# Re-delivery survey



## gclabbe (Feb 20, 2009)

*Re-delivery survey -- take 2*

O.K.

after seeing a few threads on this subject, I thought it might be fun to gather some actual information on the subject of time between drop-off and re-delivery.

If you'd like to play along with me, please visit this survey I've put together:

http://www.sunshinelobby.com/bmwedsurvey

As of now, there is no access to the resulting data. Once we've got a few submissions in there, I'll work on how to report back ... first pass will probably be Excel and then I can program the data views that make the most sense into web pages for all to see.

So, why fill out a survey? Well, when we've got enough data in there, we'll be able to find out how long it takes to get a car from Madrid to Oklahoma ... Milan to North Dakota, etc, etc. Maybe time of year or day of the week have an impact ... all fun stuff for statisticians 

Put feedback, issues, etc here ... hopefully there's nothing big since changing the survey appears to be a major league pain 

Chris


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## soledoc (Feb 5, 2007)

why don't we just do it in this thread?


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## STE92VE (Jun 12, 2006)

soledoc said:


> why don't we just do it in this thread?


Would need to create a separate thread with a poll. Options could be:

Redelivery in:

- < 5 weeks
- 5 weeks
- 6 weeks
- 7 weeks
- 8 weeks
- > 8 weeks

But it really wouldn't be accurate because some would be east coast, some west coast, some closer to VDC than others, etc.


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## gclabbe (Feb 20, 2009)

Yes ... my hope is to get people to enter data.

Then, I will be able to break it down by drop off city and destination state.

Survey should only take you 2 minutes if you have the dates with you. All that is required is drop off date, drop off city, re-delivery date and re-delivery state. Everything else is optional.

Only one response so far ... quite surprised given the dozen threads I found on the subject ...


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## archie253 (Feb 9, 2009)

gclabbe said:


> Only one response so far ... quite surprised given the dozen threads I found on the subject ...


I'd guess it's because "registration" is required... lots of people are (or should be if they aren't) paranoid about giving out any "personal" information or visiting any sort of data collection website. 

Having said that, seems like few people have qualms about not-so-anonymously posting detailed travel plans when they go pick up their cars.... so go figure! :dunno:

Now... I'm off to put on my flame retardant jumpsuit...


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## gclabbe (Feb 20, 2009)

Yeah ... I didn't really know the registration part until I was hours into creating the survey. I can see if there's a way out of it. This is software being run on my server, as opposed to one of the many commercial or free solutions out there.


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## gclabbe (Feb 20, 2009)

o.k. edited the starting post as well.

Removed the registration component. The survey is wide-open for public dabbling ... doesn't matter much since I wasn't screening entry to the survey anyway.

1-2 minutes of your time, lots of info for us all


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## STE92VE (Jun 12, 2006)

gclabbe said:


> o.k. edited the starting post as well.
> 
> Removed the registration component. The survey is wide-open for public dabbling ... doesn't matter much since I wasn't screening entry to the survey anyway.
> 
> 1-2 minutes of your time, lots of info for us all


Will submit shortly after redelivery....helplessly hoping sooner than later.


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## archie253 (Feb 9, 2009)

Luckily, I was able to submit my survey since the car showed up in 54 days... about a week or two earlier than officially advertised despite a wayward truck.


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## soledoc (Feb 5, 2007)

I just finished the survey...although I didn't know when it arrived at the VPC and when it left. All I knew was when it arrived at Newark. I also didn't know when it was loaded on the boat. I knew when it arrived at Bremerhaven and when it left Bremerhaven.


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## gclabbe (Feb 20, 2009)

That's fine, Soledoc. The important questions (required) are marked with a red asterisk. Everything else is optional ... if there is data in the optionals, I'll try to make some sense out of it.

Like:

How long does the average car take from drop off in city X to loading onto the boat?

How long do cars sit in the VPC?

How long from VPC to dealer?

Fun stuff.


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## voltigeur (Jun 29, 2008)

STE92VE said:


> Would need to create a separate thread with a poll. Options could be:
> 
> But it really wouldn't be accurate because some would be east coast, some west coast, some closer to VDC than others, etc.


Well, could be accurate but not take insufficient as does not include key variables

Exactly: has to a a matrix (cross-tabbed data): need end AND drop-off location.


