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## RHJS (May 23, 2010)

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## dfusnik (Jul 7, 2010)

I know I'll probably sound like your parents, but are you nuts? Don't get me wrong, I've been car crazy since I was a little kid and I'm 37 now so I understand your love for this car. Especially since I just ordered my first BMW and the wait is absolutely killing me. But you need to consider a few things:

1) A 20 year old kid with very little credit (or poor credit) might have an eye opening experience when trying to get a lease for a $65k car. Be prepared for possible rejection.

2) You're a 20 year old kid looking at leasing a $65,000 performance car. Have you checked with your insurance company on rates and whether or not they will even cover you. Even if they do insure you, your rates will be astronomical. Don't be surprised if your agent gives you a little chuckle when you initially inquire.

3) $10k down and $900/month to lease is crazy because at the end of the 4 years, you've paid out an INSANE amount of money for a car you don't own.

4) How long do you plan on living with your parents? The amount of money you're planning on paying for this car could go a long way towards putting you in your own house. 

5) I don't mean to scare you, but in this job market and economy I'd be cautious about locking myself into a contract that would be very expensive to get out of.

6) Lastly, and this is just my personal opinion. No 20 year old kid deserves to be driving around in a new M3. I make far more money than you and I can't even aspire to an M3 yet. Take a step back, and get your priorities inline.

Sorry if I sound like a parent, but I am and I've learned from my own experiences.


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## hpowders (Jun 3, 2005)

You have big eyes. Work your way up to an M3. Who will insure a 20 year old with an M3?


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## 6 Brit (Jan 19, 2009)

if you have to ask...


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## azmx74 (Aug 31, 2008)

Maybe you can go to progressive.com and get an idea of what insurance would cost relative to other cars? Their quoting system lets you "what if" different makes and models easily; even if you don't buy from them it could be instructive. Have you considered buying an e46 or e36 M3 instead? That might scratch your itch without dedicating most of your next four years to trying to pay for your car and little else. After a few years, there will probably be scores of e9x M3s available used, where others have helpfully taken the depreciation hit for you...


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## chris328 (Jul 16, 2008)

i guess it depends on what kind of job you have and what you plan on doing with it. some people have jobs where they have to impress their clients to succeed and thus have a decent reason for needing a flashy car like an m3, some people have cars as their main focus and hobby and probably have looked forward to an m3 their whole lives. then some people just need to get from point a to point b.

for myself it was the opposite, I could have afforded an m3, maybe even a maserati but i simply dont need one. my 328 is a daily driver at 40 miles a day and through the winters, it does the trick. i was never really a gearhead or into cars that much, i just needed a ride.


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## dvon (Jun 27, 2010)

what do you mean by planning to make $60K? Do you have salary or commission? I make MUCH more than you, I'm single, no kids and I would say I can't afford an M3, you can MAYBE afford a 328i. do not put money down on a lease, if you total the car you lose anything you put down, so if truck rear ended you you'd be out $10K. Also don't lease for 48 months, 36 months leases are much betters deals. As a rule of thumb don't buy a car that costs more than 50% of your income. So for you that's $30K. That benchmark is a little high in my opinion but it's better than no benchmark at all. 

I personally never spend more than 10% of my take home pay each month on car payments and many will even say that number is high. 

Using income of $60k and taking 30% out for taxes and health care you have a take home income of $3500/month so I wouldn't spend more than $350/month on a car payment. To be honest if you really want a BMW get a used 328 and work up to something better later.

In short you can't afford an M3


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## chris328 (Jul 16, 2008)

you can actually avoid losing downpayments on a lease from an accident/theft if you put the money into security deposits


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## dvon (Jun 27, 2010)

chris328 said:


> you can actually avoid losing downpayments on a lease from an accident/theft if you put the money into security deposits


oh for sure, MSD will reduce his MF but it wasn't even worth going into that since he can't afford the car anyways.


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## fredderf4444 (Mar 9, 2009)

I want an M5...but know I will most likely never have one. Its okay.

Remember, live within your means, you will be happier.

Just my two cents,
F


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## dvon (Jun 27, 2010)

One more tip to the OP, you may be living with your parents now but you won't always want to. Live like you pay rent. Figure out what the average rent is in your area and put that amount into savings every month no matter what. Treat it like rent and make it something you have to pay. You'll thank yourself a few years from now.


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## cruise_bone (Jun 6, 2007)

6 Brit said:


> if you have to ask...


.


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## cruise_bone (Jun 6, 2007)

6 Brit said:


> if you have to ask...


DING DING DING. That ^^^^^.

M3 is all about image and ego. Good luck impressing a chick and bringing her home to mommy and daddy's. Get a Carolla, buy a house, then buy the new Bimmer.

