# If your car is a lemon who do you sue? Dealer or BMW NA?



## Nichepi (Jun 10, 2011)

*Has anyone sued or began the process to sue BMW NA over a defective & lemon vehicle?*

I currently have a 550I with the M package I spent a substantial amount of money on that has turned out to be a lemon, been in and out of the shop for 6 months with no fix and the vehicle has displayed dangerous activities such as lounging at cars in front of me while at a stop. Violent shaking and sudden loss of power with the engine malfunction lights coming on all the time. And of course recent random calling by the Bluetooth phone system.

I'm looking to hear or receive feedback from anyone who has attempted to sue BMW or what type of feedback was received after sending a demand letter? They offered to take back the car but are offering a low amount of money as compensation to the large sum of money I spent on the car as compensation. IE they want to accept the vehicle back but are only providing $10,000 in compensation.

And of course they want me to sign a NDA identifying that I can't tell anyone about the extensive array of problems the vehicle as presented.


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## drive by72 (Nov 9, 2010)

Have you contacted BMWNA HQ? I think you should talk to someone high up in power before you just sue. Let them know about all your issues and offer to fax over service records if necessary. Trying to achieve cooperation will go further than going into this bullheaded. How has the dealer dealt with this so far?


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## krsabs (Apr 22, 2011)

Tell BMW that they either come up with a realistic offer, or you'll register an on-line complaint with go to NHTSA's Office of Defects Investigation - https://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/

if you file, they will be require to respond to NHTSA. Be sure to tell NHTSA that you wish your complaint to be public, and pepper the text boxes with e address and phone numbers so if someone is looking, they'll be able to make contact.


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## Nichepi (Jun 10, 2011)

I've actually been chiming in on someone else's thread. But yes. I've been in contact with 5 of the senior exec management over at BMW NA. I also work in DOT HQ in DC so I did go over to the 3rd floor and file a compliant. So far they have offered to take teh car back and 10K, that was only after i asked for them to take the vehicle back and pay 20K.
'[email protected]'; '[email protected]'; '[email protected]'; '[email protected]'; '[email protected]'; '[email protected]'

Seema is the executive office spokes person who useless and pretty much just relays information. She in no way can negotiate and more times than often has no idea about the problems with the vehicle. Mike Winter is the service manager to BMW alexandria. The others are BMW NA execs.

I had a direct call from Charlie Silva whom works for Jim O'Donnell and they pretty much said that was all they were doing. based on the facts. They were offering additionally $1500.00 as "customer loyalty" to go get another BMW.
I said ford offers me $3K and their stuff doesn't break.


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## nealh (Oct 4, 2003)

if you dont mind me asking what have you spent on the car? The loan costs? just curious is this a 2010 model? I think they should swap you up to a new 550i at same monthly payments. would you still be out money if they did this?


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## Nichepi (Jun 10, 2011)

The car was $75K. 
I had lost literally 5 business days worth of hours in constantly dealing with the vehcile breaking down or acting erractically.
Car had been in and out of the shop since january 2011. The've repalced most of the wiring and parts of the throtle body twice.

I told them the only way I was sticking with a BMW is if they gave me a new 535xi at cost with the $10K.

I'm moving to an audi next.


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## nealh (Oct 4, 2003)

Nichepi said:


> The car was $75K.
> I had lost literally 5 business days worth of hours in constantly dealing with the vehcile breaking down or acting erractically.
> Car had been in and out of the shop since january 2011. The've repalced most of the wiring and parts of the throtle body twice.
> 
> ...


seems fair to me.

I loved my Audi A4 1996 but I had huge AC issues, I spent a fortune on it. Audi did nothing to help me. Since that time, I have had 2 BMWs, getting my third.

I would buy an Audi again but the design and front grill are a turn off.

I cant say Audi service with my issues


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## Nichepi (Jun 10, 2011)

I've drafted my civil suit but I'm not sure where to file. Vehicle was purchased in Alexandria Va but of course BMW NA is in NJ?


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## Ace88 (Mar 23, 2006)

Well...Its a long road and you unfortunately will have to take many steps giving BMW the chance to repair the vehicle before the suit can be filed. Depending on your state laws the options for BMW vary. You might very well be better off trying to work something out with BMW NA directly rather than diving right in.

Good luck


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## Nichepi (Jun 10, 2011)

I had another thread going.
The car is new.. a 09 under 30K miles. It has a documented history of being in the shop at least more than 50 days since December of 2010.
I've been in constant contact with the Executive office at BMW NA and I'm not content with the terms given the price of the vehicle, length of trouble and lack of customer service.
Everything out of them comes across as a threat and the NDA is not logical. Or at least its logical to the company if you call suing your own customers for talking about how dangerous one car can be.

More or less I just need to know where to send the papers, and not as much debate way. I think I've gone through the paces already. I gave them all kinds of options and there just been cheap and ridicules.

