# ****SPOILER****Monaco GP results



## SteveT (Dec 22, 2001)

racerdave said:


> Nelson Piquet had a great quote driving a F1 car around Monaco... "It's like riding a bicycle in your bathroom."
> 
> I don't think Williams is close enough this year... they're too far off the pace. I'd love if they proved me wrong.
> 
> I think Trulli will surprise again... as could Button, whose silky-smooth style could be a real boon at an unforgiving place such as Monaco. (although he wrecked big-time there last year)


Qualifying is of uppermost importance at Monaco. Last year Ralf was on the pole and Juan was second and they had a great strategy from there to win. The FW26 is good in qualifying (at least driven by JPM), but seems to be off the pace in the race. It's hard to tell from the TV whether it's a handling problem or engine power. I assume it's balance/handling/grip, but the small brake duct thing implies they were squeezing for top speed. Is that a power issue? Then there's the talk about allowing them to use more RPM. RPM=Power.

Button has done well, but he didn't move up from the back in Barcelona. OK, I heard about the carbon fragment in his eye, but he needed to show speed from there and he didn't. Button still hasn't shown he can race to the front. The Renault is not as easy to drive as they'd hoped and they're still down on power. Monaco could be their track, but it wasn't last year.


----------



## berford (Sep 10, 2002)

Thursday practices were disappointing for the good guys and a happy day for MS, nearly meeting the course record lap time--go figure.

1 1 Michael Schumacher Ferrari 1:14.741 

2 35 Anthony Davidson BAR-Honda 1:15.141 

3 2 Rubens Barrichello Ferrari 1:15.319 

4 7 Jarno Trulli Renault 1:15.472 

5 6 Kimi Räikkönen McLaren-Mercedes 1:15.479 

6 9 Jenson Button BAR-Honda 1:15.520 

7 10 Takuma Sato BAR-Honda 1:15.664 

8 38 Ricardo Zonta Toyota 1:15.690 

9 8 Fernando Alonso Renault 1:15.701 

10 3 Juan Pablo Montoya Williams-BMW 1:16.097 

11 5 David Coulthard McLaren-Mercedes 1:16.229 

12 4 Ralf Schumacher Williams-BMW 1:16.556 

13 16 Cristiano da Matta Toyota 1:16.743 

14 11 Giancarlo Fisichella Sauber-Petronas 1:16.748 

15 17 Olivier Panis Toyota 1:17.007 

16 19 Giorgio Pantano Jordan-Ford 1:17.309 

17 12 Felipe Massa Sauber-Petronas 1:17.422 

18 39 Timo Glock Jordan-Ford 1:17.756 

19 18 Nick Heidfeld Jordan-Ford 1:17.873 

20 15 Christian Klien Jaguar-Cosworth 1:17.988 

21 20 Gianmaria Bruni Minardi-Cosworth 1:18.822 

22 21 Zsolt Baumgartner Minardi-Cosworth 1:18.829 

23 40 Bas Leinders Minardi-Cosworth 1:20.370 

24 37 Bjorn Wirdheim Jaguar-Cosworth 

25 14 Mark Webber Jaguar-Cosworth


----------



## WILLIA///M (Apr 15, 2002)

A 1:13.xx to be on pole tomorrow? 

Edit: Oops, forgot we get the Friday break at Monaco. F1 practice makes me assume it's Friday. 1:13xx for pole on *Saturday*.


----------



## berford (Sep 10, 2002)

Topaz330xi said:


> A 1:13.xx to be on pole tomorrow?


That would be amazing!!!


----------



## Alex Baumann (Dec 19, 2001)

No offense to Monaco fans, but F1 Grand Prix in Monaco sucks big time, IMO. I've never been a fan of that circuit (been there once). It is all about jet-set, boobs and girls and waste of nice champagne, if you ask me.

Instead of discussing whether the Canadian Grand Prix should be removed from the GP calendar, they should be asking themselves, whether racing in Monaco is making sense anymore or not.


----------



## SteveT (Dec 22, 2001)

Alex Baumann said:


> No offense to Monaco fans, but F1 Grand Prix in Monaco sucks big time, IMO. I've never been a fan of that circuit (been there once). It is all about jet-set, boobs and girls and waste of nice champagne, if you ask me.
> 
> Instead of discussing whether the Canadian Grand Prix should be removed from the GP calendar, they should be asking themselves, whether racing in Monaco is making sense anymore or not.


Alex, Are you writing quotes for Ralf and he forgot to use this one this year? It's a waste of champagne, but not boobs.

