# Owners Choice Return in IL



## untitledfolder (Feb 24, 2016)

Arciga18 said:


> I probably would go with Owners Choice on the next turn just to stick it to the man (city of Chicago). I give them enough money already living in the City so I don't want to pay their lease tax.
> 
> Also, for the little things like having your name on the registration.
> 
> Last time I got a camera ticket with my wife's Mazda (lease) I got sass from the "judge" to the tone of "is a company car ... blah blah blah,,, and that you need a lawyer blah blah blah its the state law. ".... no sir this is a personal car.... why is it a lease..... because i like spending my money.... blah blah blah.


This is actually a part of it for me! The taxes might be a wash overall, and lease even still make slightly more sense mathematically but *f' this tax*, I kinda want my name on the title, and there is a chance I may choose to keep the car at the end sooo...


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## gohawks23 (Oct 27, 2008)

untitledfolder said:


> This is actually a part of it for me! The taxes might be a wash overall, and lease even still make slightly more sense mathematically but *f' this tax*, I kinda want my name on the title, and there is a chance I may choose to keep the car at the end sooo...


I'd double and triple check this because I've seen elsewhere if car is bought at end taxes are again due on the residual.

If you are dead set on putting money down I'd find out what happens if say the car got totaled early in the lease...what would you get paid back or would OC just be paid off because maybe you would lose all that money you put down.

And, personally, I wouldn't care about the principal of things I'd go for the solution that costs me less over the term. I've leased several BMWs in the past and never had an issue with not having my name on the title. I usually pay cash for cars now since I keep for awhile and put some miles on them and they have a title with my name on it but it doesn't really make me sleep any better than if it said BMWFS other than knowing I own it free and clear. Haha.


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## untitledfolder (Feb 24, 2016)

greginchi said:


> I'd double and triple check this because I've seen elsewhere if car is bought at end taxes are again due on the residual.
> 
> If you are dead set on putting money down I'd find out what happens if say the car got totaled early in the lease...what would you get paid back or would OC just be paid off because maybe you would lose all that money you put down.
> 
> And, personally, I wouldn't care about the principal of things I'd go for the solution that costs me less over the term. I've leased several BMWs in the past and never had an issue with not having my name on the title. I usually pay cash for cars now since I keep for awhile and put some miles on them and they have a title with my name on it but it doesn't really make me sleep any better than if it said BMWFS other than knowing I own it free and clear. Haha.


Yeah, I looked into the tax situation if you purchase at the end, but fortunately you don't pay taxes again on the residual. You own the car already (have title) when you pay off or refinance that last residual balloon payment so BMWFS is not selling it to you (triggering the re-tax like a lease). A small advantage to OC.

Again thanks for the input!!


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## gohawks23 (Oct 27, 2008)

I still don't understand how they come up with 2163 for upfront sales tax on the lease...shouldn't it just be 10.25% of 49405-32787? Only thing I'm thinking is that for some crazy reason MSDs get taxed upfront too?


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## untitledfolder (Feb 24, 2016)

greginchi said:


> I still don't understand how they come up with 2163 for upfront sales tax on the lease...shouldn't it just be 10.25% of 49405-32787? Only thing I'm thinking is that for some crazy reason MSDs get taxed upfront too?


Funny, I was going over the numbers again last night since I'm leaning towards the lease option now (thanks again!) and had this exact thought about the upfront sales tax and cash down tax totals. I've written the sales manager to clarify and will let you know.

Also under the 'itemized amount due at signing' the $4200 MSD's total + $169.27 doc fee + $196 lic. fee + $40 other fees = $4605.27. So where does $4634.65 come from in the next section? This is $29.38 higher, so we shall see...


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## gohawks23 (Oct 27, 2008)

untitledfolder said:


> Funny, I was going over the numbers again last night since I'm leaning towards the lease option now (thanks again!) and had this exact thought about the upfront sales tax and cash down tax totals. I've written the sales manager to clarify and will let you know.
> 
> Also under the 'itemized amount due at signing' the $4200 MSD's total + $169.27 doc fee + $196 lic. fee + $40 other fees = $4605.27. So where does $4634.65 come from in the next section? This is $29.38 higher, so we shall see...


