# MSD Gone / Maintenance Reduced / Discounted Reduced / Quality suffered



## mason (Jun 8, 2006)

I think I'm taking pause on BWM for the time being.

I'm just reading BMW is stopping MSD on May 2. They cut back on what covers in maintenance. They cut back on ED discounts. The quality has gone down (last BMW with multiple injector replacement, this one has cameras repaired 3 times/ A/C fails)

It is disappointing, not to mention somehow BMW now triggers all these tax letter from NY state.


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## AggieKnight (Dec 26, 2008)

I'm pondering the same thing, to be honest. Really disappointed with the areas that BMW cut corners on the new 5...combined with your other points, it is sad.


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## rmorin49 (Jan 7, 2007)

Me too. Next car will likely be a Benz or a Lexus. IMHO BMW is no longer the "Ultimate Driving Machine".

Sent from my LG-H811 using Bimmerfest mobile app


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

I'm likely going to pay cash for a manual M2. Family car will be a Benz.

Apart from any deal/price aspect, I like having different branded cars in the garage. Having 2 of the same, BMW, Toyota or whatever, is just not as exciting. But to folks' point, if BMW had an unbeatable lease deal, I would likely do 2. But having a Benz C300 currently as well, there isn't much to pick between comparable Benz and BMW models overall. BMW still drives better, but I prefer the exterior style and especially the interior of the Benz. Overall it's even.


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## mikeriley (Mar 20, 2008)

chrischeung said:


> I'm likely going to pay cash for a manual M2. Family car will be a Benz.
> 
> Apart from any deal/price aspect, I like having different branded cars in the garage. Having 2 of the same, BMW, Toyota or whatever, is just not as exciting. But to folks' point, if BMW had an unbeatable lease deal, I would likely do 2. But having a Benz C300 currently as well, there isn't much to pick between comparable Benz and BMW models overall. BMW still drives better, but I prefer the exterior style and especially the interior of the Benz. Overall it's even.


remember the good ol days of lease deal of the year or whatever you came up with back in the day! 750, m3 vert etc.


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

mikeriley said:


> remember the good ol days of lease deal of the year or whatever you came up with back in the day! 750, m3 vert etc.


Nice memory. Those are now available with the 3 pointed star


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## mikeriley (Mar 20, 2008)

Yeah, I'll say those were the days. This forum is still wonderful but not as great or involved like it was back in the day. And the deals are far from the same. 


Sent from my iPhone using Bimmerfest


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## Gary J (Dec 18, 2013)

mikeriley said:


> Yeah, I'll say those were the days. This forum is still wonderful but not as great or involved like it was back in the day. And the *deals are far from the same*.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Bimmerfest


Not sure how far 5% is from 7% but also not sure I would be out at 0%. Give me a nice day at the Welt, insurance, a European vacay and one of 12 drop off points and I might still be persuaded.


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## dalekressin (Sep 3, 2008)

The operative word "Might"

BMW has stiff competition and the marketing is reaching for a different market sector.


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## Gary J (Dec 18, 2013)

"stiff competition" is nothing new and yes marketing changes back and forth over time like fashion.


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## 3ismagic# (Mar 17, 2011)

Gary J said:


> "stiff competition" is nothing new and yes marketing changes back and forth over time like fashion.


But two things BMW could always count on 1) being the best driver's car and 2) having the best leases and quickly becoming no longer true.

I believe it was motor trend who recently did a sport sedan shootout and the 3-series came in 7th out of 8 beating only the volvo s60. The Giulia and the A4 are better drivers cars. The audi's tech and interior leave the F30 in the dust. and with BMW lease rates not what they used to be I don't see very strong reasons not to seriously shop around. I'll probably be looking to replace my E90 next summer and as of right now the BMW won't be in my top 4 choices.:dunno: YMMV


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## mikeriley (Mar 20, 2008)

Gary J said:


> Not sure how far 5% is from 7% but also not sure I would be out at 0%. Give me a nice day at the Welt, insurance, a European vacay and one of 12 drop off points and I might still be persuaded.


