# More Gross Incmpetence in Getting a Euro Delivery BMW Shipped to the US



## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

pharding said:


> We track their work to confirm that the consultant is performing the work properly and in a timely manner. I believe that this relatively common in business.


It depends on the business. The actual work involved in tracking and confirmation is wasted if everything originally goes to plan without intervention.

If a company invests enough in process and technology, then less is required for tracking and remediation. I believe that this has been BMW's approach - they considered that they had set up a sufficient process with quality processes and resources in place with a suitable tracking system for remediation. Recent examples have shown that things can be improved. It may be through updated processes, technology or training. Or your car may just be part of "acceptable delays" that have been built into their system, and to irradicate this would be more cost than benefit.

For BMW to add additional layers of tracking and process leads to one thing definitely - cost. So decisions needs to be made. Is this something the customer would pay for? Do other marques offer comparable tracking? Will BMW be at a cost disadvantage?


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

beewang said:


> Having been here at the ED forum for the last decade...and having lived thru the Tri-Color incidence...I can say that.. these things happens... unfortunately.. all the time with respect to shipping.
> 
> beewang


My car was on the Tricolor - ED 1 for me in fact. And now I've completed ED 5. Out of my 5 EDs, I've had 1 delayed delivery (out of 8-10 week window), and 1 sinking.

As someone wise once posted, folks need to find something else to interest them until redelivery. Worrying won't get your car back any faster, and whatever happened or will happen, happens. Good advice - I find myself pretty happy following that philosophy.


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## pharding (Mar 14, 2004)

I may make an acceptable delay in making lease payments. However German Companies unlike those in other parts in the world like to do things in a professional manner and seek to rise above commodity status, where the lowest price with least amount quality that people will begrudgingly accept, wins. I am confident that BMW NA will fix the situation. I know that BMW cares about my satisfaction and that they find it embarrassing that my car sat dockside in Bremerhaven for 3 weeks at the port.


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## SlamMan (Oct 8, 2009)

That sucks. 3 Weeks is too long considering where you dropped off.

I dropped off in Zurich and it took over 6 weeks before my ship departed. I'm working on week 11 now and I'm guessing no one will give a crap since I dropped off outside Germany.

If I did ED again I would only drop off in Munich or Bremerhaven. Now it looks like not even Bremerhaven is a safe bet.


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## mrdirosa (Jun 15, 2006)

SlamMan said:


> That sucks. 3 Weeks is too long considering where you dropped off.
> 
> I dropped off in Zurich and it took over *6 weeks *before my ship departed. I'm working on week 11 now and I'm guessing no one will give a crap since I dropped off outside Germany.
> 
> If I did ED again I would only drop off in Munich or Bremerhaven. Now it looks like not even Bremerhaven is a safe bet.


Now that is unacceptable!


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## German Expat (Sep 29, 2006)

SlamMan said:


> That sucks. 3 Weeks is too long considering where you dropped off.
> 
> I dropped off in Zurich and it took over 6 weeks before my ship departed. I'm working on week 11 now and I'm guessing no one will give a crap since I dropped off outside Germany.
> 
> If I did ED again I would only drop off in Munich or Bremerhaven. Now it looks like not even Bremerhaven is a safe bet.


I did drop off in Zurich 2 years ago and it took less then 7 days to make it to the boat. I am not sure Zurich is really that bad. I get the impression (also based on my current redelivery) that they are quite some kinks in the current system compared to like 2 years ago.


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## SlamMan (Oct 8, 2009)

German Expat said:


> I did drop off in Zurich 2 years ago and it took less then 7 days to make it to the boat. I am not sure Zurich is really that bad. I get the impression (also based on my current redelivery) that they are quite some kinks in the current system compared to like 2 years ago.


At 6 weeks it would seem to me that something fell through the cracks. Most seem to be 2 weeks or less. Occasionally 3 weeks or so but I haven't seen anyone else with anything near 6 weeks. Had it been 2 to 3 weeks I would have probably made it on one or two boats earlier and would have my car by now. I'll be making my third loan payment shortly.


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## pharding (Mar 14, 2004)

This morning I called BMW NA European Delivery and spoke with a manager. As expected she was embarrassed that my car is sitting at the port for two weeks and will ship in another week. I also sent a copy of the email that I posted. She called the port and is trying to get my car on a ship leaving this week. With the time difference she will have an answer tomorrow. As I said earlier BMW is a stand up company and that is one of the many reasons that I buy their cars. They are doing what they can to get this squared away and I appreciate that. 

BLG on the other hand is not too impressive. Their stupid attitude seems to be we screwed up and you'll get your car 2 weeks late because of our incompetence and apathy so too bad for you.