Awesome, I'd do the deal like it appears to be structured...roll 925 acq and sales tax into cap and put the 7 MSDs down. Only pay for doc/dealer/license fees out of pocket. Know that dealers around here will mark up MF the full 0.0004 so I'd try to get them to split the diff or 0.0001 at least.


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## untitledfolder (Feb 24, 2016)

greginchi said:


> Awesome, I'd do the deal like it appears to be structured...roll 925 acq and sales tax into cap and put the 7 MSDs down. Only pay for doc/dealer/license fees out of pocket. Know that dealers around here will mark up MF the full 0.0004 so I'd try to get them to split the diff or 0.0001 at least.


Fortunately they've agreed to do what I think is the current base MF, 0.00132. With MSD's it's 0.0009. Stay tuned lol.


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## gohawks23 (Oct 27, 2008)

untitledfolder said:


> Fortunately they've agreed to do what I think is the current base MF, 0.00132. With MSD's it's 0.0009. Stay tuned lol.


Great, should be 0.00132 minus 0.00049 for 0.00083 though if they don't mark up at all.

That Gran Coupe/sedan looks pretty sweet though!

I really want a stick again so I'm leaning towards xDrive 340 M Sport with CWP, nav and track package...wish I could get a two door cuz that new M2 looks awesome!


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## untitledfolder (Feb 24, 2016)

greginchi said:


> Great, should be 0.00132 minus 0.00049 for 0.00083 though if they don't mark up at all.
> 
> That Gran Coupe/sedan looks pretty sweet though!
> 
> I really want a stick again so I'm leaning towards xDrive 340 M Sport with CWP, nav and track package...wish I could get a two door cuz that new M2 looks awesome!


Since I'm not a returning customer, I think one of the MSD's doesn't count, so total reduction of 0.00042 instead of 0.00049 . This seems to match with the BMW lease calculator spreadsheet I downloaded from this forum...

My favorite part of the Gran Coupe is the hatchback. Seriously, that was the deal maker coming from my MINI. :rofl:

The M2 is seriously amazing, but a 340 M Sport would be a sweet ride too!


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## Ninong (May 20, 2014)

untitledfolder said:


> Since I'm not a returning customer, I think one of the MSD's doesn't count, so total reduction of 0.00042 instead of 0.00049 . This seems to match with the BMW lease calculator spreadsheet I downloaded from this forum...


Where did you read that? The part about having to be a "returning customer?" It's possible that the "BMW lease calculator spreadsheet" you downloaded is years out of date.

If you are putting up 7 MSDs, then the discount will be .00049. BMWFS does not currently require a security deposit; therefore, all seven of your security deposits count towards the discount.



P.S. -- Read the third paragraph here: http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=809480


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## untitledfolder (Feb 24, 2016)

Ninong said:


> Where did you read that? The part about having to be a "returning customer?" It's possible that the "BMW lease calculator spreadsheet" you downloaded is years out of date.
> 
> If you are putting up 7 MSDs, then the discount will be .00049. BMWFS does not currently require a security deposit; therefore, all seven of your security deposits count towards the discount.
> 
> ...


Hmmm, was looking at threads like this one (circa 2013) mentioning the possibility of new customers needing 1 "base" SD:

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=688142

**EDIT: Also found this on the BMWUSA lease disclosure?

*Leasing disclosures*
For purposes of estimating your monthly payment, the vehicle price, less any down payment or trade was used as the net capital cost of the vehicle. _A security deposit is required on lease transactions_ and an extra charge may be imposed at the end of the lease term. Not all terms and leasing options are available in all areas. Lease rates are based on the creditworthiness of the customer. Not all customers will qualify for the lowest rates.


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## jjrandorin (May 8, 2013)

Unless its different in IL, or your credit situation is different, there is no deposit required so all the MSDs count toward your discount. 7 MSDs = .00049 discount. If you are told differently by the dealership, ask them why.


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## gohawks23 (Oct 27, 2008)

After some emailing I clarified taxes on lease in Chicago are:

9.5% sales tax calculated on the total of all payments 
9% monthly use tax on top of payment

Could roll sales tax into cap but then you'd be paying interest on it and also the use tax.

