# Shopping multiple dealers for price etc.



## 3ismagic# (Mar 17, 2011)

I won't comment on the facts of this situation. I do find the topic an interesting one.

My question is this why would a CA assume he would get a truthful answer from their competitor? Unless there is price collusion (illegal), isn't it in a CA's interest to deny he is giving good deals when asked as this will decrease the chances that their competitor will attempt to beat the deal in question?


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## darbyogill (Jan 16, 2011)

quackbury said:


> You should probably call one of your old law school classmates (preferably one who actually passed the bar) and ask them to define "slander" and "defamation of character."


Are you making a citizen's arrest counselor? You can use my handcuffs. I like those tight


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

3ismagic# said:


> My question is this why would a CA assume he would get a truthful answer from their competitor?


Price collusion is illegal (I think - don't want to get into hot water on this thread). Price disclosure is not. BMW releases selling data to all dealerships in the area - keeps prices just right. They also manage inventory, so no dealership is continually selling too low. So the secret is not how much the deal is I guess, but if a specific CA is doing that deal. Pricing is not really secret. All the CAs just get a laugh out of it. What's wrong with that?


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## 3ismagic# (Mar 17, 2011)

Thanks for the info chris. Do you know if this data is provided to dealers in aggregated or disaggregated (avg deal for each dealer)?

Just providing average pricing pooled across all dealers in an area wouldn't give much info. Only how close they are to the avg. I imagine that each dealer's pricing strategy would be proprietary info and wouldn't want it shared with their competitors (at least I'm the absence of price collusion to keep everyone honest).


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## ZoomVT (May 30, 2008)

this is one of the most entertaining threads i have read in a while.

im not a lawyer, and i dont play one on TV (or internet forum) and not desire to be one. Now:

1. the OP (a dealer) making a somewhat valuable post. I think that quite a few noobs or uninformed posters would try something like that. Hell, even a seasoned poster would probably try it. Now that we know they do double check deals against each other, probably smart not to try to play sponsors against each other. Like one of them said, it is quite likely you are already getting a good deal.

2. I honestly LOLed at the idea of this being collusion or some kind of illegal activity. It doesnt take a lawyer or someone that went to law school to see that.

3. Many industries work that way. For example: Hotels check with other hotels in the area (basically hourly) to know their occupancy rate and their average rate and they price their rooms accordingly.


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

3ismagic# said:


> Just providing average pricing pooled across all dealers in an area wouldn't give much info. Only how close they are to the avg. I imagine that each dealer's pricing strategy would be proprietary info and wouldn't want it shared with their competitors (at least I'm the absence of price collusion to keep everyone honest).


How does it help the dealer if everyone is undercutting everyone else? It just drives down prices, pushes down resale etc. It's a smart way of doing things - BMW collects the data and distributes. I've got no idea how it's done - just from what I read on these boards and what I can surmise. For all I know, this may have been discontinued.

Plus BMW controls supply. It's often been said that if you are a dealer that doesn't play ball (ie you continually sell too low), then your allocation gets cut. It's hard to sell cars when you don't have any to sell.


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## tivark (Apr 8, 2011)

if i had a nickel for how many times a CA has lied to us (me and my family).... "this is the best deal this part of the country.." 
its a profit driven industry - i make no excuses for their need to lie - they get away with it 95% of the time and with lies they make a killing and feed their family and send kids to college. more savvy customers in any field will use the same tricks against them, sometimes it works this time it didnt..


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## [email protected] (Feb 18, 2010)

darbyogill said:


> Wow.
> 
> This is an interesting thread.
> 
> ...


: popcorn:

Coming from the guy that *assumed * upon no basis I didn't have a college degree because I sold cars....

Listen you guys - you can get all hustle and bustled - and say we are profit driven sharks - and we are cornering the market - and blah blah blah.

We were just pointing out that don't put us together - it will be a waste of time.

I don't think I've done a deal on this forum for more than $750 over invoice - with the majority of them being $500 over.

And there isn't one person who hasn't received the lease buy rate.

If you call $500 over invoice and buy rate a cornered market - then fine - because that is as good as a deal gets - but comon guys.