BTW, I didn't see anything in the OP about planning for retirement. Maxing out your retirement plans should be WAY in front of a $900 car payment. Quite frankly, a $900 car payment for a LEASE, then having to get something else again in 3 years is complete stupidity in your current situation.

kids. :tsk:


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## Bremen Ben (Sep 1, 2008)

I think we scared the young man off.... :rofl:

To OP, you can probably afford a M3 now if you stretch your finance, but be prepared to deal with the prospect that afte 4 years you would have spent all that money with nothing to show for.

If you truly want some speed, the Nissan 370Z may be a much wiser alternative, money wise.


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## dvon (Jun 27, 2010)

Bremen Ben said:


> I think we scared the young man off.... :rofl:
> 
> To OP, you can probably afford a M3 now if you stretch your finance, but be prepared to deal with the prospect that afte 4 years you would have spent all that money with nothing to show for.
> 
> If you truly want some speed, the Nissan 370Z may be a much wiser alternative, money wise.


the reality is he'd likely never get approved for financing.


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## Bremen Ben (Sep 1, 2008)

dvon said:


> the reality is he'd likely never get approved for financing.


That's true, but he can have mom and dad co-sign.


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## RHJS (May 23, 2010)

Thanks for the replies. I think I learned a lot just from these replies. A lot of good guidelines posted in here that I should follow. I might go to the dealer to inquire about a 328i or I might just get a regular cost efficient car(non BMW).


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## Bremen Ben (Sep 1, 2008)

I hope we (or at least I) didn't come across as a demoralizing bunch to you; I certainly would hope to see another BMW "convert." Few other cars handle as well as the BMW's.

Aside from a new car, if you look hard enough you can find some pre-owned 3ers in very good condition and affordable price range; a 330 or 335 should be plenty fast.


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## ProRail (May 31, 2006)

RHJS said:


> Thanks for the replies. I think I learned a lot just from these replies. A lot of good guidelines posted in here that I should follow. I might go to the dealer to inquire about a 328i or I might just get a regular cost efficient car(non BMW).


Good idea. Check out a used CPO 3 series about 3-4 yrs old. (My 528 was 4 yrs old when I bought it.) Owning and driving ANY Bimmer is a treat. Work your way up to an M.


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## quackbury (Dec 17, 2005)

As others have rightly said, never, ever, EVER put money down on a lease unless it is the form of multiple security deposits. When your car is gone - be it 4 years at the end of the lease, or 4 days due to a theft or accident - your money's gone too. 

One other avenue you might consider is taking over an existing lease through Swapalease.com or LeaseTrader.com. Sometimes folks have to bail on their lease (e.g. if they got into a car that was more than they could afford). There are some good deals out there from time to time, expecially from folks who put money down up front (see my first comment, above).

There are also some really stinky deals out there as well, so don't get yourself too excited. But the lease terms tend to be relatively short (6 months to 2 years remaining) and it might be a good way for you to determine how big of a payment is really workable.


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## AW328i (Aug 14, 2006)

I know the appeal of a brand new sports car sounds great but the best advice so far that I have seen is to invest that money into a personal property instead. When I was 20 I bought a relatively affordable small house. After about three mortgage payments, I was getting offers on all sorts of credit cards, and was approved for a brand new car if I wanted one. I still bought a 1yr old fuel effecient vehicle anyway. My best friend from high school aslo bought his first house when he was 19. Women don't care about what kind of car you drive but will rip on you if you bring her home to mommy and daddy's house.


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## quackbury (Dec 17, 2005)

Okay, I've given this some thought and here's what I'd recommend if you were my son.
Contrary to what others have said, don't buy a house or condo now. There are ALWAYS hidden costs you are not prepared for and it is a very "illiquid" investment. Really hard to flip it if you lose your job or move. 
Shop for a nice CPO 325i Coupe. You should find one for $20,000 to $25,000. Use $5,000 of the money you have set aside for a downpayment, take out a 3 year car loan for the balance. The payments will be MUCH lower than an M3; plus it allows you to build a credit history. Since the original owner has taken the hit for most of the depreciation, you should recoup most / all of your down payment when it's time to move on. Much better than pissing away $10,000 of savings on a leased car.
Find an apartment in a decent building or apartment complex. Further develop your credit history, while learning what it's like to pay monthly bills in the real world.
Save like crazy. Put half of your savings in an IRA or 401K, a quarter in a money market fund, and the other quarter in a mutual fund. Give yourself a cushion if you lose your job, and a way to save for a nicer car / condo.
Join BMWCCA and start autocrossing and doing HPDE's. Invest in becoming a better driver, instead of blowing money on a car. The driving skills will be with you your whole life, the car won't. And you will be amazed to see what a well driven 325 is capable of.
Learn to do your own auto maintenance. Change your oil and filters. Change your brake pads. Do some reasonable mods: exhaust, spacers, etc. Get a feel for how a BMW works. It will increase your enjoyment 1,000-fold while saving you money.
Taking the above steps, when you get the big promotion and can afford the M3, you will enjoy it so much more. In the interim, you won't be losing sleep at night worrying about making your lease payments. And if and when you meet the girl of your dreams, you will have enough $$$ in the bank to take her out to dinner and back to your place, rather than driving her to McDonalds and back to your parents' house.


