# October 2012 BMWFS Sales Support Programs



## Hockeypuck (Jun 8, 2010)

It looks like something is about to happen. I stopped by the local dealer today and they had more 3 series on the lot than I have ever seen before. They were almost all 328s but they had a big mix of models styles.


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## Jon Shafer (Dec 15, 2001)

grkmec said:


> Any word yet?


We won't hear anything at all until Monday afternoon, although the extension of the Ultimate Drive App until 12/31 was announced earlier today...

:thumbup:


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## dnadrifter (Jul 15, 2012)

Jon,

How likely would it be that loyalty cash would go up or there would be another non-lease incentive. Basically we were expecting to pick up a new car next weekend, but it came in early so we were going to pick it up Sunday. This thread has me reconsidering that. Our dealer is pretty laid back and doesn't seem too worried about when we take delivery. Is there really any potential downside to waiting a few days to a week?


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## Jon Shafer (Dec 15, 2001)

dnadrifter said:


> Jon,
> 
> How likely would it be that loyalty cash would go up or there would be another non-lease incentive. Basically we were expecting to pick up a new car next weekend, but it came in early so we were going to pick it up Sunday. This thread has me reconsidering that. Our dealer is pretty laid back and doesn't seem too worried about when we take delivery. Is there really any potential downside to waiting a few days to a week?


There is no downside unless your CA could potential lose a volume bonus. But then again, it could help them make it next month...

All I can say for certain is that inventory levels have swollen -- not so much because sales have been slow, but rather BMW has very strong objectives year over year from last year, resulting in a large increase in "Days Supply" right now, and large push of wholesale deliveries throughout the remainder of the calendar year. OLP could be enhanced. Other promotional bonuses, or even special lease rates and/or trunk money. Please don't let my prediction preclude you from taking delivery of your new BMW. I could be wrong...


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## Mbbrewer (Jun 20, 2010)

Does your prediction assume that the incentive programs are going to apply mostly on leased vehicles? I've got my ED scheduled on 10/19 and the dealer wants payment 2 weeks before. I'm not leasing so hopefully they'll be some good incentives to apply. 

Are Q4 programs announced tomorrow?


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## Jon Shafer (Dec 15, 2001)

Mbbrewer said:


> Does your prediction assume that the incentive programs are going to apply mostly on leased vehicles? I've got my ED scheduled on 10/19 and the dealer wants payment 2 weeks before. I'm not leasing so hopefully they'll be some good incentives to apply.
> 
> Are Q4 programs announced tomorrow?


We should receive update Sales Support Programs tomorrow afternoon.

I believe there will be incentives available to all prospective buyers. BMW has a very strong annual forecast, are currently running behind MBZ
for luxury brand King, and a lot of product now available on the ground.

All of the key ingredients for "The Perfect Storm"...


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## miamiboyca (Jun 19, 2012)

Jon Shafer said:


> We should receive update Sales Support Programs tomorrow afternoon.
> 
> I believe there will be incentives available to all prospective buyers. BMW has a very strong annual forecast, are currently running behind MBZ
> for luxury brand King, and a lot of product now available on the ground.
> ...


John, is it sage to assume you will post the details on this thread?


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## ish (Jan 23, 2007)

Jon Shafer said:


> Other promotional bonuses, or even special lease rates and/or trunk money. Please don't let my prediction preclude you from taking delivery of your new BMW. I could be wrong...


I have heard the same from my friends at our dealer. I'm hoping for a little extra bump for our new 550i order I was going to place this weekend!


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## miamiboyca (Jun 19, 2012)

ish said:


> I have heard the same from my friends at our dealer. I'm hoping for a little extra bump for our new 550i order I was going to place this weekend!


I sign papers on Tuesday since my ED slipped toi 10/11. You have time since its when you sign the deal.


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## cmhsam (Mar 1, 2012)

Jon Shafer said:


> 8^)


First, figure out exactly what you want, and then get ready to place your orders.

How about a working oil pump so I can actually take US Delivery of my M5. It's pending fix at the VDC


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## Jon Shafer (Dec 15, 2001)

miamiboyca said:


> John, is it sage to assume you will post the details on this thread?


It depends..



Back in the day when we first launched Bimmerfest I posted EVERYTHING that was previously held "confidential".
Nowadays it's a little different. I post as much as I can get away with, without pissing too many people off.
It makes it extra-challenging since I have a dual relationship with BMWNA.

:angel:

You can be sure I will post as much as I can, and drop enough hints so that the majority will be able to figure
it out..


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## miamiboyca (Jun 19, 2012)

Jon Shafer said:


> ... I post as much as I can get away with, without pissing too many people off.


How very California of you ;-)

Thanks John. I am not too worried as I am using a board sponsor in your neck of the woods. I mentioned it to him already and he told me he would wait until tomorrow before getting me the paper work for my ED so he would know if there is anything better. Always good to double check though...

I only wish I had found this board and its sponsors sooner.


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## the_fox (Jul 6, 2006)

My prediction:
Oct - Good
Nov - Better
Dec - Best


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## djsaad1 (Sep 3, 2012)

the_fox said:


> My prediction:
> Oct - Good
> Nov - Better
> Dec - Best


It seems like november and december are usually the same.


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## caylan (May 1, 2002)

are we there yet? 

I'm interested in a 750iX or 750LiX with M Sport + other options.
In NoVa & would like to work with board sponsors dealers but not sure how that work logistically in terms of the ordering, allocations, delivery.

Would appreciate it if some1 could chime in with some thoughts. Thanks!


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## [email protected] BMW (Aug 2, 2010)

Hopefully tomorrow will bring good news........... today is a busy day for all BMW centers/dealers as this is "month end" for us. Everyone will be trying to hit their objectives for Sept. set by BMW NA.


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## lovemygsp (Aug 22, 2012)

Well we were suppose to get our car on saturday according to our CA. Now she says its going to be Friday at the earliest. I'm irritated but at the same time interested to see what the october specials are. Hopefully it will work in our favor. We already have a credit union set up but the rate I was given was only a bit less than what I SHOULD have been offered from BMW. Our FI guy is a real piece of work though and was trying to double my rate when I have great credit.  I want to walk in there knowing exactly what is available right now to protect myself.


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## Kar Don (Aug 4, 2004)

Need updates on 2012 X5d for october pleeeeease!


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## Ace535i (Jan 28, 2012)

[email protected] BMW said:


> Hopefully tomorrow will bring good news........... today is a busy day for all BMW centers/dealers as this is "month end" for us. Everyone will be trying to hit their objectives for Sept. set by BMW NA.


Why did BMW make today the 'last day of the month' for the dealerships rather than yesterday? How would a buyer know?


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## SARAFIL (Feb 19, 2003)

Ace535i said:


> Why did BMW make today the 'last day of the month' for the dealerships rather than yesterday? How would a buyer know?


If the last day of the month falls on a weekend, the following Monday is always the "month end" for BMW. Has always been that way- very predictable, just look at a calendar.


