# Top Gear - RS4



## pintnight (Mar 19, 2002)




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## jetstream23 (Mar 9, 2004)

Maybe the RS4 should have tried going off the edge of the cliff as well  

Boy does that engine sound sweet. The ball is in the e90 M3's court now....let's see what BMW can offer up!


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## michelito (Feb 6, 2003)

something else :wow: to put on the christmas list... for 2015 or so... :tsk:


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## bmwxdrive (Nov 13, 2004)

Nice video but that was a pretty big claim its better than an M3 but it probably is because of the 8 but the new M3 will be better competition. I hope the new one kicks its ass even though the Audi is a awesome car.


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## Dave 330i (Jan 4, 2002)

bmwxdrive said:


> Nice video but that was a pretty big claim its better than an M3 but it probably is because of the 8 but the new M3 will be better competition. I hope the new one kicks its ass even though the Audi is a awesome car.


I went to Clear Lake BMW (Houston) the other day and casually asked a salesman when the new M3 will arrive...They're already here..., No, I mean the E90 M3...Yes, I'll show you the brochure...It's a V8, right? No, an inline 6. And, shaking my head, thinking, don't they hire only experienced salesman at BMW dealers?

On another subject. How do you include the grayed window of a post when you copy and paste?


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## Ajax (Feb 1, 2002)

"Dare I say it? Better than an M3?"

Oh it's ON beyotch  

Perhaps not from a track perspective, but Audi has laid down the gauntlet; lovely sounds...great looks...great fit/finish...what does 50K quid come out to $US?

I like that show.


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## WileECoyote (May 7, 2003)

I love how Jeremy debunked the Audi ads where they were saying "so good they were banned". :thumbup:

BTW, that whole episode was great via bittorrent. I love that show.


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## HW (Dec 24, 2001)

AJAX said:


> "Dare I say it? Better than an M3?"
> 
> Oh it's ON beyotch
> 
> ...


 86.2KUSD


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## andy_thomas (Oct 7, 2002)

HW said:


> 86.2KUSD


Only if you pay VAT, registration, delivery etc. on a car exported to the US. First, take off delivery charges and UK tax, registration and plates, all of which are always included in the UK price quote:

£50,000 - 800 - 200 = 49,000

Now take off VAT:

49,000 * 40/47 = £41,700

Now multiply by forex (2/12):

41,700 * 1.73 = $72,000

Now multiply by a market factor to account for the greater US sales volumes. I use 0.92, on the basis that the price of a US-market M5 is 0.92 times the ex-VAT, etc. price of a UK-market M5:

$72,000 * 0.91 = $66,400

There's your ballpark.


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## Moderato (Nov 24, 2003)

The E90 M3 is going to blow the RS4 out of the water in all categories except snow traction.


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## Boile (Jul 5, 2005)

"Gerge Bush walks like this... makes him look more powerfull" :bustingup


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## Boile (Jul 5, 2005)

Moderato said:


> The E90 M3 is going to blow the RS4 out of the water in all categories except snow traction.


Except you can't buy one today. 
Any car in the future will beat any car today.


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## EdCT (Mar 14, 2002)

Neither one of these cars excites me, they're just too heavy.

If you're going to drive a car getting up near the 4000lb mark, why not go with a 5 series, or an Infiniti M35x?

The five is a bit larger than the E90, but benefits from more lightweight materials.

Ed


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## stylinexpat (May 23, 2004)

Cool Video..


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## Credulus (Sep 16, 2005)

I saw an RS4 on the road yesterday. I know its a monster performer but I cant get over that front end. Just not my taste. Im sure it drives like bat out of hell but I'm not big on the looks. The grill and lights just dont do it for me. Something with the nose. Oh well. Still a mean car.


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## Moderato (Nov 24, 2003)

Boile said:


> Except you can't buy one today.
> Any car in the future will beat any car today.


Unless you crap $100 dollar bills, if you're going to drop 70K on a car I don't think waiting a year or two for the E90 M3 as opposed to getting an RS4 in a couple of months is out of the question.


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## Boile (Jul 5, 2005)

Moderato said:


> Unless you crap $100 dollar bills, if you're going to drop 70K on a car I don't think waiting a year or two for the E90 M3 as opposed to getting an RS4 in a couple of months is out of the question.


