# Is300



## rennfahrer (Feb 13, 2004)

Anybody here test drove the 05 altezza?
I did today, a manual 5 spd.
I tested an auto about two years ago, and I could definitely feel the improvements that they've made over the years.
The steering feels a bit tighter, chassis is stiffer too.
I can't say much about the horsepower. It's rated at 215, but my E46 325 felt a lot quicker.
But for the money, I don't think I can argue. Priced at about $31k-32k (carsdirect.com) already with the Navi, I think it's a steal.
Too bad they don't have free maintenance as BMW.
What impresses me the most was the dealership itself. I went to the one on Peck Rd in Covina, CA. I accidentally went underneath the building where they parked all of their cars. It was damn impressive. Wish I could have a garage that size, filled with assortments of cars.:thumbup: 

Another car that I tried today was the MazdaSpeed MX5. Fun little car! 
Too bad it's still a bit underpowered even with the turbocharger boosted at 7.5 (or 8.3?) psi. The suspension felt a bit rough, but expected for that kinda car. Handling was superb! 
Noise level was almost unbearable, but I think I could get used to it after a couple of weeks.
What I like the most was the pedal placements. The gas sits at the right place when you're braking.:thumbup: 
I would still say it's a bit expensive for a $24k-25k car (carsdirect.com)

Also tried the RX8 manual.
I don't know what all the rants and raves were about this car. I didn't find anything appealing as far as performance goes. It's noisy, underpowered, and doesn't handle very well. Suspension was not as tight as I expected from a sports car.

But, the worst part of all was the dealership that I went to. It was the one on Main st in Alhambra, CA. I just happened to got the worst sales person one could possibly dreamed of.
He just worked there for 4 days, and he used to work for Girls Gone Wild before.:dunno: 
He didn't know squat about cars, and he kept insisting that the RX8 is the best car out there, period.
But when I asked him how big is the engine, he said 3.0L:rofl: 

Then I went to the S2K dealership afew blocks down.
The car was just amazing.:thumbup: 
The price maybe too high for such a small car, but the fun factor was an 11 out of 10.

Then on to the 350Z. It was good, chassis was stiff, just enough power, but there was no steering feel. The steering was heavy, but dampened. Interior quality was bad as well. I personally don't think it's worth the money.

So tomorrow, I'm off to test the G35 coupe and maybe the 6spd TL. I've been told that the 6spd TL has the least torque steer and behaves more like a RWD.

If anybody has any inputs, please do tell. I'm in the market to purchase a car to replace my OBDI E36 M3 (RIP). 

I am not an expert, so please don't reply me with sarcastic or negative remarks. I'm just telling it as it is.


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## mwette (Sep 16, 2002)

I heard Honda was going to come out with a couple named the S2200. Have you heard anything about this?


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## markseven (Apr 30, 2004)

rennfahrer said:


> I can't say much about the horsepower. It's rated at 215, but my E46 325 felt a lot quicker.


I read somewhere (C&D probably) that to renew interest, the IS300 was going to get a V8 (the 4.7? - I don't know) towards the end of it's life cycle. That would be pretty dope.



mwette said:


> I heard Honda was going to come out with a couple named the S2200. Have you heard anything about this?


The current S2000 has the 2.2 liter engine - same name, no S2200.

-Mark


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## GregD (Feb 5, 2003)

rennfahrer said:


> If anybody has any inputs, please do tell. I'm in the market to purchase a car to replace my OBDI E36 M3 (RIP).