Has anyone seen the current Autosport? There's a good story there about how Juan Montoya is staying in Ralf's head all the time. It tells about how he asks Ralf the edgy questions about why he's slow in this sector or that, even before he can get out of the car.


----------



## richard (Apr 3, 2002)

Alex, your description of a Monaco sounds pretty good to me. LOL I will agree it doesn't yield many good races. Still it has a magic that I still love. Most F1 races are a parade anyway so why not surrounded it in beautiful scenery, boobs and girls. Plus the on board shots are just incredible.


----------



## mwette (Sep 16, 2002)

Speedtv.com has a story about the new soft bridgestone tires developed for this circuit.
They have been developed to provide good qualifying and good first lap. 

At this point I'm sort of rooting for MS to break some records.


----------



## racerdave (Sep 15, 2003)

Steve... I don't get Autosport... fill us in more on the JPM and Ralf stuff.

: popcorn:


----------



## berford (Sep 10, 2002)

Alex Baumann said:


> It is all about jet-set, boobs and girls... QUOTE]
> 
> And what is wrong with all that? :rofl:


----------



## SteveT (Dec 22, 2001)

racerdave said:



> Steve... I don't get Autosport... fill us in more on the JPM and Ralf stuff.
> 
> : popcorn:


The article is by Jonathan Noble and the title is: "Out-Psyched and Out Gunned". The point is, how Juan has out-psyched Ralf and how Ralf has fallen for Juan's mind games. He also deals with Rubens from the standpoint that both Ralf and Rubens should be doing better than they are. It appears that Michael is being less open with Rubens about car setup, since Rubens did well last year. Juan will taunt Ralf in the garage, even before he gets out of the car, asking him why he's losing so much time in the middle sector. This upsets Ralf, but he hasn't been able to respond to Juan. He could just go faster than Juan and silence him but that hasn't happened. Juan will leave Williams at the end of the season, but he's not leaving any room for Ralf to succeed. The theory is that Ralf does best in a well sorted car. If he has to raise the car's performance he can't and that leaves him floundering. If you look at Ralf's performances at the Nurburgring last year and at Magny Cours, he was exceptional when the FW25 was at it's best. He hasn't, or seems to have been unable to, achieve anything like that this year and that might be due to the pressure Juan has kept on him. Juan currently has a 5-0 advantage over Ralf. It looks like Ralf won't make any inroads on Juan at Monaco either.


----------



## WILLIA///M (Apr 15, 2002)

*Ralf to Announce Joining Toyota Next Week*

Since the topic is Ralf.

link


----------



## berford (Sep 10, 2002)

Topaz330xi said:


> Since the topic is Ralf.
> 
> link


I'm just curious...what's a "public-slagging match"? :rofl:


----------



## The Roadstergal (Sep 7, 2002)

berford said:


> Alex Baumann said:
> 
> 
> > It is all about jet-set, boobs and girls... QUOTE]
> ...


----------



## Pinecone (Apr 3, 2002)

The Roadstergal said:


> It's sexist and offensive? :dunno:
> 
> The whole stick-girl thing in F1 is just crap. I'd enjoy the sport more without it. And people wonder why there are no women in F1.


If there were, they would have stick boys for them.


----------



## berford (Sep 10, 2002)

The Roadstergal said:


> It's sexist and offensive? :dunno:
> 
> The whole stick-girl thing in F1 is just crap. I'd enjoy the sport more without it. And people wonder why there are no women in F1.


I guess I forgot :bigpimp:


----------



## WILLIA///M (Apr 15, 2002)

Ralf got P1 in Q1 with a 1:14.4. Who would have thought that after all the news this weekend? Is there still hope for the good guys? We'll know in about an hour.


----------



## racerdave (Sep 15, 2003)

Remember... Ralf blew an engine yesterday and has to start -10 places from where he qualifies. So he was probably running light to mitigate the starting spot. But... it's only pre-qualifying.


----------



## WILLIA///M (Apr 15, 2002)

Spoonface lays down the marker at 1:14.5. Now things get interesting. RB slots in at 1:14.7. Hmmm. JPM does 1:15.039. Trulli in at 1:13.9. :yikes:


----------



## Rich_Jenkins (Jul 12, 2003)

Topaz330xi said:


> Trulli in at 1:13.9. :yikes:


Holy [email protected]! how did he do that?!?


----------



## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

Oops.

I look forward to this one being explained ... but at least Spoonface won't win!

(Flame Suit on)


-


----------



## Jetfire (Jun 20, 2002)

WOW. WTF just happened to MS?!  This is turning into a depressing race, practically a race of attrition. It's still rather exciting.