So makes more sense to pay for sales tax upfront.


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## untitledfolder (Feb 24, 2016)

greginchi said:


> After some emailing I clarified taxes on lease in Chicago are:
> 
> 9.5% sales tax calculated on the total of all payments
> 9% monthly use tax on top of payment
> ...


Could do that, and perhaps even the acquisition up front to avoid taxes but then it's the same risk as a down payment - could lose it all in the unlikely event the car is stolen/totaled. Still pretty tempting to do... 

Also, thanks for looking into it more!


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## Ninong (May 20, 2014)

untitledfolder said:


> Hmmm, was looking at threads like this one (circa 2013) mentioning the possibility of new customers needing 1 "base" SD:
> 
> http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=688142


The link I provided is accurate current information. A security deposit is not required. If an approval is conditioned based on one or more security deposits, that would be an exception to current BMWFS policy and it would be offered as an alternative way the application would be approved.

Be aware that when you search previous threads for information, the information provided by Bimmerfest members may have been accurate at the time but may not be accurate currently. The information in that thread does not represent current BMWFS policy.



> **EDIT: Also found this on the BMWUSA lease disclosure?
> 
> *Leasing disclosures*
> For purposes of estimating your monthly payment, the vehicle price, less any down payment or trade was used as the net capital cost of the vehicle. _A security deposit is required on lease transactions_ and an extra charge may be imposed at the end of the lease term. Not all terms and leasing options are available in all areas. Lease rates are based on the creditworthiness of the customer. Not all customers will qualify for the lowest rates.


You have discovered an example of instructions on the official BMWUSA.com website that do not reflect current policy. Obviously that statement should have been revised or deleted once they changed their policy.

If at some future time they reinstate the requirement for a minimum of at least one security deposit on all leases, I'm sure we will all hear about it. In the meantime you can rest assured that currently security deposits are not required and all seven of your security deposits will earn the .00007 money factor discount. You will also notice that in every lease disclosure of the special lease offers on the BMWUSA.com website a security deposit is not included.


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## untitledfolder (Feb 24, 2016)

Wow. The people on this forum are awesome. Is there going to be a bimmerfest fee in my paperwork? 

Can you tell me if my math is right? If I paid the $925 acquisition fee and state sales tax (but not Chicago use tax which is based on the payment) up front to avoid capitalizing them and paying interest (plus taxes on the acq. fee), that would leave the Gross Capital Cost at $49,405 and Adjusted Capital Cost (less rebate) at $48,405.

Subtracting the same $32,787 residual from it then the new depreciation charge is $15,618 and rent charge $2,426.02 (($48,405+$32,787) * 0.00083 MF * 36 months). The total of base monthly payments would become $18,044.02, base monthly payment $501.22, monthly Chicago use tax $45.11 (0.09 * $501.22) and finally total monthly payment $546.33?

I assume my total out of pocket would then be $3,850 for MSD's ($546.33 rounded up to $550 * 7), $196 + $169.27 + $40 (dealer fees) + state sales tax up front of $1,714.18 (0.095*$18,044.02) + $925 acquisition fee up front + $546.33 first month payment for a total of $7,440.78 due at signing? This seems much better to me...


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## Ninong (May 20, 2014)

untitledfolder said:


> Can you tell me if my math is right?


Sorry but I think you will need someone who lives there to help you with any questions involving Chicago.


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## untitledfolder (Feb 24, 2016)

Ninong said:


> Sorry but I think you will need someone who lives there to help you with any questions involving Chicago.


No worries. Maybe greginchi or Arciga18 will be able to kindly verify.


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## Arciga18 (Mar 3, 2012)

So the Cash down tax is because they tax the "rebate". thats why you see the $94.xx

Credits don't get taxed. 

I'm looking at the rest of the numbers as I read on the john.:rofl::rofl::rofl:


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## gohawks23 (Oct 27, 2008)

untitledfolder said:


> No worries. Maybe greginchi or Arciga18 will be able to kindly verify.


546.33 is what i got too.


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