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## mrjoed2 (Apr 6, 2012)

Jon,

Anything running for the 2013 6 series coupe? I see they pulled down the option credits on the '12's.


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## BMW_F1 (Nov 6, 2009)

Orient330iNYC said:


> are you getting these from the bulletin? or calculating them from the bmwusa website?


BMWUSA website. I don't have access to DCSNet.


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## maizeblue (Jul 18, 2005)

*Money Factor for 328i or 328i xDrive 2013 sedam?*

Money Factor for 328i or 328i xDrive 2013 sedam?
Does anyone the October number is?


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## Fzara2000 (Jan 22, 2004)

dzaborn said:


> Jon posted the above earlier, so hopefully the MF has been reduced. He didn't mention anything about a enhanced residual for the 328, so no surprise that has stayed at 59% for 15K/yr.


Assuming a MF reduction of 0.00020 (from 0.00145 to 0.00125) on a car with an msrp of $57k and a gross cap cost of $53.3k, you're only saving ~$20/mo. with the reduced MF..i guess still better than nothing


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## jcs (Dec 25, 2001)

Thanks BMW_F1.


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## Rohardi (Aug 7, 2011)

I see the 5 series line up got a nice bump in residuals. Any increase in the M5 residual?


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## zetabetatau (Dec 9, 2009)

Is the M6 Coupe still 51% .00140 for 15k


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## sderose (May 8, 2007)

Only $20/month difference between a 528 and a 535? Wow. Never seen that before. I am curious as to why? Anybody know? How is the 4 cyl 528 selling?


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## mrjoed2 (Apr 6, 2012)

Wow, from what I see not a big deal for Oct incentives, certainly not for the 6 coupe. I'll sit tight until BMW gets serious...............


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## sb1805 (Oct 2, 2012)

Does anyone have the residual/MF for 2013 535i? 15k miles per year. Thanks!


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## elistein (Jul 3, 2008)

Hey guys, been about 3 years since I posted on Bimmerfest. What happened to the sticky list of monthly rates/residuals? It appears it's not allowed on here anymore? If so, could anyone please give me the October residuls and money factor for the 2013 X6?
Thanks.


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

sderose said:


> Only $20/month difference between a 528 and a 535? Wow. Never seen that before. I am curious as to why? Anybody know? How is the 4 cyl 528 selling?


Tooting my own horn - but late last year, there was a time when the difference between a 528 and Hybrid 750 was about $25/month - http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=584523

We may be heading to that region with the ActiveHybrid 3 and 5. $2000 more in credits for the hybrid, and a few end of year support programs, will be all that is needed. One big thing in favor of a deal is that the LCI for the F10 5 series is due in 2014? This makes the 2013 ripe for deals. A further bump in residuals can't hurt either.


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## Jon Shafer (Dec 15, 2001)

elistein said:


> Hey guys, been about 3 years since I posted on Bimmerfest. What happened to the sticky list of monthly rates/residuals? It appears it's not allowed on here anymore? If so, could anyone please give me the October residuls and money factor for the 2013 X6?
> Thanks.


I will try to prepare a residual matrix if I can get caught up answering quote request emails.

Lease Money Factors are deemed "confidential" (buy rate), so I can't post those.

While I would love to help everyone out, please don't email me solely to ask what the
money factory/residual on a particular vehicle is. I've been hammered with these questions today,
and that is not really what I am here for. I have my own customers who are counting on
me to get back to them in a timely manner, which I cannot do if I am shagging endless
requests for confidential information.

Those who have been proactive in researching money factors are allowed to post them here in this thread.

I just can't do it (for obvious reasons)...

Thanks for your consideration.


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## enig44 (May 2, 2012)

*328 mf*

Saw on F30post.com that someone said that 328 MF dropped from .00145 to .00135 can anyone confirm that?

So I am expecting to take delivery late next week, when I asked the CA in August when I ordered what if rates dropped he said it's locked, but that seems to not be the case, nothing is final until I sign the paper work right? Seems that I should be able to get the lower MF if it is actually lower?


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## elistein (Jul 3, 2008)

Sorry man, was just posting a general question...."Ride With G" website posts a monthly update so it doesn't look like it's that confidential....was just wondering what happened to that monthly sticky by some company...


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## [email protected] (Jun 28, 2012)

Jon Shafer said:


> I will try to prepare a residual matrix if I can get caught up answering quote request emails.
> 
> Lease Money Factors are deemed "confidential" (buy rate), so I can't post those.
> 
> ...


:rofl: No way...you too :rofl: Sorry, i gave up after the 15th email...Im calling it quits for the day

BTW, the emails that came in with just one line and starts with ..."*hey*, what is the MF/Residual for Oct"...I send it all to the delete box ...Sorry plz forgive


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## Jon Shafer (Dec 15, 2001)

[email protected] said:


> :rofl: No way...you too :rofl: Sorry, i gave up after the 15th email...Im calling it quits for the day
> 
> BTW, the emails that came in with just one line and starts with ..."*hey*, what is the MF/Residual for Oct"...I send it all to the delete box ...Sorry plz forgive


Well, this should help: https://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7109837&postcount=1

If enough people request, I'll prepare one for MY2012...

:bigpimp:


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## Jon Shafer (Dec 15, 2001)

elistein said:


> Sorry man, was just posting a general question...."Ride With G" website posts a monthly update so it doesn't look like it's that confidential....was just wondering what happened to that monthly sticky by some company...


Well, since you asked, "that company" got sued and a "Cease & Desist Order" now precludes them (Lease Compare) from posting them now.. Just because "Ride with G" is getting away with it for now doesn't mean they'll be doing it forever.
If it was legal to be posted, the lease money factors surely would be posted here as I used to do for many years (before you joined Bimmerfest) until they cracked down on us...

:nono:


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## Kar Don (Aug 4, 2004)

chrischeung said:


> Tooting my own horn - but late last year, there was a time when the difference between a 528 and Hybrid 750 was about $25/month - http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=584523
> 
> We may be heading to that region with the ActiveHybrid 3 and 5. $2000 more in credits for the hybrid, and a few end of year support programs, will be all that is needed. One big thing in favor of a deal is that the LCI for the F10 5 series is due in 2014? This makes the 2013 ripe for deals. A further bump in residuals can't hurt either.


Hmmm.. I'll be watching for a thread from you on lease deal of the year! Please keep me in the loop, still kicking myself for missing the AH F01


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## Ace535i (Jan 28, 2012)

So, no option credits for this month (2012s and 2013s)? Any trunk money for the dealers?

BMW is not too concerned being left in the dust by MB??


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## Jon Shafer (Dec 15, 2001)

Ace535i said:


> So, no option credits for this month (2012s and 2013s)? Any trunk money for the dealers?
> 
> BMW is not too concerned being left in the dust by MB??


Seemingly not worried for now..

All of the extra incentives are based on sales performance awarded to Sales Department personnel...


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## Orient330iNYC (Jul 30, 2002)

a little birdie may have implied to me that MFs dropped by 0.00010.


