# Factory Paint Defect Compensation



## jsmith97321 (May 25, 2013)

Hello,

One week ago (on a cloudy day) my wife and I picked up our new 2014 Z4 35IS, which was ordered back in June. The car is awesome and well worth the wait. It is so much fun to drive. 

A few days later when the sun was out, I noticed what looked like some dark shadows on the driver's side rocker panel (Melbourne Metallic Red). Upon closer inspection, there is a paint defect under the clear coat. It looks like not enough paint was sprayed on parts of the rocker panel and the darker under coat is showing through. 

I have contacted the dealer, and have an appointment with the BMW After Sales Manager in a few days. I don't expect to have any issue getting the panel replaced or repainted.

My concerns are that a re-spray is never as good as factory paint, especially after spending that much on a new BMW. The hassle of after having the car less than two weeks it will be in for service for several days, not to mention the dealership is a hour drive each way.

Can anyone tell me what additional compensation I can expect or should ask for beyond just repainting the panel? 

I feel like additional compensation is in order, but also want to be reasonable. I was going to ask for the 2yr BMW extended warranty. I really like the Z4 and can see myself being a repeat customer if this is handled well by BMW NA. 

Please share your opinions and experiences,

Thanks in advance


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## ctorrey (Mar 17, 2007)

I'm curious to see how this is handled as well. Not to be snarky, but totally snarky, I would say that a respray would actually be better than the factory paint at this point. Seriously though, there are a number of cases where new cars are damaged during shipment and are repaired at the VPC before delivery. From what I have read on this board, the repairs are invisible in most cases.

Good luck and please share!


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## alex2364 (May 8, 2006)

ctorrey said:


> I'm curious to see how this is handled as well. Not to be snarky, but totally snarky, I would say that a respray would actually be better than the factory paint at this point. Seriously though, there are a number of cases where new cars are damaged during shipment and are repaired at the VPC before delivery. From what I have read on this board, the repairs are invisible in most cases.
> 
> Good luck and please share!


A respray is never as good as factory paint. The repair might be invisible to the naked eye, but it can easily be seen with a paint meter. In addition, a dealer repair is not anywhere near the same as a VPC repair. Dealers usually send off body work to 3rd party shops.

As far as what to do in this situation, I'd ask around and find the best paint shop in the area. Insist on only getting the work done at that shop.


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## Ilovemycar (Feb 19, 2010)

The rocker panel is plastic, right? IMO, not a big deal, have it removed, sanded, repainted, baked for cure, reinstalled. JMO. There are people having plastic panels redone here on a nearly daily basis. Metal panel, that would have been a bummer. 

Of course this is assuming that this is actually a paint defect (super ultra rare), and not just contamination. You sure it's not something like... leftover cosmoline that wasn't completely removed perhaps, just grasping at straws...


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## jsmith97321 (May 25, 2013)

Ilovemycar said:


> The rocker panel is plastic, right? IMO, not a big deal, have it removed, sanded, repainted, baked for cure, reinstalled. JMO. There are people having plastic panels redone here on a nearly daily basis. Metal panel, that would have been a bummer.
> 
> Of course this is assuming that this is actually a paint defect (super ultra rare), and not just contamination. You sure it's not something like... leftover cosmoline that wasn't completely removed perhaps, just grasping at straws...


Hello and thanks for the reply.

Yes, it appears to be an actual defect. I have shown it to several BMW buddies and they all agree. The area is hard to notice in anything other than direct sunlight as it looks like shadows. In direct sunlight there shouldn't be any shadows, so it is most noticeable. When you get very close and look, you can see the thin/missing top coat paint, and you see the under coat showing through - the area also feels not as smooth as the rest of the car, slightly bumpy, like an orange. The clear coat seems to be fine.

The defect runs down the entire length of the rocker panel, and is worse toward the rear tire.

Any feedback on compensation????


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## Ilovemycar (Feb 19, 2010)

jsmith97321 said:


> Hello and thanks for the reply.
> 
> Yes, it appears to be an actual defect. I have shown it to several BMW buddies and they all agree. The area is hard to notice in anything other than direct sunlight as it looks like shadows. In direct sunlight there shouldn't be any shadows, so it is most noticeable. When you get very close and look, you can see the thin/missing top coat paint, and you see the under coat showing through - the area also feels not as smooth as the rest of the car, slightly bumpy, like an orange. The clear coat seems to be fine.
> 
> ...


I see! I am sorry that I do not know what to say about compensation, I suppose that could be a personal, situation-to-situation type of thing... I hope you are taken care of though.


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## jsmith97321 (May 25, 2013)

*Photo*

Signature updated with photo!!!!!


