# POLL: Did you get the ZHP on your 330?



## rumratt (Feb 22, 2003)

330 owners, did you get the ZHP option?

I'm trying to figure out how many people actually buy 330's without it. 

Looks to me like BMW should have charged an extra $2k for the package based on the popularity.


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## eyeguy (Apr 29, 2004)

I voted - out of curiosity, how do the numbers break down that you come up with $2k?


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## rumratt (Feb 22, 2003)

eyeguy said:


> I voted - out of curiosity, how do the numbers break down that you come up with $2k?


I made up the number. I just meant that from a marketing point of view, if it is wildly popular, you can over-charge for it and get away with it.


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## BloodRedHog (Mar 9, 2004)

You got it - ZHP.

*"ZHP - there is no substitute."* (apologies to Porshe)

*"ZHP - English for BMW."* (ditto to Fosters beer)

*"It's not BMW - it's ZHP."* (HBO)

*"A ZHP is forever."* (DeBeers diamonds)

*"Just ZHP it."* (Nike)

*"ZHP -- it takes a licking and keeps on ticking (stalling)."* (Timex)

*"ZHP - Don't leave home without it."* (AMEX)

*"There are some things money can't buy. For everything else, there's a ZHP."* (MasterCard)

*"When a ZHPer talks, people listen."* (EF Hutton)

*"ZHP - kid tested; mother approved."* (Kix cereal)

*"ZHP - it's grrrrreat!"* (Kellogg's Frosted Flakes)

*"Yo quiero ZHP."* (Taco Bell)

*"Z-H-P spells Relief."* (Rolaids)

*"This is your car.....This is your car on ZHP. Any questions?"* (Drug Free America)


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## eyeguy (Apr 29, 2004)

:clap: :bustingup :bow:


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## Wallenrod (Nov 25, 2003)

Well, it is not like you missed on some new model by not getting a ZHP. Really it is more a sum of parts rather than one thing. I really like that I get cloth/alcantara interior plus M3 wheel, shorter shifter, aerodynamic pack and stiffer suspension/wheel/tire combo plus some bump in hp/torque. It is a sum of the parts. I think its is a great package and well worth the money but that is all it is. A package. Think of it as a 1995 M Sport 540i.
Those who got a 330i SP should not regret their decision.
If I were to do it again, I would absolutely get ZHP.


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## dynosor (Jul 15, 2003)

*SP all the way*

Call me silly, but I prefer the regular SP to the ZHP. I don't need larger rims or a sportier ride. My SP corners better than most cars I care to own. The handling does not need to be any sharper nor am I willing to put up with a ride that is only "a little harder". If I used the car only on the race track my attitude would be different, but it is an everyday commuter.

The 350Z is good example of handling optimization killing the street ride. The E46 M3 is also too harsh for my old bones. It does not balance ride and handling nearly as well as the E36 M3.


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## andy_thomas (Oct 7, 2002)

rumratt said:


> I made up the number. I just meant that from a marketing point of view, if it is wildly popular, you can over-charge for it and get away with it.


Rather than just pluck a number from the air, why not make a proper attempt? You know how much the M Sport II package costs in BMW's domestic market - a trip to the German site is all that's required - knock off the VAT and divide by your favourite forex rate. Assume that the lower diff doesn't actually increase cost by any significant amount, and all you have to do is work out how much the extra 10 bhp would cost you if you had to DIY with re-ground cams, 
and what it's worth to you.

The answer I get is US$3,900. Say, $500 for the extra 10 bhp, and $3,300 for the rest of the kit (€3,150 for the M Sport II package in Germany, and a little over €1,20 to the dollar). Maybe $100 for the alcantara bits inside, and the upcharge for the beefier exhaust.

How much does BMWNA charge for the PP? Hey, it's $3,900 .


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## Dr. Phil (Dec 19, 2001)

BloodRedHog said:


> You got it - ZHP.
> 
> *"ZHP - there is no substitute."* (apologies to Porshe)
> 
> ...


 :rofl: :rofl:


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## MicahO (Apr 19, 2004)

rumratt said:


> I'm trying to figure out how many people actually buy 330's without it.


