# German Cars European Delivery?



## Dewaynrlson (Feb 14, 2011)

Many people buy brand new german cars but never take advantage of the european delivery. I am so confused. I mean, these car companies give you great cars made right in the homeland, they knock of 7% of the price, they pay for your trip there, they pay for you to stay in top of the line hotels, and they will ship your car back for free, I just don't get why more people do not take advantage of this. The free vacation part sounds awesome but to me the biggest attraction is the 7% price reduction. So my question to you is: Why do people not take advantage of the German Car Companies' European Delivery? Have any of you taken advantage of it? How was it? Have any of you not taken advantage of it


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## The Other Tom (Sep 28, 2002)

Welcome to the fest. We have all been newbees at one time or another. It's best to start by reading the stickies at the top of the page, also the Wiki. Those will probably answer all your questions.


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## Hound Passer (Feb 2, 2007)

Shhhh. ED is the best secret going.


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## bfv (Sep 30, 2010)

Dewaynrlson said:


> Many people buy brand new german cars but never take advantage of the european delivery. I am so confused. I mean, these car companies give you great cars made right in the homeland, they knock of 7% of the price, they pay for your trip there, they pay for you to stay in top of the line hotels, and they will ship your car back for free, I just don't get why more people do not take advantage of this. The free vacation part sounds awesome but to me the biggest attraction is the 7% price reduction. So my question to you is: Why do people not take advantage of the German Car Companies' European Delivery? Have any of you taken advantage of it? How was it? Have any of you not taken advantage of it


Welcome!

1) They don't pay for your trip OR stay there...at least BMW.

2) Actual price reduction is 11-14%.

3) Read the forums and Wiki on this site and you will be


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## CarSwami (Oct 2, 2005)

You are preaching to the choir on this forum!:thumbup:


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## bayoucity (Jun 11, 2010)

Sometimes, buyer needs to have replacement vehicle immediately & it will be impossible to wait for ED. Anyway, welcome !


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## Kamdog (Apr 15, 2007)

I did ED and loved it as a life experience. It is not cheaper when you factor in the airfares, hotels, food, etc., plus, you lose the car for a month or more on the way back, so you need additional transportation.

It was well worth it for me, but I am retired, and we vacation in Europe a lot. Different strokes for different folks.


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## rmorin49 (Jan 7, 2007)

I have been researching the Audi ED program and I found not a single dealer willing to negotiate off ED MSRP. Not familiar with the MB program.


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## bayoucity (Jun 11, 2010)

rmorin49 said:


> I have been researching the Audi ED program and I found not a single dealer willing to negotiate off ED MSRP. Not familiar with the MB program.


Same here. What is ironic is most AUDI dealer will just gave you ED pricing (5% discount) on inventory car off the lot when you start inquiring about ED. I check into MB program awhile ago regarding E350 BlueTEC, they are inflexible with ED pricing. What you see on the website is pretty much what you will have to fork over to seal the deal. There is no such thing as -X% of ED MSRP.


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## MB330 (Oct 18, 2005)

rmorin49 said:


> I have been researching the Audi ED program and I found not a single dealer willing to negotiate off ED MSRP. Not familiar with the MB program.


+ you have to pay up front VAT tax - 19%.


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## bayoucity (Jun 11, 2010)

MB330 said:


> + you have to pay up front VAT tax - 19%.


That's not necessary the fact. You have to write them a check in the amount of 19% VAT. The dealership will hold the check until the vehicle clear the US custom. The only exception is if you fail to turn in the ED vehicle & keep it in Europe.


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## ProRail (May 31, 2006)

bayoucity said:


> Sometimes, buyer needs to have replacement vehicle immediately & it will be impossible to wait for ED. Anyway, welcome !


That's a biggie for me, and if (when) I travel in Europe I like to have plenty of options: car, train, bus, tram, U-bahn and S-bahn, canal boat, river craft, and more. Having an ED car llmits those choices and diminishes the European experience.


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## ProRail (May 31, 2006)

CarSwami said:


> You are preaching to the choir on this forum!:thumbup:


Not necessarily. Some of us just drop in now and then to enjoy the pictures and stories and to pick up some new info on what's happening on European roads. (You don't have to do ED to be a Europhile.)


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## Andrew*Debbie (Jul 2, 2004)

ProRail said:


> That's a biggie for me, and if (when) I travel in Europe I like to have plenty of options: car, train, bus, tram, U-bahn and S-bahn, canal boat, river craft, and more. Having an ED car llmits those choices and diminishes the European experience.


You can always drop or park the car.

We drive less here than we did in the US. After two years the MINI has 9,500 miles on it. I prefer to use the rail network for long haul trips.  We even took the train from North Wales to Paris. But there are places that aren't convenient to get to by public transport.