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## gclabbe (Feb 20, 2009)

Exactly, the survey has drop off location and destination state.

Come play with us!


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## gclabbe (Feb 20, 2009)

Not very many responses, yet, but here's what we see so far:

Summary data on google docs

Highlights

Port City / Avg Days	
Los Angeles = 55	
New York = 41.5	
Both = 49.6

Year / Avg Days	
2006	= 66	
2007 = 39.5	
2009 = 51.5

Shortest = 34 on 10/31/2007 to New Jersey
Longest = 66 on 7/28/2006 to California


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## JSpira (Oct 21, 2002)

how many responses have you gotten?

I found the form a bit of a PIA because the calendar had to be reset on each question instead of taking on the attributes of the calendar setting from the prior question. I could have entered more of my cars but the first one took so long I didn't.


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## gclabbe (Feb 20, 2009)

5 so far ... pretty meaningless until we get to 30+ ... and each sub-data pt isn't really valid until we get to 30+ (i.e. in order to make all 50 states have good data, we're looking at 1500 samples  )

I could probably have found a more powerful survey software, but my interest in NFP projects is pretty limited  This one is stored in my servers dbase so I can write web pages that will auto-pull the data ... if we get enough entries to make it interesting.


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## gclabbe (Feb 20, 2009)

Oh, and you can just type in the dates ... that calendar widget is just there if you want to use it. Date format is beside each question, so you might find it much quicker to just type them.


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## STE92VE (Jun 12, 2006)

Are you considering redelivery when it arrives at the selling dealer or when you take actual possession? I ask this because I dropped my car in Amsterdam on 4/22 and was delivered to my dealer today, 5/21.


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## gclabbe (Feb 20, 2009)

I would think the meaningful date for re-delivery is "when did the dealer tell you it's ready?" not "when did you decide to pick it up after that?"


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## JSpira (Oct 21, 2002)

gclabbe said:


> Oh, and you can just type in the dates ... that calendar widget is just there if you want to use it. Date format is beside each question, so you might find it much quicker to just type them.


Date format is a bit non standard for daily usage however although it's admittedly faster than the widget


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## JSpira (Oct 21, 2002)

gclabbe said:


> 5 so far ... pretty meaningless until we get to 30+ ... and each sub-data pt isn't really valid until we get to 30+ (i.e. in order to make all 50 states have good data, we're looking at 1500 samples  )


First off, since it hasn't really been said, I think this is a great idea.

Here are a few suggestions/problems:

1.) I would suggest you change "die Welt" to "in Munich" so that it doesn't exclude an entire class of BMW customer.

2.) In addition, when I skip to 
Which port was your BMW offloaded at?

I consistently get an error that my date format is wrong (it's not wrong).

3.) Several times, I've entered the correct answer to the arithmetic question and been told it was wrong (5+95 is always 100, no?).

I just got this error now upon entering the survey:

*Warning*: strpos() [function.strpos]: Empty delimiter in */home/sunshine/public_html/limesurvey/common.php* on line *2571*


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## gclabbe (Feb 20, 2009)

> First off, since it hasn't really been said, I think this is a great idea.


Thanks ... it will be fun once there's some momentum



> 1.) I would suggest you change "die Welt" to "in Munich" so that it doesn't exclude an entire class of BMW customer.


Fixed. Rewrote the entire question to make it read better and not exclude pre-Welt'ers



> 2.) In addition, when I skip to
> Which port was your BMW offloaded at?
> 
> I consistently get an error that my date format is wrong (it's not wrong).


I can make that error happen if I only put single digits on months or days. That's not cool but I don't have a fix yet ... enter dates using 4 digit year, 2 digit month and 2 digit day. I'll see if there are options for the date system. Maybe I'll re-write their php for them since date fields shouldn't act like that.



> 3.) Several times, I've entered the correct answer to the arithmetic question and been told it was wrong (5+95 is always 100, no?).


I've seen that once, but just entered the survey like 30 times and couldn't get it to happen. What browser version? When I saw it before I was using Chrome on the work PC.



> I just got this error now upon entering the survey:
> 
> Warning: strpos() [function.strpos]: Empty delimiter in /home/sunshine/public_html/limesurvey/common.php on line 2571


Yuck ... checking that one out now.

We're up to 8 entries now!