----------



## WILLIA///M (Apr 15, 2002)

Patrick 520iAT said:


> Oops.
> 
> I look forward to this one being explained ... but at least Spoonface won't win!
> 
> ...


I don't see how that could be Montoya's fault with Spoonface locking the brakes up in front of him in the tunnel for no reason but I'm sure that's what they'll try and say. :tsk:


----------



## Jetfire (Jun 20, 2002)

Patrick 520iAT said:


> Oops.
> 
> I look forward to this one being explained ... but at least Spoonface won't win!
> 
> ...


 I suppose it's refreshing to see someone else win, but Michael was drivin the p1ss out of his car today and I was really looking forward to a strong finish for him.

With a full lap between JPM and 3rd position, there's no way he'll make the podium unless there's another incident in the front. And at that point, finishing in his qualifying position would have been equivalent to finishing dead last. See, depressing race.


----------



## Clarke (Oct 21, 2002)

So far it looks to me like Michaels suspension failed before the impact.It looks cocked while the wheel is smoking which would also explain the swerve in.Rgal may be a happy camper tonite!


----------



## Jetfire (Jun 20, 2002)

So apparently Montoya apologized to MS for the incident. Quite frankly, I don't see how it's his fault. Even if he was making some kind of car adjustment, the slowdown and brake lockup came out of the blue and I think JPM was just reacting the best way he could. I hope there's some better video of the incident there...


----------



## Clarke (Oct 21, 2002)

That sounds remarkably calm and restrained for JPM.


----------



## Clarke (Oct 21, 2002)

I hope they both have enogh fuel!I'd hate to see it decided by someone rolling to a stop.


----------



## Jetfire (Jun 20, 2002)

OK, I take it back. The last few laps here have redeemed the entire race. This is really exciting!

Of course, RS's retirement is rather sad. Williams had an honest shot at gaining some points over Ferrari until that happened.


----------



## racerdave (Sep 15, 2003)

:thumbup:

:thumbup:

:clap:

:supdude:

:guitar:


----------



## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

Very entertaining!


-


----------



## - Q - (Jun 30, 2003)

Most entertaining race of the season! :thumbup:


----------



## Clarke (Oct 21, 2002)

racerdave said:


> :thumbup:
> 
> :thumbup:
> 
> ...


:stupid: What he said.Great finish!--(Jetfire- Monaco is always about attrition.)


----------



## SteveT (Dec 22, 2001)

Patrick 520iAT said:


> Very entertaining!
> 
> -


Wow, better record that for record! :rofl:

It was good. We'll have to see if any complaining starts. Good drive for Montoya, he was going very fast.

Congratulations to Jarno Trulli.


----------



## Jetfire (Jun 20, 2002)

I think the discussion that will follow this race is going to be very interesting. From what I can tell, there is already a general consensus regarding BAR's poor judgement. More importantly, I want to find out what happened to MS in the tunnel.

Yep, it was a great race. JPM had a great drive, but I think he finished pretty much exactly where he deserved today.


----------



## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

SteveT said:


> Wow, better record that for record! :rofl:


LOL! You got me there! I hope that Baumann doesn't see that post!

:bigpimp:

I cannot wait to hear what Spoonface has to say - same with Alonso for his lackluster attempt to overtake in the tunnel.

Hmm, I might even have to watch the race next weekend!

-


----------



## SteveT (Dec 22, 2001)

Patrick 520iAT said:


> Hmm, I might even have to watch the race next weekend!
> -


Patrick, you're just full of quotes today!

Where IS Alex Baumann?


----------



## WAM (Jan 30, 2002)

Wow, what a race. What an incredible start by Sato! If Kimi hadn't been behind Sato when he blew up, I think he would just have picked a side of the track and gone through without slowing up much, just as he did in Spa in 2002.

Definite bonehead move by Alonso. Ralf would have let him through out of the tunnel so what was he thinking? 

I can't wait to hear M. Scumacher's explanation on what he was doing in the tunnel! IMO Montoya did nothing wrong, it was pretty much a reflex reaction on his part to attemp to go around him. I think the apology is just being politically correct for the inquiry after the race, as Ferrari always seems to get the benefit of the doubt in these kind os instances.

Poor Rubens, another car problem for him on race day.

Great win for Trulli! He really deserved it after a great race.


----------



## WILLIA///M (Apr 15, 2002)

*Ross Brawn Blames Montoya*



Topaz330xi said:


> I don't see how that could be Montoya's fault with Spoonface locking the brakes up in front of him in the tunnel for no reason but I'm sure that's what they'll try and say. :tsk:


Yep, didn't take long.

link


----------



## Clarke (Oct 21, 2002)

Could Brawn be any more F.O.S.?