Since you seem to have liked your E36 M3, why not a 330 with the performance package? Seems like the obvious replacement. :dunno:


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## rennfahrer (Feb 13, 2004)

*2 more cars.*

thanks for the non-negative remarks guys, really appreciate it.

it's nice to see that this forum stays as it is, and not turn into another roadfly

i tested the g35 coupe today
first dealership that i went to was the metro infi at monrivia, CA.
the salesman was a complete jerk
he said that the management does not like to add miles to any of the cars.
everybody that wants the car should pretty much know the car already (how the hell should people know about the car, unless they've owned one and wrecked it, and wanted to get another one )
even after i told him that the main reason i was there was to compare the drivability and feel of the car against different cars, he still treated me like an ass.
so i said, fine, if that's how he's gonna do it.
went to the cerritos infi in cerritos, CA. awesome people.
treated me like gold.
although i was kinda stood up. 
called earlier and said she's gonna wait for me. went there and couldn't find her. got a different salesman instead. he was nice and accomodating. so he said he'd go and find a 6spd g35 coupe. 15 mnt went by and he didn't come back. called him, he said he's going to get gas. another 5 mnt and he hadn't returned.
but another sales was happy to chat with me while i waited.
so i left to go to the acura and said i'll be back.
when i got back, that stupid sales had gone home, never returned from getting that "gas".:tsk: 
but i still got the test drive.
it was just "fine" i guess.
i couldn't fine a good seating position. transmission was a bit rough, similar to the 350z. clutch was a bowflex machine. 
car felt like a pig, too heavy.
body roll was little more than minimal
not as sporty as i expected.
but the power felt more like a 330 though.
and i also liked the interior design, not the quality.

then on the TL.
it was an amazing car. loved the tranny and clutch. i've always loved the honda clutch and shifter.
steering was heavy but a bit dampened. body roll was minimal.
i didn't really get the chance to test the car's capability since i had an ignorant sales who didn't even speak a word and looked at me like a piece of siht lying on the side of the road. 
so we basically drew a small rectangle on the map of cerritos(one block test drive):thumbdwn: 
didn't even have the chance to test the "reduced" FWD effect that people has been saying on that car (least torque steer and understeer).

on the 330 zhp by greg:
"Since you seem to have liked your E36 M3, why not a 330 with the performance package? Seems like the obvious replacement. :dunno:"
well, if it's not for the price, i'd jump on it. 
another thing is, it's heavy.

so here's my own list of cars i'd love to have to replace my M3
1. S2K(awesome handling and looks, but too small and impractical)
2. 330ZHP(great handling and usability around town, too heavy and expensive)
3. IS300 or MazdaSpeed MX5.(MX5 too small but fun, IS300 ugly but worth every penny)
4. TL(good looks and comfortable drive, but FWD)
5. G35(not worth the money)
6. 350Z(useless)
any more tips guys, or anything that i'm forgetting? or where else can i get info on these car, forums, etc? what problems do each car has? resale value?
i know that the top three on my list is going to be discontinued within another year.
thanks a bunch for the help guys.
D2


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## TeamM3 (Dec 24, 2002)

therer's only one person here acting like they're on Roadfly :tsk: (and it's not me :angel: )


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## rennfahrer (Feb 13, 2004)

tsk tsk tsk :tsk: 

just say it


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## Desertnate (Mar 11, 2002)

Rennfahrer, how did you like the interior of the IS300? I have always rather liked the external apperence of the car, but that dash that looks like somebody's watch exploded is just a big :thumbdwn: for me.


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## GregD (Feb 5, 2003)

rennfahrer said:


> 1. S2K(awesome handling and looks, but too small and impractical)
> 2. 330ZHP(great handling and usability around town, too heavy and expensive)
> 3. IS300 or MazdaSpeed MX5.(MX5 too small but fun, IS300 ugly but worth every penny)
> 4. TL(good looks and comfortable drive, but FWD)
> ...


A Porsche Boxster is a lot of fun to drive and one of the most practical two seaters out there. Although if a 330 is expensive a Boxster is even more so, and you'd probably be looking at the used market.

A couple more thoughts on a ZHP. It's only about 200 pounds more than an E36 M3, and with the $3,000 manufacturer to dealer incentive this month on 2004s, you should be ale to get a very good deal on one right now. 

I have a friend who has a 97 M3/4, and we compared his car to mine, back to back. You do feel the additional weight of the ZHP, the M3 feels more nimble, but we both thought the steering feel was actually a little better on the ZHP. Overall handling was very close, tough to choose between the two. His M3 has Konis, the front lower crossbrace and a strut brace, mine has the M3 strut brace as its only mod.

