# Drove a 335i today and I don't want one...



## brkf (May 26, 2003)

Frank Rizzo said:


> Funny because the three cars I narrowed down to were the CTS, Evo and R32.
> 
> If you want 4dr semi tossable, the EVO IX is worth a look. The IX is very daily drivable, not at all kidney belt inspiring. Mrs. Rizzo had no ride complaints during testing. It's DSG, though so that might not be too appealing to you. The deck spoiler is too much for me.
> 
> ...


The CTS is an option. My wife gets special pricing on Ford/GM products. I can always try one.  That and a G8.

Same with the G8.

Wife nixed the Evo - said "It looks too much like a mako." Whatever...you ride in cars from the inside. She shot it down nonetheless.


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## AK (Jan 19, 2002)

blueguydotcom said:


> The CTS is an option. My wife gets special pricing on Ford/GM products. I can always try one.  That and a G8.
> 
> Same with the G8.
> 
> Wife nixed the Evo - said "It looks too much like a mako." Whatever...you ride in cars from the inside. She shot it down nonetheless.


I drove a G8. It's a huge car. Moves pretty quickly. Don't expect BMW levels of refinement or interior quality. It drove nicely, though. Frankly I'd take one of those over a CTS. I had a bad experience w/ Cadillac and their customer service ('05 CTS-V was lemon'd).


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## Barmats (May 21, 2007)

You didn't mention this, but I'm guessing you didn't drive the car in DS mode. This transforms the 335i from a mild-mannered everyday driver to a totally different experience. Engine note, perceived power delivery, shift firmness and rpm, as well as when or if the up/downshifts occur... it's very, very different. For me, it's the difference between fun (D) and wow (DS).


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## Frank Rizzo (Aug 2, 2003)

The thought occurred to me - 
Subaru Legacy Spec B ????


I like cars that are not that common 
.


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## brkf (May 26, 2003)

I drove the 2009 CTS today. That's a nice car. Outside is attractive, inside the interior mostly feels nicer than a 3 or G35/37. The low seating and cockpit-like feel is also welcome, making the CTS also feel kinda bimmer like. The ride is controlled on city streets and power with the DI engine was nice. In corners there was pronounced body-roll but i did not press it more than about double the posted limits for corners. Nice car. Automatic also was a downside and the dealer straight out laughed when I mentioned a manual. 

If i were 10 years older and less sports inclined, I'd probably consider it more strongly. Looked at a Genesis too but man that thing is so big we looked and left. Again, if I were older, I might be more interested. At 34, it just seems the Genesis (like a 5 or 7) is a way of really saying to myself all fun is gone in driving.

My wife is thinking I should wait to try the G37 with the newer, more efficient engine. At this point I'm hoping she'll just forget about me getting another car for 8 or 9 months.


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## EdCT (Mar 14, 2002)

blueguydotcom said:


> I drove the 2009 CTS today. That's a nice car. Outside is attractive, inside the interior mostly feels nicer than a 3 or G35/37. The low seating and cockpit-like feel is also welcome, making the CTS also feel kinda bimmer like. The ride is controlled on city streets and power with the DI engine was nice. In corners there was pronounced body-roll but i did not press it more than about double the posted limits for corners. Nice car. Automatic also was a downside and the dealer straight out laughed when I mentioned a manual.
> 
> If i were 10 years older and less sports inclined, I'd probably consider it more strongly. Looked at a Genesis too but man that thing is so big we looked and left. Again, if I were older, I might be more interested. At 34, it just seems the Genesis (like a 5 or 7) is a way of really saying to myself all fun is gone in driving.
> 
> My wife is thinking I should wait to try the G37 with the newer, more efficient engine. At this point I'm hoping she'll just forget about me getting another car for 8 or 9 months.


I spent 500 miles behind the wheel of a CTS (the new model) and found the steering weighted on the heavy side, the seats too small (and sparsely padded) and the cockpit a bit too cozy.

It drives well, and you don't really feel the 4000 lb curb weight, but it's no BMW.