----------



## SteveT (Dec 22, 2001)

Brawn continues to be the classic blowhard.


----------



## WILLIA///M (Apr 15, 2002)

*Monaco Stewards Clear Montoya*

No blood no foul. link


----------



## SteveT (Dec 22, 2001)

They've also ruled that the Alonso-Ralf incident requires no action. Alonso will not be happy. I have my doubts about Alonso from last year's Brazil incident where he ignored the flags at the end.

From AtlasF1



> No Action Taken on Schumacher-Montoya Incident
> 
> Sunday May 23rd, 2004
> 
> ...


----------



## Alex Baumann (Dec 19, 2001)

Just came back from my business trip to Istanbul. Unfortunately, I couldn't watch the race. The replay is coming in a few hours on TV. 

So, no comments at the moment .... :eeps:


----------



## The Roadstergal (Sep 7, 2002)

SteveT said:


> They've also ruled that the Alonso-Ralf incident requires no action. Alonso will not be happy. I have my doubts about Alonso from last year's Brazil incident where he ignored the flags at the end.
> 
> From AtlasF1


Ha, just what I was thinking. This is what I posted on our local club board:

Alonso has talent, but he still does too many hotheaded things, like when he rammed the tire full-tilt under yellow in Brazil last year or when he tried to lap Ralf in the tunnel. That cost Renault points.

That was a terrific start by Sato. Too bad he couldn't keep going. And it must have been heartbreaking for Kimi to move through the field so well only to have to retire.

Much as I'm annoyed by Montoya's whining this year, I can't blame him for what happened to MS. Going into a dark tunnel out of bright sunlight has got to make you momentarily blind, and then having the guy in front of you slam his brakes... Montoya even cheated right to give MS room to recover. If you're going to penalize Montoya for that, you have to penalize Fisichella for taking out Coulthard...
MS had yet to pit. I think Trulli would have come in first even if MS hadn't kissed the wall; the Renault seemed to be doing better with a full tank than the Ferrari.

All in all, it was the most interesting race of the year to watch thus far.


----------



## Bruce (Dec 24, 2001)

I know it never came to it as Sato blew up...but from one camera angle I swear he jumped the start- or he got very lucky and guessed right.


----------



## Jetfire (Jun 20, 2002)

Bruce said:


> I know it never came to it as Sato blew up...but from one camera angle I swear he jumped the start- or he got very lucky and guessed right.


 That possibility has definitely been suggested, from what I can tell. The stewards being who they are, my guess is that Sato somehow managed to get it "perfect." This was probably entirely by chance. Jumping the start or not, he definitely had some great traction off the line. Too bad his engine wasn't in a cooperative mood.


----------



## The Roadstergal (Sep 7, 2002)

I do think Sato should have left the track before he blew. He had plenty of warning - the car lost tons of power, it started belching blue smoke. He endangered everyone behind him by not pitting.


----------



## AC (Apr 28, 2002)

Alex Baumann said:


> No offense to Monaco fans, but F1 Grand Prix in Monaco sucks big time, IMO. I've never been a fan of that circuit (been there once). It is all about jet-set, boobs and girls and waste of nice champagne, if you ask me.
> 
> Instead of discussing whether the Canadian Grand Prix should be removed from the GP calendar, they should be asking themselves, whether racing in Monaco is making sense anymore or not.


But just when you think it will suck, a race like today's happens! :thumbup:

No Monaco=no F1


----------



## AC (Apr 28, 2002)

Topaz330xi said:


> I don't see how that could be Montoya's fault with Spoonface locking the brakes up in front of him in the tunnel for no reason but I'm sure that's what they'll try and say. :tsk:


Will that be your story if you ever rear end someone? "But.... he was braking!"

I'm not really sure why MS did that in the tunnel, but I'm also not sure why JPM thought he had to be so close considerin he was a lap down.... :dunno:


----------



## WileECoyote (May 7, 2003)

Alex Baumann said:


> Just came back from my business trip to Istanbul. Unfortunately, I couldn't watch the race. The replay is coming in a few hours on TV.
> 
> So, no comments at the moment .... :eeps:


Don't you have VCRs or TiVos over there???? :rofl:

This was an interesting race, to say the least.

Why didn't they show replays from Schumacher's or Montoya's car cams? Were they not "cleared" for broadcast or something???

I can't sakt JPM seriously ever since the "you broke my fscking head" incident

Beyond that, I would have loved to see the perspective from the left mirror, which I think I only saw one in the whole thing, OR a whole lap from one car's perspective..