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## beewang (Dec 18, 2001)

pharding said:


> This morning I called BMW NA European Delivery and spoke with a manager. As expected she was embarrassed that my car is sitting at the port for two weeks and will ship in another week. I also sent a copy of the email that I posted. She called the port and is trying to get my car on a ship leaving this week. With the time difference she will have an answer tomorrow. * As I said earlier BMW is a stand up company and that is one of the many reasons that I buy their cars. They are doing what they can to get this squared away and I appreciate that. *...


pharding,
So its fair to say that you knew this was gonna happen. You've done this ED thing before and like many of us "old-timers" have known that BMW ED will take care of business. You and I both knew that they will make you whole (even at no fault of their own) on the monetary issue.

Soooo .. care to retract your earlier statement


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## pharding (Mar 14, 2004)

It is premature to retract any statements. However I still believe that BMW needs to track these cars besides the customer.


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## rmorin49 (Jan 7, 2007)

Does there appear to be an overall decline in the efficiency and quality of ED shipments in general? I have only been an active member of this forum for about 4 years but it does seem that there are more shipping related issues in the last several months. True or False?


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## beewang (Dec 18, 2001)

The real question here is this:

Has the DHS implemented new custom clearing procedures for the West Coast, United State that would cause a problem in the status quo??

I have several close friends at US Customs, and the answer is "Affirmative"


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## pharding (Mar 14, 2004)

rmorin49 said:


> Does there appear to be an overall decline in the efficiency and quality of ED shipments in general? I have only been an active member of this forum for about 4 years but it does seem that there are more shipping related issues in the last several months. True or False?


There are more complaints about ED shipments now than at any time since I have joined this forum in 2004.


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## M FUNF (Apr 2, 2008)

Would it have any relationship to the amount of vehicles being delivered and shipped? As the volume of sales dropped the number of cars needing shipping also decreased, since cars leave the turn in point Munich, Frankfurt, Zurich, or Vienna and Paris there are fewer cars for the transporters. The Transporters need a full truck before they proceed to the port, and the port needs a full load before the ship sails, so with the reduction in sales comes longer redelivery times. That is why I have maintained that Frankfurt was the optimal turn in point as they aggregate not only BMW, but Volvo, Audi, and Mercedes, and the Military autos returning to the States. This may get your car to Bremerhaven sooner but they still need a fairly full load before the boat sails or needs several stops to fill it before the crossing. I used to be amused by the people tracking the ship across the pond, and through the canal but this obsession with delivery times is a waste of energy. I agree that it is a pain to wait and hold ups in customs are even more painful, but really, if an additional lease payment is critical then maybe you really cannot afford a BMW in the first place. If your business is leasing the car for you then it is a 100% deductible business expense so not a dime out of your pocket. Maybe being a simple farm boy out here on the prairie gives me a more laid back attitude, but then I do not suffer from high blood pressure either.


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## JSpira (Oct 21, 2002)

M FUNF said:


> Would it have any relationship to the amount of vehicles being delivered and shipped? As the volume of sales dropped the number of cars needing shipping also decreased, since cars leave the turn in point Munich, Frankfurt, Zurich, or Vienna and Paris there are fewer cars for the transporters. The Transporters need a full truck before they proceed to the port, and the port needs a full load before the ship sails, so with the reduction in sales comes longer redelivery times.


Everything you said is correct, except for what I highlighted. The vessel will sail on schedule - the shipping company makes sure that they book enough cars and cargo. The vessel does not wait for a full load. If there are a few empty slots, off she goes.


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## tlak77 (Aug 5, 2009)

JSpira said:


> vessel will sail on schedule


The vessel my car was scheduled on, left port 1 day before schedule. Schedules move around if needed, it crucial to have cargo but the weather is a factor as well especially during the winter months.


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## pharding (Mar 14, 2004)

M FUNF said:


> ...if an additional lease payment is critical then maybe you really cannot afford a BMW in the first place.


What a condescending bunch of BS. If I didn't have to work for a living I could tell others not to worry about anything. I am capable of determining what I can afford. I do not need you to tell me that because I complain about incompetence and apathy that leaves an expensive BMW sitting dockside at the port for 3 weeks that "I really cannot afford a BMW in the first place".



M FUNF said:


> .....If your business is leasing the car for you then it is a 100%deductible business expense so not a dime out of your pocket.


 Not true my friend. You are confusing a deductible business expense with a farm subsidy. Even with a business expense that is deductible there is still major cost to the business that the owners absorb.



M FUNF said:


> Maybe being a simple farm boy out here on the prairie gives me a more laid back attitude, but then I do not suffer from high blood pressure either.


Simple farm boys have their existence heavily subsidized by the federal government so they can afford to have a laid back attitude and pass on the heavily subsidized wealth to their kids. Some of us work hard in our free market economy without federal subsidies so that we get concerned about wasted time and money.


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## pharding (Mar 14, 2004)

JSpira said:


> Everything you said is correct, except for what I highlighted. ...


And thank you too, Jonathan.