Any numbers on ed done this year vs say 5 years ago? Based on this forum, yes a biased sample, but I would still bet the numbers are way down.

Sent from my iPhone using Bimmerfest mobile app


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## Gary J (Dec 18, 2013)

3ismagic# said:


> But two things BMW could always count on 1) being the best driver's car and 2) having the best leases and quickly becoming no longer true.
> 
> I believe it was motor trend who recently did a sport sedan shootout and the 3-series came in 7th out of 8 beating only the volvo s60. The Giulia and the A4 are better drivers cars. The audi's tech and interior leave the F30 in the dust. and with BMW lease rates not what they used to be I don't see very strong reasons not to seriously shop around. I'll probably be looking to replace my E90 next summer and as of right now the BMW won't be in my top 4 choices.:dunno: YMMV


All opinion but so what? Let's say Car & Driver declares BMW 2nd best "driver's car" whatever that is. How does it work out for Apple having the second best selling phone? We can play the opinion and anecdotal "BMW won't be in my top 4 choices" game all day but it gets real boring, real fast. :wave:


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## Gary J (Dec 18, 2013)

mikeriley said:


> Any numbers on ed done this year vs say 5 years ago? Based on this forum, yes a biased sample, but I would still bet the numbers are way down.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Bimmerfest mobile app


Your research would probably be as good as mine.


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## rmorin49 (Jan 7, 2007)

Since BMWs are now starting to drive like a Buick they are competing not only with the other German marques but with many of the Asian ones as well.

Sent from my LG-H811 using Bimmerfest mobile app


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## Bikie (May 2, 2004)

chrischeung said:


> Nice memory. Those are now available with the 3 pointed star


Chris where will I find the MBZ deal of the year?? Is there a Bimmerfest equivalent? I'll be shopping for a new lease next spring. I still regret not getting in on the 7 series deal. Was worried about the battery taking up trunk space as we were four on our ED.


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## need4speed (May 26, 2006)

Gary J said:


> "*stiff competition" is nothing new *and yes marketing changes back and forth over time like fashion.


I guess that depends on how far back you want to go. Even 10 years ago the competition was much weaker.


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## Tanning machine (Feb 21, 2002)

3ismagic# said:


> But two things BMW could always count on 1) being the best driver's car and 2) having the best leases and quickly becoming no longer true.


On 1, it's been a long-term trend that BMW has aimed more mass-market to increase sales, both in terms of the overall product line (SUVs/SAVs/GTs) and the specific products, which are more luxury than sport than they were. As a business it has worked for them, but for those who were attracted to BMW for the reasons that the cars weren't mass market, it's an unfortunate move.

On 2, I haven't been a leaser, but great lease terms generally mean that either owners are subsidizing leasers or (more likely) lease terms are designed to adjust for uncompetitive pricing.

But, yeah, agree things aren't going in a great direction for ED and more generally . . .


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

Bikie said:


> Chris where will I find the MBZ deal of the year?? Is there a Bimmerfest equivalent? I'll be shopping for a new lease next spring. I still regret not getting in on the 7 series deal. Was worried about the battery taking up trunk space as we were four on our ED.


You need to research and shop for the Benz deals. Often it's individual dealer incentives, last day of the month that will get you there. I've seen some good examples from Edmunds Lease forums, mbworld, and leasehackr. Here was my recent deal - http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=970542&highlight=

I predict some superb deals towards year end on leftover 2017 Benz S550s and CLS550s if you are into those. Fair deals on E300s, but harder to find.


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## Kief (Dec 6, 2007)

It certainly is sad times for us BMW enthusiasts when we compare how things were 10-15yrs ago. I recently took a short break from BMW and sold my M4 for a Jag F-Type R coupe. But despite loving the Jag, I missed the BMW family and returned to a M3 ZCP. However, there are days when I question my return. Once my wife's X5's warranty expires, I too may be looking into a Benz GLC63 AMG depending on the look and driving feel of the X3M or may consider a Jag F-Pace SVR. For myself, I was toying with the idea of an Audi TTRS.

Then again, I'm scheduled to participate in ///M School next month, and I'm sure I will leave there loving the brand!


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