----------



## Plaz (Dec 19, 2001)

WileECoyote said:


> OR a whole lap from one car's perspective..


 I have a feeling they couldn't get uplinks from the cars between the Grand Hotel hairpin and somewhere between the tunnel exit and the Nouvelle chicane.


----------



## The Roadstergal (Sep 7, 2002)

AC said:


> Will that be your story if you ever rear end someone? "But.... he was braking!"


"And he didn't have brake lights!" :neener:


----------



## WILLIA///M (Apr 15, 2002)

AC said:


> Will that be your story if you ever rear end someone? "But.... he was braking!"
> 
> I'm not really sure why MS did that in the tunnel, but I'm also not sure why JPM thought he had to be so close considerin he was a lap down.... :dunno:


He was doing it warm the brakes up before restart, which is a legitimate thing to do. He just f***ed up while doing it a bit offline and locked them up. Montoya went right and hugged the wall to avoid him but Spoonface veered right also and ..oops. Montoya not braking hard also was the right decision I think so as to not have a pile up behind him in the tunnel. That's just MHO though. I'm not biased at all. :angel:


----------



## berford (Sep 10, 2002)

Topaz330xi said:


> He was doing it warm the brakes up before restart, which is a legitimate thing to do. ... :angel:


It may be legitimate, but one should use a little common sense about where you're going to do it and what the traffic is like behind you. In the tunnel with a car right behind you is just plain dumb, if not sanctionable (of course that would never happen to MS).


----------



## DannO (Apr 25, 2002)

two words: BRAKE CHECK

Best race in a long time. Viva Monaco!


----------



## racerdave (Sep 15, 2003)

And about all MS can come up with for answers is "yeah, but..." 

All of that just validates the "no foul" decision by the stewards. Dumb on both accounts.


----------



## Alex Baumann (Dec 19, 2001)

Why do I have the feeling that you guys are putting the blame on MS ? I have watched the race last night. All I can say that is it was very dumb of JPM. Just plain simple, dumb.



> but one should use a little common sense about where you're going to do it and what the traffic is like behind you


You are the race leader behind the Safety car and the dude behind you is one lap behind. Which common sense applies here ? :dunno:

MS did brake checks many times before the tunnel. It is JPM's responsibility to check the distance to the front. Not that he's going to make flying start or needs to catch MS after the lights goes off or so. rolleyes:


----------



## berford (Sep 10, 2002)

racerdave said:


> And about all MS can come up with for answers is "yeah, but..."
> 
> All of that just validates the "no foul" decision by the stewards. Dumb on both accounts.


What do you mean by "both"?


----------



## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

berford said:


> What do you mean by "both"?


Alonso's **** up in the tunnel.

-


----------



## Motown328 (Jun 4, 2003)

The Roadstergal said:


> Was it Hobbs who said it? "Had to give up cigarettes, can't keep his girlfriends straight..."


That was about the Tech Director of Renault, can't remember his name.

Bruni's GF was his stick-girl for Melbourne.


----------



## The Roadstergal (Sep 7, 2002)

Motown328 said:


> That was about the Tech Director of Renault, can't remember his name.
> 
> Bruni's GF was his stick-girl for Melbourne.


I can't keep those older guys with way younger model girlfriends straight.


----------



## Motown328 (Jun 4, 2003)

The Roadstergal said:


> I can't keep those older guys with way younger model girlfriends straight.


Yeah, I thought that was why guys go into F1 in the first place, it's a sure way to score. Is there not a time and place where there are no hordes of girls lining up to get a piece of 'an F1 driver'???!?!

Pound-for-pound, they have to be the most lusted after males on the planet. Maybe it's the danger quotient that makes the girls lust after them?!?! :dunno:


----------



## racerdave (Sep 15, 2003)

Motown328 said:


> KUDOS TO YOU racerdave!!! You got it spot on!!! :thumbup:


Every once in a while, a blind squirrel can find a nut.


----------



## The Roadstergal (Sep 7, 2002)

Motown328 said:


> Pound-for-pound, they have to be the most lusted after males on the planet. Maybe it's the danger quotient that makes the girls lust after them?!?! :dunno:


In many cases, it's because they're hot.

That does not apply to the non-drivers we were talking about, though. In their case, I can't imagine money is not a factor.


----------



## Motown328 (Jun 4, 2003)

The HACK said:


> Briatore?


Yes, yes, Flavio!

I think visions of his smoky gray mop has clouded my memory...hahahaha...

Looks like a lovable guy...