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## mrjoed2 (Apr 6, 2012)

Ace535i said:


> So, no option credits for this month (2012s and 2013s)? Any trunk money for the dealers?
> 
> BMW is not too concerned being left in the dust by MB??


Ace535i - I'm with you, disappointed given the hype talk about the Oct incentives. I mean other than the activhybrids and 7 series M package - there is nothing ! Everything I'm reading
says BMW is locked in battle with MB for units, so this is puzzling. All I know is I'm passing on Oct - it's a dud!


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## Ace535i (Jan 28, 2012)

mrjoed2 said:


> Ace535i - I'm with you, disappointed given the hype talk about the Oct incentives. I mean other than the activhybrids and 7 series M package - there is nothing ! Everything I'm reading
> says BMW is locked in battle with MB for units, so this is puzzling. All I know is I'm passing on Oct - it's a dud!


: popcorn:


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## Jon Shafer (Dec 15, 2001)

mrjoed2 said:


> Ace535i - I'm with you, disappointed given the hype talk about the Oct incentives. I mean other than the activhybrids and 7 series M package - there is nothing ! Everything I'm reading
> says BMW is locked in battle with MB for units, so this is puzzling. All I know is I'm passing on Oct - it's a dud!


There are unprecedented direct incentives based on volume for CAs and Sales Managers. This extra motivation to take the skinnier deals is there. In other words, there is more to the picture than meets the eye. Consumer incentives are just one prong of the attack so to speak. Hold out if you want. Inventories are great, incentives are strong. Wait if you want...


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## mrjoed2 (Apr 6, 2012)

Jon,

Understand what your saying- but the customer incentives are important from the buyer perspective when trying to time the purchase - especially when in my case it's buying not leasing. Bottom line is I am interested in a 650 coupe and BMW has nothing for me this month ( I don't qualify for the $750)


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## Jon Shafer (Dec 15, 2001)

mrjoed2 said:


> Jon,
> 
> Understand what your saying- but the customer incentives are important from the buyer perspective when trying to time the purchase - especially when in my case it's buying not leasing. Bottom line is I am interested in a 650 coupe and BMW has nothing for me this month ( I don't qualify for the $750)


Depending on where you live, you have huge dealer discounts possibly..

You also have lease money factors as low as they go. A decade ago buyers would have died and gone to heaven to get rates like this.

I hear what you are saying but if you look at history, there has never been a better time to buy a car like this. Dealers would have never taken deals like these, rates would have been way higher, and "incentives" on BMWs? They never really existed until the post-9/11 world.

What vehicle are you comparing it against? The 650 coupe is a high-performance low-production-volume model.

Why does everyone now expect domestic-car-type incentives on premium European automobiles nowadays?

I mean no disrespect, I guess buyers are being trained. But you have to keep things in historical perspective, and more importantly supply:demand. If we see a repeat of the pre-election crash of 2008, maybe we'll see trunk money on 2013s before the end of 2012? That sounds crazy in and of itself. Trunk money was invented to help dealers clear out last year's model... I am all for great deals, seriously. Keep in mind you are buying a BMW and not a deal. How far do you want to see the product devalued? They could raise the price and then offer trunk money.



All joking aside, I hear what you are saying. Personally I can't see how if somebody really wanted to buy one, that not having an "incentive" would keep them from buying?

Can these cars not sell without artificial stimulation?

:dunno:


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

Jon Shafer said:


> Why does everyone now expect domestic-car incentives on premium cars?


Folks often also are short sighted in not realizing that continued incentives equate to lower resale and brand devaluation. This is also bad for leasing, since it pushes down residuals. Pay now or pay later.

As long as BMW can run at profitable production, and the cost of ownership is a constant, wouldn't it be better to have the cache of a premium product that is able to command a higher price, with excellent resale? For BMW as well as customers?


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## TxnBluDvl (Mar 12, 2002)

Hi Jon --

Wondering if you can tell us if the incentives to dealers are to hit monthly objectives or quarterly objectives (or both)?

In the market to buy an X5d, have an Olympic credit that's expiring in my bucket of incentives and wondering if it makes more sense to lock in something in before the end of the month or wait it out until the end of the year.


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## Jon Shafer (Dec 15, 2001)

TxnBluDvl said:


> Hi Jon --
> 
> Wondering if you can tell us if the incentives to dealers are to hit monthly objectives or quarterly objectives (or both)?
> 
> In the market to buy an X5d, have an Olympic credit that's expiring in my bucket of incentives and wondering if it makes more sense to lock in something in before the end of the month or wait it out until the end of the year.


Right now all of the money is on our current October sales objectives.


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## NoI4plz (May 2, 2012)

I appreciate Jons, commitment to educating us on lease incentives and etc. Honestly what other dealer is willing to carefully give us information that might help us make an educated purchase. That being said, I was looking for some purchase incentives to combo with the team usa credit. But im guessing im gonna have to wait it out. However the AH credit is remarkable. 

Again, thanks Jon for the info, hope to see the same for every month!


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## Jon Shafer (Dec 15, 2001)

NoI4plz said:


> I appreciate Jons, commitment to educating us on lease incentives and etc. Honestly what other dealer is willing to carefully give us information that might help us make an educated purchase. That being said, I was looking for some purchase incentives to combo with the team usa credit. But im guessing im gonna have to wait it out. However the AH credit is remarkable.
> 
> Again, thanks Jon for the info, hope to see the same for every month!


My pleasure as always..

Are you still interested in X5?


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## letuz (Sep 25, 2006)

Hello!

Thanks for posting all of the information, this board is a wealth of knowledge! Some questions:

1.) How does the 39 month lease work in terms of mileage. If I go with a 10k/39 mo lease, how many miles am I actually given? Still only 30k? Or is there an "allowance" for the extra three months?

2.) Can the BMW ultimate drive app credit be used in conjunction with ED? What if I am using an out of state board sponsor? Can I still receive the credit?

3.) if I intend to take delivery in December, I imagine that now would be the best time to lock rates in, yes?

Thanks again


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## miamiboyca (Jun 19, 2012)

Jon Shafer said:


> ... Personally I can't see how if somebody really wanted to buy one, that not having an "incentive" would keep them from buying?


+1 :thumbup:


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## miamiboyca (Jun 19, 2012)

fzutel said:


> Hello!
> 
> Thanks for posting all of the information, this board is a wealth of knowledge! Some questions:
> 
> ...


1 - You get 3 months worth of miles, so on a 10K lease you get 32,500

2 - I can't speak to the ED credit, but you can buy from anyone you want. i am buying from California and registering in Miami. All incentives still apply.

3 - Getting qualified now allows you to take advantage of October reates, but unless you use a CA dealership - the rates only lock in for 60 days so you would need to keep that in mind. (i.e Oct 3 - take delivery by Dec 3) unless west coast dealer.


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## mrjoed2 (Apr 6, 2012)

Jon Shafer said:


> Depending on where you live, you have huge dealer discounts possibly..
> 
> You also have lease money factors as low as they go. A decade ago buyers would have died and gone to heaven to get rates like this.
> 
> ...