Here are a few photos of places we wouldn't have gone to without a car. Some like Harlech castle are close to a rail station but it is on the wrong line. Llanfairpwll to Harlech is an hour drive or 5 1/2 hours by train. I wouldn't have felt safe walking to the train station after a concert at Manchester's Gorton Monastery.

Photos of places we've driven to:










Debbie and Willow Penrhyn castle. To be fair, there is a bus but we couldn't have taken Willow. 









Sioe Mon









Cowboy Junkies at The Monastery

















Harlech Castle 1 hour by car or 5 1/2 by train!


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## beewang (Dec 18, 2001)

bayoucity said:


> ... What is ironic is most AUDI dealer will just gave you ED pricing (5% discount) on inventory car off the lot when you start inquiring about ED....


Why is it ironic?? Audi are not as desireble as BMW's or MBZ, except for a couple model of "one-off" exceptions, Audi cars are NOT selling at the rates of the 1st tier German cars brands. There is an old saying.. for Volvo and Audi "... if you paid invoice... you paid WAY TOO MUCH!!"

You want a real bargain?? Buy a slightly used Audi... The resales are just pathetic on them...


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## MB330 (Oct 18, 2005)

bayoucity said:


> That's not necessary the fact. You have to write them a check in the amount of 19% VAT. The dealership will hold the check until the vehicle clear the US custom. The only exception is if you fail to turn in the ED vehicle & keep it in Europe.


Not anymore. They cashed next day.


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## SD ///M4 (Jan 24, 2011)

ProRail said:


> That's a biggie for me, and if (when) I travel in Europe I like to have plenty of options: car, train, bus, tram, U-bahn and S-bahn, canal boat, river craft, and more. Having an ED car llmits those choices and *diminishes the European experience*.


Well, I suppose that's _one _way of looking at it. For me, the thrill of picking up our new car and driving it in Europe is going to vastly increase the European experience. The enthusiastic reports of EDers seems to support the latter.


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## AggieKnight (Dec 26, 2008)

The biggest thing the X5 has going against it in my wife's mind as we look for her next car is that you *cannot* get one on European Delivery (for obvious reasons). If they made it in Germany, she would never have wanted to look at the Porsche, the Volvo, the Audi, the Acura (hideous thing) SUVs.

(yes I know you can do other manu ED on some of those)


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## bayoucity (Jun 11, 2010)

MB330 said:


> Not anymore. They cashed next day.


The local Audi dealership never bother to cash my VAT check. They have to collect the 19% VAT deposit per Audi USA's guideline. The only time they will cash it is when you decide to keep the vehicle in Europe. However, different dealership might follow the guideline differently. In fact, my friend has recently done an ED on A5 & his dealership didn't cash the VAT check as well.

p/s Re-write per professor ProRail .


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## ProRail (May 31, 2006)

bayoucity said:


> My last Audi dealership simply hold the check until the vehicle clear the dock. They never cash it. They say it is the formality in the event ED vehicle fail to export back to USA because Audi AG is ultimately responsible for collecting VAT. I'm unsure if it is depending on the dealership because I've also heard other dealership will cash the check. If you are interested, you might want to check around with different CA.


What language this?


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## ProRail (May 31, 2006)

SD 335is said:


> Well, I suppose that's _one _way of looking at it. For me, the thrill of picking up our new car and driving it in Europe is going to vastly increase the European experience. The enthusiastic reports of EDers seems to support the latter.


Fine for them. Not my thing. Sorry if that bothers anybody.


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## NateXTR (Aug 8, 2006)

ProRail said:


> Not necessarily. Some of us just drop in now and then to enjoy the pictures and stories and to pick up some new info on what's happening on European roads. (You don't have to do ED to be a Europhile.)


While I agree that you don't have to do ED to appreciate this forum. The statement about preaching to the choir is apt. I would guess that most of the people who actively participate in this forum either have done, are actively planning or desperately want to do ED (in my case, all three are true).


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## GTFan712 (Feb 13, 2011)

NateXTR said:


> I would guess that most of the people who actively participate in this forum either have done, are actively planning or desperately want to do ED (in my case, all three are true).


+1. Bimmerfest is definitely the best forum for information on ED.


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## bayoucity (Jun 11, 2010)

ProRail said:


> What language this?


My bad ! English. 

p/s This is what happen when I'm using BB & typing in a hurry.


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## bayoucity (Jun 11, 2010)

*A proper write-up per ProRail:*

Below is a reply from Audi this morning ([email protected]):

Hello Mr. ,

In the event the vehicle is not dropped off within the guidelines of the
program, the dealer is charged the 19% tax, and each dealership has
their own internal policy as to how the VAT is held. In some cases it
is deposited, and in others it collected in the form of a "hold check".
The VAT is not forwarded to Audi of America.
Once you have returned from your trip, your dealer can contact Audi of
America to confirm your vehicle drop-off and return your VAT. You do
not have to wait until your vehicle clears US Customs or is dealer
delivered.