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## vern (Apr 19, 2002)

On the good side . Last ED checked in at Harms Munich early in the morning and the 535i was on the truck by afternoon. At the port the car was there 4 days before loaded on the ship. 32 days from Harms to JMK. Just hit it lucky at both places. IMO there are more people that do ED that this has happen to but you don't hear about it. Seems you always read more about the negative than the positive.
Good luck
cheers
vern


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## tlak77 (Aug 5, 2009)

vern said:


> Seems you always read more about the negative than the positive.
> Good luck
> cheers
> vern


You should not be surprised my friend, forums are not representation of really live statistics. People come here to learn from others, as well as express there dissatisfaction when nobody else care.


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## dalekressin (Sep 3, 2008)

Pharding,
I like your positive attitude about BMW and your confidence in the product.
I also agree unless individuals make BMWNA aware of your specific situation and our general concerns; they have plenty of other work to focus on.
My bet is you will be taken care of. Perhaps you will get a green letter (free pass) to go to School in Spartanburg. That would be my dream come true.

As far as business goes, it amazes me in general how customer support has deteriorated accross several industries.
I'd be out of business if I treated my customers with silence.


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## vern (Apr 19, 2002)

tlak77 said:


> You should not be surprised my friend, forums are not representation of really live statistics. People come here to learn from others, as well as express there dissatisfaction when nobody else care.


True my friend but when it becomes whining it becomes tire some.
cheers
vern


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## tlak77 (Aug 5, 2009)

dalekressin said:


> As far as business goes, it amazes me in general how customer support has deteriorated accross several industries.
> I'd be out of business if I treated my customers with silence.


+1000
BMW would avoid having people dissatisfied if they had transparency, keep people updated and get their record straight. I deal with multiple projects all the time involving private parties and government (yes our intolerable government ) Everything can be coordinated and tracked properly so everyone know what is going on. BMW at least get your web straight it's pathetic; if you provide tracking info have data right. It make me think that everything is done manually :tsk:


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## pharding (Mar 14, 2004)

vern said:


> True my friend but when it becomes whining it becomes tire some.
> cheers
> vern


And cheers to you too. Everyone benefits if BMW Euro Delivery cars do not sit dockside for 3 weeks. That is wasteful and contrary to BMW's goal of customer loyalty and customer retention. I bought 5 BMW's in the last ten years. Prior to this, BMW hit the stated time frames 50% on my BMW Euro Delivery Cars. If people do not express dissatisfaction the situation will not get better. Unfortunately delivery timing appears to be getting worse. Vern I am happy that your last ED made such great connections. Your lack of empathy for those whose cars got lost in an unmanaged system doesn't bother me. However I am entitled to post my opinions here. If you don't like a thread, please don't read it and certainly don't post to it.


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## JSpira (Oct 21, 2002)

tlak77 said:


> The vessel my car was scheduled on, left port 1 day before schedule. Schedules move around if needed, it crucial to have cargo but the weather is a factor as well especially during the winter months.


A day or so variation happens frequently - although those schedule changes appear (from what I've seen) to be related to delays in getting from one port to another, not in terms of getting a full load on board.


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## mason (Jun 8, 2006)

I don't think vessels are waiting to get the load full. Again I use Fedex or UPS as example, they send out trucks whether is full or half full. If they consistently see plenty of half full trucks, they would adjust the capacity and route to address the issue.

As for extra lease payment or tax deduction, I can't say for some really small number of people who can't really afford $60k to $70k car and still try to do it...... Most of us have no financial difficulty making the extra lease payment or even 2 without the car. For me, I just feel that it is an inefficient way or money wasted, lack of better words. We all love to have as little lag time as possible. Good for the driving pleasure and good for money. How do you feel if the bank said that you would have to make a mortgage payment or 2 before letting you to move in?


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## mrdirosa (Jun 15, 2006)

mason said:


> I don't think vessels are waiting to get the load full. Again I use Fedex or UPS as example, they send out trucks whether is full or half full. If they consistently see plenty of half full trucks, they would adjust the capacity and route to address the issue.
> 
> As for extra lease payment or tax deduction, I can't say for some really small number of people who can't really afford $60k to $70k car and still try to do it...... Most of us have no financial difficulty making the extra lease payment or even 2 without the car. For me, I just feel that it is an inefficient way or money wasted, lack of better words. We all love to have as little lag time as possible. Good for the driving pleasure and good for money. How do you feel if the bank said that you would have to make a mortgage payment or 2 before letting you to move in?


Most of us did not get to where we are now by wasting/throwing away money. We got here due to good decisions and management of our resources, not frivolous spending. When something is costing you $20-$30/day FOR UP TO 3 WEEKS due to someone else's mistakes or inefficiencies, it is aggravating.

-Michael


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## German Expat (Sep 29, 2006)

It is not a matter of affording a car or not. I also don't burn money just because I have it. Our current payment is a little more then 500$ per month. Having additional 4 or 8 weeks transfer time corresponds to 500$ or 1000$ spent for something that I don't have.
People with money usually have money because they don't waste it. I for one would not just throw that amount of money out of the window.
It is my car, I paid for it and BMW puts a clear expectation up what the transfer time is. Things do and can happen in transit and some additional time is acceptable. The issue is that BMW seems not to care much about our cars (they got their money) and we do need to do all the follow up work.
The European Delivery program is done as a way to attract and keep loyal customers and the main German competitors do know this as well and are in the same boat. Its not done out of the goodness of anybody's heart, its a business decision on BMW's part.
The expect their customers to have a good time in Europe and a great experience and make them loyal repeat customers. If the last part of the experience leaves a sour taste in your mouth the goal has failed and BMW does also spend substantial money on creating this experience (BMW Welt, discount on sales price etc.). It is in their best interest to create an all around outstanding experience.