You're never going to get a good picture of who buys the 330 without the ZHP package on this forum. There are a relatively small number of ZHP equipped cars out there, something like 1-3% of the e46 production run. There are far more 330's with the Sport package or just the Premium package. For one reason or another, however, MANY ZHP owners have migrated here. There should probably be a moratorium on ZHP related posts for a while to try and bring back all the non-ZHP-ers that have recently bugged-off in annoyance.

You are getting a good idea of how many 330 owners *->on this one forum<-* have purchased the ZHP package, but applying that statistic to the general population is going to be seriouly flawed.

As popular as it is here, BMW maybe could have charged more. Then there would be yet another reason for non-ZHP owners to say that there are stars upon thars..... Oh, right - we've already been told it's a waste of money!


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## jmt_esq (Jun 15, 2004)

MicahO said:


> You're never going to get a good picture of who buys the 330 without the ZHP package on this forum. . . . For one reason or another, however, MANY ZHP owners have migrated here.


Very good point. I found this forum because I was looking to buy a ZHP, and posts on other forums (www.roadfly.org) sent me to bimmerfest. So, anecdotally at least, it appears that the 3-series forum here has a disproportionately high number of ZHP owners, as compared to the general population. My guess is, since, by definition, anyone who seeks out an Internet forum to discuss / learn about their car is at least a low-grade car "enthusiast," you'll also find a higher proportion of ZHP, ZSP, and M owners online than in the population at large.


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## RoyE46 (Jan 31, 2004)

rumratt said:


> ...I'm trying to figure out how many people actually buy 330's without it. ..


This bb is heavily self-selecting of ZHP owners. (like me  )


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## rumratt (Feb 22, 2003)

MicahO said:


> You are getting a good idea of how many 330 owners *->on this one forum<-* have purchased the ZHP package, but applying that statistic to the general population is going to be seriouly flawed.


Yes, I totally agree.

I actually had the phrase "what ratio of people _here_ have the ZHP" but I ended up deleting and reposting because I messed up the poll and it is un-editable.

The second time around I was typing quickly.


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## BloodRedHog (Mar 9, 2004)

So far, 60%. That seems awful high.


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## doeboy (Sep 20, 2002)

Wasn't available when I got mine.

So I improvised...


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## Nbtstatic (Oct 9, 2002)

No smg available or I would have. :thumbup:


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## nate (Dec 24, 2001)

If I were getting a 330, I would order the ZHP option.


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## jgrgnt (Apr 27, 2002)

45 ZHP'ers so far. You're a larger group than I expected.

Chalk up another 325 owner here. If I had waited a year and WAS in the market for a 330, I most likely would have sprung for the ZHP.


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## Roadhawk (May 21, 2004)

I will be a ZHP owner (in about 3 weeks...)..should I vote?

And I agree with the posters who expressed the opinion that forums such as this tend to attract the more performance orientated folks. I imagine that there is a higher percentage in folks who have modded their cars and in folks who have other performance maxed BMWs - such as the M3/5, M coup and such then in the population at large.

No choice is wrong IMO. All BMWs are nice cars and "do it" for their owners IMO. Some don't want, need or even like the extra performance (and perhaps the rougher ride, greater maintenance or what have you - that goes with a performance tweaked vehical)...and for some its a cost/afordability issue. Personally I wanted the performance and features of the ZHP package (4 doors & somewhat softer ride then the M3) - and I also wasn't willing to pay the significant difference for the M3 (particualrly when I would have had to justify [the drawbacks & price etc] to the wife...


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## salvo (Feb 28, 2004)

I SHOULD HAVE!!! Damn it...its only 10+ HP, dif cams, throatier exhaust....a sweet bumper...THATS ENOUGH!...  

although, i dont like the rubber trim on the bumpers and the mirrors are so so...compared with the SP...


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## DrivingMaryland (Jun 16, 2004)

zhp ci :bigpimp:


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## jeffh325 (Mar 15, 2004)

salvo said:


> I SHOULD HAVE!!! Damn it...its only 10+ HP, dif cams, throatier exhaust....a sweet bumper...THATS ENOUGH!...
> 
> although, i dont like the rubber trim on the bumpers and the mirrors are so so...compared with the SP...


If you don't want your non-ZHP 330Ci, I know someone willing to take it off your hands.


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## NetEngWiz (Apr 5, 2004)

Looking at the results...I can see why there are so many "ZHP" posts.