I started looking at a MB 550 coupe, which is still on my short list. The 650 is certainly a step up, but of course it should be for $25K more. Again lease factors are not a consideration as I am looking at a purchase. And fact is we are in the post 9/11 world, and all Mfgs have consumer incentives to some degree. I honestly don't think there's anything wrong with wanting a BMW AND a deal. Fact is as much as I like the 650, it is overpriced, with features like blind spot/lane departure a option which are standard on cars half the price. and LED's which should be standard on their halo car. Frankly the only way I will go for the 650 is with decent incentives/discounts. And frankly after doing some research, the 6 series has historically had big time depreciation, this even before BMW began customer end incentives - so it would seem logical to get it at the lowest price possible. We all know BMW makes huge profit margins on the upper end 6/7 series. And I understand it's not a domestic - but again a $2000 incentive in a $90,000 BMW is not in the same ballpark as $2000 off a $25,000 Ford or Chevy. BMW won't even feel it.

Bottom line from my point of view - BMW offered $2500 incentive last Dec on the 6er, when it was a brand new model, and can't imagine they won't do something similar this year, given it's now in it's second year, competition with MB, and European market crashing. I'll wait a bit longer ( would like the updated Idrive as well which for some bizarre reason is now in the 5 & 7 series but they skipped the 6) I do appreciate your insight. And in my case - no, it won't sell without some stimulation. And I would think dealers would love the incentives, BMW is funding them and you would get more sales - lobby Munich!!


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## Jon Shafer (Dec 15, 2001)

mrjoed2 said:


> I started looking at a MB 550 coupe, which is still on my short list. The 650 is certainly a step up, but of course it should be for $25K more. Again lease factors are not a consideration as I am looking at a purchase. And fact is we are in the post 9/11 world, and all Mfgs have consumer incentives to some degree. I honestly don't think there's anything wrong with wanting a BMW AND a deal. Fact is as much as I like the 650, it is overpriced, with features like blind spot/lane departure a option which are standard on cars half the price. and LED's which should be standard on their halo car. Frankly the only way I will go for the 650 is with decent incentives/discounts. And frankly after doing some research, the 6 series has historically had big time depreciation, this even before BMW began customer end incentives - so it would seem logical to get it at the lowest price possible. We all know BMW makes huge profit margins on the upper end 6/7 series. And I understand it's not a domestic - but again a $2000 incentive in a $90,000 BMW is not in the same ballpark as $2000 off a $25,000 Ford or Chevy. BMW won't even feel it.
> 
> Bottom line from my point of view - BMW offered $2500 incentive last Dec on the 6er, when it was a brand new model, and can't imagine they won't do something similar this year, given it's now in it's second year, competition with MB, and European market crashing. I'll wait a bit longer ( would like the updated Idrive as well which for some bizarre reason is now in the 5 & 7 series but they skipped the 6) I do appreciate your insight. And in my case - no, it won't sell without some stimulation. And I would think dealers would love the incentives, BMW is funding them and you would get more sales - lobby Munich!!


Just between you and me, I hope (1) BMW comes with stronger incentives, and (2) you end up getting one.

I am all for buyers getting the best deal possible; incentives do, as a matter of fact, make my job easier...

:thumbup:


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## VK2 (Sep 3, 2012)

Jon, I do want to thank you and all on this forum for the wealth of information. I've been considering a BMW for a while but got down to serious research in the last two to three months and placed an order a few weeks back. While relatively new to BMW pricing, discounts, negotiations, from a BMW perspective, I can appreciate why they would give dealer incentives rather than customer incentives for Oct - a) many like me who've ordered and signed up for a car but haven't taken delivery would have got those Oct benefits. This might have been suboptimal so early in the model year b) I've always felt a bit concerned that I could not get discounts that others could get for a multitude of reasons - USAA, graduate, loyalty, drive events, BMW App etc. This levels the playing field a bit.


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## Alpine300ZHP (Jan 31, 2007)

mrjoed2 said:


> Wow, from what I see not a big deal for Oct incentives, certainly not for the 6 coupe. I'll sit tight until BMW gets serious...............


Same here. I expect a little something special with November and December deals. BMW does not want to lose the sales crown to MB. I personally am shopping BMW against MB and will buy whichever makes the most sense to me.



elistein said:


> Sorry man, was just posting a general question...."Ride With G" website posts a monthly update so it doesn't look like it's that confidential....was just wondering what happened to that monthly sticky by some company...


I suspect Ride with G will continue to get away with postings for the time being. Leasecompare got away with it for a good 5 plus years before they got sued.



Jon Shafer said:


> My pleasure as always..
> 
> Are you still interested in X5?


I am....drove an x5M...really like it. :thumbup:


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## mrjoed2 (Apr 6, 2012)

VK2,

Keep in mind USAA allows pretty much all BMW customer incentives to be added to to their program discount.(As long as you don't finance through BMWUSA) In my case USAA discount for a '13 650 coupe is already around $13K and will increase as model year marches on. If BMW brings back a incentive later this year like last years "mission to drive" for $2500 off, it will be sweet.


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## elistein (Jul 3, 2008)

Jon Shafer said:


> Well, since you asked, "that company" got sued and a "Cease & Desist Order" now precludes them (Lease Compare) from posting them now.. Just because "Ride with G" is getting away with it for now doesn't mean they'll be doing it forever.
> If it was legal to be posted, the lease money factors surely would be posted here as I used to do for many years (before you joined Bimmerfest) until they cracked down on us...
> 
> :nono:


Got it... Interesting...didn't know it went down like that... thanks for the update.


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## miamiboyca (Jun 19, 2012)

mrjoed2 said:


> I started looking at a MB 550 coupe, which is still on my short list. The 650 is certainly a step up, but of course it should be for $25K more. Again lease factors are not a consideration as I am looking at a purchase. And fact is we are in the post 9/11 world, and all Mfgs have consumer incentives to some degree. I honestly don't think there's anything wrong with wanting a BMW AND a deal. Fact is as much as I like the 650, it is overpriced, with features like blind spot/lane departure a option which are standard on cars half the price. and LED's which should be standard on their halo car. Frankly the only way I will go for the 650 is with decent incentives/discounts. And frankly after doing some research, the 6 series has historically had big time depreciation, this even before BMW began customer end incentives - so it would seem logical to get it at the lowest price possible. We all know BMW makes huge profit margins on the upper end 6/7 series. And I understand it's not a domestic - but again a $2000 incentive in a $90,000 BMW is not in the same ballpark as $2000 off a $25,000 Ford or Chevy. BMW won't even feel it.
> 
> Bottom line from my point of view - BMW offered $2500 incentive last Dec on the 6er, when it was a brand new model, and can't imagine they won't do something similar this year, given it's now in it's second year, competition with MB, and European market crashing. I'll wait a bit longer ( would like the updated Idrive as well which for some bizarre reason is now in the 5 & 7 series but they skipped the 6) I do appreciate your insight. And in my case - no, it won't sell without some stimulation. And I would think dealers would love the incentives, BMW is funding them and you would get more sales - lobby Munich!!