You all know too much - you don't let us make that much profit - and we know that.

The incentive for us in being here is the majority of you are all informed - so you know what a great deal is - and it makes them quick and easy.

All we do here is give you guys good deals - and they come _automatically_.

Oh - and Happy Easter!


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## silverforum (Apr 5, 2011)

We certainly very much appreciate the straightforward and helpfulness of the CAs on the forum. I would assume this is an isolated incident and majority of bimmerfest members would fact fairly  All the antitrust etc. speculation belongs in a seperate thread but let me say try buying a Ipad 2 for anything less than MSRP


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

I got my ipad 2 under msrp - corporate purchase program. What's your point?


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## darbyogill (Jan 16, 2011)

[email protected] said:


> : popcorn:
> 
> Coming from the guy that *assumed * upon no basis I didn't have a college degree because I sold cars....
> 
> ...


Thanks for responding directly Will.

You said you're 25, and have been selling cars for 5 years. The timeline didn't seem to work for a college degree, but if in fact you are a man of letters then I apologize for the erroneous assumption. Clearly my math was faulty in a couple of other areas as well, and I'd also like to apologize for my general tone in that thread.

As I've said before, you clearly have a lot of fans here, and that's good for you. They clearly appreciate your shoot-from-hip, tell-it-like-it-is style. I know how important repeat and referral business is, and even if every deal you get from here is a skinny one clearly it's enough for you to pay for your dry cleaning.

So please humor me when I voice my opinion, because I do think it's interesting how some of these threads turn into the car salesman's watercooler. As a customer I feel a little weird to hear you talking about me when I'm still in the room (in an electronic sense, anyway). Like I said in the other thread, I don't want to hear my shoe salesman complain about how my feet stink--that strikes a deep chord with me. Clearly others want to hear you vent. I hope we all can respect everyone's right to have an opinion.

And yeah, the price fixing/collusion/anti-trust argument is completely spurious, a total red herring. But I just wanted to make the point that when you start spouting off at the water cooler, there's no telling how people will interpret it and where it will go.

Perhaps a little more discretion, Dr. Shaw? Just a thought. Or maybe I'm just a crusty old man and I should go back to yelling at the kids running through my lawn looking for pastel colored eggs.


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## quackbury (Dec 17, 2005)

Such a tempest in a teapot.

There are folks on here who appreciate Will taking the time to say "if you are going to cross shop us, try to be intelligent when you do." I'm shocked that at least one member was so egregious about it, but I guess nothing should surprise me any more.

If folks DON'T want to hear what CA's have to say, then why hang out on the "Ask-a-Dealer" forum? Makes no sense to me. Unless you have an axe to grind against a certain CA because you showed yourslef to be a total tool in another thread. Pretty juvenile, but again, why should I be surprised.

@Chris Cheung: I think the iPad reference was to say "Don't sweat collusion in the auto market, when no retailer is allowed to sell Apple products at a discount." If someone wants to complain about price fixing, Apple is the poster child.

Props to Will, Greg and the others for all the mini deals they do, even for the jackasses out there. :thumbup:


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## darbyogill (Jan 16, 2011)

Oh quacky, y so srs? It's just the internet.

I do want to hear what CAs say. And I reserve the right to voice my opinion, even if it's different from yours. 

Is this the first time someone's disagreed with you counselor?


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## Bart001 (Apr 9, 2005)

One of the many things that amazes me is that people will spend HOURS of their time and of multiple SA's time to try to shave the last $200 off of a $60,000 car :dunno:

I enjoyed reading of the poster who after wasting all of that time realized that the cost to ship the car exceeded the discount he was shopping for. :rofl:

I think that the problem is that price haggling is entertainment for some buyers, but of course it's the livelihood of the person at the other end of the transaction. Buyers complain that 'it's not a fair fight' because dealerships have 'all the info,' but I submit that the converse is true too; a buyer can spend time f'ing around with an out-of-area SA, putting him or her through the ringer trying to shave $200, with ZERO intention of buying from them.

I'd certainly respect a SA who said, "I'm done; you're just using my numbers to shop someone else."