Ed


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## E36 Phantom (Apr 3, 2007)

The CTS-V comes in a 6 speed as well I'm pretty sure. I enjoyed the interior feel, but I haven't had time to drive one. 

I drove a G8-GT and enjoyed the drive. The interior was definitely lacking (the Caddy was worlds apart), but that's comparing it to BMW or Jaguar interiors. Compared to most cars, the interior was livable. Power was great, I didn't get much of a chance to check handling but it felt lighter than I expected through a couple sharp 90* turns. The thing that got me....the exhaust note.....oh damn that was beautiful. Boy racer colors are a bit bright, I love the electric blue but not sure if I'd want to own one. 

The G8 GXP has the 6spd option, and that should be easier to get your hands on than the CTS-V 6spd.


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## 'Cane (Jun 16, 2003)

I'd let you drive my 6MT (coupe), but...
A. You're on the wrong coast, and
B. My car is still in the body shop, and after $25K in damages, I'm not sure that it's gone drive like it should anyway.


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## Frank Rizzo (Aug 2, 2003)

blueguydotcom said:


> I drove the 2009 CTS today. That's a nice car. Outside is attractive, inside the interior mostly feels nicer than a 3 or G35/37. The low seating and cockpit-like feel is also welcome, making the CTS also feel kinda bimmer like. The ride is controlled on city streets and power with the DI engine was nice. In corners there was pronounced body-roll but i did not press it more than about double the posted limits for corners. Nice car. Automatic also was a downside and the dealer straight out laughed when I mentioned a manual.
> 
> If i were 10 years older and less sports inclined, I'd probably consider it more strongly. Looked at a Genesis too but man that thing is so big we looked and left. Again, if I were older, I might be more interested. At 34, it just seems the Genesis (like a 5 or 7) is a way of really saying to myself all fun is gone in driving.
> 
> My wife is thinking I should wait to try the G37 with the newer, more efficient engine. At this point I'm hoping she'll just forget about me getting another car for 8 or 9 months.


FE2 or FE3 suspension?
The FE2 has "all season tires". The FE3 CTS has the "summer" only tires, the big brakes and has paddle shifters. There was a big difference IMHO.
....


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## brkf (May 26, 2003)

Rizzo, it had 18s but I didn't check if they were summer or all season tires. I don't remember paddles. Must have been an FE2. Nice car. If i were older I might consider it.


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## pilotman (Feb 2, 2006)

i can probably get you Infiniti employee discount if you decide to go that way...

otherwise just buy a used ZHP


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## Motown328 (Jun 4, 2003)

cwsqbm said:


> The answer is simple: used e46 ZHP. You know you'll love it.


:stupid::hi::drive::supdude:


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## Motown328 (Jun 4, 2003)

Or how about an older 540 wagon? Those were HOT!


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## brkf (May 26, 2003)

Thanks guys. I'm a tad afraid of a 4 year old ZHP. 

My wife is backing off as she's seeing I'm not really enjoying this fruitless hunt. She just keeps repeating "cars mean more to you, so keep what you have, get the M3, I don't care...just don't be unhappy about it." 

Thanks for all the advice and suggestions. I'm going to wait until next week to really decide if I want to strike in January. If indicators are that it's even worse than december, this might bode well for February buyers. :0


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## Motown328 (Jun 4, 2003)

blueguydotcom said:


> Thanks guys. I'm a tad afraid of a 4 year old ZHP.
> 
> My wife is backing off as she's seeing I'm not really enjoying this fruitless hunt. She just keeps repeating "cars mean more to you, so keep what you have, get the M3, I don't care...just don't be unhappy about it."
> 
> Thanks for all the advice and suggestions. I'm going to wait until next week to really decide if I want to strike in January. If indicators are that it's even worse than december, this might bode well for February buyers. :0


Nothing wrong with a 4 year-old ZHP!