I am confused by your comments.. Just my 2 cents. You are will to buy a car you feel is over priced and pay a 25K difference but the 2K in incentives will make all the difference?

Or is that you are upset that you feel there were better deals last year than this year? :dunno:

John, thanks for the info you (and Grep P) saved me a few bucks... always apprecaited. :thumbup:


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## CK530 (Nov 16, 2006)

Jon Shafer said:


> Seemingly not worried for now..
> 
> All of the extra incentives are based on sales performance awarded to Sales Department personnel...


+1, I went to my local dealer on 9/24 asking for a purchase price on a 2013 X5 Premium. Initial conversation started with an email from the dealer. They asked me to come to the dealership. I went and spoke to the internet advisor and their initial quote was $56,068 with a MSRP of $60,695 (SAV was in stock). That's very close to invoice. Now, I deduct USA drive, loyalty & Ult App credit. With the $2,250 incentives, that will bring my purchase price couple thousands below invoice. Not a bad deal at all. She gave me the quote without any incentives. That was the price to lease or to buy. She wrote all the information on her business card + the buy rate of .00145.

Like Jon said, find a dealer that is willing to work with you. I'm also a big believer of buying at the end of the month.


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## NoI4plz (May 2, 2012)

mrjoed2 said:


> I started looking at a MB 550 coupe, which is still on my short list. The 650 is certainly a step up, but of course it should be for $25K more. Again lease factors are not a consideration as I am looking at a purchase. And fact is we are in the post 9/11 world, and all Mfgs have consumer incentives to some degree. I honestly don't think there's anything wrong with wanting a BMW AND a deal. Fact is as much as I like the 650, it is overpriced, with features like blind spot/lane departure a option which are standard on cars half the price. and LED's which should be standard on their halo car. Frankly the only way I will go for the 650 is with decent incentives/discounts. And frankly after doing some research, the 6 series has historically had big time depreciation, this even before BMW began customer end incentives - so it would seem logical to get it at the lowest price possible. We all know BMW makes huge profit margins on the upper end 6/7 series. And I understand it's not a domestic - but again a $2000 incentive in a $90,000 BMW is not in the same ballpark as $2000 off a $25,000 Ford or Chevy. BMW won't even feel it.
> 
> Bottom line from my point of view - BMW offered $2500 incentive last Dec on the 6er, when it was a brand new model, and can't imagine they won't do something similar this year, given it's now in it's second year, competition with MB, and European market crashing. I'll wait a bit longer ( would like the updated Idrive as well which for some bizarre reason is now in the 5 & 7 series but they skipped the 6) I do appreciate your insight. And in my case - no, it won't sell without some stimulation. And I would think dealers would love the incentives, BMW is funding them and you would get more sales - lobby Munich!!


I agree with your with you pov, who doesn't like incentives to purchase a car. At the end of the day yes I'm not expecting crazy incentives on a vehicle (unless it's last gen or it's sales dud) however I do expect some trunk money on any car.

Now will I complain that AT THIS VERY MOMENT the TRUNK MONEY ISNT THERE? YES. However BMW runs a business, and I don't purchase a car the moment I set my eyes on it. I know BMW will in the future run some sort of incentives programs which will make me want to buy the car, at the price I want to pay and then I will happily purchase it. Patients and restraint will happily snag you the right price. This is one of those time were you have to make a decision whether you want the car now at a price above what your willing to pay, vs later where new incentives might pop up.


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## NoI4plz (May 2, 2012)

miamiboyca said:


> I am confused by your comments.. Just my 2 cents. You are will to buy a car you feel is over priced and pay a 25K difference but the 2K in incentives will make all the difference?
> 
> Or is that you are upset that you feel there were better deals last year than this year? :dunno:
> 
> John, thanks for the info you (and Grep P) saved me a few bucks... always apprecaited. :thumbup:


Contradictary, but hey that's how the financially well to do, stay well to do :bigpimp:


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## NoI4plz (May 2, 2012)

Jon Shafer said:


> My pleasure as always..
> 
> Are you still interested in X5?


Sent you a PM. Don't worry take your time answering it, and it's not about any incentives LOL

EDIT: next time I'll sHouod try sending the message before posting I sent you a pm!

I'll just email after a couple days, after the initial bulk of incentive questions are done ROFL


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

miamiboyca said:


> I am confused by your comments.. Just my 2 cents. You are will to buy a car you feel is over priced and pay a 25K difference but the 2K in incentives will make all the difference?
> 
> Or is that you are upset that you feel there were better deals last year than this year? :dunno:


Yes - the comments are contradictory. He wants incentives - but complains that resale is bad. 6 series has features that are on cars half the price - yet he still will get a 6 series even though it is much more expensive.

From what I've read, it sounds like just wanting to get a deal better than others and justifying it with unassociated ideas. I don't say there's anything wrong with wanting the best deal out there, but just that the arguments presented are inconsistent, and that the only thing I can come up with is being greedy for the best deal.


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

mrjoed2 said:


> I'll wait a bit longer ( would like the updated Idrive as well which for some bizarre reason is now in the 5 & 7 series but they skipped the 6)


If that is your course of action, I really can't see why you would be really upset. Sure, everything has been about super duper October incentives, but it was all just rumour. Just sit and bide your time. If history is any indicator, all you need to do is have cash ready, and wait. It may be end of year, it may be next year - but if time is on your side, I don't see any cause for concern.

And I'd offer that as my opinion to anyone else - if you want a deal, and need a car soon, head down to a sponsor, and take something off the lot or in the pipeline. Per Jon, incentives are there to move in stock cars.

If you'd rather order or do ED and the deal is paramount, it may pay to wait if you can.


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## miamiboyca (Jun 19, 2012)

chrischeung said:


> From what I've read, it sounds like just wanting to get a deal better than others and justifying it with unassociated ideas. I don't say there's anything wrong with wanting the best deal out there, but just that the arguments presented are inconsistent, and that the only thing I can come up with is being greedy for the best deal.


+1 :thumbup: Not that there is anything wrong with that... Judging by your deals you are very good at this or have a rabi at BMW :rofl::rofl:


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## mrjoed2 (Apr 6, 2012)

chrischeung said:


> Yes - the comments are contradictory. He wants incentives - but complains that resale is bad. 6 series has features that are on cars half the price - yet he still will get a 6 series even though it is much more expensive.
> 
> From what I've read, it sounds like just wanting to get a deal better than others and justifying it with unassociated ideas. I don't say there's anything wrong with wanting the best deal out there, but just that the arguments presented are inconsistent, and that the only thing I can come up with is being greedy for the best deal.


Yes, I do want the best deal, maybe you don't. Don't like incentives? Go right ahead and pay sticker. And check the data- the resale/depreciation- has always been lousy on the 6 series even before large customer incentives, I understand that going in, but still love the car. 
And are you suggesting pay a higher price for it to try to keep the resale up? Ridiculous.
And some things about BMW are hard to swallow , such as I mentioned about options that should be standard. It can be argued that BMW is being greedy, looking for huge profits, but I guess that's ok with you. As one of the other posts said, you don't become financially successful by giving it away......


