# SMG vs. 6 spd stick



## matt325i (Apr 3, 2002)

Hey M3 owners...

I am going to upgrade my 2001 325i SP for an M3 w/in the next year. Although I have to admit I haven't tried SMG for myself yet, it seems like amazing technology. 

This fact notwithstanding, my question is this: Do you miss going through the gears and the other drivers' joys in owning a stick, or are you happy with the SMG? I realize that the SMG performs wonderfully, but I'm looking for more of an aesthetic perspective. 

I have driven manual tranny's all my life, and believe I'd miss the feel of it. What are your thoughts?

Thanks! Matt


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## SteveT (Dec 22, 2001)

Matt,

I'm about to spec one myself and have had the same thoughts. My sales lady told me a few weeks ago that BMW sent out a bulletin saying that they should not allow their customers to believe that SMG was equivalent to an automatic. It requires the same thought process a manual transmission does, even though it is computer controlled. I've seen various owners posts saying essentially the same thing. SMG does have the automatic mode, but it still is not really an automatic transmission. Hopefully one of the guys with recent experience will add to your thread.

I'm still planning on SMG for my order btw. Good luck!


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## ALEX325i (Dec 19, 2001)

Matt,

I traded a 95 325is (manual) I had for a 98 A4 (Tip). While I don't regret the A4 ownership experience, I do regret getting it with Tip... Back in 98, that was news (at least in terms of Audi), and I thought I could get used to it... Yeah, right... :tsk:

If you think you'll miss the manual tranny, trust me, you will...


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## SteveT (Dec 22, 2001)

Alex,

The big difference with SMG is that there is no torque converter. The Tip is just an automatic with a torque converter with slightly different controls. SMG is a mechanical transmission with a clutch. The computer controls it all, but it's got to be different.


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## ALEX325i (Dec 19, 2001)

I know, I know. It's just that the thought of not having the third pedal again scares the heck out of me.

Granted, I haven't driven an SMGII equipped M3, but I still can't bring myself to believe it's that different from a manumatic just because there's no torque converter... :dunno:


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## in_d_haus (Jan 2, 2002)

SMG 4 me! Hey...that might make a good license plate!


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## pj1234 (Apr 3, 2002)

*30 days with SMG*

It is a different transmission. It does have a clutch, does not have a clutch pedal. Wheather you are in auto or sequential mode you can aid shifting to save your clutch. A slight lift when up or down shifting will ease that drivetrain clunk you get with power shifting. Unlike an auto, it won't hold you on a hill.

The auto mode 3 is very nice in city traffic, and sequential 5 or 6 is great when really pounding some country curvy road. You will never be able to downshift as quick or as smoothly as this box does.

And for those "certain" times, as a bonus, you have Lauch Control.

Only had mine for 30 days, but I think a lot of people are going to be surprised at how soon they need a clutch when they try to hot rod this car as an automatic.


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## Clem (Oct 29, 2001)

I got to test drive an SMG equipped M3 the other day:

1. Amazing technology
2. Still rather have a 6-speed
3. For a glorified "step" there's no auto mode. 
4. Fun to drive but to me it's more of a novelty
5. Using "Launch Mode" 4 to 6 times will void your warranty

That given, give me a 6-speed anyday.


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## in_d_haus (Jan 2, 2002)

Very cool Clem!


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## Mr. The Edge (Dec 19, 2001)

Clem said:


> *I got to test drive an SMG equipped M3 the other day:
> 
> 3. For a glorified "step" there's no auto mode.
> *


There is an Auto mode...


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## Clem (Oct 29, 2001)

atyclb said:


> *
> 
> There is an Auto mode... *


Elaborate please :dunno:


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## Mr. The Edge (Dec 19, 2001)

SMGII contains a manual (Sequential) mode with 6 programs (S1-S6), and an Automatic mode with 5 programs. (A1-A5)

You go from A to S using the shift knob.


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## JST (Dec 19, 2001)

Clem said:


> *I got to test drive an SMG equipped M3 the other day:
> 
> 1. Amazing technology
> 2. Still rather have a 6-speed
> ...


Uh oh. I suspect that those hood stripes will be the Next Big Thing in 3XXCi/i "performance" mods.


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## blackdawg (Jan 4, 2002)

*launch control and the warranty...*

is it true that launch control slips the clutch a bit, too?

is this why CLem suggests that using it 4-6 times will void the warranty?

the clutch being a wear and tear item, i.e. not truly covered under warranty?


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## Clem (Oct 29, 2001)

atyclb said:


> *SMGII contains a manual (Sequential) mode with 6 programs (S1-S6), and an Automatic mode with 5 programs. (A1-A5)
> 
> You go from A to S using the shift knob. *


Well I guess I shoulda done some more research, but my opinion hasn't changed. I'd still prefer a 6-Speed :bigpimp:


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## pj1234 (Apr 3, 2002)

*Clem, Launce Control*

If, launch control is set at 3800 RPM in Eu, and only 1800 in states why would 5 or 6 launches void warrenty on clutch.