We both thought the brakes had a little nicer feel on the ZHP, but it's close. The tranny and shifter are almost identical in the two cars with a slightly shorter shift throw in his car, but that's because he spent a large chunk of change to put a 6 speed in his M3 with a short shifter. 

Enginewise, the M3 definitely had more low end grunt, but the ZHP had more urge over 6000 RPM, so the M3 launches a little better, but once they're both rolling, there was very little difference. The engine in the ZHP was a little quieter and noticeably smoother than the M3s.

Inside the cars, the ZHP was much quieter, and maybe a little smoother riding. To me, the M3s interior is looking dated, but my friend likes it better than my ZHP so it's a personal preference thing. The seats in both cars are excellent, although we both agreed that the cloth and alcantara did a better job of holding us in place than the leather in the M3.

About the exterior, well that's a matter of personal preference, but personally I think both cars look great. :thumbup:


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## GregD (Feb 5, 2003)

rennfahrer said:


> 1. S2K(awesome handling and looks, but too small and impractical)
> 2. 330ZHP(great handling and usability around town, too heavy and expensive)
> 3. IS300 or MazdaSpeed MX5.(MX5 too small but fun, IS300 ugly but worth every penny)
> 4. TL(good looks and comfortable drive, but FWD)
> ...


A couple more thoughts. Before I bought my ZHP, I drove all of the cars you listed above except the TL, plus an A4, a Jag X-Type, and a Mustang Cobra. My thoughts on those 3.
- The A4 was heavy, but surprisingly nimble, a little sluggish off the line, and funky brake feeling, but it had a very nice interior and a fairly roomy back seat.
- The X-Type was heavy, plowed like a farm implement, and felt slow. I liked the exterior styling, but that was about it.
- The Cobra is unrefined, coarse, and rattly compared to most of the above, but it'll smoke all of the above in a straight line, the handling is surprisingly good although the tires didn't impress me, and the brakes work and feel great. Also, the back seat isn't the best place for adults, but it is usable for short distances.

I agree with most of your comments on the cars you drove. The IS300 was probably my second choice but the back seats were a little small for my son, and the car looked too ricey for my taste. Plus the warranty with full maintenance was a nice perk with the BMW; that, along with Euro Delivery clinched the deal.


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## brkf (May 26, 2003)

rennfahrer said:


> Anybody here test drove the 05 altezza?
> I did today, a manual 5 spd.
> I tested an auto about two years ago, and I could definitely feel the improvements that they've made over the years.
> The steering feels a bit tighter, chassis is stiffer too.
> ...


Wait for the MazdaSpeed6.

270+ HP and AWD for 30k. Great Mazda handling, finally got the power the car needed.


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## AF (Dec 21, 2001)

I Always loved the *IS300* but the redesign is right around the corner so keep that in mind. I was never a big fan of the interior of that car and I felt like the seats needed more comfort. They felt very thinnly padded ... kind of a shame because Lexus is so good at making an interior sweet it's a shame they didn't lexus-ize this one.

I came very close to getting one back when I had originally ordered my first 330 and beleive me it was tough to spend the extra dough on the bimmer after driving it.

*The TL* ... well I wrote a review on it on this board, if your interested, check it out. Sorry but maybe it's because I have had so many Honda/Acura products that I am not too impressed. I'd consider the Accord coupe with a 6 speed if you don't need a 4 door.

*RX8* - I'd test drive one again ... my first test drive in one was :thumbdwn: I had no idea of the hype it created and why until I borrowed my step fathers for 3 or 4 days ... damn this car is awesome, I traded in a 1 yr old 330i for one because I straight out fell in love. Seriously try it again ... you might like it.