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## RandyB (Mar 4, 2003)

*Regular old 330i SP here...*

I elected not to get the ZHP for a number of reasons, most of which are cosmetic. Primarily, the color I wanted (Electric Red) wasn't available in ZHP, only the muddy red was. :rofl:

I actually prefer everything that the SP has relative to what they changed on the ZHP, except the taller rear gear and the extra 10 hp. I got very few options - only SP, bi-xenons, and leather interior (6-speed was standard). I figured I would try to make up for not having the 10 extra hp by having a few less lbs.

The ZHP extras have since grown on me a bit, but I still have no regrets. The decision was made easier for me with the color non-availability business.


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## Moderato (Nov 24, 2003)

I got the 330i without the ZHP package and it was available at the time of purchase. For me the 330i regular SP & PP was sporty enough for me, but with a bit more luxury and comfort then the ZHP package, which was why I optioned it that way. I think the ZHP is a nice car too though. :thumbup:

edit - What year did the ZHP option become available, because that is going to effect the numbers in the poll right? Maybe there should be an option if you bought your 330i before it was available, would you or would you not have gotten it.


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## swchang (Oct 5, 2003)

Started in MY2003.

I got the ZHP option (yes, I can admit it's an option package, not an entirely different car), and I'm glad I did. However, I can say that if BMW would have still been making the M3 in a 4-door variant, they'd be $10k richer at my expense. But given that lack, I'm making do. :bigpimp:


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## mkh (Mar 24, 2003)

swchang said:


> Started in MY2003.


To be more precise, the first shipment arrived the first week of April, 2003.


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## swchang (Oct 5, 2003)

mkh said:


> To be more precise, the first shipment arrived the first week of April, 2003.


 :bow:


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## Moderato (Nov 24, 2003)

mkh said:


> To be more precise, the first shipment arrived the first week of April, 2003.


That's what I'm saying, the ZHP is a recent thing so you're limiting your statistics to bimmerfest members from only the last 2 years at the most. For those who bought a 330i before the ZHP was an option, there should be a "I would've gotten the ZHP(and I've driven one or not) and I'm happy with my standard 330i or SP ( and I've driven a ZHP or not) and would buy it that way again, choices for the poll. This way we can get a feel for how many bimmerfest members would've gotten the ZHP option, and also we can see if they've actually driven one or not this way we can tell if they really know for sure they would want a ZHP or if they are just saying they would want the ZHP because of all the positive posting about the ZHP here. I also agree with what was said before about people who get the ZHP package are more likely to use the internet and post on message boards. It's true that a lot of BMW owners could care less about these message boards and don't have the "enthusiasm" for their cars, like we bimmerfest members have.

edit - The poll title should also include something to the effect, asking all bimmerfest members to please vote regardless of what their ride is.


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## Moderato (Nov 24, 2003)

rumratt said:


> I thought about that, but I wanted real sale decisions, not hypotheticals.
> 
> The last two poll choice is not intended to be meaningful. They were put there just to give people something to click on, essentially to make sure they don't screw up any of the top two choices.
> 
> Given that, I think the subject is fine.


Yea, but you're not getting the opinions of all the other bimmerfest members on the ZHP. We are only able to here from those who bought a ZHP and those who bought a 330i while the ZHP was available, which is what percent of bimmerfest members? I just think the results of this poll are inconclusive because everyone on this site who got the ZHP wants to show support for the decision, while most who got the base 330i, just don't care. To avoid hypotheticals is why I said to include whether you're basing the decision on actuall behind the wheel time in a ZHP or only on what you've read about it. I'm as interested in this topic as you are, but I think that the results of this poll will be biased. :dunno: I'm not trying to be butthead here, I admit I might be wrong about this though.


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## PhilH (Jun 7, 2002)

The reality of my purchase is somewhere between choices two and three. The day I placed my order, Saturday 12/7/02, the ZHP package had not been announced. On the Monday after I placed my order, 12/9/02, the first press release from BMW came out regarding the ZHP package.

However, they only released general information, and did not have specifics on actual upgrades, they did not have any pictures and there was no pricing information. Speculation was that the package would cost at least a couple thousand, and rather than cancel my order (basically before it was officially placed on Monday morning) and continue to put off ordering my car, I stuck with the order I placed. 

I voted that the ZHP package was not available when I placed my order, since that is technically true.