----------



## racerdave (Sep 15, 2003)

Yeah, Flav knocked-up Heidi Klum, dumped her and picked up a newer, younger model.

Class act, that Flav.


----------



## SteveT (Dec 22, 2001)

We've seen Michael do the brake bias thing before to warm his tires. I've never seen anyone else do that before. Have any of you guys seen that lock up the wheels routine to warm the tires from others? The burnout sure, but lock them up and then do the burnout? Juan has commented that he knew what Michael was doing. They've all said it was pretty slippery in the tunnel at low speed without downforce. Juan was no doubt trying to stay close. A few years ago Michael had Jenson off avoiding him at Monza with a similar maneuver. If Juan was stupid Michael was at least as stupid for doing it in the tunnel.


----------



## Motown328 (Jun 4, 2003)

racerdave said:


> Yeah, Flav knocked-up Heidi Klum, dumped her and picked up a newer, younger model.
> 
> Class act, that Flav.


ARe you serious?!?! I didn't here about that?!!! How on earth did he get her?!?!?! WOWOWOW!!! F1 is a serious love potion...hahaha... :yikes: :eeps:


----------



## WileECoyote (May 7, 2003)

SteveT said:


> Juan was no doubt trying to stay close. A few years ago Michael had Jenson off avoiding him at Monza with a similar maneuver. If Juan was stupid Michael was at least as stupid for doing it in the tunnel.


I'd have to agree - also, consider that the tunnel had no sunlight, and therefore was a colder portion of the track than anywhere else.

I have a feeling this was a case where each of them did something boneheaded and predicted that the other driver would be able to handle what they were doing. Apparently both were wrong.
:dunno:


----------



## berford (Sep 10, 2002)

WileECoyote said:


> I'd have to agree - also, consider that the tunnel had no sunlight, and therefore was a colder portion of the track than anywhere else.
> 
> I have a feeling this was a case where each of them did something boneheaded and predicted that the other driver would be able to handle what they were doing. Apparently both were wrong.
> :dunno:


I still can't stomach any driver locking their brakes intentionally when they know another car is close behind them. And then taking the position that he shouldn't have been so close because he had been lapped and was out of the running is equally ludicrous. It's not as if Montoya isn't competitive at Monte Carlo. Sheeeeeeeeesh. The F-team will say and do anything to justify bad driving. They're a real "sour-grapes" lot, IMO.


----------



## Alex Baumann (Dec 19, 2001)

berford said:


> I still can't stomach any driver locking their brakes intentionally when they know another car is close behind them. And then taking the position that he shouldn't have been so close because he had been lapped and was out of the running is equally ludicrous. It's not as if Montoya isn't competitive at Monte Carlo. Sheeeeeeeeesh. The F-team will say and do anything to justify bad driving. They're a real "sour-grapes" lot, IMO.


Berford, you sound as if you have watched an F1 race for the first time in your life. Every driver does braking and accelarating during the Safety Car phase. It's a common practice.

Justifying bad driving ? Michael was the fastest driver on the circuit on Sunday.

People should stop whining how 'bad' Ferrari and its drivers are. They better concentrate on building faster cars. Look, even Renault is playing cat and mouse with BMW and Mclaren.


----------



## berford (Sep 10, 2002)

Alex Baumann said:


> Berford, you sound as if you have watched an F1 race for the first time in your life. Every driver does braking and accelarating during the Safety Car phase. It's a common practice.
> 
> Justifying bad driving ? Michael was the fastest driver on the circuit on Sunday.
> 
> People should stop whining how 'bad' Ferrari and its drivers are. They better concentrate on building faster cars. Look, even Renault is playing cat and mouse with BMW and Mclaren.


For the first time? Not by a long shot--for 30 years and counting, whenever I have the opportunity. "Braking and accelerating," yes. But at appropriate times and under appropriate conditions. Not at that time or under those conditions. MS thinks he can do whatever he wants and get by with it--and he does.

"Michael was the fastest driver on the circuit on Sunday." Whatever.

Seems to me that the Ferrari team was doing the whining Sunday.


----------



## PhilH (Jun 7, 2002)

Motown328 said:


> ARe you serious?!?! I didn't here about that?!!! How on earth did he get her?!?!?! WOWOWOW!!! F1 is a serious love potion...hahaha... :yikes: :eeps:


Yeah, this was the press release back when they announced she was pregnant.
http://www.ananova.com/entertainment/story/sm_847699.html


> *Supermodel and Formula One boss expecting baby*
> Supermodel Heidi Klum is expecting a baby with Formula One boss Flavio Briatore.
> 
> German-born Klum, 30, and 53-year-old Briatore have been dating for the past year.
> ...