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## ard (Jul 1, 2009)

jsmith97321 said:


> My concerns are that a re-spray is never as good as factory paint, especially after spending that much on a new BMW. The hassle of after having the car less than two weeks it will be in for service for several days, not to mention the dealership is a hour drive each way.
> 
> Can anyone tell me what additional compensation I can expect or should ask for beyond just repainting the panel?
> 
> I feel like additional compensation is in order, but also want to be reasonable. I was going to ask for the 2yr BMW extended warranty. I really like the Z4 and can see myself being a repeat customer if this is handled well by BMW NA.





alex2364 said:


> A respray is never as good as factory paint. The repair might be invisible to the naked eye, but it can easily be seen with a paint meter. In addition, a dealer repair is not anywhere near the same as a VPC repair. Dealers usually send off body work to 3rd party shops.
> 
> As far as what to do in this situation, I'd ask around and find the best paint shop in the area. Insist on only getting the work done at that shop.


1. You will get no compensation. They will fix the defect, which is the extent of their obligation. They will purport to use methods that are approved by BMW and equivalent.

2. BMW paint sucks. It is EASY to get superior paint from a high quality shop

3. I categorically reject the oft-repeated assertion that the VPC paint is superior to other paint shops- nonsense. Nor is 'factory' paint superior. VPC does nothing more than what any other shop can do... BMW and BMW dealers and BMW salesmen have a vested interest in perpetuation this fallacy, as it puts peoples mind at rest. Nobody has an interest in setting the record straight. Does the VPC strip out the entire interior, and dunk the body into the chromate wash prior to primer,, then paint? No. They do repairs the way any high quality shop does.

Id love to hear CONCRETE examples of how their methods differ from state of the art repair.

IMO

4. Dont get too twisted up about 'being wronged'...it will needlessly ruin your experience. Had this been detected by the dealer they could have fixed it and you'd be non the wiser...

5. Only if this repair will be reported as a repair could you justify a claim for compensation for diminished value. But I dont think they will. People have had FAR worse repair issues and were offered a month of lease payments or a set of floor mats. Like a month in the shop. A week to perfectly paint a rocker wont cut it.

Sorry


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## JoeFromPA (Jan 21, 2007)

Agreed with previous post. This is not a significant issue, though it may suck on your brand new vehicle. 

That being said, a high quality re-paint on a brand new car could easily be superior to the factory paint job. But the goal is not to make it superior - the goal is to make it a dead on match. The factory paint may have significant orange peel - the goal of the paint shop is to MATCH that orange peel so that you can't tell where the old and new paint is. So bear that in mind.

BMW is responsible for fixing the defect and providing you with a loaner car during the experience. This is no different than if your car at 2,000 miles had a mechanical defect that needed to be fixed. Would you expect some sort of warranty give away for that? Probably not.

This will not be posted to your car's carfax/autocheck history. It is not an accident. A paint-meter MAY be able to detect the difference, but this is not going to have any effect whatsoever on trade-in value since it was not an accident.

Rant: People think that paintwork somehow depreciates the car's value. These aren't classic ferraris or other vehicles. They are also new and most likely traded-in in a few years. This is the equivalent of touching up rock chips on the front end - it involved no panel replacement and is just paintwork. There is no hit to the car's value at this time.


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## mrblahh (Oct 9, 2006)

only thing that detracts is if it's not caught right away. if it's fixed years later a respray is hard to match due to sun fade


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## BimmerBahn (Nov 24, 2005)

jsmith97321 said:


> Signature updated with photo!!!!!


B-E-A-Utiful Automobile! :thumbup::bigpimp:


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## Ilovemycar (Feb 19, 2010)

I, for one, do not think BMW paint sucks. At least on any BMW I've leveled clearcoat on, but the newest MY I've touched is about 2008. I own a paint gauge, but not an ultrasound based one, let alone one that can distinguish clear/CF/fiberglass...

Define besting factory paint "easily". 

The most knowledgeable detailer I've ever come across anywhere has said that the most expensive part of your car is the paint job, outside of a handful of exotics (and if you saw Ferrari orange peel, it would be easier to believe), it costs more than your chassis including the cost of its metal.

The last BMW video that addressed the painting process (which I can't relocate right now), had the panels go through 13 tanks, taken off and reorganized to come back later again for the best possible matching. 

If a good paint shop "easily" bests factory paint, well I know for sure one criterion will be a really big budget. 

BMW paint is superior to many brands IMO, in thickness and in quality. Maybe not quite as hard as Lexus, and not Audi, but closer to those than most any of the other makes. Thickness seems to be pretty close from what I remember. 