Since L.C. is an undocumented feature of SMG how could BMW tell someone they have voided an unknown warrenty feature? Too many bmws are sold to lawyers in this country to have that scenario fly.

I have a feeling that the LC warrenty voidance stories are just street stories, but would like to see a STB or memo of anykind from BMWUSA to that effect.

Has anyone actually seen any real evidence?


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## Mr. The Edge (Dec 19, 2001)

As far as I know, there is NO pre-set limit on launches, either here or worldwide. There were rumors that 30 launches would void the warranty in the UK, but that was proven to be false.

Since clutch replacement is hardly ever covered by warranty anyway, it's no surprise that using launch control could be expensive.


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## in_d_haus (Jan 2, 2002)

JST said:


> *
> 
> Uh oh. I suspect that those hood stripes will be the Next Big Thing in 3XXCi/i "performance" mods. *


I like the stripes.... I like the checkered flag on the E36 LTW better though...


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## blackdawg (Jan 4, 2002)

*grand scheme of things:*

clutches are pretty inexpensive.

better that than the variolok rear diff, the SMG unit and gears, or driveshaft.


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## Clem (Oct 29, 2001)

*Re: Clem, Launce Control*



pj1234 said:


> *If, launch control is set at 3800 RPM in Eu, and only 1800 in states why would 5 or 6 launches void warrenty on clutch.
> 
> Since L.C. is an undocumented feature of SMG how could BMW tell someone they have voided an unknown warrenty feature? Too many bmws are sold to lawyers in this country to have that scenario fly.
> 
> ...


No real evidence, but I was told by salesmen and service reps that it would.


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## admac (Mar 31, 2002)

i don't miss rowing through the gears. i don't miss the clutch pedal at all. in truth, it is a bit less satisfying clicking the levers than moving the gear selector, but the positives outweigh the negatives as far as i'm concerned.


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## SacM3 (Mar 1, 2002)

I've always driven sticks and don't miss the clutch pedal at all. The SMG is a blast and keeps the driver very involved.


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## dakarm (Apr 1, 2002)

I consider this for myself.

Until I drove the stanard 6-speed. Then I really knew I had to get SMG.

Why? because I have a physical handicap. My left leg is about an inch shorter and is missing a good 5-10 pounds of muscle mass due to Polio. The clutch on the E46 M3 is way way too heavy for me. During my weekend drive with my friends new M3, I was not able to drive the car for more then 30min in traffic. I had to pull over because my leg refused to work. For the last 5min I was assisting the left leg with my left arm to push the clutch pedal down. I can't imagine ever trying to drive the car on the track for fear of my own safety as well as others.


In my M coupe, I have no such problems and have driven to work several times, stuck in the infamous Sunol Grade traffic jam. No leg fatigue what so ever.


I did decide to pass on buy a E46 M3 but I will consider buy a used one in the future. That is if I can find a SMG version. If not I will have to pass. 

So for some of us SMG is the only choice.


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## ezsce46 (Mar 7, 2002)

*Re: Re: Clem, Launce Control*



Clem said:


> *
> 
> No real evidence, but I was told by salesmen and service reps that it would. *


OK Clem where's the missing fog lite?


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## ___lk___ (Dec 21, 2001)

ALEX325i said:


> *
> If you think you'll miss the manual tranny, trust me, you will...  *


agreed.









can't imagine why anyone would ever get an M3 w/o full manual transmission...there may come a day when you CAN'T get manual trans, and the SMG will be forced upon you....why *choose* it now, while you can still hold on to some shred of sporting heritage that once was embodied by the mighty M3...?


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## pj1234 (Apr 3, 2002)

*Why would a luddite buy a ...*

... high tech car? It works in F-1, it's here and like Pandora, you can't put knowledge back in the box.

"
can't imagine why anyone would ever get an M3 w/o full manual transmission...there may come a day when you CAN'T get manual trans, and the SMG will be forced upon you....why choose it now, while you can still hold on to some shred of sporting heritage that once was embodied by the mighty M3...? "


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## ggman (Apr 23, 2002)

*smg vs man*

rolling back to LA from Santa Barbra after the bimmerfest , I found that not one man.trans could pass me up .And up around the limit I seemd to be pulling away like my limiter was a set little higher or something. " I AM NOT TRYING TO BRAG ", I just want to know if there is any validity to this? Also for anyone who likes to speed in calif.. Invest in the CHP 11-99 foundation. It saved my ass from a ticket and a trip to the pokey and the impound !!!!!:thumb:


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