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## Alpine300ZHP (Jan 31, 2007)

Bart001 said:


> One of the many things that amazes me is that people will spend HOURS of their time and of multiple SA's time to try to shave the last $200 off of a $60,000 car :dunno:
> 
> I enjoyed reading of the poster who after wasting all of that time realized that the cost to ship the car exceeded the discount he was shopping for. :rofl:
> 
> ...


Thank you. I was waiting for someone to point out this obvious fact. Reality is that most people do not have the time or desire to spend hours haggling over a couple hundred dollars. I like to buy from a certain fest sponsor who I like and trust, but under no circumstance would I take a 750 over deal and try to shop it down to 500. I would buy from the 750 over guy because he gave me a good and fair deal and should be rewarded for his efforts (even though it is a mini deal for him). Also, I am sure it was a red flag to the OP that someone told him he was offered a zero over ED invoice deal and that person was still shopping. Who the heck would shop a deal like that? If it was a real offer the person would have taken it before the dealer changed his mind.


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## Stevej2001 (Jan 26, 2008)

*I concur-- squeezing the last few hundred dollars isn't worth it to me.*

I know you'll all gasp, but when I ordered my new F10 I went to our one local dealer, offered $1000 over invoice and told him that I knew it was a very good deal for him, and I expected superior service... and that's what I've gotten both before and after the sale.

$500 on a $60,000 purchase? Big deal.


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## donkeyjote (Nov 6, 2006)

Bart001 said:


> One of the many things that amazes me is that people will spend HOURS of their time and of multiple SA's time to try to shave the last $200 off of a $60,000 car :dunno:
> 
> I enjoyed reading of the poster who after wasting all of that time realized that the cost to ship the car exceeded the discount he was shopping for. :rofl:
> 
> ...


I totally agree with you that spending two or three days saving $200-$500 is ridiculous--just to say I got the BEST deal. Guess what. I don't really care. I can make that $500 a lot more easily in less time at work so I'm happy for the CA to have a fair deal.

As far as out-of-area of SAs, I ended up buying 200+ miles away because they were fair and put the time in. My local dealership basically said good luck and screw you.


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## b-y (Sep 14, 2004)

darbyogill said:


> Wow.
> 
> This is an interesting thread.
> 
> ...


Actually, there are times when the Robinson-Patman Acts *requires* a seller to confirm that the price he believes he is matching or beating has actually been offered to the customer.

--/signed/ Your friendly professor, who warns that this advice is possibly worth what you are paying for it. :angel:


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## guymandude (Dec 28, 2010)

darbyogill said:


> Like I said in the other thread, I don't want to hear my shoe salesman complain about how my feet stink--that strikes a deep chord with me.


wash your feet and wear clean socks next time


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## [email protected] (Feb 18, 2010)

darbyogill said:


> Thanks for responding directly Will.
> 
> You said you're 25, and have been selling cars for 5 years. The timeline didn't seem to work for a college degree, but if in fact you are a man of letters then I apologize for the erroneous assumption. Clearly my math was faulty in a couple of other areas as well, and I'd also like to apologize for my general tone in that thread.


I worked full time while going to school. Some people do that. I started sophomore year of school. Graduated in 2009 with no job market and making a good living. Here I am.



darbyogill said:


> So please humor me when I voice my opinion, because I do think it's interesting how some of these threads turn into the car salesman's watercooler. As a customer I feel a little weird to hear you talking about me when I'm still in the room (in an electronic sense, anyway). Like I said in the other thread, I don't want to hear my shoe salesman complain about how my feet stink--that strikes a deep chord with me. Clearly others want to hear you vent. I hope we all can respect everyone's right to have an opinion.


You aren't my customer - and quite honestly unless you wouldn't be. Get off your high horse of entitlement to think that we are all in here to talk about you.



darbyogill said:


> And yeah, the price fixing/collusion/anti-trust argument is completely spurious, a total red herring. But I just wanted to make the point that when you start spouting off at the water cooler, there's no telling how people will interpret it and where it will go.


So far, I don't think you've made one good point on any input thus far in any thread. But please - keep trying.



darbyogill said:


> Perhaps a little more discretion, Dr. Shaw? Just a thought. Or maybe I'm just a crusty old man and I should go back to yelling at the kids running through my lawn looking for pastel colored eggs.