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

pharding said:


> However I still believe that BMW needs to track these cars besides the customer.


How would they track the car before it gets into their possession? You need to call them every day while on ED to let them know where it is? They call Harms/BLG every day to see if your car was dropped off?

I can't see an easy and cost effective way to do this efficiently and comprehensively with full redundancy. If there is, I'm sure BMWED would welcome the suggestion.

In BMW's shoes, if this was a requirement, they may even drop the ED program. Similarly to how they dropped the 5 series touring - it's not that they didn't want to do it, but the economics of the operation didn't add up.


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## vern (Apr 19, 2002)

pharding said:


> And cheers to you too. Everyone benefits if BMW Euro Delivery cars do not sit dockside for 3 weeks. That is wasteful and contrary to BMW's goal of customer loyalty and customer retention. I bought 5 BMW's in the last ten years. Prior to this, BMW hit the stated time frames 50% on my BMW Euro Delivery Cars. If people do not express dissatisfaction the situation will not get better. Unfortunately delivery timing appears to be getting worse. Vern I am happy that your last ED made such great connections. Your lack of empathy for those whose cars got lost in an unmanaged system doesn't bother me. However I am entitled to post my opinions here. If you don't like a thread, please don't read it and certainly don't post to it.


I do have empathy for those that had the long wait but like it was said in a other post,"sh*t happens". Its up to me if I want to read the post, the last time I looked thats what the open forum is about. IMO you do have a legitimate grip but now its not about information any more its about whining, your starting to repeat yourself in your posts. If you don't like my post, "please don't read it and certainly don't post to it"
cheers
vern


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## tlak77 (Aug 5, 2009)

chrischeung said:


> How would they track the car before it gets into their possession? You need to call them every day while on ED to let them know where it is? They call Harms/BLG every day to see if your car was dropped off?
> 
> I can't see an easy and cost effective way to do this efficiently and comprehensively. If there is, I'm sure BMWED would welcome the suggestion.


You drop off the car at the Harms/BLG location, a car gets into inventory/database, location on the ship is assigned; database is sheared with BMW counterparts. Ships and inventory is tracked through the voyage. Ship content gets send to customs before it arrives to the port, customs pick if every item gets inspected (only percentage of any product get inspected at the docks). 
You don't really think cars just go there sit at the parking lot till someone physically look at it and decide to ship it at random point. It's 2010 not 1960, we automate processes as much as possible. Either BMW are really purely designed or they did not take under account all of the variables and implement margins. 
The variable you describe is not that hard to account for with good margin, ED car comes with 3 (?) weeks insurance, if extended BMW know about, number of ED cars cannot be high enough to effect ship assignment, and regular cars could be shipped as a second priority.
In the future BMW could ask customers to indicate drop off date and location to better estimate time, most of people doing ED plan ahead; if you think that could help. It took my car to get from Munich to the ship 28 days (BMW NA ED and Welt knew about my droop off day months in advance), and after clearing customs to my dealer another 31. I don't care about the time as much as the fact that no-one wanted to tell me what was going one with the car for 59 days....


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## mason (Jun 8, 2006)

chrischeung said:


> How would they track the car before it gets into their possession? You need to call them every day while on ED to let them know where it is? They call Harms/BLG every day to see if your car was dropped off?
> 
> I can't see an easy and cost effective way to do this efficiently and comprehensively with full redundancy. If there is, I'm sure BMWED would welcome the suggestion.
> 
> In BMW's shoes, if this was a requirement, they may even drop the ED program. Similarly to how they dropped the 5 series touring - it's not that they didn't want to do it, but the economics of the operation didn't add up.


I think he wants to do Fedex like tracking............ But honestly, even Fedex has black hole. I shipped some items to Munich hotel before this ED. I tried to track it, but there is a black hole after it left the airport and before arrived in Munich. For a coupe of days, it just simply showed me: Left Newark Airport in transit.


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## pharding (Mar 14, 2004)

We use UPS and FedEx on-line software to track packages that are worth far less than a BMW 550i. BMW already has a rudimentary tracking system in place for cars after they are produced. BMW has extremely sophisticated tracking software in place to build the cars, including tracking of major outsourced component assemblies like the dashboard assembly, wiring harnesses, transmission, and steering assemblies. What I and others are suggesting in terms of tracking software is a relatively simple extension of BMW's in place systems.