It's just getting warmed up!!!:thumbup::supdude:


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## BTMaximus (Jan 13, 2004)

Blueguy, just curious whether that dealer ever came down to your price for the 2008 M3? I'm kinda in the same boat as you in that I'm on the fence about the M3. The sensible part of me says I should just go 328 or something else. The value part of me says when will you get another chance to get such a great deal on an M3?! I have been intermittently negotiating with a dealership that has a relatively stripped 08 M3 sedan.


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## brkf (May 26, 2003)

BTMaximus said:


> Blueguy, just curious whether that dealer ever came down to your price for the 2008 M3? I'm kinda in the same boat as you in that I'm on the fence about the M3. The sensible part of me says I should just go 328 or something else. The value part of me says when will you get another chance to get such a great deal on an M3?! I have been intermittently negotiating with a dealership that has a relatively stripped 08 M3 sedan.


Last i tried he was 1k off my desired price but 6k off sticker. It's downright goofy of me to think I'll ever find a chance to get into an M3 again for about $400 in interest payments over 3 years. Sensible side will win but I keep checking to make sure they still have it though...


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## TeamM3 (Dec 24, 2002)

The M3 is so overpriced that I can't see anyone buying one that isn't wealthy enough that cost doesn't matter


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## BTMaximus (Jan 13, 2004)

I just got an offer from the dealer for 656/month (includes tax), nothing down except 2 MSDs, 36 mos/10k for their fairly stripped M3 (only prem pack, Sat radio). I declined. If they went to 600/month (approx 3k under invoice) I would have pulled the trigger. Nevertheless, an M3 for under 700/month is mighty tempting.


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## 'Cane (Jun 16, 2003)

BTMaximus said:


> I just got an offer from the dealer for 656/month (includes tax), nothing down except 2 MSDs, 36 mos/10k for their fairly stripped M3 (only prem pack, Sat radio). I declined. If they went to 600/month (approx 3k under invoice) I would have pulled the trigger. Nevertheless, an M3 for under 700/month is mighty tempting.


yikes. I'd take that deal in a minute.


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## brkf (May 26, 2003)

'Cane said:


> My Z4 had 21,000 when I turned it in, and my 335 will have around the same (though, we hope nobody nice buys it).


Can you do 8k a year leases?


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## 'Cane (Jun 16, 2003)

blueguydotcom said:


> Can you do 8k a year leases?


I wish. They should pay me for in-excess mileage though.


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## EdCT (Mar 14, 2002)

blueguydotcom said:


> Oh local dealer has a nice CPO 06 325i with sport,etc and it's got 20k miles on it. 20k miles and 3 years old? How is that possible?
> 
> Wish i trusted a BMW out of warranty as that car seems like a steal.


17k on my 3 year-old convertible.

Ed


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## dima123 (Jul 7, 2005)

pilotman said:


> i can probably get you Infiniti employee discount if you decide to go that way...
> 
> otherwise just buy a used ZHP


what kind of infiniti employee discount can you get??


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## Griffoun (Jan 19, 2006)

EdCT said:


> 17k on my 3 year-old convertible.
> 
> Ed


12K after 3 years on my E46 coupe... that's back in 2003.


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## brkf (May 26, 2003)

Griffoun said:


> 12K after 3 years on my E46 coupe... that's back in 2003.


Do you walk to work?


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## EdCT (Mar 14, 2002)

blueguydotcom said:


> Do you walk to work?


I work at home - if my car weren't so much fun to drive, it'd have next to no miles on it at all. 

Ed


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## TeamM3 (Dec 24, 2002)

I think we should hold blueguydotcom personally responsible for the downfall of the auto industry 

I did a 2 year lease on an '03 Z4 3.0 6 speed and it only had around 6k miles when I turned it back in, 2k I did in one trip out to Kalifornication

before the Z4, an '01 Z06 that I bought used with 3k miles and only put several thousand on it

presently own a 2005 Mazda RX-8 6 spd that I bought new after the Z4 and it only has 7000 miles

on the otherhand my '07 Honda Ridgeline has 81k in only 28 months, the obvious answer is none of the other cars mentioned were daily drivers


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## Frank Rizzo (Aug 2, 2003)

TeamM3 said:


> I think we should hold blueguydotcom personally responsible for the downfall of the auto industry
> 
> I did a 2 year lease on an '03 Z4 3.0 6 speed and it only had around 6k miles when I turned it back in, 2k I did in one trip out to Kalifornication
> 
> ...