*Audi A4* - I am a sucker for AWD now that I've had one (though mine isn't an A4) for the past few months plus I've driven Audi's and always loved them but never actually owned one and got to know it real close until recently. They are just as addicting as bimmer's once you own one ... they are tight, they handle and again that quattro comes in handy much more then I ever realized. One other huge factor is the interior's are just beautiful

*G35 *- another excellent car and fast as hell, though I found the clutch a little heavy in the Coupe I drove and it felt more of a muscle car and less like a sports car in my eye's. 
If you are considering an automatic transmission and want a bargain the G35 sedan is great plus I've noticed the dealer's here in NY are packed with 2004 AWD models, I bet a great deal could be made for one of these ... BTW the steering on the G35 is very tight and fairly responsive though it's not offering the feel of a bimmer it's still a sweet car.


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## Chris90 (Apr 7, 2003)

The IS300 is too dated to buy new - there is a new model coming next fall, with two engines, probably a 2.5L and 3.5L V6 (maybe 205 hp and 265 to 300 hp). If you want rear drive in a sedan, your choices are pretty limited. 

I think the RX-8 is a failed design - give it a few years and this will be the going wisdom.

I'm sure the TL feels like rear drive - when you're in reverse. I believed all that Acura and car mag hype, and test drove the TSX - what a joke, that car is not even remotely sporty or fun. And as slow as my old Civic EX.


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## AF (Dec 21, 2001)

Dawg90 said:


> I think the RX-8 is a failed design - give it a few years and this will be the going wisdom.


Huh ? Can you please elaborate ? That statement is too broad for a sports car that just hit it's 100,000th mark


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## brkf (May 26, 2003)

AF-RX8 said:


> Huh ? Can you please elaborate ? That statement is too broad for a sports car that just hit it's 100,000th mark


Especially one that's got a uniqueness about it that will always set it apart.

I'm still in love with the old 95 RX-7. Yummy.


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## brkf (May 26, 2003)

Dawg90 said:


> I'm sure the TL feels like rear drive - when you're in reverse. I believed all that Acura and car mag hype, and test drove the TSX - what a joke, that car is not even remotely sporty or fun. And as slow as my old Civic EX.


Either you drove an automatic (why buy any vehicle with auto?) or you don't know how to drive stick. It's that simple. Keep the tach north of 4k on a TSX and the car is, imho, a fun little runner for 25k.


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## markseven (Apr 30, 2004)

blueguydotcom said:


> I'm still in love with the old 95 RX-7. Yummy.


:thumbup: Had a 3rd Gen RX-7. I could talk about that car for days. Unfortunately my talent ran out far before the car's did and I totaled her 

-Mark


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## Chris90 (Apr 7, 2003)

blueguydotcom said:


> Either you drove an automatic (why buy any vehicle with auto?) or you don't know how to drive stick. It's that simple. Keep the tach north of 4k on a TSX and the car is, imho, a fun little runner for 25k.


Admittedly, the lame Acura dealer around here gives you such a short test drive, it's hard to wind it up. But I had a '97 GSR sedan, and that was way more fun to drive. Besides, if it's slower than my 325i, I'm not impressed.


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## Chris90 (Apr 7, 2003)

AF-RX8 said:


> Huh ? Can you please elaborate ? That statement is too broad for a sports car that just hit it's 100,000th mark


A lot of cars are hot their first year. But with the oil burning issue, the crap gas mileage, the lack of torque, the hefty competition, and the high volume production hopes, you're looking at a financial disaster in about 3 years. The Acura NSX was also a great driver's car, but after the first 18 months where it was really hot, they couldn't give them away.


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## brkf (May 26, 2003)

Dawg90 said:


> Admittedly, the lame Acura dealer around here gives you such a short test drive, it's hard to wind it up. But I had a '97 GSR sedan, and that was way more fun to drive. Besides, if it's slower than my 325i, I'm not impressed.


I've driven both the GSR and the TSX many times. I'd take the TSX any day and twice on Sunday. That 166 lb-ft of torque pulls nicely. IMHO, that engine is more fun than the inline 2.5 and the tranny so far beyond BMW's that I never considered the 325i after driving a TSX manual. Handling wasn't as sharp but the car was so much more for less money in every other regard. Heck, sometimes I wish I'd gone with the TSX even over my 330i ZHP. I'd at least have a car I felt was dependable and would last.


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