Waiting a year or two?
BMW won't even confirm what specs it will have. How do you know it will blow the RS4 ? :rofl:


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## Jeff_DML (Mar 13, 2002)

andy_thomas said:


> Only if you pay VAT, registration, delivery etc. on a car exported to the US. First, take off delivery charges and UK tax, registration and plates, all of which are always included in the UK price quote:
> 
> £50,000 - 800 - 200 = 49,000
> 
> ...


good ballpark, rumor on audiworld is 65k base


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## Moderato (Nov 24, 2003)

Boile said:


> Waiting a year or two?
> BMW won't even confirm what specs it will have. How do you know it will blow the RS4 ? :rofl:


Obviously the E90 M3 will have 400+ HP and be around 400lbs less then the RS4, that sounds like a win to me. Even if it's on a par with the RS4, which I doubt but if it is I'd still rather have the E90 M3, it's going to be the best 4 seat GT you can buy for under 70K. My only problem is deciding if I'm going to get Silver/Black or Black/Cinnamon.


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## fearyaks (Jun 1, 2005)

*My problem with the M3*

Well, my problem with the M3 is that it doesn't come in four doors! I think the RS4 really doesn't compare to the C55 or M3 but more to the E55 and M5. If I had the extra cash, I'd definately have to consider an RS4 over an M5. They're both sweet cars and I suppose it'd come down to 'different strokes for different folks' (or however that saying goes).


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## Jeff_DML (Mar 13, 2002)

Jeff_DML said:


> good ballpark, rumor on audiworld is 65k base


update my own rumor, latest rumor in a official looking email is lows 70s  guess that is prettty loaded if you care


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## SmoothCruise (Jul 23, 2005)

Moderato said:


> Obviously the E90 M3 will have 400+ HP and be around 400lbs less then the RS4, that sounds like a win to me. Even if it's on a par with the RS4, which I doubt but if it is I'd still rather have the E90 M3, it's going to be the best 4 seat GT you can buy for under 70K. My only problem is deciding if I'm going to get Silver/Black or Black/Cinnamon.


Don't you think that once the new M3 comes out that Audi will bump up the numbers for the Audi RS4 to stay competitive? Then at that point, will you skip out on the new M3, and wait a few years down the road for BMW to come out with a better M3? At which point don't you think Audi will bump up the numbers for the Audi RS4 to stay competitive? Then at that point, will you skip out on the new new M3 and .... on and on....


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## armaq (Apr 18, 2003)

Jeff_DML said:


> update my own rumor, latest rumor in a official looking email is lows 70s  guess that is prettty loaded if you care


The first batch of US cars will come pre-packaged from the factory (with Prem Pack). Still not worth $70k IMO. The US model will lose the wonderful Recaro racing seats, the Lambo steering wheel, the start button and the option of ceramic brakes. In Europe, you can also order with Alcantara interior, colored stitching, colored seat inlays, dechromed exterior (dark grill, wheels, window trim and exhaust tips). Out of all the goodies, we in the US only get amber reflectors, for free.


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## Moderato (Nov 24, 2003)

SmoothCruise said:


> Don't you think that once the new M3 comes out that Audi will bump up the numbers for the Audi RS4 to stay competitive?


No.


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## SmoothCruise (Jul 23, 2005)

Moderato said:


> No.


Why not? Is it too costly? I mean, BMW made incremental improvements to the 645, don't you think Audi would do the same to the RS4?


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## Moderato (Nov 24, 2003)

SmoothCruise said:


> Why not? Is it too costly? I mean, BMW made incremental improvements to the 645, don't you think Audi would do the same to the RS4?


The engine in the RS4 is the same as the regular S4, therefore it is already tweeked to the max. Plus the change on the 645 also encompassed the 545 as well so there was more to gain, financially from putting in the research hours towards that project. BMW loves to introduce a model and get everyone who "has to have" the new model. Then 2 years later they make the improved version which hooks everyone else. Then at then end of the cycle they make the limited editions (ZHP, ZCP) to get the final customers. It's brilliant. RS4 is at the end of it's life, and I suspect is a gateway to completely new models Audi will release in the future.


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## SmoothCruise (Jul 23, 2005)

Moderato said:


> The engine in the RS4 is the same as the regular S4, therefore it is already tweeked to the max. Plus the change on the 645 also encompassed the 545 as well so there was more to gain, financially from putting in the research hours towards that project. BMW loves to introduce a model and get everyone who "has to have" the new model. Then 2 years later they make the improved version which hooks everyone else. Then at then end of the cycle they make the limited editions (ZHP, ZCP) to get the final customers. It's brilliant. RS4 is at the end of it's life, and I suspect is a gateway to completely new models Audi will release in the future.


Ah, okay. But, according to your post, does that mean there is another model of the 6 after the 650 (aside from the M6)? Will it be that bmw supercar that looks almost like a 6?