I read that the Ridgeline cant tow crap...on this board IIRC...
:hi:


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## TeamM3 (Dec 24, 2002)

Frank Rizzo said:


> I read that the Ridgeline cant tow crap...on this board IIRC...
> :hi:


I tow at the combined truck & trailer max weight limit (5000# tow, 10000# combined) without issue and through the mountains no less :dunno: , but nobody ever runs their mouth on teh intrawebz without knowing squat about the specific topic at hand ...


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## TeamM3 (Dec 24, 2002)

... double wtf post


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## Justin T (Oct 10, 2006)

There is still time to get an M3 sedan blueguy. There are 30 dealers w/i 250 miles of San Diego; surely one has a car that you can work a deal on before 3/2...

I would recommend this pursuit; it was worth it for me. :drive:


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## waydeki (Jan 23, 2004)

i'm in the same boat. 2 kids under 3 years old. i just sold my 05 zhp because i was sick of the narrow seats and stiffness on MN roads. but now i can't remember why i sold it. i miss it. like my old college girl friend. 20 minutes with her and i would remember the wonderful torture:rofl:. anyway, i can't afford a 4dr M3. so i'm really screwed. and i drive 30k miles a year. so a bmw is pretty much out of the question. sorry for hijacking this post.

can't wait to see what you end up with. but, avoid subarus i had an 05 legacy gt and couldn't fool my developed sense of taste in automobiles.


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## sunilsf (Sep 22, 2003)

Okay, blue... what's the status? Any more test drives, or did you purchase something?


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## TeamM3 (Dec 24, 2002)

he already passed on an m3 over a measly $1000, the difference between $53k vs. $54k is so negligible that he obviously doesn't want one for whatever reason

since the reason to pass on the EvoX was because the wife hated it, and she's since cut you loose from that obligation, it may be worth another look


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## brkf (May 26, 2003)

Just drove a 335i manual. How can it feel so different from the automatic? It was like a different car. Down to the WRX and the 328/335i manuals. I can't drive an automatic.

TeamM3, I tried to drive an Evo and Ralliart. The Mitsu dealer said they had to do a credit check to _drive_ the car. WTF? Haven't had a chance to try another Mitsu dealer yet.


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## Chris90 (Apr 7, 2003)

blueguydotcom said:


> I tried to drive a ralliart but the dispsh!t dealer said they'd only allow test drives with a credit check. I laughed at them and left. You're not running my credit to drive a lousy 27k car.


What's up with that anyway? It's not like that'll tell them anything, and their cars are insured. If it's just an annoyance to see if you're serious, why not say "Sure, you can drive it if you let me put my hand down your pants and rummage around."


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## 300B (Sep 28, 2005)

Saab Turbo X.


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## Kamdog (Apr 15, 2007)

blueguydotcom said:


> Just drove a 335i manual. How can it feel so different from the automatic? It was like a different car. Down to the WRX and the 328/335i manuals. I can't drive an automatic.
> 
> TeamM3, I tried to drive an Evo and Ralliart. The Mitsu dealer said they had to do a credit check to _drive_ the car. WTF? Haven't had a chance to try another Mitsu dealer yet.


I can teach you how to drive an automatic. Do what I did. After driving a stick for 35 years, do you know what you get?

Old.

Then, the back goes. And the orthopedist tells you that 3 pedals is one too many, so you gotta give one up. I asks if I have a choice to which one? He says, choose anyone you want, as long as it is the clutch.

And don't let anyone tell you that manually shifting an automatic is the same, It aint.