It took approximately 8 1/2 hours to assemble my car with their well organized and managed approach. How much sense does it make that my car to sit at the port a few hundred yards from multiple auto cargo ships that are US bound for 504 hours while I pay for that time? Actually it worse than that because I am making lease payments on 2 BMW's at the same time. That makes no sense whatsoever. As someone of German descent, who just got back visiting with relatives in Germany, that kind of sloppiness is very un-German and not looked kindly upon. It is certainly contrary to the core values of BMW.


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## mason (Jun 8, 2006)

pharding said:


> We use UPS and FedEx on-line software to track packages that are worth far less than a BMW 550i. BMW already has a rudimentary tracking system in place for cars after they are produced. BMW has extremely sophisticated tracking software in place to build the cars, including tracking of major outsourced component assemblies like the dashboard assembly, wiring harnesses, transmission, and steering assemblies. What I and others are suggesting in terms of tracking software is a relatively simple extension of BMW's in place systems.
> 
> It took approximately 8 1/2 hours to assemble my car with their well organized and managed approach. How much sense does it make that my car to sit at the port a few hundred yards from multiple auto cargo ships that are US bound for 504 hours while I pay for that time? Actually it worse than that because I am making lease payments on 2 BMW's at the same time. That makes no sense whatsoever. As someone of German descent, who just got back visiting with relatives in Germany, that kind of sloppiness is very un-German and not looked kindly upon. It is certainly contrary to the core values of BMW.


One difference is that what you describe is all within all BMW control environment. BMW can keep track which transmission, suspension, CD player come out of the warehouse. But once the a BMW leaves the plant, it enters into a place that is controlled by another company. If BLG or Harms agrees to track a car that pleases you or BMW, it may not please Audi or Benz. What should Harms do? Have a 3 or 4 system to track?

Say you usually have one person keep track of a project that your company design, what happen another client said "No, I want 4 employees." and next one says "No, I like 3." and the next one says "I like 2 + owner.". This would go insane.

We all agree that there is plenty to improve and much information to share with us, but it needs to have a balance somewhere. What happen if BMW goes with your suggestion and get plenty of complaints for TMI??


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## pharding (Mar 14, 2004)

Dashboard assemblies, wiring harnesses, transmissions, and steering assemblies are all made by vendors, not by BMW, and not in a BMW controlled environment. It is surprising to see how much of a BMW's components are outsourced. That system works well even though BMW does not have direct control. I realize that shipping cars across the ocean is more challenging. However there is clearly substantial room for improvement in the current loosely managed process.


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

BMW uses SAP. My wife's an SAP consultant, who is currently working with a supplier to BMW. Trust me, it's not cheap (or easy) to do anything with SAP. Major upgrades generally run in the $XX million region on the SUPPLIER side. Think about what it would be on the manufacturer's side. Then you have to get everyone in the supply chain on the same system. For what - 2,500 cars a year? Of which 500 customers say will find value? This isn't going to get through IT governance.

I'd bet that it likely won't happen in itself. It may occur as an addition to an overall integration upgrade involving the tracking tool as long as all parties are signed onto it.


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## kcdude (Sep 17, 2004)

chrischeung said:


> BMW uses SAP. My wife's an SAP consultant, who is currently working with a supplier to BMW. Trust me, it's not cheap (or easy) to do anything with SAP. Major upgrades generally run in the $XX million region on the SUPPLIER side. Think about what it would be on the manufcaturer's side. Then you have to get everyone in the supply chain on the same system. For what - 2,500 cars a year? Of which 500 customers say will find value? This isn't going to get through IT governance.
> 
> I'd bet that it likely won't happen in itself. It may occur as an addition to an overall integration upgrade as long as all parties are signed onto it.


Silly question, but for so few cars why not just re-organize the ED staff and have them individually case manage each delivery. Basically they just manually look in each system that is already available to them and problem solve from there. Isn't this what is happening each time I call? Why does this require 7 figure SAP solutions? All you "systems" folks need to pull this back up to 30,000 feet and just think in terms of existing resources....I know for a fact that the information that is currently available is not even being fully utilized. How about starting there?


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## mason (Jun 8, 2006)

pharding said:


> Dashboard assemblies, wiring harnesses, transmissions, and steering assemblies are all made by vendors, not by BMW, and not in a BMW controlled environment. It is surprising to see how much of a BMW's components are outsourced. That system works well even though BMW does not have direct control. I realize that shipping cars across the ocean is more challenging. However there is clearly substantial room for improvement in the current loosely managed process.


I am talking once they entered BMW warehouse.

And piggy back to Chrischeung, what is the value of investing on a system like that? What about the few hundred thousands of regular cars BMW makes? Say it is 300,000 and 3,000 ED, so 99% of cars should follow the lead of 1% And may be it is 1% of that 1% is complaining.

Remember (if it is true) the reason your car is stuck at the port is due to data transfer error, so error like this can happen no matter how sophisticated the system is, like an entry clerk accidentally delete an entry. He/She left for the day and next day return he/she thought already entered your car hence skip to the next car. All these stuff would simply put the car at the port for at least a few extra days or more.


