# Finally drove a 2005 Legacy GT Limited manual.



## brkf (May 26, 2003)

Well after all the talk on here I drove a legacy gt limited 5 speed yesterday.

First thoughts - interior is clean, functional and pretty typical of mid-level Japanese cars. The interior in not on par with a G35/3 series/a4 by any stretch. It's very econobox cheap. Soft materials but the overall design makes blah seem edgy.

Seats were decent but the cheap leather wasn't warming me over. Steering wheel felt slim and plasticky. Not a very sturdy unit. Auto down on one window and no auto up at all? WTF, this is a 2005?! Shifter felt notchy without the engine running and just the clutch depressed.

Started the car - whoa the 2.5 is a rough running engine. Neat little swing of the needles when the engine comes to life. Ran through the gears again at a standstill, still vague, notchy, rubbery VW-like manual feel. Pulling out of the spot the steering felt dead. That's okay, it's just parking lot stuff.

hit the road and accelerate. nice. I had forgotten how wonderful it feels to have instant power (unlike the torque-less world of BMW's inline 6 engines). car pulls pretty strongly through the first few gears. also the bulky outside of the car doesn't appear that bad when moving. interior's feeling cramped though and egad do you sit up high in the car. I could use a lowering of a few inches.

First corner comes and the car leans. Salesguy says many mods available. Yeah it'd need some serious tuning on the suspension to make the car livable. Once we hit the freeway the car roughly roars up to 80. Only 5 gears? Damn, no wonder gas mileage is sh!tty! It's turning high rpms and I'm only doing 90. engine's pretty noticable too but not in a purring sexy way like my ZHP. This is more nissan clatter - as if a rod or some part of the engine will explode through the hood at any moment.

Nice pick up though - again, the bad gearing means the car will sprint at highway speeds but it's at the sacrifice of mileage and the constant drone of a malfunctiong lawnmower sounding engine. Salesguy claims 3-4k in mods will get you over 300 whp. Intriguing...

Off the freeway and banking. Not exactly glued to the road. The typical intrusive, fun-numbing of Subaru's awful AWD system robs corners of their enchanting promise. Car stays planted but doesn't feel like it's being guided by invisible rails (ala bmw, miata, etc). Too much mechanical interference with cornering, imho.

On surface streets the engine's always on boil and little too unrefined for my tastes. The car wants to run hard but it's more of a nissan-like level of half-way threre luxury. This car isn't a near luxury competitor...too many cost cutting corners from the wind noise to the bad manual to the light doors.

Good size trunk. Back seat is not comfy - neither is the bimmer's though.

Overall a fairly fun car but more of a 22k car given the total lack of anything approaching luxury. honda's accord coupe v6 sports a better, more refined, eager engine, infinitely better tranny, and total luxury-like entombment. If not for the FWD, it'd be a lexus-like car. can't see spending 26-28k on this car. I'd always feel like I was driving something slapped together by boy racers who wanted to pretend they were going after the luxury class.

On another note, drove the 2005 G35 manual sedan. Improvements to the interior are evident immediately. Wow, nice aluminum trim everywhere. Electronic tilt-telescope (if it were bmw I'd expect that would break after 2-3 years). Seats are wide, la-z-boy like. Shifter feels smoother and shorter than that 2003 manual I drove. Engine's got crazy power - pulls like a damn rocket sled. Car still feels lumbering and not very agile even with optional 18s. you sit far too high up so the feeling of speed is more apparent than in the bmw and it ends up making the car feel more like a souped up, decent handling buick with that big interior and so much metal everywhere. fun car for 32k or so. But still think I'd opt for a used bimmer before getting a G35. It still doesn't feel like a legit sport sedan. More a fast sporty sedan. And that engine, while powerful just is too rough when pushed. It sounds like it might break above 5k rpm. No redline on the tach but an annoying light starts to blink at 3500-4k telling me to shift. Dumb design and it makes it impossible to tell the car's real redline.


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## Scorp76 (Dec 9, 2002)

FINALLY someone not babbling on and on about the Legacy like it's the sports sedan to end all sports sedans. Everytime I read a review and they compare that horribly plain interior to Audi or BMW I want to scream. Between that, the bland looks, the lack of BASIC convenience features found on the competition, and that god-awful sounding engine, I wouldn't buy one if the price was slashed in half. 

Agreed also on the nissan; it's all go and no soul, nothing to get excited about.


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## racerdave (Sep 15, 2003)

blue... putting on real tires should be any prospective Legacy GT owner's first priority. Will help with grip and steering feel/response.

Overall, I don't agree with a lot of what you said, but to each his own. I'm sure a lot of folks around here don't agree with your oft-asserted notion that BMW I-6's are gutless wonders in terms of torque.

So the beauty of what we can purchase today is just that... many choices to fit what people find important, acceptable, etc.


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## Scorp76 (Dec 9, 2002)

racerdave said:


> blue... putting on real tires should be any prospective Legacy GT owner's first priority. Will help with grip and steering feel/response.