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## mrjoed2 (Apr 6, 2012)

miamiboyca said:


> I am confused by your comments.. Just my 2 cents. You are will to buy a car you feel is over priced and pay a 25K difference but the 2K in incentives will make all the difference?
> 
> Or is that you are upset that you feel there were better deals last year than this year? :dunno:
> 
> John, thanks for the info you (and Grep P) saved me a few bucks... always apprecaited. :thumbup:


Was saying I starting looking at a less expensive car a MB 550, and then at the 650. I feel the 650 IS overpriced and the only way I can justify it is with great incentives - what's wrong with that?, my POV. And the best deals last year seem to have been Dec, so guess what, I'll wait until December, no rush, it's a 3rd car for us.


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## NoI4plz (May 2, 2012)

mrjoed2 said:


> Yes, I do want the best deal, maybe you don't. Don't like incentives? Go right ahead and pay sticker. And check the data- the resale/depreciation- has always been lousy on the 6 series even before large customer incentives, I understand that going in, but still love the car.
> And are you suggesting pay a higher price for it to try to keep the resale up? Ridiculous.
> And some things about BMW are hard to swallow , such as I mentioned about options that should be standard. It can be argued that BMW is being greedy, looking for huge profits, but I guess that's ok with you. As one of the other posts said, you don't become financially successful by giving it away......


I think BMW isn't being greedy, but rather trying to make a profit on their investment, which will help run their business. At the same time, it's also your business to make the best return on your investment, hence you would want to buy the 6 when the purchase price yields max benefit in options. Historically you will see that happen with BMW, as the model line gets close to an LCI or you get some business record BMW group is trying to break. I think as the year gets closer to Mayan doomsday (I had to say it, Caz it seems to have lost it popularity amongst people) the incentives tend to flow, especially with VAG tryin dominate the luxury market.

Also Mr joe, you and everyone else here works hard for every penny, why justify your philosophy of spending, just to do what you do to get you what you want on your terms. That's what everyone else does lol, no need to justify it. A friend once said to me, IT'S YOUR MONEY, USE IT ANY FREAKIN WAY YOU WANT, AS LONG AS YOUR HAPPY WITH THAT WAY!
Living by that philosophy every since!

-i4


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## Ace535i (Jan 28, 2012)

mrjoed2 said:


> Yes, I do want the best deal, maybe you don't. Don't like incentives? Go right ahead and pay sticker. And check the data- the resale/depreciation- has always been lousy on the 6 series even before large customer incentives, I understand that going in, but still love the car.
> And are you suggesting pay a higher price for it to try to keep the resale up? Ridiculous.
> And some things about BMW are hard to swallow , such as I mentioned about options that should be standard. It can be argued that BMW is being greedy, looking for huge profits, but I guess that's ok with you. As one of the other posts said, you don't become financially successful by giving it away......


A fool and his money are soon parted.... :wave:


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

mrjoed2 said:


> Yes, I do want the best deal, maybe you don't. Don't like incentives? Go right ahead and pay sticker.


I think you're putting words into my mouth - I never said your or I should pay sticker. I said if you want the best deal, wait. If you need a car now, you can go in and work with your dealer and pick up a car with the current incentives.

Yes - I don't want the best deal. That is because I'm not prepared to miss out on the better things in life by thinking they'll be cheaper down the road. I'll be the first to admit that I've overpaid for many things (including my current BMW), and underpaid for quite a bit more. Sure, I'll do my research, and often be patient for the deal, but when I don't get it, or see someone get a better deal, I don't think it's unfair, blame the seller, say something is overpriced etc.

But to me it's not how much I paid for something - it's what I was able to get out of it that is most important to me. It's a little sad - I've been on the Bimmerfest boards for 10 years+ give or take, and I've seen a lot of the enthusiasm for the cars been changed to a lot about how good a deal is (or not). From what I've seen over the years, by just having spent a couple of hours/days on these boards, the vast majority of people I would guess have gotten 80% of the potential savings at least of the best deal possible for their car - meaning if the best deal is $5000 off, then most folks would have gotten at least $4000 off. Just a guess on my part, but I'll put it out there. It's personally strange that people get upset over a few hundred dollars on a $50K+ purchase.

Bottom line - be happy, either way. If the deal works, get the car. If not, keep your cash.


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## miamiboyca (Jun 19, 2012)

mrjoed2 said:


> Was saying I starting looking at a less expensive car a MB 550, and then at the 650. I feel the 650 IS overpriced and the only way I can justify it is with great incentives - what's wrong with that?, my POV. And the best deals last year seem to have been Dec, so guess what, I'll wait until December, no rush, it's a 3rd car for us.


Joe, its obviously your prerogative to wait as long as you want, no problem. What confuses me here is that you say its over priced (25K difference) but then a 2K incentive would make it ok.

I get wanting to get the best deal, that is something I think everyone understands.

One question, what happens if there are no incentives in Nov/Dec? What will you do then? Just curios.


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## Ace535i (Jan 28, 2012)

Perhaps a lovely trip to Munich....


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

Ace535i said:


> Perhaps a lovely trip to Munich....


Most people spend more on European Delivery than what they saved on the car. I'm assuming you mean a "lovely" vs "quick and cheap" European Delivery. USAA rebate is also not combinable with European Delivery.


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## German Expat (Sep 29, 2006)

chrischeung said:


> Most people spend more on European Delivery than what they saved on the car. I'm assuming you mean a "lovely" vs "quick and cheap" European Delivery. USAA rebate is also not combinable with European Delivery.


We are 'making' money on our trips to Munich but that is a special case. We go there anyway at least every 2nd year and in the years we do ED we save the rental car costs. And we get a free breakfast .
Obviously the wait afterwards is there but we have an older spare 3rd car to bridge the gap.


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## NoI4plz (May 2, 2012)

European delivery is a great way to experience what the vehicle was designed for. There really aren't any savings, but it makes for one memorable trip and a chance to take a nice vacation with or without the family (lol) and the driving experience. If your doing it to get a fantastic price, I think the point of ED is lost, and your better off trying to special order/buy off the lot here. 

Same thing with PCD, it's a driving experience, and somewhat of a vacation package rolled nto one, and stateside. Both of them offer an opportunity to get familiar with the vehicle, and make some memories in the process.


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## mrjoed2 (Apr 6, 2012)

NoI4plz said:


> I think BMW isn't being greedy, but rather trying to make a profit on their investment, which will help run their business. At the same time, it's also your business to make the best return on your investment, hence you would want to buy the 6 when the purchase price yields max benefit in options. Historically you will see that happen with BMW, as the model line gets close to an LCI or you get some business record BMW group is trying to break. I think as the year gets closer to Mayan doomsday (I had to say it, Caz it seems to have lost it popularity amongst people) the incentives tend to flow, especially with VAG tryin dominate the luxury market.
> 
> Also Mr joe, you and everyone else here works hard for every penny, why justify your philosophy of spending, just to do what you do to get you what you want on your terms. That's what everyone else does lol, no need to justify it. A friend once said to me, IT'S YOUR MONEY, USE IT ANY FREAKIN WAY YOU WANT, AS LONG AS YOUR HAPPY WITH THAT WAY!
> Living by that philosophy every since!
> ...


