars and that we would ave to check with our dealerships about updates. Shouldn't BMW have a site for BMW owners to check to see if any Softwre updates are available kind of like what Microsoft does :yikes: ? They don't have this service available to their car buyers nor do their representatives at their head office know of the updates available :tsk:


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## Ashe too (Dec 22, 2001)

Here's the tech bulletin my SA printed out for me.


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## Eduardo (Jul 13, 2004)

Ashe too said:


> Here's the tech bulletin my SA printed out for me.


Cheers, mate! :thumbup:


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## MicahO (Apr 19, 2004)

Ashe too said:


> Here's the tech bulletin my SA printed out for me.


Thanks!


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## Gabe (Sep 20, 2004)

Note that the bulletin says 39.1, not 39.2, and also makes no mention of the 4k RPM power dip.


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## wheel-man (Sep 28, 2004)

sorry guys... got busy this week and forgot about getting the bulletin.

have to go back in to get my plates... will pick it up then.


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## JAWJr (May 4, 2004)

I'm going out on a limb here but have to ask a question:

I've heard a few people complain that a ZHP is slower than a regular 330 at lower rpm's. Being that the ZHP was designed a bit more for track use, such as how it has a higher redline so you can hold a gear through a corner at the track, is it possible that it is calibrated more like European-spec cars? Saying this I mean how a Euro-spec M3 is slightly slower than a US-spec M3 in a 0-60 race because it's designed for high speed power, not American friendly low speed power. And, is it possible that part of the slowness of a ZHP at low rpm's could be a software design, and that this was changed with the new 39.2? I'm just really curious about this because a few people have said their cars felt faster after the upgrade- and thought I'd seek the opinion of everyone here. 

Thanks

~Jon


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## killajoe (Apr 22, 2004)

*finally!!!*

Thanks for posting that Service Measure - much more credible to give my SM than "...I seen lot's of post on the net..."

killajoe


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## doeboy (Sep 20, 2002)

rumratt said:


> I've had my car 17 months and I've only seen it a few times. It usually comes after reasonably hard driving when sitting at at traffic light.
> 
> I wonder if the ZHP engine modifications exaggerate the problem somehow. :dunno:


Been almost 23 months for me... I've never felt this dip before... I've seen it manifest itself as a slight dip on my dyno chart, but I've never noticed it while driving... :dunno:


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## stylinexpat (May 23, 2004)

*Dealer told me that the ZHP had no ignition Coils recalls on it*



MysticBlue said:


> Called Rasmussen in Portland to make an appointment for my first oil service. (It will be at about 14,500.) I asked about the Ignition Coil issue and gave him the sevice bulletin number. He looked it up and said yup, my car is covered - they will replace them, no problem. I asked about the rough idle/stalling issue and new software; he knew exactly what I was talking about without me even explaining it and said they will update software to 39.2, no problem.
> My only point in relating this is so you know how a good, knowledgable dealer should respond to these issues.


The bulletin had nothing to say about coils for the ZHP models...? Or did it??


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## MysticBlue (Jun 20, 2003)

stylinexpat said:


> The bulletin had nothing to say about coils for the ZHP models...? Or did it??


My first instinct is to run screaming into the night rather than stir this hornets nest again, but here goes... ZHP is not a "model", it is just an option package.
For your information, you have a BMW 330i.


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## missing23 (Feb 1, 2002)

MysticBlue said:


> My first instinct is to run screaming into the night rather than stir this hornets nest again, but here goes... ZHP is not a "model", it is just an option package.
> For your information, you have a BMW 330i.


Last time I checked freedom of speech allows me to call it whatever I want...and ZHP it is...


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## Rich_Jenkins (Jul 12, 2003)

MysticBlue said:


> My first instinct is to run screaming into the night rather than stir this hornets nest again, but here goes... ZHP is not a "model", it is just an option package.
> For your information, you have a BMW 330i.


Bzzzzzz...Bzzzzzzzz...Bzzzzzzzz : popcorn:


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## Arthur (Sep 11, 2004)

Eduardo said:


> Reading through this thread I was wondering if the software update is applicable to 330i ZHP Manuals *AND * Automatics?


Thats what I was wondering. I have an automatic and it hauls ass. Is this a manual issue, my car's idle and horsepower have never seemed off. It is a 4/04 build.


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## johnnygraphic (Jun 26, 2004)

*Another Hornets Nest*

Arthur & Eduardo-Automatic is just an option, not a car...Just kidding! I couldn't resist.

Anyway, I've got close to 5k on my car now & only have experienced it 2x-both when the car was fairly new. Otherwise, it has been a real strong performer. I have also noticed the 4k RPM dip. It does seem to occur normally. It doesn't really bother me too much. When I bring it in for a 7500 mile oil change, I will address it along with a few other minor things.

Yes, my car is a 'row your own' ZHP optioned 330i. Is that o.k.???