Should correct something I wrote earlier. We will have interesting data when we start to get 10 data pts per set. So, 10 East Coast & 10 West Coast will start to tell us something. It takes 30+ to develop statistical confidence that the answers are actually the same or different. When we get there I'll throw the data into the stats crunchers and see what's what.


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## gclabbe (Feb 20, 2009)

Near as I can tell, that nasty error you got was a temporary problem with the survey software talking to the database on the server.

If it keeps happening, let me know and I'll go torture my vServer vendor.


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## gclabbe (Feb 20, 2009)

11 entries now ... starting to get more interesting 

Summary data on google docs

*Highlights*

Port City / Avg Days	
Los Angeles = 58.2 (5 entries)
New York = 36.8 (6 entries)
Both = 46.6

Year / Avg Days	
2005 = 32.0 (1 entry)
2006	= 49.5 (2 entries)
2007 = 39.5 (2 entries)
2008 = 49.8 (4 entries)
2009 = 51.5 (2 entries)

Shortest = 32 on 11/18/2005 to New Jersey
Longest = 74 on 8/4/2008 to Oregon


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## JSpira (Oct 21, 2002)

gclabbe said:


> 11 entries now


3 are mine :angel:


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## b-y (Sep 14, 2004)

gclabbe said:


> ...
> Year / Avg Days
> 2005 = 32.0 (1 entry)
> 2006	= 49.5 (2 entries)
> ...


Personally, I would not report the yearly overall averages as they may reflect a change in the E/W mix more than any change over time. Once you have more data, possibly annual averages separately for E & W might be useful.

Otherwise, nice work. :thumbup:


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## gclabbe (Feb 20, 2009)

16 entries now ... starting to get more interesting

Summary data on google docs

Highlights

Port City / Avg Days from dropoff to redelivery
Los Angeles = 58.29 (7 entries)
New York = 41.7 (9 entries)
Both = 48.9

Port City / Avg Day from dock to redelivery
Los Angeles = 14.8 (7 entries)
New York = 17.8 (9 entries)
Both = 16.2

Shortest = 32 on 11/18/2005 to New Jersey
Longest = 74 on 8/4/2008 to Oregon


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## STE92VE (Jun 12, 2006)

Just entered my info...took a week for them to locate a rattle we discovered in Germany. Someones going to get written up for leaving a plastic bolt inside a cross member under the driver's seat.:yikes:


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## gclabbe (Feb 20, 2009)

Thanks. There have been a few more. I'll re-crunch the data in a bit. With only a few at a time trickling in, I'm not very motivated to invest the time in creating sql code to auto-analyze the data ... yet.


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## gclabbe (Feb 20, 2009)

21 entries now ...

new state -- New York
new port -- Amsterdam

Summary data on google docs

Highlights

Port City / Avg Days from dropoff to redelivery
Los Angeles = 57.89 (9 entries)
New York = 42.08 (12 entries)
Both = 48.86

Port City / Avg Day from dock to redelivery
Los Angeles = 13.5 (9 entries)
New York = 17.17 (12 entries)
Both = 15.07

Shortest = 32 on 11/18/2005 to New Jersey
Longest = 74 on 8/4/2008 to Oregon


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## JohnnyRoaster (Oct 28, 2008)

My car arrived at the dealer today! I was not sure about how to track from customs through the VPC. I sort of guessed on those dates. Five weeks for redelivery seems pretty fast to me.

My 2 o'clock pick up time on Monday can't come soon enough.


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## gclabbe (Feb 20, 2009)

Yeah, 5 weeks is quick ... congrats.

I should be picking my car up Tuesday, finally ... 54 days

Thanks for filling out the survey ... up to 26 responses so far. A few incomplete ones where lurking in there. Everyone please remember to fill in all of the red-starred questions ... the rest are optional (although I couldn't not fill them in on Safari just now  )


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## vern (Apr 19, 2002)

gclabbe said:


> Yes ...
> 
> Only one response so far ... quite surprised given the dozen threads I found on the subject ...


Just maybe there having trouble entering the date like I am. When I try to enter the date, date is not valid comes up and then you get the old faithfull freeze and have to shut down. I tried twice and the same thing happen.
cheers
vern


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## Shorty609 (Sep 22, 2008)

21 total so far and not a single one from the Gulf Coast. The closest is South Carolina. Im trying to guestimate when mine will reach south Louisiana its kinda difficult with the existing data, but i will be sure to fill out the survey when mine arrives.


