# Dealer won't budge on money factor.



## OBS3SSION (Oct 1, 2002)

I know Jon is away on vacation, but there are many other knowledgeable folks who might have an answer for this. I called my salesman to inform him that I will probably prefer a lease for my car instead of financing. When we were comparing numbers over the phone (I was using leasguide.com) I asked about negotiating the money factor. His response was he can't touch that, or his boss would "chop his hands off". He actually seemed surprised that I knew what their buy rate was.

When we negotiated the price of the car before, we settled on 5% over invoice. I was hoping for better, but he used the same excuse then... that his boss would not like if he did that, and they wouldn't make any money with less than 5%. I was told that this is actually pretty good for a BMW. Is the same true with not being able to negotiate on the money factor when dealing with BMW?


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## F1Crazy (Dec 11, 2002)

Eric,
Many dealers still play their old games, my boss will chop my hands off, have to feed my kids, etc. It's all BS, they can do better, look at what kind of deals you can get at Jon's dealership, $1,200 over invoice for 325i or 530i ! 
I had to drive 400 miles to get the car but it was worth it. Maybe you should shop around. 
You give them 5% profit already, this is more than fair and the least they can do for you is to give you their buy rate. Be firm with them and good luck!


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## F1Crazy (Dec 11, 2002)

About MSDs, 
this is nice option but negotiate your money factor first and then tell your dealer you want to do MSDs.


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## 3Wagon (Nov 8, 2002)

5% over invoice is kind of high (unless we're talking about an M3.) You can definitely get a better deal.


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## OBS3SSION (Oct 1, 2002)

I'm taking delivery at the PC on Feb 3, so there is no more time to change my order or go to another dealership. The car I've ordered is already in the US and is configured as such:

330i, Tourmaline Violet, Premium/Sport/Cold Weather packages, Bi-Xenons, Nav, and Step.

(Here's a side question... does TV incur a metallic paint charge? The Vehicle Inquiry printout my salesman gave me has $0 next to the paint.)

Now you're getting me worried... I had the understanding that 5% over invoice on a BMW is a fair deal. Sure, better deals might exist, but 5% wouldn't be considered a "rip off" either. Here's a breakdown of how I arrived at the price of my car:

$38,560 - Invoice (excluding Nav... I added this later)
+ $500 - MACO
+ $160 - Training Fee
+ $695 - Destination Fee
========
$39,915
+$1,995 - 5% Profit
========
$41,910 - Original negotiated price
+$1,640 - Add Nav to the order (got straight invoice price)
========
$43,550 - Final negotiated price

So, my price over invoice and fees is $1,995, which I understand is supposed to be a "good deal".

In regards to the money factor, my primary question is whether that is negotiable at most dealerships at all. My salesman says no. Is that the case at most other dealerships? I don't want to (can't) put multiple security deposits down. I'm lucky not to be upside-down on my current car's loan right now with its 5-year loan and shitty used car market.

How can I convince him to lower the money factor after he's already told me he can't?


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## bpa (Dec 7, 2002)

Offer to split the difference between their buy rate and their sell rate. That's what I did and my dealer agreed. Seemed more than fair to me. Let me know if you don't have the actual rates - there's a thread here somewhere with the rates from autospies.


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## F1Crazy (Dec 11, 2002)

What is the money factor he's giving you? Like mentioned in previous threads max he can ask is .0004 over buy rate, tell him to split it with you. It doesn't cost him anything to get you lower rate, anything above BMWFS buy rate is profit for him, tell himyou can't give him more than you already did.
Don't beat yourself about 5%, it's fair for you both.
Post this question on bimmer.org financing/leasing massage board, you should get some tips over there. Do a search there on money factors and you'll see people can negotiate their rates.


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## Jon Shafer (Dec 15, 2001)

OBS3SSION said:


> *In regards to the money factor, my primary question is whether that is negotiable at most dealerships at all. My salesman says no. Is that the case at most other dealerships? I don't want to (can't) put multiple security deposits down. I'm lucky not to be upside-down on my current car's loan right now with its 5-year loan and shitty used car market.
> 
> How can I convince him to lower the money factor after he's already told me he can't? *


Find another dealer that is more flexible, and then 
tell your Client Advisor that he is going to lose the
deal if he doesn't fulfill your wishes..


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## GimpyMcFarlan (Aug 13, 2002)

*Nope...*

My dealer did not budge on the money factor, however it was probably my fault... I should not have told them that I was foing to use the multiple security deposit plan as early as I did. In retrospect, I could have played more hard ball. But in the end the factor was acceptible overall considering it was on a new MY coupe. :dunno:


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## OBS3SSION (Oct 1, 2002)

Jon Shafer said:


> *Find another dealer that is more flexible, and then
> tell your Client Advisor that he is going to lose the
> deal if he doesn't fulfill your wishes.. *


I don't see how I can do that, considering the car is long since ordered, built, and shipped to the US already. :dunno:


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## Jon Shafer (Dec 15, 2001)

OBS3SSION said:


> *I don't see how I can do that, considering the car is long since ordered, built, and shipped to the US already. :dunno: *


In the vernacular of the car biz, it's called "Playhouse 90"...

:yikes:


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## GimpyMcFarlan (Aug 13, 2002)

Jon Shafer said:


> *In the vernacular of the car biz, it's called "Playhouse 90"...*


Don't know about the restr of the folks here, you lost me here... :dunno:


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## Mr. The Edge (Dec 19, 2001)

GimpyMcFarlan said:


> *Don't know about the restr of the folks here, you lost me here... :dunno: *


I looked it up--it's an old TV show (Rod Serling was a writer) that was carried live back in the 50's.

Basically it's come to mean countering one person's bull with your own bull.


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