Absolutely agree. But when I'm called greedy, need to respond if you know what I mean.


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## [email protected] (Jun 28, 2012)

mrjoed2 said:


> Hey is that not the great thing about forums like this?
> 
> I am banking on the holiday cash or option credit. In my case with a buy, residuals don't matter. And it is just business, and business is about money. And timing can be everything.


Forums like this? yes and no but thats for another thread at another time...

You are the buyer...so you are in the driver's seat...you make the final decision on where you want to spend your $$$


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## Jon Shafer (Dec 15, 2001)

There will likely be additional *Sales Support* throttled ahead in November and/or December. I think we can all agree on that...

*All the more reason to place your custom factory order right now* (right now, right now).

:str8pimpi

SO YOU CAN BE BURNING RUBBER OVER THE HOLIDAYS


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## mrjoed2 (Apr 6, 2012)

Jon Shafer said:


> There will likely be additional *Sales Support* throttled ahead in November and/or December. I think we can all agree on that...
> 
> *All the more reason to place your custom factory order right now* (right now, right now).
> 
> ...


Jon,

I will be placing a custom factory order - and as you mention sales support likely before end of year. If I place the order now, does BMW honor those incentives when I take delivery - (basically asking if they will add whatever incentive develops to my deal)

Thanks


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## Jon Shafer (Dec 15, 2001)

mrjoed2 said:


> Jon,
> 
> I will be placing a custom factory order - and as you mention sales support likely before end of year. If I place the order now, does BMW honor those incentives when I take delivery - (basically asking if they will add whatever incentive develops to my deal)
> 
> Thanks


As long as you have a dealer that agrees to pass on any additional incentives to you, you will be fine. Some dealers will take orders and then scoop the extra profit later if given the opportunity. With my customers when I take an order, the "meeting of the minds" includes the understanding that I will pass on future incentives to them.

In the case of finance/lease deals, the most prudent thing that you can do (you'll see me post this over and over and over again) is get pre-approved by applying directly to BMWFS online when you leave your deposit for the order. That way you are locked/covered whichever way the wind blows. If programs improve, you go with the new program. If programs get worse (e.g., loss of an incentive, residual decay, LMF increase), you simply stay with the program that was in effect at the time of the issuance of the approval.

:thumbup:


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## thegandalf (Sep 8, 2012)

So, once the order is placed, it's better to apply on line than through the dealer?


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## mrjoed2 (Apr 6, 2012)

Jon Shafer said:


> As long as you have a dealer that agrees to pass on any additional incentives to you, you will be fine. Some dealers will take orders and then scoop the extra profit later if given the opportunity. With my customers when I take an order, the "meeting of the minds" includes the understanding that I will pass on future incentives to them.
> 
> In the case of finance/lease deals, the most prudent thing that you can do (you'll see me post this over and over and over again) is get pre-approved by applying directly to BMWFS online when you leave your deposit for the order. That way you are locked/covered whichever way the wind blows. If programs improve, you go with the new program. If programs get worse (e.g., loss of an incentive, residual decay, LMF increase), you simply stay with the program that was in effect at the time of the issuance of the approval.
> 
> :thumbup:


Jon,

Thanks for the info. In my case it's a purchase using USAA, so I won't be using BMWFS.
So I would have to get dealer agreement as you mention - is that ever put in writing on the order?
One other question you might have the answer to. Would like to time my order for a 650 coupe to get the updated Idrive 4.2 I have read posts as to the date production will start to include it, but nothing official, do you happen to know.

Thanks again.


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## miamiboyca (Jun 19, 2012)

thegandalf said:


> So, once the order is placed, it's better to apply on line than through the dealer?


I think you need to approved in order to place your order.


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## [email protected] (Jun 28, 2012)

mrjoed2 said:


> Jon,
> 
> I will be placing a custom factory order - and as you mention sales support likely before end of year. If I place the order now, does BMW honor those incentives when I take delivery - (basically asking if they will add whatever incentive develops to my deal)
> 
> Thanks


Actually not all BMW special offers qualify for P1(ordered) cars. Some offers are lockable; some are not. Some offers do not apply to vehicles ordered* before *the introduction of the offer. For example TM USA credit can not be combined to an ordered car pre event.

Also, there are limitations as to what may and may not be combined with USAA


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## mrjoed2 (Apr 6, 2012)

[email protected] said:


> Actually not all BMW special offers qualify for P1(ordered) cars. Some offers are lockable; some are not. Some offers do not apply to vehicles ordered* before *the introduction of the offer. For example TM USA credit can not be combined to an ordered car pre event.
> 
> Also, there are limitations as to what may and may not be combined with USAA


Thanks Justin,

Good info to have on the order question.

I have seen a few offers that can't be stacked with USAA, the drive for team USA for example. But I think most can such as option credits, holiday cash,ect. USAA fine print reads "This incentive can be combined with all current retail offers unless otherwise stated"

Also , do you happen to know anything about the production start for the new version of Idrive in the 6 series?


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## [email protected] (Jun 28, 2012)

mrjoed2 said:


> Thanks Justin,
> 
> Also , do you happen to know anything about the production start for the new version of Idrive in the 6 series?


Officially...No


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## NoI4plz (May 2, 2012)

mrjoed2 said:


> Thanks Justin,
> 
> Good info to have on the order question.
> 
> ...


Officially no one knows that info currently. Speculation from different websites suggest that spring is the earliest we can see the new idrive for most vehicles.


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## mrjoed2 (Apr 6, 2012)

[email protected] said:


> Officially...No


How about unofficially?


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## miamiboyca (Jun 19, 2012)

Some is known... take a look at something SS provided to me when I was asking about the new iDrive.



shawnsheridan said:


> Personally, I would be reluctant to buy any 2012 pre July build F10 without the new upgraded Navigation Pro and iDrive-ConnectedDrive system:
> 
> http://www.f30post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=716464
> http://www.f30post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=716908
> ...


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## mrjoed2 (Apr 6, 2012)

NoI4plz said:


> Officially no one knows that info currently. Speculation from different websites suggest that spring is the earliest we can see the new idrive for most vehicles.


Yeah I have read some of the same things. But the 5 & 7 series have it NOW - I have seen it and it is a nice improvement. And the 3 series gets it starting Nov. 6 series is one of the last - ridiculous given it's a flagship model.


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## mrjoed2 (Apr 6, 2012)

miamiboyca said:


> Some is known... take a look at something SS provided to me when I was asking about the new iDrive.


Thanks - I think the LCD dash is slated for the '14 6 series, which means waiting for July '13 production likely (ugh)


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## mrjoed2 (Apr 6, 2012)

miamiboyca said:


> Some is known... take a look at something SS provided to me when I was asking about the new iDrive.