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## gclabbe (Feb 20, 2009)

There is a Texas entry that had everything but the re-delivery date filled in. I re-entered it and matched the re-delivery date to the "at dealer" date.

For the lockups, what browser & OS are you using?


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## former (Apr 5, 2005)

I just put mine in. I didn't have any trouble, other than a bunch of validation errors complaining about, I'm assuming, my blank date fields as I went back and forth between tabs to get the correct dates. I'm using Firefox 3 on Vista.


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## gclabbe (Feb 20, 2009)

It is a bit of a pain. When I get a few minutes (ha) I'll try to figure out how to patch or re-write their code to be less picky.

Here's the good news ... I got to take my own survey :bigpimp:


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## strider41 (Feb 9, 2008)

Just added my information but erred on the drop-off date at Harms. It was a drop-off on July 21st not 22nd as posted on survey. Hope you can correct the entry. Did not remember the date my car cleared customs and went to VPC and did not enter any date. Redelivery was a lot faster than I expected. I could have picked up my car on the day it was received at the dealership on Aug 20th but opted for Aug 21st to insure all the insurance data was correct and up to date before picking it up.


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## gclabbe (Feb 20, 2009)

No problem. Correct the drop off date.

Also adjusted the redelivery date per your notes to reflect when the car was ready. The dealer-in to dealer-out date appears to be 0 to 1 days in every case.

Chris


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## strider41 (Feb 9, 2008)

Any update on the numbers participating and survey results?


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## AggieKnight (Dec 26, 2008)

You have to be able to do add to take this course?

Whew, as an Aggie, its a good thing I took those extra courses in advanced addition or I'd be unable to participate.

Nice survey.


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## hbdb (Jan 1, 2009)

*Great initiative... this should really be a Sticky*

:thumbup:


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## vern (Apr 19, 2002)

How come I can't enter a 2nd car?
cheers
vern


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## gclabbe (Feb 20, 2009)

You should be able to Vern ... I know JSpira entered 3 of his. What error is it giving you? Have you tried closing the browser session and re-opening it?

The software I picked for this is not quite a robust as was advertised 

New results in the next post.


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## gclabbe (Feb 20, 2009)

37 entries now ...

Summary data on google docs

Highlights

Port City / Avg Days from dropoff to redelivery
Los Angeles = 57.00 (14 entries)
New York = 39.57 (23 entries)
Both = 46.16

Port City / Avg Day from dock to redelivery
Los Angeles = 12.92 ( entries)
New York = 13.43 ( entries)
Both = 13.19

Shortest = 26 on 10/31/2005 to New York
Longest = 77 on 8/15/2008 to California


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## Zooks527 (Mar 15, 2009)

I've got a 5/16 dropoff with a scheduled 6/22 redelivery (37 days). Once I've got her back, I'll be entering the data.


.


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## hbdb (Jan 1, 2009)

Added my information... 38 days


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## hbdb (Jan 1, 2009)

... might be interesting to add the name of ship (Undine)


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## Zooks527 (Mar 15, 2009)

hbdb said:


> ... might be interesting to add the name of ship (Undine)


For curiosity's sake, who's your dealer? I was on the Undine as well, and I'm scheduled for Monday (oh no, an extra 3 days !). I'm curious if they "single stream" cars to dealers, or wait until they have a portable parking lot full.


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## hbdb (Jan 1, 2009)

Tulley, NH


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## caveatesq (Jun 23, 2005)

You should consider adding to the survey a question to track in-transit damage. I've now done 4 Euro Deliveries since 2005 and my last two cars both suffered front bumper damage between being dropped off in Munich and redelivered to my dealer - and neither was repaired at the VDC. I'd be interested in seeing if I've just got bad luck of if the shipping personnel are just really careless.


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## Zooks527 (Mar 15, 2009)

hbdb said:


> Tulley, NH


Ah. BMW of Peabody here, so we don't have a datapoint.

Congratulations on your receipt!

.


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## vern (Apr 19, 2002)

gclabbe said:


> You should be able to Vern ... I know JSpira entered 3 of his. What error is it giving you? Have you tried closing the browser session and re-opening it?
> .