If I had discretion - then I wouldn't be giving you fuel to run your mouth. That wouldn't be any fun....


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## The BoatMan (Apr 2, 2002)

[email protected] said:


> : popcorn:
> I don't think I've done a deal on this forum for more than $750 over invoice - with the majority of them being $500 over.
> 
> And there isn't one person who hasn't received the lease buy rate.


Not worth my time to shop a deal better than that. I'd take that any day of the week.


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## Ty Vil (Dec 19, 2002)

Bart001 said:


> One of the many things that amazes me is that people will spend HOURS of their time and of multiple SA's time to try to shave the last $200 off of a $60,000 car :dunno:
> 
> I enjoyed reading of the poster who after wasting all of that time realized that the cost to ship the car exceeded the discount he was shopping for. :rofl:
> 
> ...


Best post in this thread.

There are plenty of people who transacting with them isn't worth the pittance you're going to make off them. One step beyond that are the people who you're glad you didn't transact with at any value.

We had a client in here a few weeks ago who had used HOURS of my time demoing/shopping me with his new X5 that he'd bought at a different dealer 50ish miles away because he saved a grand $200 or some stupid amount. He cornered one of my collegues and wanted a tutorial about how to use the car as they didn't have the know how to properly deliver the car. I guess the $200 he saved probably would've taught him to use the car...


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## Me530 (Feb 17, 2005)

: popcorn:


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## darbyogill (Jan 16, 2011)

[email protected] said:


> If I had discretion - then I wouldn't be giving you fuel to run your mouth. That wouldn't be any fun....


I agree, no fun at all. We look forward to a long and spirited discourse, Dr. Shaw.


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## quackbury (Dec 17, 2005)

Luckily, BF makes really easy to avoid feeding the troll by clicking on the "ignore" button. If enough folks do that, most trolls eventually tire of "discoursing" with themselves, and find another way of crying out for attention. Just clicked that button, and wish I'd done it a week ago. 

Sent from my HTC Inspire using BimmerApp


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## adrian's bmw (Feb 14, 2003)

Bart001 said:


> One of the many things that amazes me is that people will spend HOURS of their time and of multiple SA's time to try to shave the last $200 off of a $60,000 car :dunno:
> 
> I enjoyed reading of the poster who after wasting all of that time realized that the cost to ship the car exceeded the discount he was shopping for. :rofl:
> 
> ...


:bow: I officially nominate this as the Ask a Dealer Post of the Year.


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## adrian's bmw (Feb 14, 2003)

[email protected] BMW said:


> In general most people on this forum are stand up people who are just looking for no BS and a good deal which I respect.. We just don't like it when they play us and assume we will not cross check w/ other dealers if it sounds too good to be true. All of CA's at some point say PASS to a deal if it's either too much work or they expect us to work for free. It's a good business overall, with good clients. But like any sales position sometime you have know when to pass on a sale, either due to too low a price or lack of ethic from buyer.


:thumbup: I agree. They are the most loyal group of folks ever. I've been blessed with their support and business since 2003 and maybe that's why you have so many dealer sponsors on here now.

I liken it to basically being a contractor where the buyer is soliciting bids for a project. The buyer interviews the contractor, has them submit a proposal, the buyer reviews it and the contractor's reputation... and of course, gets low ball bids, high ball bids, and middle of the pack bids and makes a decision from that point.

Sadly, I hate passing up deals. I really do. I'll even make an honest confession: I don't take $500 over invoice deals on ED. I just can't. Murphy's law, maybe. Happens everytime where what I'd refer to as a donation with a risk has it's consequences (chargeback, bad survey, an honest mistake, etc); where it ultimately isn't justifiable much less worth it. Will, PK, and Greg can do them or close to them.. maybe it's a California thing. :dunno: I just don't understand how $500 over (or very close to it) is becoming the new $1,000 over for some ED specialists. It used to be that $1,000 over was and many view as a very fair deal. I mean, after the dealership pays the CA $100-$250 for commission, then other expenses like gas and detail, how is it really worth it to net a few bucks much less get beat up over several emails for a few hundred bucks from a $1,000 over?