I may or may not have ordered the package if all the details were out at the time of my order. I probably would have. A year and half later, knowing what I know now of the package, I'm actually a little glad I didn't get it. I have no stalling problems and I look forward to upgrading my suspension and wheels with aftermarket parts in the future.


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## LouT (Jun 11, 2003)

rumratt said:


> 330 owners, did you get the ZHP option?
> 
> I'm trying to figure out how many people actually buy 330's without it.
> 
> Looks to me like BMW should have charged an extra $2k for the package based on the popularity.


I got a bad case of the 'I wants' when BMW introduced the car - BMW must have been thinking of me when they designed it. The car has been perfect and is a joy to drive, no stalling or other weird behavior that's been discussed on this forum. Although BMW has expanded the package to the coupe and convert, I still feel as though I have a relatively unique car. There is another ZHP here in Corvallis, but have seen few others in my travels. :thumbup:


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## BloodRedHog (Mar 9, 2004)

LouT said:


> There is another ZHP here in Corvallis, but have seen few others in my travels. :thumbup:


I have yet to see another in the whole state where I am in. Dealer said this was his first ZHP (but I think he meant ZHP 6MT.)


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## FenPhen (Jan 13, 2004)

BloodRedHog said:


> Dealer said this was his first ZHP (but I think he meant ZHP 6MT.)


I picked up mine in April '04 at Niello BMW in Sacramento and he said it was the first ZHP they had seen.


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## JamesSpot (Mar 4, 2003)

*Very Happy with my Imola Red/Nat Brwn/ Black cube ZHP*

I waited a long time to buy my 330i ZHP. For me, it is a truly balanced sports sedan. 
1. The 6 speed short-shifting manual transmission, the 18" wheels with performance tires, the comfortable ///M steering wheel, and the powerful, smooth-revving engine with tuned exhaust offer sports car performance. 
2. The luxury features, stereo, and four doors make it a nice ride for four people for an hour or a tremendous all-day ride for two. 
3. The fact that my sports sedan gets grouped with owners of automatic transmission, premium package 330i buyers for insurance purposes rather than exclusively with owners of sports cars is a good thing.

To see the difference between an E46 M3 and a 330i ZHP, you need to be at wide open throttle on a track where the M3's 98 Hp advantage and 1200 rpm redline increase could be put to use. For my daily driving to work and weekend flings on two lane roads, the ZHP handling is good enough to bring a smile to my face every time I turn the key. There is no other car that offers the blend of practical daily driver and sports car as good as a 330i ZHP.

330i ZHP in Imola Red/Nat Brwn/Black Cube/Xenons/Cold Wx Pkg


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## Roadhawk (May 21, 2004)

Well said JamesSpot (and welcome).- I second everything you said...what a car. 3 series in general is a great car - and ZHP is even better (IMO) - at least for my needs/wants etc. I can hardly wait the 2 weeks now to pick it up and drive it in Europe. If your into (excellent/balanced) performance - don't have the cash for or the desire to go the M3 route (for whatever reason) and aren't necessarily planning on modding the car out - the ZHP is the 3! And so far - looking all over the DC area - I have only seen one on the road. The car looks great and is rare anough for just a bit of exclusivisity. And you know when you see someone with a ZHP they are very likely an enthusiast - I would argue as much as or perhaps even more then an M3 driver. My resoning is that I think some buy the M3 just for its marque/status value - wheras those who spend for the ZHP are likely folks wanting just a bit more from your standard 3 in the performance realm...but maybe not anough to want to go through the hassle (and warrenty voiding) of serious mods to get that edge. Except for perhaps some minor tweaks (CDV removal, clutch stop etc) I imagine I'll keep mine pretty stock - and I think I'll be loving it just that way!


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## swchang (Oct 5, 2003)

Roadhawk said:


> Well said JamesSpot (and welcome).- I second everything you said...what a car. 3 series in general is a great car - and ZHP is even better (IMO) - at least for my needs/wants etc. I can hardly wait the 2 weeks now to pick it up and drive it in Europe. If your into (excellent/balanced) performance - don't have the cash for or the desire to go the M3 route (for whatever reason) and aren't necessarily planning on modding the car out - the ZHP is the 3! And so far - looking all over the DC area - I have only seen one on the road. The car looks great and is rare anough for just a bit of exclusivisity. And you know when you see someone with a ZHP they are very likely an enthusiast - I would argue as much as or perhaps even more then an M3 driver. My resoning is that I think some buy the M3 just for its marque/status value - wheras those who spend for the ZHP are likely folks wanting just a bit more from your standard 3 in the performance realm...but maybe not anough to want to go through the hassle (and warrenty voiding) of serious mods to get that edge. Except for perhaps some minor tweaks (CDV removal, clutch stop etc) I imagine I'll keep mine pretty stock - and I think I'll be loving it just that way!