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## brkf (May 26, 2003)

I got up this morning 95% sure I'd picked the 09 WRX. I liked it more than the 328i/330i/325i automatics I'd tested. It was more visceral, utilitarian, dependable and salt-of-the-earth. Great power, tenacious grip when pressed really hard, lots of room for tuning (maybe) and lots of room all around.

Just to be sure I drove a 2007 335i manual (one finally showed up at the dealer). The sticker at Cunningham said 35k and it had tons on it - sport, cold, comfort, premium and that 6 speed. The drive left me grinning like a fool. Grinning in a way I hadn't since I first took a ZHP down the exact same route in May of 2003. This felt right. Not as good as the ZHP but as close as I'd come in years and years. It felt alive, it hugged the corners and most importantly, I controlled the engine. 

I returned to the dealership and my wife saw the glee in my eyes. But she wanted to be sure this was the car for me. It wasn't. My research had turned up only 3 used 335i manuals in socal. Brecht had a black one with fewer miles and options at 32k. Shelly had one with the same miles, but only sport and navi. They wanted 30k. 

We went to breakfast and I sent an email to Shelly and called Brecht. Brecht said they'd call back but didn't. Shelly called back. They took my price. We drove up to Buena Park and on the way I gave the dealer all my numbers so the loan work would be ready. The salesman, Axel, was great and low key. He had the car cleaned and refueled while we drove up to the OC. A five minute test drive confirmed this car was as close to perfect as I would find used (perfect would be sport, comfort access, bluetooth and seat heaters). 

I left the dealer within an hour of arriving. And I'm still quite happy with my choice. It's a silver CPO 2007 335i with aluminum trim, sports package and navi. 28k miles sit on the odometer and I ended up buying it for 27k. According to Edmunds, that's what the car should get on trade-in. It's an odd package, so most dealers would probably give me less. Regardless, I'm very happy with my choice and after the BMWCCA rebate, the car's final cost, not including TTL, will be 26.5k. 

Had I not driven a 335i manual this morning, a shiny silver 09 WRX hatch would be in my garage and I'd have a lingering bit of doubt about it. I don't have any doubts about the car in my garage. Ironic, I started a thread about not liking the 335i automatic and in the end found the 335i manual was the car for me. 

Thanks to everyone for the suggestions, comments and more or less for joining in the fun of the hunt.


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## 'Cane (Jun 16, 2003)

You can Lemon Law used cars in CA? Wow. Not in FL.


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

What was the reason for the lemon lawing? I haven't seen any other posts by you about this - give me a link if there is one.


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## brkf (May 26, 2003)

Patrick said:


> What was the reason for the lemon lawing? I haven't seen any other posts by you about this - give me a link if there is one.


My engine went to hell - HPFP, injectors, manifold, turbos, reflashing, etc. Grand total of about 30 days in 2 months. Some research turned up that prior to my purchase the car had been in 3 times for HPFPs before I bought it.

It's gotten to the point that I expect to see "engine malfunction" during a drive. :rofl:

Bummer as it was fun.


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## brkf (May 26, 2003)

Looking at things (and after getting a nice taste of BMWs with my loaners), I really think I could survive a 328, 525/528 or even an X3.

Seems like a 328i with sport package is pretty tough to find. I know many folks here mod their cars. I'm guessing some new shocks/springs, swaybar, etc will help convert a 328i/528 into something a bit more aggressive?


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

blueguydotcom said:


> My engine went to hell - HPFP, injectors, manifold, turbos, reflashing, etc. Grand total of about 30 days in 2 months. Some research turned up that prior to my purchase the car had been in 3 times for HPFPs before I bought it.
> 
> It's gotten to the point that I expect to see "engine malfunction" during a drive. :rofl:
> 
> Bummer as it was fun.


Ouch.

And this sounds like a "normal" problem for that engine...

You should have got a 335d M-Sport.


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## TeamM3 (Dec 24, 2002)

oops ....