And as far as buy rate is concerned, I really want to know how the finance manager's react to these client advisors when they hand these buy rate deals to them? I mean, it's like a cash deal for these finance manager's, so they can't be too happy about them. I've been torched on this topic before (in defense of finance managers making a little money on the lease factor), so I'm used to it, but I'd really like to know from Will and maybe Greg, and maybe PK (not sure if he does buy rate, too). :angel:


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## 3ismagic# (Mar 17, 2011)

Just speculating but a few factors make it possible and even profitable to do $500 over on ED deals.

1) The fact that ED allocation is essentially unconstrained while regular allocation is constrained creates an interesting Niche ED market. This niche market consists disproportionately of enthusiasts and board members. In this niche market either a lot of dealers can pad their sales numbers a little bit or a few dealer to raise their numbers a lot.

2) Boards like these allow buyers to connect with sellers they would have never imagined working with and open up more price competition. Someone willing to fly to germany to pick up their car won't have too much problem driving or catching a short flight to pick their car up from a dealer in another state or region or doing a PDC.

3) PDC delivery reduces the actual costs to dealers for doing these deals. With some e-mails and a fax machine a deal can be done without the CA and buyer ever meeting. That lowers the profit point for ED sales.

4) all these forces can lead to a consolidation of the ED market in the hands of a small number of knowledgeable ED specialists who can do high volume/low margin deals as a side business to their low volume/high margin standard business. Boards like this create social networks which serve a conduits for information about who gives the best ED deals/gives the best service etc. This further concentrates the ED market among those who get the Fester seal of approval as it were.

I wonder why more dealers in big/centralized/airline-hub markets don't aggressively try to exploit this niche.


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## mclaren (Jan 5, 2005)

Any car salesman ( client advisor ) would be happy to sell a new BMW for 1 penny as long as he gets his mini commission. A mini is a mini whether the gross profit is $500 or minus 50k. It's the sales manager who sets the parameters. He gets his orders from the owners. I suspect that most owners of BMW dealerships just don't want to do $500 over ED deals, they figure the cars are discounted 7% and that's enough of an incentive to do ED for some people. I don't think they want to do 1k over deals either which used to be the "great deal". Too many people call or email frequently and the whole thing becomes a real PITA. Then if you don't cater do their every whim they give you a bad survey. All things considered I don't think ED is a great business.


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## 3ismagic# (Mar 17, 2011)

mclaren said:


> Too many people call or email frequently and the whole thing becomes a real PITA. Then if you don't cater do their every whim they give you a bad survey. All things considered I don't think ED is a great business.


Those are potential problems of all deals now a days and are not confined to ED. Welcome to the 21st century. That is the reality of modern car sales. The internet has dramatically reduced the information asymmetries that used to substantially privilege dealers in negotiations. Those that can adapt to the new reality and hire people capable of tapping into and servicing this market will thrive, those that cannot will go away.


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## mclaren (Jan 5, 2005)

Yeah, but the potential problems are greatly magnified with ED. Nevertheless I agree with your general point. People like Adrian who got on this website early sold a ton of cars, I've bought 4 myself which would never have happened if he didn't exploit the internet. Trying to sell cars being the next "up" is tough.


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## AnonCA (Oct 26, 2010)