Welcome to the NoVA ZHP club!

That's what I'll say to you in two weeks.


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## 330soon2b (May 30, 2004)

i have only seen one on the highway so far in jersey. it was red and i saw it on route 80. this was just before I bought mine. i had an 04 TL and see them every where now. in any event, the zhp seems little bit unique which is just fine with me.


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## MicahO (Apr 19, 2004)

330soon2b said:


> i have only seen one on the highway so far in jersey. it was red and i saw it on route 80. this was just before I bought mine. i had an 04 TL and see them every where now. in any event, the zhp seems little bit unique which is just fine with me.


I finally saw another one this weekend that was actually being driven by it's owner. Prior to yesterday, I had seen one TiAg ZHP with dealer tags that was being used by an employee of Prestige BMW in Ramsey. This weekend I went by a Mystic Blue ZHP in my own town. I'd never seen one before that, and I'm into and out of Manhattan 5 times a week, with a 120 mile RT commute. Yes, it is just an option package, and yes, it is unique.


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## Playaymar (May 6, 2004)

*Zhp ....*

Having driven around in a 325i with the Sport and Premium Packages for the last 3 years I went out and drove many cars in the same "class" and "price range" as my 3 when deciding to buy a new car. After driving Merecedes, Infinity and even a Nissan the choice wasn't among other companies, it was among *which* BMW model to purchase. (I wish I had more daily problems like that!)  The choice between getting a 5 series (the styling does grow on you, and as someone else posted, once you are inside one you forget what is outside) or getting another 3 series. Having 4 doors is pretty much a must, so after driving the 545i with the sport package and the 330i ZHP, I chose the 330i with ZHP. The drive was more nimble and more in tuned with what I was looking for. (Cost was also a consideration....)

My 325 handled very well, my 330i handles better. My 325i was quick, my 330i is quicker. My 325i looked good, my 330i looks better. My 325i was fun to drive, my 330i with ZHP is much  more fun to drive. What more could one ask for? (Self cleaning wheels maybe?)

I live in Tampa, so the roads are nothing like Mission Viejo/Laguna Hills where I used to live, but I've only seen one other ZHP so far. I like that....


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## swchang (Oct 5, 2003)

Playaymar said:


> Having driven around in a 325i with the Sport and Premium Packages for the last 3 years I went out and drove many cars in the same "class" and "price range" as my 3 when deciding to buy a new car. After driving Merecedes, Infinity and even a Nissan the choice wasn't among other companies, it was among *which* BMW model to purchase. (I wish I had more daily problems like that!)  The choice between getting a 5 series (the styling does grow on you, and as someone else posted, once you are inside one you forget what is outside) or getting another 3 series. Having 4 doors is pretty much a must, so after driving the 545i with the sport package and the 330i ZHP, I chose the 330i with ZHP. The drive was more nimble and more in tuned with what I was looking for. (Cost was also a consideration....)
> 
> My 325 handled very well, my 330i handles better. My 325i was quick, my 330i is quicker. My 325i looked good, my 330i looks better. My 325i was fun to drive, my 330i with ZHP is much  more fun to drive. What more could one ask for? (Self cleaning wheels maybe?)
> 
> I live in Tampa, so the roads are nothing like Mission Viejo/Laguna Hills where I used to live, but I've only seen one other ZHP so far. I like that....


Noticed your sig. Can your car get any blacker?


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## 330soon2b (May 30, 2004)

MicahO said:


> I finally saw another one this weekend that was actually being driven by it's owner. Prior to yesterday, I had seen one TiAg ZHP with dealer tags that was being used by an employee of Prestige BMW in Ramsey. This weekend I went by a Mystic Blue ZHP in my own town. I'd never seen one before that, and I'm into and out of Manhattan 5 times a week, with a 120 mile RT commute. Yes, it is just an option package, and yes, it is unique.


