# how much over ED invoice???



## DreamCar (Sep 29, 2010)

How much over European invoice is considered as a deal? does the dealer have hold back on ED sales? can they sell for invoice??


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## Kurt_OH (May 3, 2008)

First of all, it depends upon the car. But, after that ...

I suggest you negotiate the best deal you can, and in line with what you read here on Bimmerfest, and then just go be happy with your deal and your car. There is ALWAYS someone who got a "better" deal.

In my case, I dealt with board sponsor Adrian Avila and got an excellent deal, zero hassles and great service. I leave tomorrow for my 11/7 E90 M3 Euro Delivery.

Three years ago, I dealt with my local dealer (Midwestern BMW in Dublin OH) on our 335i, and also got an excellent deal and loved the trip and still love the car.

Put sufficient effort to get that excellent deal, and just go live and enjoy! On a car the price of a BMW, luxury, including the luxury of just getting a good deal done and enjoying the rest of the delivery/ownership, is worth a lot. $500 isn't going to change that. Allow yourself the luxury of accepting a good, fair deal and get on with enjoying the car and life.

In my case, I paid $1k over ED invoice on the 335i, and $1.5k over ED invoice on the M3.

On a $50k, and $70k car, I'm completely cool with that. I WANT my CA to have enough benefit from the sale, that when I contact them again, they're interested in pleasing me so that I'll come back.


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## Technic (Jun 24, 2002)

$500 over ED invoice here... :thumbup:


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## 3ismagic# (Mar 17, 2011)

$500-1,000 over ED invoice.


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## Norm37 (Jun 28, 2008)

3ismagic# said:


> $500-1,000 over ED invoice.


:thumbup: $750 over ED invoice June 2009.


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## Merlosso (Feb 9, 2011)

$500 over invoice for my 2011 E90 M3. :thumbup:


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

Dealers are allowed to sell cars for whatever they wish. I've heard rumors of invoice - I guess some CA wanted to get the top dog spot in terms of volume, and got a bonus on that. The amounts given are generally accurate (I pay a little more - get better service, expect more help with financing etc.), but a lot depends on what is the going rate in your area, the CA, and how far you are willing to drive.

Most people rather than focus initially on price, ask for recommendations for a dealership and CA in their area. They then just mention bimmerfest, and usually get a very competitive price. Quite simple and painless.


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## dpritchett (Sep 6, 2006)

Conventional wisdom says generally about $500 above invoice on a 3, about $1k for a 5'er.


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## ddtan (Apr 28, 2006)

As has been said, $1000 and everyone should feel good. Suggest $500 and see what the CA says, and decide if it is worth tension to push for it. More importantly, there are some other charges that sometimes make up for a really low over invoice number, such as "vehicle prep". You might find that at $1000, they would be willing to give up the prep fee, but at $500, the prep fee suddenly becomes $400+. 
Now if the CA laughs at $1000 over, it's time to look for a new dealer.


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## Prost (Nov 23, 2005)

I paid $600 over for my 535i ED and $750 over for my Z4 ED...


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## SD ///M4 (Jan 24, 2011)

We offered $1,000 over European invoice but due to a huge miscalculation on the part of our CA and the initial price we were offered, we paid less than $500 over. 

Because of his miscalculation our CA had priced the car well below their cost. We suspected this from the start and addressed it several times, but the CA was adamant that his price was what we were going to pay. When we went in to sign the final docs we had a new number ready in case we were right, rounded down to a nice even amount. Our CA was visibly relieved that we didn't press for his original price and he gladly agreed to the new amount, saving us more than $500 more.


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## thumper_330 (Jan 3, 2009)

To echo everyone else; $500 - $1000 is conventional wisdom, though it does become somewhat of a "whatever the market will bear" sort of thing.

Generally offer what you're comfortable with. If you want to start at invoice price and work your way up, give it a shot but don't be too surprised if the CA won't deal and then maybe won't do ANY deal with you after that. Remember, they are busness people too and need to make a profit in order to make the deal worthwhile at all. 

I try to be fair... with a car in excess of $40K (which is MOST BMW's, let's be honest) the difference between $500 over invoice and $1000 over invoice is such a small amount in monthly payment that really I don't think it's worth hassling over. Besides, if you treat your CA right (particularly one who's been in the business a while) then you're more likely to get good, honest work and more likely to be able to work another deal with them in the future.

Remember, most car dealers won't even start from invoice... you have to haggle them down. I for one am glad that BMW dealers are willing to start from such a huge discount from MSRP in the first place for their educated enthusiasts. This is one of the reasons I came back to BMW when I started to consider Audi recently. They won't deal... not like BMW...


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## dkreidel (Aug 24, 2005)

10 ED's over the last 16 years: a low of $500 over and a high of $1500 over invoice (excluding M cars before there was a reduced ED price). I think $1,000 over invoice is a fair price for the dealer and a *great* price for the customer. I suppose I could beat up my dealer to save $500 but I want my CA to make a few bucks and not have to go begging to his management every time I swing the door. My dealer and CA take great care of me and I want to keep it that way :thumbup:


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## AggieKnight (Dec 26, 2008)

Pay what you can negotiate with your CA understanding that $500-$1500 is pretty much the range from the cheapest car BMW makes to its most expensive. Keep in mind that unless you are buying with cash, an unhappy CA can get you back at the finance table 2 weeks before your trip (speaking from personal experience).

In the scheme of things a couple hundred bucks one way or another shouldn't "break" the deal and that your relationship with your CA is worth 10x much. Relax, negotiate in good faith, and be happy.


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## jmnbmw (Aug 19, 2006)

*F30 SPort -$1,000 over ED Invoice plus $199.50 doc fee?*

I just got a proposal from one of Sponsors of this forum on a F30 Sport. He offered $1,000 over European Delivery wholesale plus $199.50 documentation fee for out of state defray overnight expenses.
Is this Doc charge the norm or it's ssupposed to be included in the dealer profit? 
And what about the $1,000 over invoice.


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

Doc fee is normal. Include it in profit for your own calculations. Whether you count it as a cost is up to you. But if you do, do you also count electricity, CA commission etc. - there is a line you need to draw before going overboard working out if they are making $1 or $100. It's not really a factor. Focus on the overall deal and what you expect out of it in terms of support and service, then price/offer accordingly.

Most folks when they quote "over invoice" do not factor in doc fee. Expect out of state, and even out of area to cost the dealer more overall in terms of costs. If you feel comfortable with the CA, and how things are progressing, is it really worth it to find someone else for potentially $200? Personally, I was asked by my CA to pay a little more in terms of profit than my last ED, and readily agreed. The value of the relationship and expertise were worth much more to me, and it has already shown.


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## 3ismagic# (Mar 17, 2011)

Here in PHX dealers demand $500 or more for doc fees and refuse to negotiate them. It's one of the reason's I bought from Greg Poland at Pacific BMW.


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## odiesback (Jun 9, 2008)

Technic said:


> $500 over ED invoice here... :thumbup:


Same here


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## Meiac09 (Jan 2, 2006)

I paid $695 because mine jumped through a lot of hoops to make the deal work pretty damn smoothly for me... I guess $1200 with the doc fee... That was heavy but I avoided the DMV entirely!


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## [email protected] BMW (Aug 2, 2010)

when it comes to ED deals it's always relative to invoice........... usually $700-$1,200 is ok, depends on car and CA..... remember you get what you pay for when it comes to CA's and service. THERE IS NO HOLDBACK, 5%, AVP all the same things, when we sell a car for $700 over that IS ALL THE $ WE MAKE.... and our commission are based on that amount.


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