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

kcdude said:


> Silly question, but for so few cars why not just re-organize the ED staff and have them individually case manage each delivery. Basically they just manually look in each system that is already available to them and problem solve from there. Isn't this what is happening each time I call? Why does this require 7 figure SAP solutions? All you "systems" folks need to pull this back up to 30,000 feet and just think in terms of existing resources....I know for a fact that the information that is currently available is not even being fully utilized. How about starting there?


What happens when someone goes on vacation? Turn over - internal and external? There's a major cost in training and change management every time someone walks out the door since IP is concentrated within specific personnel.

It doesn't require a 7 figure SAP solution - which is what I'm saying. That would be a poor use of resources. I'd be almost willing to bet that BMW looked at the entire process, and came up with the one which balances cost, efficiency and effectiveness. Why would they do it otherwise?

And regarding the $XX million spend - companies don't put that kind of money in unless there is a $XXX reduction on the bottom line. Thats generally through saved labor costs (ie. layoffs or outsourcing). It looks like the BMW ED IT budget extends to just changing the "Tourist Delivery" field and ED pricing on the monroney sticker. I'm probably over simplifying it, but I doubt it would be much more specific than that.


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## M FUNF (Apr 2, 2008)

pharding said:


> What a condescending bunch of BS. If I didn't have to work for a living I could tell others not to worry about anything. I am capable of determining what I can afford. I do not need you to tell me that because I complain about incompetence and apathy that leaves an expensive BMW sitting dockside at the port for 3 weeks that "I really cannot afford a BMW in the first place".
> 
> I may be retired now but this is my 4Th retirement, started the process when I retired as an AF Officer in 1985, and then 3 more times after that, but this time it may stick,,,,, unless???
> 
> ...


Simple Farm boy is a phrase we use to describe those of us out here in fly over country, it distinguishes us from you super soofisticaded boys from that "todlin town" you call home and, all those further East. I do keep an I-Pass in several of my cars. Do not get me started on farm subsidies, my personal views do not play well outside the city in which I live. Most farms today are multi million dollar operations and if they cannot be run without government assistance then they should be sold, and the owners live off the income from the investments they could make, tax free T-bills is just one option. Not a popular view out here at all. But those running the farms are anything but simple and are very sophisticated business people.


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## jimefam (Jul 28, 2010)

Why would BMW need to track each shipment? That is why they pay a shipping agent good money for. What they need is to put pressure on the shipping agent to due things in a timely fashion. In our business we have acceptable timeframes for each of the requirements that go with importing goods into the US. I have worked with the same agent for 8 years now and had one delay that could be considered excessive. Why? Because we have an agreement in place that monetarily penalizes any mistakes. As for "customs delays" this is the ultimate trump card but it's total bs 99% of the time. I import from Colombia of all places! As you can imagine everything is physically inspected and examined every which way and yet it's pretty amazing how efficient they are. I am new to this forum and haven't even done my first ED yet(nov 12) but if the issue is the agent not handling the paperwork in a timely fashion or other mistakes of this kind it is absolutely something BMW can force them to improve.


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

I asked my wife for a back of the envelope cost estimate. Millions USD. Integration with the agent(s), US customs, NYK, W&W. Plus BMW will want to have a DMZ/firewall to protect their system. And who will administer it all? I also forgot to mention multi-lingual. So figure on adding $500-$1000 per car for real time tracking.

Her recommendation - exception handling. Meaning ED is not part of the regular supply chain and executed separately.


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## Yay-Z (Aug 13, 2007)

napajon said:


> Update: Called EH Harms 800 number and was informed that my car was badly damaged by trucking company. That car is indeed going to Newark. They are however currently building me a replacement that will be going to my dealer. Of course my dealer was informed of this last week. I'm sure he would have eventually let me know about this minor detail.


O my :yikes:


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## JSpira (Oct 21, 2002)

chrischeung said:


> I asked my wife for a back of the envelope cost estimate. Millions USD. Integration with the agent(s), US customs, NYK, W&W. Plus BMW will want to have a DMZ/firewall to protect their system. And who will administer it all? I also forgot to mention multi-lingual. So figure on adding $500-$1000 per car for real time tracking.
> 
> Her recommendation - exception handling. Meaning ED is not part of the regular supply chain and executed separately.


We're already there - E.D. is not part of the regular supply chain. In fact, how E.D. cars are handled is pretty much on a one-by-one basis. They are taken out of the normal system at the point at which they head for the BMW Welt. They never return to the normal system until they hit the VDC.

E.D. cars represent a tiny fraction of BMW's business although the tourist delivery segment is very important to the company.

I can tell you that Harms worked for quite a while to get their Web reporting system on line and there are fewer integration points.


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## Yay-Z (Aug 13, 2007)

If they cant carry out any part of their business properly, they should not be in that business. ED folks might be a small portion of the overall business but we are also a very vocal group of people.