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## hpowders (Jun 3, 2005)

Yes. I would also recommend starting with a BMW CPO 3 Series vehicle-it will look like new-nobody can tell-and the best thing-it will ride like a terrific BMW and won't cost an arm and a leg.


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## m4hk33 (May 31, 2009)

you cant afford it, and if it were me, i would be a little more concerned with getting my own place then getting a new car that your going to take a 50 percent hit on in the first 2 or 3 years, 

making 60 k a year, you dont make enough to basically burn 15k a year in deprecation cost.

dont take this the wrong way, there is nothing wrong with wanting to have a nice car. but until you essentailly have **** you money, look at CPO and used that you are only going to lose 5 or 10 k over the life of the car


but with that being said, if i could recomend a 2006ish 335i. with a tune 2500 dollar tune, you can be running with an m3 all day. the can be found for low 20's and are an incredbly well preforming car.


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## RHJS (May 23, 2010)

^thank you. love the "**** you money" line. but yeah if I am going to with BMW I will be buying a CPO. hopefully I can find the one that I want locally. and hopefully I can even get approved with barely any credit.


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## LHB (Apr 16, 2010)

Every time some kid asks a question like this, a bunch of people chime in with advice about "buying a house" or "saving for your retirement." I usually just keep my mouth shut, but:

1) Buying a house would be far riskier than leasing a semi exotic car for a 20 year old. At least you can take the car with you when you move, which you will likely do every 6 months when you're in your early 20s. You shouldn't buy a house until you're mature enough to take care of children, because a house is at least as much work. Anybody who's responsible enough to take care of a cat can handle a car lease, although a $900 car lease is a fairly expensive cat.

2) Everything a 20-something person should be doing with their time and money is either illegal, immoral and/or fattening. Nagging a person who's just barely out of high school to start saving for their retirement is so over-the-top stingy, it makes me wonder what people who give the advice do for their kids at Christmas. Give them books filled with loan amortization tables and formulas for calculating the present values of variable annuities?

3) What kind of life have you lived if the the thing you remember most about being in your 20s was the level of interest rates when you were 22, or stock market fluctuations during the two weeks after your 21st birthday, or that incredibly inverted yield curve on Septermber 20, 2012? 

Makes me wanna holler!


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## RHJS (May 23, 2010)

^ imagine how I felt when I read most of these posts. telling a 20 year old to save for retirement is ****ing nuts. sorry but I'm not a ****ing guppy and I don't have an office job. (and my parents are not rich, I wish) but it's not like I didn't expect these replies from a BMW forum.


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## dvon (Jun 27, 2010)

RHJS said:


> ^ imagine how I felt when I read most of these posts. telling a 20 year old to save for retirement is ****ing nuts. sorry but I'm not a ****ing guppy and I don't have an office job. (and my parents are not rich, I wish) but it's not like I didn't expect these replies from a BMW forum.


What do you do for work? If you have the option of 401K contribution you should be saving. Telling a 20 year old to save for retirement is not nuts at all. I started putting money into my 401K with my very first job out of school. Should you have some fun with your money while you're young? hell yes. it's just about moderation though.

A CPO 3 series would be a great option for you


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## hpowders (Jun 3, 2005)

The consensus from those posting here much in the know,
Say do the BMW used as a nice CPO.


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## m4hk33 (May 31, 2009)

i dont think that its people trying to be hard on the kid, i just think that its people alot of successful people who mean well are telling the kid not to be stupid.

think about it
60k per year saler
minus 20k local and federal taxes
minus 12k per year in payments
minus at least 6k for insurance

and your at 22ish per year before you even figure in any other expense, thats not alot of money, find a great girl want to get your own apt to your down to about 10 k per year, add in food and theres not much room there

so dont take it the wrong way, its not people or at least me beeing snoody but people see time and time again young people get into horrible situations because of a new car,

like i said before, look for a 20k 335i or chip it if you want the current body style or consider a 2002ish m3 and do some mods, might be ablet to find one for 15-20k both are incrfedible cars and can run in the 4s for 0-60s


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## hpowders (Jun 3, 2005)

Whatever you do, don't take it the wrong way,
Folks here got experience and know what to say.