Kind regards,
Audi European Delivery Program

&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&

Audi's ED program remain unchanged & different dealership might follow the guideline differently.


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## SD ///M4 (Jan 24, 2011)

bayoucity said:


> Below is a reply from Audi this morning ([email protected]):
> 
> Hello Mr. ,
> 
> ...


So if I understand this correctly, BMW trusts you to get the car out of Europe within 5 months, but Audi doesn't, so they pre-charge the 19% VAT tax as an incentive to do so. The 19% (probably at least $10k and more) goes to your Audi dealer, who can choose to use your money if they want to until you prove that you have the car in the US. Or am I wrong?


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## Erregend (Apr 22, 2003)

> What language is this?





> Fine for them. Not my thing. Sorry if that bothers anybody.


Somebody keeps getting up on the wrong side of the bed each morning! :dunno:


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## bmw325 (Dec 19, 2001)

SD 335is said:


> So if I understand this correctly, BMW trusts you to get the car out of Europe within 5 months, but Audi doesn't, so they pre-charge the 19% VAT tax as an incentive to do so. The 19% (probably at least $10k and more) goes to your Audi dealer, who can choose to use your money if they want to until you prove that you have the car in the US. Or am I wrong?


Sounds like it. Audi's ED program pales in comparison to BMW's. You can't lease, you only get 5% off (off which 2% is actually a dealer "contirbution"), and the upfront VAT. Surely with the resources of VW at their disposal they could do better.


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## bayoucity (Jun 11, 2010)

bmw325 said:


> Sounds like it. Audi's ED program pales in comparison to BMW's. You can't lease, you only get 5% off (off which 2% is actually a dealer "contirbution"), and the upfront VAT. Surely with the resources of VW at their disposal they could do better.


Porsche's program is worst.


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## bald (Feb 3, 2007)

Hey andrew*debbie, nice trip!


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## Donny (Jul 4, 2009)

Was going to do a Porsche ED. Going with a 335 is instead


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## bayoucity (Jun 11, 2010)

SD 335is said:


> So if I understand this correctly, BMW trusts you to get the car out of Europe within 5 months, but Audi doesn't, so they pre-charge the 19% VAT tax as an incentive to do so. The 19% (probably at least $10k and more) goes to your Audi dealer, who can choose to use your money if they want to until you prove that you have the car in the US. Or am I wrong?


No, no & yes. Majority of the dealership don't even bother to cash VAT check. It is strictly an upfront agreement between you & your CA. Again, I'm not here to bitch about either program. I'm simply trying to clarify the urban myth.


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## bayoucity (Jun 11, 2010)

Donny said:


> Was going to do a Porsche ED. Going with a 335 is instead


Donny, will you give us the low down on Porsche's program? I heard through the grapevine there is additional surcharge on MSRP to do ED with Porsche.


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## M FUNF (Apr 2, 2008)

bayoucity said:


> Donny, will you give us the low down on Porsche's program? I heard through the grapevine there is additional surcharge on MSRP to do ED with Porsche.


That is correct, cost depends on the car you buy, any wonder why Porch is considered the most profitable car company in the world. :dunno:


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## MB330 (Oct 18, 2005)

bayoucity said:


> No, no & yes. Majority of the dealership don't even bother to cash VAT check. It is strictly an upfront agreement between you & your CA. Again, I'm not here to bitch about either program. I'm simply trying to clarify the urban myth.


Well, that was not I read and confirm from at list 2 Audi customers. Both of them told me, that their check was cashed next day. And new check was issued after they returned from ED.


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## Andrew*Debbie (Jul 2, 2004)

bayoucity said:


> Porsche's program is worst.


No kidding.

Volvo's ED program includes round trip airfare on SAS and one night in a hotel. Discount is "up to 8% off MSRP". 
http://www.volvocars.com/us/sales-s...efits_of_overseas_delivery/pages/default.aspx

Mercedes program includes 7% discount from MSRP, a night in a hotel, * a full tank of fuel* and two taxi vouchers.

http://www.mbusa.com/mercedes/european_delivery_program/what_is_included

Saab used to have a good program, including $2000 towards travel costs but GM killed it years ago. Dunno what the new owners have planned.

=====

Americans can take advantage of French tax-free short term lease programs.

Peugeot and Renault have programs where you can lease a brand new car for 17 to 170 days. Cars are resold in France after you turn them in.

http://www.peugeot-openeurope.com/lang=en/

http://www.renaultusa.com/ Take a Dacia Sandero on the Nurburgring!