----------



## Alex Baumann (Dec 19, 2001)

berford said:


> For the first time? Not by a long shot--for 30 years and counting, whenever I have the opportunity. "Braking and accelerating," yes. But at appropriate times and under appropriate conditions. Not at that time or under those conditions. MS thinks he can do whatever he wants and get by with it--and he does.
> 
> "Michael was the fastest driver on the circuit on Sunday." Whatever.
> 
> Seems to me that the Ferrari team was doing the whining Sunday.


Appropriate time, appropriate conditions ? :rofl: Do you think he should have waved at Montoya and signaled him that he's going to make a brake check ? Maybe they should install brake lights and signals on Ferraris for the rest of the season.

He was 5 car lengths behind the Safety car and following its speed. It is all conform, to the letter as it's written in the rulebook. Montoya was the one to follow him in safe distance, which he didn't do unfortunately.



> MS thinks he can do whatever he wants and get by with it--and he does.


He does ? Did he ? Remember, he was shooted out of the race by Montoya, not the other way around. Montoya was told on the radio to pass Michael, if he had the chance (you can find the details about this on various channels), because it was a shame for BMW to be overlapped by Ferrari, especially on a circuit like Monaco. So, that is the reason why he was following Michael five inches behind his exhaust.

It must suck to be Montoya this year.



> Seems to me that the Ferrari team was doing the whining Sunday.


Of course they were whining. Their best driver and championship candidate were torpedoed by another driver, who was playing virtually no role in the race.


----------



## berford (Sep 10, 2002)

Alex Baumann said:


> Appropriate time, appropriate conditions ? :rofl: Do you think he should have waved at Montoya and signaled him that he's going to make a brake check ? Maybe they should install brake lights and signals on Ferraris for the rest of the season.
> 
> He was 5 car lengths behind the Safety car and following its speed. It is all conform, to the letter as it's written in the rulebook. Montoya was the one to follow him in safe distance, which he didn't do unfortunately.
> 
> ...


There weren't any sanctions, were there?


----------



## berford (Sep 10, 2002)

PhilH said:


> Yeah, this was the press release back when they announced she was pregnant.
> http://www.ananova.com/entertainment/story/sm_847699.html


Other SOs here: http://www.f1-legend.com/quiz/2003quizzz04_res.htm

Nice array.


----------



## Alex Baumann (Dec 19, 2001)

berford said:


> There weren't any sanctions, were there?


No, there weren't. I am not demanding anyone to be punished for the incident either. I am just trying to say that Montoya should have paid more attention to what was going on in front of him.


----------



## racerdave (Sep 15, 2003)

As I said before, a double-dose of poor judgement. And therefore a racing incident... which, ironically, occured under a safety car period.


----------



## berford (Sep 10, 2002)

Alex Baumann said:


> No, there weren't. I am not demanding anyone to be punished for the incident either. I am just trying to say that Montoya should have paid more attention to what was going on in front of him.


And I'm just saying that Michael should have paid more attention to what was going on behind him. There was plenty of time to "warm up" before the SC was to pull off.


----------



## Alex Baumann (Dec 19, 2001)

berford said:


> And I'm just saying that Michael should have paid more attention to what was going on behind him. There was plenty of time to "warm up" before the SC was to pull off.


Why should he ? He was the race leader at the moment and behind the SC. As I have pasted the reglement above, he had to keep 5 car lengths distance behind the Safety Car. His duty was not to check what is going on behind, because during a Safety Car period it is obvious that noone is going to try to pass you or you don't need to defend your position.


----------



## Jetfire (Jun 20, 2002)

Alex Baumann said:


> Why should he ? He was the race leader at the moment and behind the SC. As I have pasted the reglement above, he had to keep 5 car lengths distance behind the Safety Car. His duty was not to check what is going on behind, because during a Safety Car period it is obvious that noone is going to try to pass you or you don't need to defend your position.


 If someone is running five feet behind you on the highway, and there is nothing extraordinary going on, is it "not a problem" if you slam on the brakes and cause an accident?

You're right, MS does not have to prevent anyone from passing him if the safety car is out. And, as the lead car behind the SC, he is able to sort of set the pace for everyone behind him. However, drivers should always be aware of the cars around them. JPM wasn't trying to pass MS but he was close behind. How is that unacceptable, even if he was not on the lead lap?

Maybe JPM should have kept his distance. Maybe MS should have checked his mirrors before locking up the brakes. Maybe either of them should have qualified higher and avoided putting themselves into this mess 56 laps into the race. Nobody here did anything explicitly wrong, and in this particular case, people can't point fingers at either party without seeing that the other side has an equally valid argument.