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## Moderato (Nov 24, 2003)

SmoothCruise said:


> Ah, okay. But, according to your post, does that mean there is another model of the 6 after the 650 (aside from the M6)? Will it be that bmw supercar that looks almost like a 6?


Hold on let me check my magic 8-ball............not too clear. Ok, let me speculate then. I think the 650 & M6 will be the final versions of the 6 series until the next generation, if they make one. I do expect the E90 3 series to follow that time line I mentioned though. I'm really wondering if they are going to do an E92 330Ci with the 255hp engine first or if they will release the 335Ci right from the begining. One nice thing about the M3 is that they don't seem to change that much from year to year, with the exception of the E36 M3 95 - 96.


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## ze_shark (Dec 31, 2005)

*Audi RS4 test drive*

I posted on Asphalte an article on a pretty long test drive of the new Audi RS4 V8.

I have to say it's the first Audi that convinces me as a real sports car, the engine is a real success, and the rest is up to the task. No real flaw except the usual slightly mushy brake pedal feel and a tank which will not take you very far if you play with the beast.

I repeatedly measured 50 to 160 km/h in less than 10s (around 9.8) in 3rd ...

There's a new player in town, it will be a long wait until the E92 comes out, and it better be good (and light).


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## Moderato (Nov 24, 2003)

ze_shark said:


> I posted on Asphalte an article on a pretty long test drive of the new Audi RS4 V8.
> 
> I have to say it's the first Audi that convinces me as a real sports car, the engine is a real success, and the rest is up to the task. No real flaw except the usual slightly mushy brake pedal feel and a tank which will not take you very far if you play with the beast.
> 
> ...


Do you have an English version of your review? Also how was the low end torque on the RS4? Did it feel heavy, or like all of the weight was up front? Does it have open diffs front & rear? Did it understeer easily? Have you heard of a coupe version called the RS5? Thanks.


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## Jeff_DML (Mar 13, 2002)

yeah english version would be great, tried translation but it is no fun reading broken language. 

Everything I have read has not mentioned anything about LSD in the front/rear diffs, usual torsen quattro center LSD only, open front/rear. Only thing new is that default bias is rear wheel biased, 40/60ish, from the previous 50/50 setup


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## Moderato (Nov 24, 2003)

Jeff_DML said:


> yeah english version would be great, tried translation but it is no fun reading broken language.
> 
> Everything I have read has not mentioned anything about LSD in the front/rear diffs, usual torsen quattro center LSD only, open front/rear. Only thing new is that default bias is rear wheel biased, 40/60ish, from the previous 50/50 setup


I really don't like the idea of an open diff using the brakes for torque transfer on a performance car, especially for the rear.


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## ze_shark (Dec 31, 2005)

I'll try to work on english translations if I have the time, also had similar requests for the long term test on my 355GTS F1 but never got the time to do it.

To answer your questions, the handling is rather neutral with slight understeer at the limit. The weather was cold, much too cold for the Michelin PS2s, but I was nonetheless impressed by the grip level and balance. No doubt that on a scale, the car weight balance is nose heavy, but it does not feel like it. 
In corners, the balance is neutral, with very slight lift-off oversteer, and slight understeer if you hammer too much from mid corner on. A hint of adjustability with the throttle at the limit. The claimed torque bias towards the rear axle is hard to perceive, feels more like a Porsche Cayman S where the rear is planted and the front will eventually signal the grip limits.

In any case, it's way more sorted than any Audi I drove so far, S4 V6 biturbo (B5), S4 V8 (B6), TT 3.2 DSG, etc ... Still biased towards efficiency vs fun, but with the performance level of the V8, efficiency is fun it its way. Not a driftmeister hooligan though, perhaps more a 996TT than a 360/430 in spirit.

I don't know if the diffs have limited slip, I am not even sure whether the concept makes mechanical sense on a Quattro, but inner wheel spinning is absolutely not an issue.

There is talk of an A5 4-seat coupé with the RS4's V8, but if it ever comes out, it's far away in time.


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## MG67 (Aug 19, 2003)

"Big Dead Horse Nailed to the radiator grill..." :rofl:


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## wwb4 (Dec 29, 2005)

fearyaks said:


> Well, my problem with the M3 is that it doesn't come in four doors! I think the RS4 really doesn't compare to the C55 or M3 but more to the E55 and M5. If I had the extra cash, I'd definately have to consider an RS4 over an M5. They're both sweet cars and I suppose it'd come down to 'different strokes for different folks' (or however that saying goes).


BMW is releasing a E90 M3 4 Door Version.


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