Pickup and drop off outside of France (including Munich) are available for a fee.


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## bayoucity (Jun 11, 2010)

MB330 said:


> Well, that was not I read and confirm from at list 2 Audi customers. Both of them told me, that their check was cashed next day. And new check was issued after they returned from ED.


Dude, I'm not here to beat the death horse. If you are interested in doing Audi ED, I can forward you the name of the dealsership here that doesn't cash & earn interest on your VAT check . I'm hoping you won't go to the dark side & get a soup-up VW since BMW has much better re-sell value. The different between Welt, BMW Museum & Ingostadt is like night & day.

We are truly spoiled to have great pricing structure, no confusing VAT policy, first class support & capable CA like Adrain Avila & so on.


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## MB330 (Oct 18, 2005)

bayoucity said:


> Dude, I'm not here to beat the death horse. If you are interested in doing Audi ED, I can forward you the name of the dealsership here that doesn't cash & earn interest on your VAT check . I'm hoping you won't go to the dark side & get a soup-up VW since BMW has much better re-sell value. The different between Welt, BMW Museum & Ingostadt is like night & day.
> 
> We are truly spoiled to have great pricing structure, no confusing VAT policy, first class support & capable CA like Adrain Avila & so on.


Thanks, bayoucity!
You right regarding BMW be a better inform their customer (and treat them well also) about ED. Let's leave pure horse alone.


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## boothguy (Feb 1, 2007)

A minor clarification on Volvo's OSD program: the complimentary airfare is for two and must be on SAS for the overseas leg. The USA domestic leg feeding into the SAS flight can be with any carrier but is covered. Biggest penalty is that the coach seats on SAS are like a concrete park bench - just not as cold. 

The free hotel night is only if you're picking up at Volvo's main OSD center at the factory in Gothenburg, Sweden - otherwise, you're on your own for hotels. Pickup is (or at least was) available in about a dozen other European cities for an additional fee. 

When we did one for my wife's S80T6, we signed papers at Volvo's HQ in Brussels and then were driven to a large-ish local dealer to pick up the car. Dark downstairs "VIP delivery room" in the attached picture now seems like a hovel in comparison to the palatial BMW Welt.

And the online communities for both Volvo and Audi as far as ED is concerned are almost nonexistant compared with this one.


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## rmorin49 (Jan 7, 2007)

bayoucity said:


> Dude, I'm not here to beat the death horse. If you are interested in doing Audi ED, I can forward you the name of the dealsership here that doesn't cash & earn interest on your VAT check . I'm hoping you won't go to the dark side & get a soup-up VW since BMW has much better re-sell value. The different between Welt, BMW Museum & Ingostadt is like night & day.
> 
> We are truly spoiled to have great pricing structure, no confusing VAT policy, first class support & capable CA like Adrain Avila & so on.


I agree on the resale value of Audis and have decided I will purchase a nice CPO S5 instead of a new one. I'll tour the Audi World this April while vacationing in Germany instead of picking up a new ED Audi. As far as a "souped up VW", my R32 is one of the best cars I have ever owned. I like BMWs but Audi-VW also builds some very nice cars.


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## basiluf (Dec 16, 2010)

Kamdog said:


> I did ED and loved it as a life experience. It is not cheaper when you factor in the airfares, hotels, food, etc., plus, you lose the car for a month or more on the way back, so you need additional transportation.
> 
> It was well worth it for me, but I am retired, and we vacation in Europe a lot. Different strokes for different folks.


Not necessarily. We are saving around $200/month on a 36 month lease over a local dealer.

36 X 200= $7200
- Airfare= $750
- Hotel 3 nights= $225
Spending money= $750

Total savings= $5475
Two car payments at once for one month= $5000 saving


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## Andrew*Debbie (Jul 2, 2004)

boothguy said:


> Dark downstairs "VIP delivery room" in the attached picture now seems like a hovel in comparison to the palatial BMW Welt.


That VIP room is a Palace compared to Kundenzentrum Freimann. But there was a certain cool factor in just being able to find Freimann and getting in the gate.

More photos of Freimann in this thread http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=125999

EDIT: Kundenzentrum Freimann in street view.

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&sou...d=d4pDW1eyV4sNfFYUTQjkRQ&cbp=12,307.96,,0,7.1

Debbie with the X3 in 2007:


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## MB330 (Oct 18, 2005)

Andrew*Debbie said:


> That VIP room is a Palace compared to Kundenzentrum Freimann. But there was a certain cool factor in just being able to find Freimann and getting in the gate.
> 
> More photos of Freimann in this thread http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=125999
> 
> EDIT: Kundenzentrum Freimann in street view.


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