I tried that and it worked fine. Is there a way to edit after you enter all the information?
cheers
vern


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## gclabbe (Feb 20, 2009)

I can do it for you, but after we dropped the registration part, the system has no way of knowing which entry is yours ... with registration, it would save partial entries and allow you to go back and change what you'd entered.

Send me what you need to modify and the redelivery data/city so I can find the entry and I'll make any mods necessary.


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## Zooks527 (Mar 15, 2009)

My 37 day redelivery is into the survey.

Is there a slot for how many miles before it had a problem and needed a tow? http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=377965 

George


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## CrazyBimmer (Jul 1, 2002)

Added my 29 day redelivery.


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## Shorty609 (Sep 22, 2008)

gclabbe,

can we get an updated "Summary Data"?... im at 43 days and my CA is telling me "It now shows In Transit to VPC" which i assume means Spartanburg:dunno:, then i have to wait to get it in south Louisiana, i need some numbers to pass my time.


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## vern (Apr 19, 2002)

Added my 3rd BMW 36 days to redelivery
cheers
vern


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## doulan77 (Feb 25, 2009)

*Latest statistics*

Getting ready to leave in 8 days. :thumbup: Just curious if you had updated statistics to date...something to ponder...thanks.


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## Snareman (Nov 24, 2006)

Added my info, although I had to estimate a few of the dates such into and out of the VPC. I only definitively know off the ship and on to the truck. 

So where's the data?


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## doulan77 (Feb 25, 2009)

Just added our 44 day re-delivery to Pennsylvaina.


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## ventuno (Sep 8, 2008)

:thumbup:
Took delivery today on 328xi Barbera at 11am from the Sewickley Car Store(Pittsburgh).
The car sat in NJ from July 7 until July 28 for no apparent reason. Our salesman called and finally found our car, sitting in a very large parking lot. The people who overlooked our car for almost 3 weeks told him the customer should read the info which says 6-8 weeks for delivery. When he got mad the women hung up on him for being rude!:dunno:
I will try to do the survey in later today.


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## ventuno (Sep 8, 2008)

Trying to attach a picture of our 328 in Lake Hallstatt.


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## ventuno (Sep 8, 2008)

Well, actually near Lake, not in it.
Finally got my picture on.


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## mgthompson (Oct 14, 2007)

I just found out that my car is stuck in the Department of Agriculture. I hope that this doesn't add weeks to the redelivery.


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## MichelleJ (Apr 30, 2009)

Just added my 58 day redelivery to Tulsa!


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## ben008006 (Aug 20, 2009)

61 days from Amsterdam to Seattle!


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## mgthompson (Oct 14, 2007)

46 days from Frankfurt to Providence, RI.
It could have been much faster if the Department of Agriculture didn't sit on it for 13 days.


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## FrankAZ (Feb 19, 2009)

61 days from drop-off in Geneva to redelivery in Phoenix, AZ. (I have not included extra time needed at the dealer for window tinting and paint surface treatment).

23 of those days were getting from Geneva to the departure of the ship though. I think that I was unlucky by just missing a ship and having an exceptionally long wait for the next one.

Frank.


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## NeoE46 (May 16, 2009)

52 Days from Drop-off at CDG in Paris through Brunswick for pick-up in Atlanta. 

Drop Off CDG, Paris: 7/15 
Leaves Bremerhaven: 7/31
Arrives at Brunswick, GA: 8/19
Arrives at Atlanta: 9/3
Redelivery: 9/5

I think it cleared customs pretty quickly in Brunswick, but it took a while to get on a truck to go to the dealer.
By the way, your survey only includes New York and LA as ports. My vehicle came through Brunswick, GA


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## BMR2009 (Mar 20, 2009)

I am also a Brunswick arrival, and it's been there almost two weeks. It hasn't cleared customs yet.


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## kloh (Mar 28, 2009)

just added mine


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## wmo168 (Mar 26, 2009)

*My final update*
*57* Days from Drop off until redelivery at PCD

Got info after 8 days from the drop off...