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## EdCT (Mar 14, 2002)

blueguydotcom said:


> Weird thing - the 328 seems far pricier than 10 months ago. I paid 27k for my 335i with sport and navi. I can't seem to find a 328i advertised with sport for less than 26k. WTF?! There's something so wrong about paying even 24k for a 328i.


Used car prices are up across the board, it's the economy thing.

The 328 is a nice car, it'd be my choice if I were going E90 series - for me, it'd be the coupe with a SP and stick.

That price differential issue in the used market is interesting too, you can buy a 5 series for not much more than a 3 and in some cases, a recent edition 7 for less than a 5.


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## brkf (May 26, 2003)

EdCT said:


> Used car prices are up across the board, it's the economy thing.
> 
> The 328 is a nice car, it'd be my choice if I were going E90 series - for me, it'd be the coupe with a SP and stick.
> 
> That price differential issue in the used market is interesting too, you can buy a 5 series for not much more than a 3 and in some cases, a recent edition 7 for less than a 5.


Yeah the 5 is tempting because it's got a bit more room, nearly the same hustle and nearly the same handling. Wife's now pushing 07 X3 as she's realized I'm going BMW again.


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## getz (Sep 21, 2007)

blueguydotcom said:


> I actually put in a bid on an 08 M3 last week. Sticker was 59k. Best I got them down to was 54k. Had they accepted 53k, I'd have it in the garage right now.
> 
> Wag, yeah I wanted more power in my ZHP but I fully admit parting ways with it in 06 was a big mistake. Live and learn.
> 
> ...


You turned down an offer on a car you really like over a grand difference. Seems pretty odd. Also, if you want to save some dough, by the M3 used.
-Getz


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## EdCT (Mar 14, 2002)

blueguydotcom said:


> Yeah the 5 is tempting because it's got a bit more room, nearly the same hustle and nearly the same handling. Wife's now pushing 07 X3 as she's realized I'm going BMW again.


I test drove an 07 X3 with an automatic and found it to be a bit jumpy - never seemed to settle in the right gear.

Do some searching here for issues wrt auto transmission and 07 X3's.

Otherwise, I quite liked it.

Ed


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## brkf (May 26, 2003)

getz said:


> You turned down an offer on a car you really like over a grand difference. Seems pretty odd. Also, if you want to save some dough, by the M3 used.
> -Getz


That was quite some time ago. And yes. A line must be drawn. If 1k doesn't matter, then 2k doesn't and so on. You must establish a private valuation and stick with it.


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## brkf (May 26, 2003)

EdCT said:


> I test drove an 07 X3 with an automatic and found it to be a bit jumpy - never seemed to settle in the right gear.
> 
> Do some searching here for issues wrt auto transmission and 07 X3's.
> 
> ...


Read the same things.


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## sunilsf (Sep 22, 2003)

What about a 328i wagon manual w/sport package? 
The main thing about not getting a sport package and making adjustments in the aftermarket is you may be hard-pressed to get those sport seats.
Someone on these boards was selling one a few weeks ago for $28K... it sold pretty quickly.

What about a Golf TDI? Not much hp, but loads of torque and they sticker for $24k.


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## hts (Dec 19, 2001)

i think you should go '03 540iA M-sport all the way...


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## getz (Sep 21, 2007)

blueguydotcom said:


> That was quite some time ago. And yes. A line must be drawn. If 1k doesn't matter, then 2k doesn't and so on. You must establish a private valuation and stick with it.


Sounds like a pretty decent discount on a new M3. If that car would make you happy, then one grand over the life of ownership is absolutely negligible.
-Getz


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## brkf (May 26, 2003)

getz said:


> Sounds like a pretty decent discount on a new M3. If that car would make you happy, then one grand over the life of ownership is absolutely negligible.
> -Getz


Price isn't the only factor. Sometimes you can't stomach giving specific dealers that much profit. I'd rather go without than let that dealership get an extra grand.