It can***8217;t be filed under the BBB lemon law since the vehicle was purchased in my company name making it not eligible.

But the vehicle displays dangerous activity and is not safe to drive. I***8217;ve had the NJ engineers out 5 times. The dealership says the test and drive it yet the problem persist. So again I***8217;ve done my due diligence for more than 6 months and it***8217;s time to sue.

Most companies just do not take you seriously unless you drop some papers on their desk. I***8217;m sure after a round of discovery they might be more open.


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## 1Dreamer (Oct 23, 2004)

Nichepi said:


> I had another thread going.


I merged them. If you want to get more feedback in a thread, you can try bumping it up to the top if you want, but please don't cross-post and try to post in the right forum. Thanks much.


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## Nichepi (Jun 10, 2011)

Thank you.


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## brkf (May 26, 2003)

Almost lemoned my 07 335i. It was in the shop constantly. Told bmw they needed to buy it back and they did. Shrug. Pretty easy. Not sure what advice to give. I did not ask for cash or another car...i just wanted it gone. 

Fwiw, we have an audi too. In my experience Audi warranties suck, dealers deny everything and the overall build quality is low but repairs expensive. You could experience something else. I will buy a bmw again but do not expect to go near audi (sadly my wife loves her audi).


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## Nichepi (Jun 10, 2011)

I would agree with your audit statements though I will personally say since I know several people whom do car reviews back in detroit teh audi brand and quality has drasticallt steeped u their game since the pre 2000's. We looked back at the audis before the 550i and i couldn't stand the plastic inside.
I'm sure things would have been streame lined if the vehicle was not registered to my compnay has opposed to an individual.

Though again I have to assume their is one person on this board that has at least attempted to sue BMW NA over the vehicle and knows where to send the lawsuit too?? I should I just send it to the dealer I bought it at? Thats the only advise I'm looking for really. I'm more of a actions then talk type person.

Having owned a perfomrance parts business I got quite use to suing vendors for providing bad product or just taking the money and running.


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## jw (Dec 21, 2001)

I had a lemon once. It was a Cadillac. After the 4th time it was in the shop for a problem (screwed up radio/GPS) I told them I'm turning it in as a lemon. They offered me a new car on the spot in the existing lease contract. Best part was I was 12k miles into with my first car and the mileage on the lease contract reset to 6 miles (which was what was on the new Caddy).


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## Nichepi (Jun 10, 2011)

Well I just took it in for the 7rth time yesterday since december. It averages 1-2 weeks per month since december. The people at the enterprise treat me better then the bmw dealer at this point.
And in fact they are a great source of information. Most likely the local car rental place knows more about upset BMW customers whom have long term issues then anyone else just ebcause thats where everyone gets sent each time the car is back into the shop.

While just par for the course the dealer did completely dent in a rim and took a chunk off the side wall.









Notice the complete lack of effort in cleaning the wheel.


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## Nichepi (Jun 10, 2011)

This is BMW's "standard release".
Since I haven't signed it I can still talk about it.
It does come across as a negative type of document identifying bmw's efforts to keep customers quite about extensive vehicle issues while dangling the prospects of monetary compensation over someone***8217;s head. Meaning if you have a lemon, and you can***8217;t drive your car because of said issue, and want to get rid of it you have to sign this document in their time frame or they will "close the issue" essentially forcing people who's backs may be up against a wall financially into quickly entering into an agreement to get rid of THEIR defective vehicle. If you***8217;re a person paying $1000.00 a month for your car it may appear to be a good deal.


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## brkf (May 26, 2003)

Nichepi said:


> I would agree with your audit statements though I will personally say since I know several people whom do car reviews back in detroit teh audi brand and quality has drasticallt steeped u their game since the pre 2000's. We looked back at the audis before the 550i and i couldn't stand the plastic inside.
> I'm sure things would have been streame lined if the vehicle was not registered to my compnay has opposed to an individual.


We have a 2006. Audi quality, warranty, dealers, repairs are all, in my experience horrendous. There is no comparison in San Diego. BMW dealers treated me great; our audi dealer (the only one in San Diego) is just ghetto.


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## Nichepi (Jun 10, 2011)

The audi of Tysons and the Audi of Chantilly VA are pretty nice. Of course yes the BMW's are nice as well.


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## sno_duc (Sep 3, 2008)

blueguydotcom said:


> We have a 2006. Audi quality, warranty, dealers, repairs are all, in my experience horrendous. There is no comparison in San Diego. BMW dealers treated me great; our audi dealer (the only one in San Diego) is just ghetto.


Before switching to BMW, we had owned Audi's back to the mid 80's (4 in a row).
Your observation about Audi's service??? dept, matches ours. Twenty years ago they bent over backwards to give you great service, now they just bend you over. 
Which is why we both drive BMWs.


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