Too bad that won't do jack for that horrible sounding engine. :rofl:


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## AF (Dec 21, 2001)

racerdave said:


> blue... putting on real tires should be any prospective Legacy GT owner's first priority. Will help with grip and steering feel/response.
> 
> Overall, I don't agree with a lot of what you said, but to each his own. I'm sure a lot of folks around here don't agree with your oft-asserted notion that BMW I-6's are gutless wonders in terms of torque.
> 
> So the beauty of what we can purchase today is just that... many choices to fit what people find important, acceptable, etc.


 Like I told Blue in another thread, I see things very differently from his review but you gotta say the guy does a great job putting his thoughts into words ...


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## racerdave (Sep 15, 2003)

Scorp76 said:


> Too bad that won't do jack for that horrible sounding engine. :rofl:


It's in the exhaust header design. It's unequal length headers. The 2.0-liter Japanese GT's use a equal-length header, and it sounds like any other 4 on the market.

That said, to be honest, I was not looking forward to that engine note either. But when you experience the power that comes along with it on a daily basis, it grows on you. Maybe like a fungus  but it grows on you nonetheless.

And Scorp, you should be the one to talk!  I've driven a Ford Duratec V-6 like yours before and that's no symphony either!


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## brkf (May 26, 2003)

racerdave said:


> blue... putting on real tires should be any prospective Legacy GT owner's first priority. Will help with grip and steering feel/response.


Yeah I imagine it'd help. But I think I'd still have to grab a sway bar and change the suspension too. I find my ZHP is too soft for me, so you can imagine my reaction to the Gt's setup.



> Overall, I don't agree with a lot of what you said, but to each his own. I'm sure a lot of folks around here don't agree with your oft-asserted notion that BMW I-6's are gutless wonders in terms of torque.


Shrug. Thank God we have choices. I may not like the torque on my 330 but I do love how silky smooth that engine is up to redline. Only Honda and BMW seem to be capable of building engines that rev like butter to the red.



> So the beauty of what we can purchase today is just that... many choices to fit what people find important, acceptable, etc.


Amen. I'd still suggest the GT to people and my next charge (I believe my sister is now shopping again) will certainly get a visit to Subaru. My niggles about the GT may be things she like - she complains that her husband's 325i manual is pretty slow and for some reason she dislikes the low seating position. The GT may be to her liking.


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## Chris90 (Apr 7, 2003)

The only time I'll ever want to drive my girlfriend's WRX over my E36 is when it's snowing, and that's just cause my snow tires are bald! Just not a fan of the Suby's.


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## Scorp76 (Dec 9, 2002)

racerdave said:


> And Scorp, you should be the one to talk!  I've driven a Ford Duratec V-6 like yours before and that's no symphony either!


A growling V6 regardless of its origin sounds better than any go-kart engine with a turbo attached. :thumbup:


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## Chris90 (Apr 7, 2003)

Scorp76 said:


> A growling V6 regardless of its origin sounds better than any go-kart engine with a turbo attached. :thumbup:


I think the WRX engine sounds ok, the puka-puka-puka sound is kind of funny.

Give me a Type R motor any day though, those sound sweet. Or an inline six obviously - from BMW or even the Lexus IS, though that one is too quiet.


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## racerdave (Sep 15, 2003)

Scorp76 said:


> A growling V6 regardless of its origin sounds better than any go-kart engine with a turbo attached. :thumbup:


That V-6 doesn't growl, however.

It sounds like an Evinrude. 

And I'm sorry you've never driven a proper racing go-kart to appreciate its sound.


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## Scorp76 (Dec 9, 2002)

racerdave said:


> That V-6 doesn't growl, however.
> 
> It sounds like an Evinrude.


However you want to slice it, the sound is better than the go-kart/lawn-mower thing that subarus have going on.



> And I'm sorry you've never driven a proper racing go-kart to appreciate its sound.


And I'm sorry there's nothing to appreciate about its sound.


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## AF (Dec 21, 2001)

Scorp76 said:


> However you want to slice it, the sound is better than the go-kart/lawn-mower thing that subarus have going on.
> 
> And I'm sorry there's nothing to appreciate about its sound.


 I drove the Mazda 6s this morning in both an automatic and a manual and the engine was not exactly thrilling ... I liked the car but the engine sound wasn't it's strong point ...


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## brkf (May 26, 2003)

AF-RX8 said:


> I drove the Mazda 6s this morning in both an automatic and a manual and the engine was not exactly thrilling ... I liked the car but the engine sound wasn't it's strong point ...


Yeah, you gotta wait for a Mazdaspeed6. The regular 6 handles nicely but otherwise it's a dog.


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## Desertnate (Mar 11, 2002)

AF-RX8 said:


> I drove the Mazda 6s this morning in both an automatic and a manual and the engine was not exactly thrilling ... I liked the car but the engine sound wasn't it's strong point ...


For me, not only was the sound not that thrilling, but the engine did nothing for me either. Smooth, but NO grunt and moderate RPM :thumbdwn:


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## Jeff_DML (Mar 13, 2002)

I love the sound of my boxer engine especially with my borla exhaust. Rivals the sound of the inline 2.5l in our wagon. darn 911s sound like a go kart :blah: but you are free to have your own opinion


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