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## the J-Man (Jul 31, 2009)

chrischeung said:


> I asked my wife for a back of the envelope cost estimate. Millions USD. Integration with the agent(s), US customs, NYK, W&W. Plus BMW will want to have a DMZ/firewall to protect their system. And who will administer it all? I also forgot to mention multi-lingual. So figure on adding $500-$1000 per car for real time tracking.
> 
> Her recommendation - exception handling. Meaning ED is not part of the regular supply chain and executed separately.


 I understand that it would be difficult to implement such a system, but it doesn't have to be. With all the processes and approvals, and consultants billing big businesses $300/hour to do simple and mundane tasks, common sense gets lost. BMW could hire a full time person at $40K per year to track all ED cars (yes, I understand BMW already has employees devoted to ED, but they could use 1 more just for tracking). That's only about $13-$20 additional expense per ED car. That person could be responsible for following up daily on every single ED car with all the various parties, and inputing such real time data into a special online database setup in 20 hours by a mediocre programmer. Every ED client would have a login to see their real time status. Or better yet, the full time person at BMW could just call or email every single ED customer every day. The ED volume is low enough that all of this could be accomplished by a single full time person. I know this would never happen in such a large company, though. There would have to be a committee within BMW to decide how to handle it. There would be bids, quotes, forecasting and NPV analysis. And then a bunch of SAP consultants would come in and convince some department head that it would be too big of a security/internal control risk and that the only real solution is a multi-million dollar tracking system. Said department head would recoil in fear at the fancy terminology of the consultants and decided that ED customers will get their cars when they get their cars, because he'll be damned if he's going to lose his job over ED tracking internal control risks.

<---- Awaits all the replies from the consultants who will tell me they are smarter than me and that my logic is eternally flawed. :angel:


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

Technology is not the driver of process. It's the other way around. Technology is a possible solution.

The problem with what you propose is that it is a highly customized process that you have simplified, that is too difficult to manage with the resources you have assigned. Communications, security etc. out of BMW are uniform - as with any large corporation. They have been vetted and conform to specific standards. A lot of this we have witnessed first hand. This isn't out of luck or having just 1 person. It's a lot of hours and work. The justification is amortization over a large business. ED is not a large business. The risks of some snafu happening by a small system impacting BMW's reputation is too great for them to risk. And yes, a decision maker will care that it's there job on the line when they make that decision.

Just think about a call you make to BMW or BMWFS. Each associate is meant to sound the same, answer in the same manner, pass certain criteria. Answers are delivered within specific time frames. You get a survey afterwards. This isn't some fly by night operation. To expect 1 person to create and execute all this for $40K a year without any additional support, adhering to BMW's standards would be honestly setting the system up for failure. Yes, a lot of repairs to BMWs can be done with duct tape and bondo - but that wouldn't meet customer expectations. This is the reason why they wouldn't implement a duct tape and bondo process and system for tracking - they'd be a laughing stock.


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## tlak77 (Aug 5, 2009)

chrischeung said:


> they'd be a laughing stock.


 The way BMW is handling ED process makes them not very far away from that. Even, if we assume that BMW is not going to invest millions of dollars (per you) in improving the process, at lest they should hire some people which are competent and care about the service they provide. I'm sure BMW has quality processes in place  implement them in BMW NA ED office as well.


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## ND40oz (Oct 6, 2009)

I have to chime in and say I didn't have a good experience with E. H. Harms. I had nothing but problems with them in Baltimore where a vehicle I had BMW ship for me sat in port for 3 weeks before it could be picked up. Their phone lines were constantly down and I'd have to call the Newark office to try and get some answers. When I finally had someone go to their office (which was a little hole in the wall over top of a diner) it was a bunch of fresh out of high school kids working at the place. On top of that, I had to pay them $380 just for them to get my vehicle cleared at port and park it in a lot so I could pick it up even though all the paperwork had already been done on the backside. Same process took an hour in Liverpool when I did a private vehicle shipment using WWL and only cost £50.


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## pharding (Mar 14, 2004)

It is clear that improvements are needed in the current approach. It is apparent that the current approach is not working consistently like it should. It makes no sense to deliver my fully loaded 550i in a $500 million world class building with a highly orchestrated, great experience for my wife and I and cap it off by my 550i literally sitting dockside for 3 weeks at the port while multiple, not fully loaded auto cargo ships leave for the US East Coast. This was our first delivery at the BMW Welt and the whole experience was absolutely amazing and absolutely perfect. We also toured the new BMW Factory at Leipzig. The Central Building was another great, world class building and another perfect presentation of BMW. Being the loyal BMW Customer that I am I get stuck paying 3 weeks of lease payments on TWO 550i's. I am going to write a very senior person at BMW in Munich and explain what happened, my purchase history of 5 BMW's in 10 years, and that what happened is not consistent with what BMW is as a company and our German heritage. I know that my letter will be given careful consideration because BMW cares.


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

Do they really need to change the process? Or find out what's going wrong, address it, and get it back to how things used to be? Perhaps more the latter, with improvements based on the former. The best efforts may be focussed outside of ED - say Harms or Customs. The easiest solution may be to just quote a delivery time of 8-12 weeks .