Yes, agree - the new Idrive is worth waiting for. I find is frustrating that BMW keeps the rollout details so secret. No dealer I have spoken to has got back to me about official date I can order to get it in a 650. My thought is BMW does NOT want customers to know about new system -just order now and get the outdated system in a $85,000 car.


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## miamiboyca (Jun 19, 2012)

I don't think it that treacherous.. Lol

In my experience its the product team that decides when something goes into production. That idrive team team may have told the 6 series team that its ready to a certain point and perhaps the 6 series team is waiting on some enhancement (something in the road map) or something else completely to combine at same time of an update. The more pieces the more complex the planning and the smaller the item that can cause a delay.

And we know how Germans like to be precise so until they are sure they are ready, mums the word.


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## djsaad1 (Sep 3, 2012)

There is already a newer touch idrive that will probably start rolling out next fall or so. You will be outdated either way, might as well buy during the holiday season and enjoy the better rates or just wait for the 2014.


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## mrjoed2 (Apr 6, 2012)

miamiboyca said:


> I don't think it that treacherous.. Lol
> 
> In my experience its the product team that decides when something goes into production. That idrive team team may have told the 6 series team that its ready to a certain point and perhaps the 6 series team is waiting on some enhancement (something in the road map) or something else completely to combine at same time of an update. The more pieces the more complex the planning and the smaller the item that can cause a delay.
> 
> And we know how Germans like to be precise so until they are sure they are ready, mums the word.


Yeah, but the cats out of the bag as the new version is in the 5 and 7 series on dealer lots now. And I might be wrong, but it's the same upgrade across the model range so the 6 team should not have to do much - just install the new hardware on the line.
I look at it this way - the newest hardware/tech should go into the line top down. 6 & 7 series first, 1 series last.


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## mrjoed2 (Apr 6, 2012)

djsaad1 said:


> There is already a newer touch idrive that will probably start rolling out next fall or so. You will be outdated either way, might as well buy during the holiday season and enjoy the better rates or just wait for the 2014.


Nope, rather be outdated 1 upgrade, not 2. This new version of idrive is the first full refresh to the system since 2008 by the way.


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## miamiboyca (Jun 19, 2012)

mrjoed2 said:


> Nope, rather be outdated 1 upgrade, not 2. This new version of idrive is the first full refresh to the system since 2008 by the way.


ACTUALLY - Its not. Their is another upgrade in the pipe for touch and hand writing recognition. Could be the 7 and the 5 are testing grounds prior to going into the other lines.



mrjoed2 said:


> Yeah, but the cats out of the bag as the new version is in the 5 and 7 series on dealer lots now. And I might be wrong, but it's the same upgrade across the model range so the 6 team should not have to do much - just install the new hardware on the line.
> I look at it this way - the newest hardware/tech should go into the line top down. 6 & 7 series first, 1 series last.


There a lot of factors other factors including production numbers, interfaces with stereos etc. And you are entitled to your opinion but that has not been the case in many automakers.

Anyway this thread has gotten WAAAAY off track.

Jon - thanks for the finance info. I sign next week and can't wait for my short but awesome ED trip.


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## mrjoed2 (Apr 6, 2012)

miamiboyca said:


> ACTUALLY - Its not. Their is another upgrade in the pipe for touch and hand writing recognition. Could be the 7 and the 5 are testing grounds prior to going into the other lines.
> 
> There a lot of factors other factors including production numbers, interfaces with stereos etc. And you are entitled to your opinion but that has not been the case in many automakers.
> 
> ...


I agree - but know one thing, I'm not ordering now, taking delivery of a $85,000 car in Dec and have it outdated by March.


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## thegandalf (Sep 8, 2012)

mrjoed2 said:


> I agree - but know one thing, I'm not ordering now, taking delivery of a $85,000 car in Dec and have it outdated by March.


Yet if you wait until March that car will be outdated by September. BMW might also decide to avoid bringing such a change mid year just to avoid people feeling this way.


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## djsaad1 (Sep 3, 2012)

mrjoed2 said:


> I agree - but know one thing, I'm not ordering now, taking delivery of a $85,000 car in Dec and have it outdated by March.


I understand what you are saying, but if you are already going to wait, why not wait for the 2014 model just in case it gets the even newer idrive or lcd tachometer thing.


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## miamiboyca (Jun 19, 2012)

thegandalf said:


> Yet if you wait until March that car will be outdated by September. BMW might also decide to avoid bringing such a change mid year just to avoid people feeling this way.


Good point. I split the difference, went with the 2013 that has the new Idrive but passed up waiting on a 2014 that has been refreshed.

It's all what you can deal with, and how long will you wait.


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## mrjoed2 (Apr 6, 2012)

djsaad1 said:


> I understand what you are saying, but if you are already going to wait, why not wait for the 2014 model just in case it gets the even newer idrive or lcd tachometer thing.


Tough decision- one one hand not in a rush, but on the other hand the '14 won't start production likely till July, so now we are talking waiting until next Sept. Kind of crazy.


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## mrjoed2 (Apr 6, 2012)

miamiboyca said:


> Good point. I split the difference, went with the 2013 that has the new Idrive but passed up waiting on a 2014 that has been refreshed.
> 
> It's all what you can deal with, and how long will you wait.


That's my gut feeling too. What is your dealer telling you timeframe wise as to when to place the order to get the new Idrive in a 6?


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## miamiboyca (Jun 19, 2012)

mrjoed2 said:


> That's my gut feeling too. What is your dealer telling you timeframe wise as to when to place the order to get the new Idrive in a 6?


A 6??? I wish. Look at my signature I am getting a MY 13 next week, but its a 535i.

I decided not to get a 12, but there was no way I was going to wait a year for the refresh. I can wait a little but not that long.


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## mrjoed2 (Apr 6, 2012)

miamiboyca said:


> A 6??? I wish. Look at my signature I am getting a MY 13 next week, but its a 535i.
> 
> I decided not to get a 12, but there was no way I was going to wait a year for the refresh. I can wait a little but not that long.


Sorry, didn't see it. You should be all set. my understanding is the new idrive is standard on all 5 series that started with July production.


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## miamiboyca (Jun 19, 2012)

Yep, one if the reasons I waited. Even thought the incentives on the 2012 made for a better deal.


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## rmorin49 (Jan 7, 2007)

Are the MF and residuals accurate on bmwconfig?


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## thegandalf (Sep 8, 2012)

I think they are not. Go to www.ridewithg.com to find the latest MFs and residuals.
The residual values you will get are for a 36month 15k lease. Add 2% for a 12k or 3% for a 10k.

John recently posted a Pdf with all the residuals. It's very detailed.

Right now the base nf is. 00135


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## Orient330iNYC (Jul 30, 2002)

rmorin49 said:


> Are the MF and residuals accurate on bmwconfig?


no, bmwconfig defaults to 0.00240 and a resid of 59%
current MF is 0.00135 across the board, resids vary by model.


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