I hope you don't drive your zhp into manhattan!? I picked up my plates at the dealer on Saturday and I got to look at an 04 M3 Convertible. Nice car, but the interior is virtually the same as the ZHP, which made me feel good. Actually, I prefer the silver cube over the M3 trim. Likewise, I like the alcantara steering wheel better than the M3 setup. However, the M3 body panels and huge tires give it the, "I mean business" appearance that is unique to the M3.


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## Playaymar (May 6, 2004)

swchang said:


> Noticed your sig. Can your car get any blacker?


 :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Thanks for the laugh.

--Slightly off topic..

.... Not much blacker, only brake dust gets it closer to being in full stealth mode. I like black cars although mystic blue was my next choice. I drove a really nice Blue Top/Mystic Blue 330Cic ZHP. I almost, almost pulled the trigger on that one, but it just wasn't realistic for family travel and after the salesman said, "Go Ahead, punch it!" :yikes: while I was testing it, there was no way I would have taken it. It certainly looked nice, but it felt really slow, must have been the extra weight or the Steptronic...


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## FenPhen (Jan 13, 2004)

JamesSpot said:


> There is no other car that offers the blend of practical daily driver and sports car as good as a 330i ZHP.


Everything you said, plus gas mileage. :thumbup: And it has a back seat... :eeps:


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## EclipsedEvo (Jul 8, 2004)

I just got my 04 330i ZHP, and I absolutely love it! The car is great to drive and was worth the extra over the 330 Sport.


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## Playaymar (May 6, 2004)

EclipsedEvo said:


> I just got my 04 330i ZHP, and I absolutely love it! The car is great to drive and was worth the extra over the 330 Sport.


Congratulations! :thumbup:

What are your impressions about how it compares with your M3?


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## Chris90 (Apr 7, 2003)

i finally drove a ZHP at the Cancer Drive. It's a really nice car, though not that exciting. Still way better than the '01 330 i drove back in '01. The only thing I didn't like was the funky throttle, but maybe that just takes getting used to. 

Lovely sound though, I like it better than my E36, which already sounds nice. Wonderfully competent handling - too good in my opinion, i don't feel like it takes any skill or attention to corner fast. It's not a car that I feel like I have to own, it's just not as exciting as say an E36 M3. 

No other new sports sedan comes close though, I'll say that. The IS300 was more fun than the early 330s or 325s, being more of a driver's car, but the latest 330 w/ ZHP is a real step up in sportiness.


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## FenPhen (Jan 13, 2004)

EclipsedEvo said:


> I just got my 04 330i ZHP, and I absolutely love it! The car is great to drive and was worth the extra over the 330 Sport.


 :thumbup:


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## deadarmadillo (Feb 21, 2004)

I was really torn between an M3 (my original plan) and the ZHP. Several factors weighed in favor of the latter: 1) everyday liveability 2) 4 doors 3) cost, including the dreaded "gas guzzler" tax and 4) engine concerns at the time I was shopping (since more-or-less resolved and not an issue now). In retrospect, I probably made the correct (practical) choice but a part of me still wants the significantly upgraded M3 performance. No regrets whatsoever about buying an E46 - I'm still very suspect of the next generation, given BMW's recent track record - but thats a subject for another thread.


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## gerg (Dec 28, 2003)

This is off the topic but I've been meaning to ask it for awhile. 

Did the 2000 328Ci coupes come with sport suspension as std?

Greg


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## PhilH (Jun 7, 2002)

gerg said:


> Did the 2000 328Ci coupes come with sport suspension as std?


Yes. All US coupes have had the sport suspension standard.


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## EclipsedEvo (Jul 8, 2004)

Playaymar said:


> Congratulations! :thumbup:
> 
> What are your impressions about how it compares with your M3?


Thanks! The ZHP is a great vehicle. I have a 4 door so it has more practicality than the E36 M3. The ZHP corners well and has gobs of torque. With all this in mind, it simply is not a M3. The E36 M3 corners much better as you would think, and the gear ratios are much more aggressive. The ZHP is fun to drive and is almost as fast in the staright line, but the M3 simply is a different creature. The driving feel cannot be matched by the ZHP. However, the ZHp gives you almost the same power, 4 doors, and light clutch for everyday driving. If you are looking for an E46 4door M3, the ZHP is the closest you are going to get.


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