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## GoldenBimmer (Mar 14, 2010)

RHJS said:


> ^ imagine how I felt when I read most of these posts. telling a 20 year old to save for retirement is ****ing nuts. sorry but I'm not a ****ing guppy and I don't have an office job. (and my parents are not rich, I wish) but it's not like I didn't expect these replies from a BMW forum.


First off, Im 18 and have been saving since 15, 10% every check is a good idea at any age:thumbup:...

And as for buying a new M3, it makes no sense to upgrade to a new M3 for your (second?) car. And if you DO make 60k a year, save 20k, and buy an older M3 (or even M5) outright.

P.S. its "yuppie"


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## hpowders (Jun 3, 2005)

You get these replies from a BMW forum,
'cause we want to be truthful, and surely not bore 'im.


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## AW328i (Aug 14, 2006)

LHB said:


> 3) What kind of life have you lived if the the thing you remember most about being in your 20s was the level of interest rates when you were 22, or stock market fluctuations during the two weeks after your 21st birthday, or that incredibly inverted yield curve on Septermber 20, 2012?
> 
> Makes me wanna holler!


I remember my interest rate when I was 20, 7%. Had a 5 year arm and in the 4th year it was 4.5% before jumping up to 5% in the 5th year. The most fond memory I have is remodeling it and selling it for an almost 40k profit. Giving the advice of, "oh, he's a young kid, let him do whatever he wants," is assinine. Saving for the future, or buying a house where you could see a possible return on investment (no way in a lease) is much better advice than bling it up and hope for the best! Oh yah...


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## Ilovemycar (Feb 19, 2010)

hpowders said:


> the consensus from those posting here much in the know,
> say do the bmw used as a nice cpo.





hpowders said:


> whatever you do, don't take it the wrong way,
> folks here got experience and know what to say.





hpowders said:


> you get these replies from a bmw forum,
> 'cause we want to be truthful, and surely not bore 'im.


  haha


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## hpowders (Jun 3, 2005)

Ilovemycar said:


> haha


I'm glad I made you a Ha! Ha!
Cause it's so freakin' hot down here in Baja!


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## RHJS (May 23, 2010)

I'm actually 19 years old.(20 in 2 months) I am an LVN in California working 2 jobs / week with 12 hour shifts, 6 days/week. 60k was just an estimate of what my salary was because I honestly don't know since I had just started working. I have a 26k loan to pay off that im currently paying off and I'm going back to school for RN and will have a 70k loan to pay when I'm done with that.


Ps I know it's yuppy but I'm typing from my iPhone and the auto correct on here changes almost every slang word I type. And thanks to the people who are answering my real question and I will be looking for a CPO 3 series.


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## samsonitep (Jun 13, 2010)

RHJS said:


> Hey guys I am new here (Sorry if this is in the wrong place)
> 
> I had just started working and am pretty stable at the moment and I really need a new car (Using an old hand-me0down) at the moment). I want a new M3 to lease or get through the BMW select program.
> 
> ...


Screw what the other people are telling you....here is what you do.

Do you have a steady stream of income/investments coming in? If so then do it.
Now I looked on your lease deal. 10k down and STILL 900/month? I did a rough calculation on the m3 with decent options(tech, premium etc etc)

total cost is around 69k. I put down 10k and 36 month lease(your best bet) and got 775/month. However I hate that 10k.

10k down is a waste. If you could do 0 down with 900/month then that is more reasonable. that way you take your 10k put in in a bank and collect interest (American Express offering 1.39%) get 40-60 bucks on interest it helps. have your money work for you.

HOWEVER...if your heart is set on it splurge.......if it adds happiness in your life do it. Just make sure you can financially support it. You maybe strapped and have to cut back a bit but it will be worth it!


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## E92Carrera (Aug 6, 2007)

RHJS said:


> Thanks for the replies. I think I learned a lot just from these replies. A lot of good guidelines posted in here that I should follow. I might go to the dealer to inquire about a 328i or I might just get a regular cost efficient car(non BMW).


I think thats a really good idea. I mean, I would love to have an M3 but financially I know I can't afford it yet. I have a 328 coupe and its a really great car. Great advice from everyone, make sure you think long term as well not just I want the nicest car I can afford now.

PS. I just graduated college last year and I have a fairly stable good paying job for the economy, but I know what my financial limits are.

Remember if you do decide to get a bimmer to ask around the forums here, there's plenty of people that can help you get the most bang for your buck.

Good Luck.


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## getz (Sep 21, 2007)

I think spending the equivalent income of a year of your salary seems like a solid financial decision. You sound like you have your priorities straight, so I give a resounding "go for it".
-Getz


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