----------



## Alex Baumann (Dec 19, 2001)

Jetfire said:


> If someone is running five feet behind you on the highway, and there is nothing extraordinary going on, is it "not a problem" if you slam on the brakes and cause an accident?


But we are talking about a Safety Car period in an F1 race here. Every, I mean every, driver knows that they do weird manouvers to keep the tires and the brake temperatures warm.


----------



## Jetfire (Jun 20, 2002)

Alex Baumann said:


> But we are talking about a Safety Car period in an F1 race here. Every, I mean every, driver knows that they do weird manouvers to keep the tires and the brake temperatures warm.


 Yes, most drivers will keep their tires warm one way or another. It happens almost excessively during the first parade lap, for example. But I also know that drivers tend to stick close together when the yellow flag or the safety car comes out. It's a strategic move that gives drivers the possibility of passing someone once the SC exits the course. I don't think MS would give anyone more than a few inches of room if he were stuck behind someone, and there's nothing wrong with that IMO. The highway analogy was not very strong, but my point was that neither driver should be given sole responsibility for what happened. They both took risks, and this time they were both wrong and MS got stuck with the bad luck. Considering his amazing string of successes, I think this one event is pretty acceptable. It's too bad, though, that he didn't get the chance to win six straight.


----------



## Alex Baumann (Dec 19, 2001)

Yes, s-hit happens and happened too.

Anyway, I'm done with this thread.

See ya on Sunday.


----------



## Motown328 (Jun 4, 2003)

berford said:


> Other SOs here: http://www.f1-legend.com/quiz/2003quizzz04_res.htm
> 
> Nice array.


Thanks for the link! :thumbup: Good stuff.

Who was it that they showed the other day...Trulli's current girlfriend?? HOLY SMOKES!!!!! :yikes: A barn-burner for sure!!!


----------



## berford (Sep 10, 2002)

Motown328 said:


> Thanks for the link! :thumbup: Good stuff.
> 
> Who was it that they showed the other day...Trulli's current girlfriend?? HOLY SMOKES!!!!! :yikes: A barn-burner for sure!!!


Ain't F1 exciting.  :clap: :yumyum:


----------



## Jetfire (Jun 20, 2002)

Alex Baumann said:


> Yes, s-hit happens and happened too.
> 
> Anyway, I'm done with this thread.
> 
> See ya on Sunday.


 I'll be on a plane  to Nassau.  I hope the hotel has some kind of decent news coverage, or at least USA Today or something.


----------



## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

Jetfire said:


> I'll be on a plane  to Nassau.  I hope the hotel has some kind of decent news coverage, or at least USA Today or something.


I have to (unfortunately) retract my previous statement; I will NOT be watching the race this weekend - or anything else on TV.

My silly Austrian friends arrive Friday evening (SERVUS!) ... and I have no idea when the weekend will actually end. 

*Help!*

:bigpimp:

-


----------



## The Roadstergal (Sep 7, 2002)

berford said:


> Other SOs here: http://www.f1-legend.com/quiz/2003quizzz04_res.htm
> 
> Nice array.


Let's be fair, here.

http://www.girlsf1.com/driverstart.htm


----------



## Melissa (Aug 9, 2002)

The Roadstergal said:


> Let's be fair, here.
> 
> http://www.girlsf1.com/driverstart.htm


Thank you, Rgal, this site made my week!! :banana:


----------



## The Roadstergal (Sep 7, 2002)

Awwwww....

<img src=http://www.girlsf1.com/jpm/juanconnie.jpg>

I didn't know he _could_ smile.

I think we need to have this split into an "F1 hot photos" thread.


----------



## The Roadstergal (Sep 7, 2002)

"Nope. No phallic symbols here. Move along, folks."

<img src=http://www.girlsf1.com/op/olivecar.jpg>


----------



## Jetfire (Jun 20, 2002)

Is it just me, or has JPM gained some weight recently?


----------



## The Roadstergal (Sep 7, 2002)

He defintely had more chin at the 3rd place press conference than he had in that pic.


----------



## berford (Sep 10, 2002)

Mr. Know-It-All said:


> Man you've got to put *NWS* on that! I almost got caught having a "wood" moment at work.


JEEEEEEEZ. It wasn't THAT bad.


----------



## berford (Sep 10, 2002)

The Roadstergal said:


> Let's be fair, here.
> 
> http://www.girlsf1.com/driverstart.htm


Fair enough.


----------