Johnny


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## MysticBlue (Jun 20, 2003)

greginaz1 said:


> Last time I checked freedom of speech allows me to call it whatever I want...and ZHP it is...


Yes, last time I checked, you can call it whatever you want. I was refering to the TSB which clearly states E46 330i with M54 engine and gives build dates. If options like PP, ZHP, Sunroof were relevent, it would say that. When you asked an inappropriate question, like does it refer to ZHP models, I only pointed out that that was an oxy-moron as it relates to the subject at hand. Sorry if I offended your sensibilities while trying to inform those who asked.


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## sun8dog (Apr 15, 2003)

How can you tell what version of software is programmed on the DME? Thanks


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## stylinexpat (May 23, 2004)

*Sorry if I stirred your Nest of Hornets*



MysticBlue said:


> My first instinct is to run screaming into the night rather than stir this hornets nest again, but here goes... ZHP is not a "model", it is just an option package.
> For your information, you have a BMW 330i.


I thought it would be a different Model by BMW as it used a different computer and different Engine. If you had the same exact cars that used different Engines and ECU's wouldn't they be different model cars? :dunno:


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## Arthur (Sep 11, 2004)

johnnygraphic said:


> Arthur & Eduardo-Automatic is just an option, not a car...Just kidding! I couldn't resist.
> 
> Anyway, I've got close to 5k on my car now & only have experienced it 2x-both when the car was fairly new. Otherwise, it has been a real strong performer. I have also noticed the 4k RPM dip. It does seem to occur normally. It doesn't really bother me too much. When I bring it in for a 7500 mile oil change, I will address it along with a few other minor things.
> 
> ...


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## cwsqbm (Aug 4, 2004)

greginaz1 said:


> Last time I checked freedom of speech allows me to call it whatever I want...and ZHP it is...


And the rest of us can then call it the PeePee.  I've never seen so much fighting over a 10hp option. Now, if it made 15 more hp, I'd understand.


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## missing23 (Feb 1, 2002)

cwsqbm said:


> And the rest of us can then call it the PeePee.  I've never seen so much fighting over a 10hp option. Now, if it made 15 more hp, I'd understand.


I don't care about what other people call it (PeePee is pretty lame BTW), or say about it, I just know the ZHP equipped 330 truly differentiates itself from plain old commodity 330's...it is nice to have something different from the masses. The 10HP is not that big of a deal but the alcantara seats, M styling, shifter, suspension changes are...to me anyway and that is all that matters.


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## missing23 (Feb 1, 2002)

MysticBlue said:


> Yes, last time I checked, you can call it whatever you want. I was refering to the TSB which clearly states E46 330i with M54 engine and gives build dates. If options like PP, ZHP, Sunroof were relevent, it would say that. When you asked an inappropriate question, like does it refer to ZHP models, I only pointed out that that was an oxy-moron as it relates to the subject at hand. Sorry if I offended your sensibilities while trying to inform those who asked.


BTW, I didn't ask that 'inappropriate' question though it would make sense to me that 39.2 has a ZHP version since I believe the engine software on ZHP's is different than on commodity 330's.

As for offending me... :rofl: ...you aren't that important...


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## FenPhen (Jan 13, 2004)

cwsqbm said:


> I've never seen so much fighting over a 10hp option. Now, if it made 15 more hp, I'd understand.


It's a 0.5-second option... :eeps:


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## Andy (Jul 16, 2003)

FenPhen said:


> It's a 0.5-second option... :eeps:


 :thumbup:


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## swchang (Oct 5, 2003)

I brought my car in requesting 39.2, but supposedly got 39.1 instead. I say supposedly because I still have the same problems I had before. Namely, whenever I'm in first gear and I clutch in, the engine will occasionally die. No shaking or anything, but the engine dies. Is this something you guys have experienced previous to but not after getting the fix? Also, I noticed my revs at idle are the same as before.

During the same visit, I was also told I have no CDV. Hmm...


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## shizat63 (Feb 14, 2002)

How can one find out what rev the DME is at? My '05 idles perfectly and hasn't stalled once. 

Full disclosure, only 800 miles thus far


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## adc (Apr 1, 2003)

swchang said:


> whenever I'm in first gear and I clutch in, the engine will occasionally die. No shaking or anything, but the engine dies. Is this something you guys have experienced previous to but not after getting the fix?


Yes, exactly so. I have 3-400 miles since the 39.2 and (knock on wood) so far, so good.

Go back to the dealer and request the latest version, which is 39.2.

adc
03 330 ZHP


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## RSPDiver (Jul 14, 2004)

I thought you WERE having those issues, schwang...*wink wink, nudge nudge*

shizat, the service advisory goes *TO* June 04 build date, but since mine was a June 04 build, I was able to fenagle getting it. I'm hoping yours was built with the fix, since it came out on this side of the pond a couple of months ago.


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