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## BmW745On19's (Aug 12, 2005)

getz said:


> Sounds like a pretty decent discount on a new M3. If that car would make you happy, then one grand over the life of ownership is absolutely negligible.
> -Getz


I try to figure out how some private owners think when it comes time to trade a car in or if I buy one off someone. There isn't specific math to it, some people are just stubborn as hell, others, like myself, follow a 2% rule. If the deal can be done within 2% of the max I'm willing to pay, I will pay the extra 2%. Like if I'm at my max of $25,000 and a guy wants to do no less than $26,000, I will go the extra 2%, even though I don't want to, to do a great compromise, because I know I will not let a deal go for $500 difference and neither will the other person.



blueguydotcom said:


> Price isn't the only factor. Sometimes you can't stomach giving specific dealers that much profit. I'd rather go without than let that dealership get an extra grand.


I don't understand your logic, what difference does it make if a dealer is making $10k off you or losing $10k as long as you're receiving a great deal? I understand there is a good feeling associated with "sticking it to the man", but that isn't a logical thing to do.

I could have $50k in a car and be selling it for $60k, which could be $10k under fair market value, making the car a great deal for someone. Should it matter to anyone that I'm making $10k? No, absolutely not, good for me, right? Who cares if you still don't like the price if its a great deal, I don't have to do business with you because I _know_ someone else will come along and buy it because its priced extremely well. I did my job well and I deserve a reward, sure I'm willing to come down on the price if I need to, but that's expected with doing a car deal.

People NEED money off the price of a car or they feel they won't be getting a good deal. Some people, however, hate to get money off the price of a car. It's all psychology.

Bluedotcom- PM me with details on what you want and how much you're willing to spend, we can work something out.

'07 328i's can easily be had for under $24k. '08s have a $1000 price difference. '09s are doing around $30k.


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## brkf (May 26, 2003)

BmW745On19's said:


> I don't understand your logic, what difference does it make if a dealer is making $10k off you or losing $10k as long as you're receiving a great deal? I understand there is a good feeling associated with "sticking it to the man", but that isn't a logical thing to do.


Two parts to the story.

1. I set a limit on what I felt an M3 was worth. I'm not going to budge off that limit as once the ceiling set it's in place.

2. I used that specific dealer for ED and in the end I had a really hard time even contacting them about the M3.

When they wouldn't drop to the ceiling I set then I would have to swallow my pride in two places - breaking my self-imposed limit and giving money to a dealer who behaved shamefully in my last dealing with them. If it had been a good dealer in SD (like Cunningham/South County) then I would have gone beyond my limit as I like their people and service staff.

Regardless, I'll find a 328 and hopefully the engine won't crap out on me like my 335i's. I've noticed used values on 335is is plummeting. I've seen a bunch online and at local lots only about 1-2k higher than 328s.


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## EdCT (Mar 14, 2002)

blueguydotcom said:


> Regardless, I'll find a 328 and hopefully the engine won't crap out on me like my 335i's. I've noticed used values on 335is is plummeting. I've seen a bunch online and at local lots only about 1-2k higher than 328s.


While the normally aspirated engine isn't as "sexy" as the twin turbo - it's a better engine IMO - it's lighter, newer and smoother. It was a clean-sheet design. One gets the feeling the twin turbo, with its hybrid block/head sourced from an older motor, was an afterthought drummed up to get advertised HP numbers over 300hp.

Obviously, the 328's motor is more reliable too.

As for the price differential between 335's and 328's, in the used market, that six or seven grand difference new, sure shrinks used, doesn't it?

Ed


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## brkf (May 26, 2003)

EdCT said:


> While the normally aspirated engine isn't as "sexy" as the twin turbo - it's a better engine IMO - it's lighter, newer and smoother. It was a clean-sheet design. One gets the feeling the twin turbo, with its hybrid block/head sourced from an older motor, was an afterthought drummed up to get advertised HP numbers over 300hp.
> 
> Obviously, the 328's motor is more reliable too.
> 
> ...


I agree in every way.

I do find it curious the 328i doesn't have the X3's engine. 260 HP, more torque, same size.

Anyway, yep, I find the 3.0 to be better balanced and smoother too.


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