"Those that can adapt to the new reality and hire people capable of tapping into and servicing this market will thrive"..and what the consumer will end up with is about 3 gigantic BMW dealerships in the country..offering xero over invoice deals on every deal and the accompanying bare minimum of service. Do you really think the normal(not high volume) client advisor can financially survive on 10 $200 mini-commissions per month? Even with maybe 5 used deals at 400/each? Especially since most client advisors won't sell the minimum 6 new cars per month to qualify for any BMW NA driven unit bonuses. So, let's imagine 4 mini commissions at 200 each..plus MAYBE 5 used deals at a more conservative 300 each. $2,300/month before taxes are taken out (27,600/yr)? 26% tax rate brings that down to about 21k/yr....before health insurance is deducted. You want order-takers? That's what I'm hearing from the majority of posters on here....at least the more vocal ones. They don't care if the purchase experience is up to par. They want costco-ish pricing in addition to white-glove service..and free mats, keychains, hats, etc. The only saving grace is that 90% of the market isn't of a similar mindset;...or at least the ones that complain about $100.00 loss to their bottom line on a $60,000 car. As has been said, this becomes a game to many while it's our financial survival to us. Too many consumers think that client advisors make upwards of 60-75k/yr. Some do but most labor tirelessly in markets or dealerships that will never support those numbers. Is it a great career in general? It can be. There are many client advisors that work in terribly supportive dealerships. As in other areas of life, there are a ton of owner-principles that couldn't care less about their CA's sucess. Their only concentration is the bopttom line profit. Short-sighted as hell? Yes. Reality? Yes again...very much so.


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## Stuka (Jul 17, 2002)

I recently had the pleasure of working with both Will and Greg.

Though I did not end up getting a car from either one, I will not hesitate to recommend both of them to anyone who asks me.

They were both upfront and no BS about the deals that they offer, certainly a big change from the last time I bought an M3 from a SoCal dealer.


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## Stuka (Jul 17, 2002)

yenal said:


> If I was in SoCal, things might have been different. For me, to buy the car from over there, the deal must be substantially better to justify the risks of shipping the car 300 miles in a truck. In the end, I will stop my search for a while because Bay Area dealers apparently want to make huge profit from each sale. If I was still living there, I would have placed the order with one of you guys even after all this.


My M5 I bought in Portland. I flew up and drove it down.

My GT2 I bought in NorCal. I flew up and drove it down.

It's a quick drive on the 5, and to me, nothing beats showing up at jerky dealers with a car you got from a great dealer, like Will or Greg here, and then inquire on the price of a windshield sunshade.:bigpimp:

Point being, if I were you, I wouldn't let 300 miles stop me from doing a deal with these guys.


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## Stuka (Jul 17, 2002)

ZoomVT said:


> this is one of the most entertaining threads i have read in a while.
> 
> im not a lawyer, and i dont play one on TV (or internet forum) and not desire to be one. Now:
> 
> 1. the OP (a dealer) making a somewhat valuable post. I think that quite a few noobs or uninformed posters would try something like that. Hell, even a seasoned poster would probably try it. Now that we know they do double check deals against each other, probably smart not to try to play sponsors against each other. Like one of them said, it is quite likely you are already getting a good deal.


When I try to do a deal, I ask for quotes, and I compare. Whoever has the best deal wins.

I certainly won't forward the quotes from one dealer to another, that's just a bit well, dbag-ish.

The dealer quote you a deal that they think will work for both you and them. If someone else comes back with a better deal, that means that they are OK making a little less for whatever reason. There is no need to go back to the first dealer to try to grind them.


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## FastMarkA (Apr 21, 2008)

I think this thread can really be summed up with this advice: "Don't lie."

Plain and simple.


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## AnonCA (Oct 26, 2010)

We had a guy broadcast email 6 dealers at the same time explaining the terms of his offer. He would accept intital bids, review them, tell us all where we stood and then he would accept a 2nd round of bidding to arrive at a winner. I think we may have accidently deleted that email.


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## [email protected] (Feb 18, 2010)

adrian's bmw said:


> :thumbup: I agree. They are the most loyal group of folks ever. I've been blessed with their support and business since 2003 and maybe that's why you have so many dealer sponsors on here now.
> 
> I liken it to basically being a contractor where the buyer is soliciting bids for a project. The buyer interviews the contractor, has them submit a proposal, the buyer reviews it and the contractor's reputation... and of course, gets low ball bids, high ball bids, and middle of the pack bids and makes a decision from that point.
> 
> ...


Adrian - two things.

Bimmerfest isn't all of my deals - maybe 5 or 6 per month. Finance hates it - but to me - it's not worth the argument - since these guys know the buy rates anyways. There is no point in arguing - because honesty - they get it anyways.

But my standard internet leads are worked like standard internet leads - with lease rates marked up etc. In the end I still end up carrying about a $850 backend.