Repainted metal panel will actually read much THICKER. But thick doesn't tell you much, for instance the clearcoat can still be razor thin. You would need a very expensive PTG to read that. 

I just don't understand some of the BMW paint sucks comments that float around here. 

Thinnest paint you'll ever typically see if Mazda. But at least that clear has some resistance, from what I've seen Toyota is like warm butter. Outside of their single stage white of course, the hardest paint in the world.


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## jsmith97321 (May 25, 2013)

Hey Guys,

Thanks for the comments, keep them coming!!


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## Robert A (May 18, 2003)

You're two weeks in to the car? Ask the dealer (nicely) if they'll pick up one of your monthly payments. Can't hurt to try.

BMW prides itself on the quality of their paints. I wouldn't be surprised if the dealership will go that far.


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## beashonda (Feb 17, 2008)

Ilovemycar said:


> I, for one, do not think BMW paint sucks. At least on any BMW I've leveled clearcoat on, but the newest MY I've touched is about 2008. I own a paint gauge, but not an ultrasound based one, let alone one that can distinguish clear/CF/fiberglass...
> 
> Define besting factory paint "easily".
> 
> ...


Very true about Mazda. I owned one many, many cars ago and there were crazy paint chips down to base coat fri. Daily driving on the expressway, which was paved. Some road construction going on, but not enough for that much chipping. Had district manager look at it and thy were like..ohhhhhh. The offered to repaint. I decided to trade.


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## jsmith97321 (May 25, 2013)

*Resolved!!!!!*

Hey guys, OP here with an update:

I met with the Service Manager and the After Sales Manager to show them the paint defect. They were both very nice to deal with. The Z4 was parked in the shade, but as soon as I backed it out into the sun shine they both immediately noticed the defect. The ASM immediately agreed they would take care of it. The passenger side panel also had a small defect. He agreed to have both sides re sprayed.

We talked for a while as he had just traded in his Z4. We talked about the body shop that would perform the work and how the repair would be made. The SM said he could even arrange for me to be present during the repair.

As the conversation lulled, I asked the ASM what additional compensation I could expect. The ASM hesitated and said they had some nice accessories in the parts department. I told him I was thinking more alone the lines of a warrantee extension. We talked for a minute, and he agreed to extend my warrantee to 6yr, 100K mi as part of good will.

I'm sure nothing would have been offered if I had not asked, but at the same time, I didn't have to make much of a case. I just simply asked.

It was a great experience and exceeded my expectations. Both the SM & ASM were very nice, professional and understanding. It was the kind of experience that makes someone a repeat customer.

I will drop the Z4 off next week for the repair which will take an estimated 4 days.

Thanks again to everyone that responded with an opinion. After I read them all, I wasn't sure what to expect, but it turned out to be a great experience.

This is my first BMW, so I'm not sure if all dealerships are like this, but so far the buying experience and service has been excellent.

:rofl::bigpimp::rofl:


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## Ilovemycar (Feb 19, 2010)

Damn!

I wish my car came with a paint defect! :rofl:

With an offer like that, I wouldn't want to cause any issues, but when you say you can be present for repair, that makes me feel like it's going to be a quick job... They are taking it off, sanding, repainting, yes? Or are they leaving the panels on the car, masking the rest of the car off, and doing it right there? They are using OEM paint and cleacoat, PPG I imagine? (I've had a different brand of clear for a bumper blend before, because it was being done in my driveway, 2 hr cure instead of 6 hr cure as with PPG, it was a great job for what it was, but I was paying here so...)

It skipped my mind previously, but I am somewhat familiar with your car, my friend just came off a 2yr lease on a Z4 sDrive 35is in red. He drove the snot out of it. 

Oh ok, you say four days. That's a while. Must be a big queue.


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## jsmith97321 (May 25, 2013)

This dealership does not do body work, they have it all done by a local collision repair shop.

I will drop the car off in a week, so the dealership can set up a timely appointment with the repair shop. The ASM told me the repair shop has been trained by BMW. The four days is the estimated time to do the actual repairs.

And, of course, they will provide a loaner car.:thumbup:


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## Robert A (May 18, 2003)

What exact warranty is being extended -- the paintwork or the whole car?


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## ard (Jul 1, 2009)

jsmith97321 said:


> As the conversation lulled, I asked the ASM what additional compensation I could expect. The ASM hesitated and said they had some nice accessories in the parts department. I told him I was thinking more alone the lines of a warrantee extension. We talked for a minute, and he agreed to extend my warrantee to 6yr, 100K mi as part of good will.
> 
> I'm sure nothing would have been offered if I had not asked, but at the same time, I didn't have to make much of a case. I just simply asked.
> 
> It was a great experience and exceeded my expectations. Both the SM & ASM were very nice, professional and understanding. It was the kind of experience that makes someone a repeat customer.