Delivery Program BMW NA 
Drop Off Location ZURICH (GLATTBRUGG) 18-Aug-2009 
Voyage Information: 
Voyage ID EA936-FAT 
Vessel Name FAUST 
Departure Port BREMERHAVEN 
Departure Date 03-Sep-2009 
Destination Port NEWARK 
Destination Date 18-Sep-2009

25-Sep-2009 Clear Custom
14-Oct-2009 Redelivery at PCD


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## Guards Red Car (Sep 8, 2007)

*62 Days to East Coast*

Munich Welt Pick Up - August 27
Harms Munich Drop Off - August 29
On Don Pasquale - September 10 - September 21 (Port NY/NJ)
*Intensive Customs Audit *- September 21 - October 15 (*24 days*)
BMW *VPC* (Front Bumper Replacement, 7 Series Spark Plug Recall/Replace, NAV System Upgrade...) - October 15 - October 29 (*14 days*)
Redelivery - October 30
Time from Harms Munich Drop Off to Redelivery - *62 days*


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## DDoone (Feb 5, 2007)

Pickup Welt 14 August
Dropoff Amsterdam 19 August
Loaded on Elektra, Bremerhaven 29 August 
Ready at NJ Dealer 18 September
29 days door to door!


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## ViaPerturbatio (Jul 25, 2009)

*My ED Delivery*

*My ED Delivery (as entered in the survey):*
*60* Days from Drop-Off until dealer re-delivery.

ED Delivery: 02SEP09
Munich Drop-Off: 10SEP09
Vessel Name: UNDINE
Departure Port: BREMERHAVEN 
Departure: 01OCT09 
Destination Port: NEWARK 
Destination: 17OCT09 
Customs Clearance: 26OCT09
VDC Release: 06NOV09
Dealer Destination & Re-Delivery: 09NOV09


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## Blue55 (May 8, 2009)

*66 days total from Nice drop off* (just entered it into the survey)

ED Delivery: 18SEP09
Nice Drop-Off: 02OCT09
Vessel Name: GRAND DAHLIA
Departure Port: BREMERHAVEN 
Departure: 26OCT09 
Destination Port: HUENEME
Destination: 22NOV09 
Customs Clearance: 04DEC09
VDC Release: 05DEC09
Dealer Destination & Re-Delivery: 07DEC09


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## b7series (Jul 31, 2005)

ED Delivery: 30OCT09
MUC Drop-Off: 03NOV09
Vessel Name: UNDIE ?
Departure Port: BREMERHAVEN 
Departure: 06NOV09 
Destination Port: NEWARK, NJ
Destination: 25NOV09 
Customs Clearance: 07DEC09
VDC Release: 09DEC09
Dealer Destination & Re-Delivery: 10DEC09- HASSEL BMW FREEPORT

Total delivery time = 38 days - Is this record time? :dunno:


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## FrankAZ (Feb 19, 2009)

*This survey still active?*

The original poster, gclabbe, hasn't been seen in this or any neighboring parish for a while.

Gclabbe: Any chance of a recent summary?


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## ViaPerturbatio (Jul 25, 2009)

FrankAZ said:


> Gclabbe: Any chance of a recent summary?


Excellent suggestion Frank to lobby for an update. Was wondering the same, particularly since we seem to have a delay in deliveries and an increase in the dreaded, "customs intensive audit."


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## JSpira (Oct 21, 2002)

Please take a moment and complete the redelivery survey here.

The OP will update his report soon and it would be good to get a bunch of responses in first.


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## Kanuck (Feb 18, 2003)

Survey is US-centric. :thumbdwn: Would be easy enough to add Halifax as a port and the 10 Canadian provinces as pick-up points (we can assume no one from Canadian territories does ED). 

Actually, I've never heard of a Canadian ED to the Canadian west coast so I'm not sure how they get there (long train trip from Halifax or to Vancouver?).


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## cronimi (Dec 6, 2003)

JSpira said:


> Please take a moment and complete the redelivery survey here.


For some reason, when I click your link, I'm redirected to this thread. Is it because I already took the survey once?

For the OP, the survey only lists 2 ports -- it neglects to include Brunswick, GA. Also, the results regarding wait times after VPC will be skewed by PCDers. For instance, my car is ready now and, if taking redelivery at my local dealership, the redelivery date likely would be in the next 5 business days or so. But because of the PCD schedule, my redelivery date isn't for 2 weeks. All in all, though, I think it is a worthwhile exercise and I'm curious to learn the results.


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