In terms of ED - I still do $1,000 over. I'm good enough that its worth the money to me. I let the $500 deals go bye bye - and let their vacation get screwed over by an inexperience salesperson that decided to cheap out ED :thumbup:


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## jackalope (Jan 29, 2009)

As a 16 + year Sales Professional for a Fortune 500 B2B company, I can tell you the blame for this unhealthy and reciprocal "us vs. them" mentality between consumer and seller can be cast on both sides.

The challenge for the consumer is to stop treating the purchase of a $60,000+ expense (notice I did not say "investment") as a mere commodity, and start looking for a value driven long term relationship with a local, valued sales professional who will service them before, during, and after the sale. Indeed, if the consumer diverted the time they spent on haggling for that extra 0.3% off their car's price to developing a positive mutually beneficial "win-win" relationship with the CA, they might just get back that 0.3% many times over.

Especially when you're in a "me too" business, the challenge for the Client Advisor is to constantly self apply and evolve themselves as sales professionals so we provide VALUE to the consumer in the form of outstsanding service and attention that will create a great buying experience and long term relationship. Too many dealerships enlist sales hacks who give our profession a bad name. These hacks are arrogant, ignorant, and treat their customers in such a way that it's no wonder some consumers devolve their view of the $60,000 car to that of just a "me to" commodity to be carelessly shopped around; why not, if you're not getting any value or service from the CA?


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## quackbury (Dec 17, 2005)

Sorry. I am a vocal defender of CA's but I don't buy the long term relationship argument. I have one with my SA. But I only see the CA once every 18 months. I expect him to respect my time and treat me honestly and fairly, but no need to schmooze me or remember my birthday. 

Sent from my HTC Inspire using BimmerApp


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## quackbury (Dec 17, 2005)

stimpee888 said:


> Not sure why OP had to post this and not just do as Chris inquired about, to make best offer and if not accepted, move on. Whats the big deal?


Clearly, he didn't HAVE to post it. Any more than you had to appoint yourself the forum police and tell us all what is or isn't appropriate.

This is a forum. Folks speak their minds. Often (not always) information is exchanged which is helpful to readers. If you don't find the thread useful, you can always go watch American Idol instead.


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## SARAFIL (Feb 19, 2003)

stimpee888 said:


> Not sure why OP had to post this and not just do as Chris inquired about, to make best offer and if not accepted, move on. Whats the big deal?
> 
> Last I saw, this is the ask a dealer forum, and I dont think anyone asked.
> 
> Put yourself in my shoes, it'd be off-putting if I told you how to conduct your business based on a bad experience with another CA.


You have 5 posts. With all due respect, I don't think you're in a position to tell the regulars what is and is not appropriate for this forum. :dunno:


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## stimpee888 (May 30, 2006)

and I'm speaking mine, sorry if you dont agree with it.
next time I'll check with you prior to posting to make sure were in agreement and im not policing.


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## bfv (Sep 30, 2010)

:rofl::rofl: Keep it up :rofl::rofl::thumbup:


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## dannyc9997 (May 15, 2008)

stimpee888 said:


> and I'm speaking mine, sorry if you dont agree with it.
> next time I'll check with you prior to posting to make sure were in agreement and im not policing.


If you have to check with someone to know your being rediculous, then why bother in the first place? There is plenty of useful information posted here that gives buyers some perspective of the other side of the table, which is part of the reason for this forum. Calling him out and saying he shouldn't have posted this thread isnt helpful to anyone.


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## [email protected] (Feb 18, 2010)

And this thread seems to have run its course....


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## Bart001 (Apr 9, 2005)

[email protected] said:


> And this thread seems to have run its course....


It does, but there's been some great CA - customer interactions (none related directly to the OP), and for that I'm grateful!

:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:


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## yenal (Jan 26, 2011)

Stuka said:


> My M5 I bought in Portland. I flew up and drove it down.
> 
> My GT2 I bought in NorCal. I flew up and drove it down.
> 
> ...


I actually ordered the car from Greg.


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## Stuka (Jul 17, 2002)

yenal said:


> I actually ordered the car from Greg.


Congrats, Greg is a great CA.


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