Wow. Almost too good to be true.

I will be shocked if you get a BMW 6/100 extended warranty.



jsmith97321 said:


> The ASM told me the repair shop has been trained by BMW.


Lets hope their quality standards are higher!



Robert A said:


> What exact warranty is being extended -- the paintwork or the whole car?


Right :thumbup:

Or will it be "oh you were confused".

OP- Report back when this is all done...


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## Campfamily (Sep 20, 2010)

OP - congrats on your resolution. Now, make sure you get it in writing.

Keith


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## jsmith97321 (May 25, 2013)

Hello

The ASM extended the BMW maintenance warranty to 6yr/100K miles. I left the dealership with signed paperwork, so it’s already in the system. The repair shop has a lifetime warranty on their paint repairs. I check them out online and they have excellent reviews. 

I’ll report back when the re spray is done.


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## Robert A (May 18, 2003)

You got something of value -- this is good.


jsmith97321 said:


> Hello
> 
> The ASM extended the BMW maintenance warranty to 6yr/100K miles. I left the dealership with signed paperwork, so it's already in the system. The repair shop has a lifetime warranty on their paint repairs. I check them out online and they have excellent reviews.
> 
> I'll report back when the re spray is done.


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## Campfamily (Sep 20, 2010)

jsmith97321 said:


> Hello
> 
> The ASM extended the BMW* maintenance *warranty to 6yr/100K miles. I left the dealership with signed paperwork, so it***8217;s already in the system. The repair shop has a lifetime warranty on their paint repairs. I check them out online and they have excellent reviews.
> 
> I***8217;ll report back when the re spray is done.


They extended the maintenance warranty? Or, the actual vehicle warranty? These are two different things. The first gives you a couple of oil changes, and if you're lucky, a new set of brakes. An extension of the vehicle warranty covers if anything breaks. Obviously the second is of more value than the first.

Keith


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## ard (Jul 1, 2009)

jsmith97321 said:


> Hello
> 
> The ASM extended the BMW maintenance warranty to 6yr/100K miles. I left the dealership with signed paperwork, so it's already in the system. The repair shop has a lifetime warranty on their paint repairs. I check them out online and they have excellent reviews.
> 
> I'll report back when the re spray is done.


That's 'maintenance PLAN' not 'warranty'... not the $4000 extended warranty....

Still, an ok value, probably cost ~ $1000. wonder if BMWNA is picking up the cost?

Better than nothing .... Congrats


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## guyver626 (Mar 5, 2013)

How long does it take from when you sign the warranty paperwork to go into the BMW corporate system? 


Sent from BimmerApp mobile app


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## jsmith97321 (May 25, 2013)

Hello

Yes, I asked for the maintenance warranty extension, not the vehicle warranty, sorry for any confusion. 

The service rep filled out paperwork, which we both signed; but he also took my comfort access key and connected it to his computer system to code the maintenance extension to my Z4, so I believe it’s in BMW corporate system now.

The ASM told the SM to bill it to corporate, so I would think BMWNA is picking up the repair and warranty extension.


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## Robert A (May 18, 2003)

I thought you should ask for a free monthly payment on your loan or lease. You did far better than that.



jsmith97321 said:


> Hello
> 
> Yes, I asked for the maintenance warranty extension, not the vehicle warranty, sorry for any confusion.
> 
> ...


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## ard (Jul 1, 2009)

jsmith97321 said:


> The ASM told the SM to bill it to corporate, so I would think BMWNA is picking up the repair and warranty extension.


The dealer is likely owned by a corporation too.

I dont know how a dealership emoplyee can make an on-the-spot commitment to have BMWNA to pay for it. Usuallyu they need to ask for this.

But hey, who cares - its not you!

(PS I'll reiterate as it confuses everyone- it isnt a maintenace WARRANTY, it is a maintenance PLAN...  )


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## jsmith97321 (May 25, 2013)

*Update*

Hello, OP here,

I picked my Z4 up yesterday and it looks Great!!! Even though it was a cloudy day, the difference between the original rocker panel and the re-spray was very noticeable. The color matched the rest of the Z4 much better, and of course, the coverage was excellent. The body shop did an excellent job, and the BWM CA was great was well.

I really missed my Z4 for the couple of days she was in the shop, but it was well worth it. Now I won't cringe every time I look at the rocker panels.

Thanks for all the posts!!!!:dunno::rofl:


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## ard (Jul 1, 2009)

Enjoy...

Now get some wax/zaino/whatever on there to protect her!


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