BMW's been doing ED for what - 20+ years. There must be something in experience.


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## kcdude (Sep 17, 2004)

chrischeung said:


> Do they really need to change the process? Or find out what's going wrong, address it, and get it back to how things used to be? Perhaps more the latter, with improvements based on the former. The best efforts may be focussed outside of ED - say Harms or Customs. The easiest solution may be to just quote a delivery time of 8-12 weeks .
> 
> BMW's been doing ED for what - 20+ years. There must be something in experience.


My point exactly. Take the existing process and resources, put another layer of proactive customer service on top of it and call it a day. This is a simple case management process and I don't buy the "what happens if someone goes on vacation" excuses for why it can't be done. This is just not that hard...all the information is right there.


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## the J-Man (Jul 31, 2009)

kcdude said:


> My point exactly. Take the existing process and resources, put another layer of proactive customer service on top of it and call it a day. This is a simple case management process and I don't buy the "what happens if someone goes on vacation" excuses for why it can't be done. This is just not that hard...all the information is right there.


 Exactly.


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## HerrK (Jan 9, 2010)

chrischeung said:


> Do they really need to change the process? Or find out what's going wrong, address it, and get it back to how things used to be? Perhaps more the latter, with improvements based on the former. The best efforts may be focussed outside of ED - say Harms or Customs. The easiest solution may be to just quote a delivery time of 8-12 weeks .
> 
> BMW's been doing ED for what - 20+ years. There must be something in experience.


Experience exists and often comes and goes, within the company and subcontractors, as personnel retire, change positions, etc. It happens in my (aerospace) industry all too often - even with the rigorous paperwork, specifications, & traceability involved. People & processes change - going backwards "to how things used to be" is not a likely a viable solution. Adapt or get eaten.


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

kcdude said:


> This is just not that hard...all the information is right there.


If that's the case, don't you find it strange that it hasn't been addressed by BMW? I always thought that efficient import/export logistics weren't that easy - otherwise there wouldn't exist a Forwarding industry.


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

HerrK said:


> People & processes change - going backwards "to how things used to be" is not a likely a viable solution. Adapt or get eaten.


I'm talking about looking at what changed from 1 year ago - when things were tutti fruiti. Not 20 years.


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

kcdude said:


> This is a simple case management process and I don't buy the "what happens if someone goes on vacation" excuses for why it can't be done.


What about the excuse of not having enough people and resources to handle the greater workload? You're probably going to say that BMW should hire temps. That would be a good solution if the problem is just the need to push paper around faster. But if there is something else fundamentally changed, it may not work. Telling a client that there car is delayed more frequently won't make it arrive more quickly.


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

I'd like to invite any 'Fester who works in the logistics/forwarding industry to make implementable and efficient improvement suggestions for BMW ED.


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## kcdude (Sep 17, 2004)

chrischeung said:


> If that's the case, don't you find it strange that it hasn't been addressed by BMW? I always thought that efficient import/export logistics weren't that easy - otherwise there wouldn't exist a Forwarding industry.
> 
> What about the excuse of not having enough people and resources to handle the greater workload? You're probably going to say that BMW should hire temps. That would be a good solution if the problem is just the need to push paper around faster. But if there is something else fundamentally changed, it may not work. Telling a client that there car is delayed more frequently won't make it arrive more quickly.


I do find it strange that BMW has not addressed this...what's your point? Are you saying just because BMW decides it correct then it must be correct? If you believe that then why are you even on this thread? No offense but I just don't understand the logic in your post.

I'm not advocating any additional resources...not my take at all...I prefer lean, mean and efficient....something BMW has down partly...they are just missing the effiect part.

I am suggesting a different approach to monitoring the progress that requires re-training of the current staff and some process changes. I tell you in my case it actually moved things along to have them sit there and continue to make excuses. After several conversations, the ED staffer admitted that she had not been there that long and didn't want to continue just telling me it would be a 3 week wait. After a simple conversation and one email later my car was on the move.

So you are missing the point...it is not more people, more systems, more information. It is a matter of simply training the people they have to use the data in front of them and working these cars by the case versus in big ole generic batches. Isn't this what your wife recommends?....exception handling


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## pharding (Mar 14, 2004)

chrischeung said:


> ..............The easiest solution may be to just quote a delivery time of 8-12 weeks......


Chris that would be a very pragmatic Chinese way to do it. Not that there is anything wrong with that. Rather than fix a problem just make a very business like decision and change the terms, leaving the problem undressed. Germans would never do that. That is not in their psyche. They have very high standards and immense pride in what they do. That is fundamental to why the Germans make great products that people around the world want to buy. For me, if BMW did that I would not do BMW European Delivery and lease BMW's every 3 years. Others probably feel the same.

Changing the topic. I got a call today from BMW NA today. They tried to get my car on a ship leaving this week to no avail. It will ship on August 18. They will expedite the processing of my car to offset some or all of the lost time. I appreciate what they are doing. This speaks highly of BMW.


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