# New CANON cameras on the way!



## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

atyclb said:


> :eeps:


That was not a stick-poke, rather I was just asking. I have no clue where else it is coming from. Seems to be gone now though ...

Ok, I have now charged the batteries and I will spend the next ten weeks trying to attach the damn hand strap to the body ... 

But what I can say is that this camera is insanely fast. And I was just shooting some low light, indoor pictures w/o any flash. A 5 fps burst is just that ... a burst.

I was using both my 50 1.8 II and the 24-70 2.8 L, and the speed of the AF is shocking. It is instantaneous. Don't like the AF point, move the camera a bit and look for a new one. Boom, there it is.

I am stunned. This puts my 10D to shame.

I can't wait to get outdoors with this, and better yet, to any type of sports/action event.

Wow.



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## rost12 (Dec 22, 2001)

Patrick 520iAT said:


> And really Rost, with your recent X5 purchase, I don't think that you should be pointing the YOU SUCK finger at anyone here!


It's a _truck_ :dunno: :angel:


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## rost12 (Dec 22, 2001)

Patrick 520iAT said:


> I am stunned. This puts my 10D to shame.


/something incoherent/ :bawling:


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

rost12 said:


> It's a _truck_ :dunno: :angel:


 :tsk: Silly Russians ...

:bigpimp:

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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

rost12 said:


> /something incoherent/ :bawling:


Uh, unless you are going to buy it, do NOT even go and check this camera out. Just stay home and be happy with your 10D ... :eeps:



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## rost12 (Dec 22, 2001)

Patrick 520iAT said:


> Uh, unless you are going to buy it, do NOT even go and check this camera out.


That's the plan, Sir  When I go in to get that 580, I'm gonna wear a blindfold :angel2:


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## ///ACS330Ci (Dec 5, 2003)

Patrick 520iAT said:


> I will pick up the new camera later today, charge the bricks and then take some pictures this weekend. If it stops raining!


Well?????


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## rost12 (Dec 22, 2001)

///ACS330Ci said:


> Well?????


x2


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## bbkat (Oct 27, 2002)

///ACS330Ci said:


> Well?????


x3


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## rost12 (Dec 22, 2001)

bbkat said:


> x3


copycat


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## bbkat (Oct 27, 2002)

rost12 said:


> copycat


 :neener:

maybe we should look for him on the DP Review boards :dunno:


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

You guys ...  

If you do want a really technical review of this machine, then dpreview.com is the place to find it!

Well, I was busy last week, so I did not get out to get any pictures until the weekend. I went fishing out in the Baltic Sea, from Thursday-Sunday, and I took the 20D with me.

I have not RTFM yet, so I really have not played around with any of the Custom Functions - I assume that they are pretty much the same as is with the 10D. I also have not figured out how to use the little joystick on the back of the camera to adjust the AF points while composing an image. I think that this may also be a Custom Function that I have to program in - once I RTFM.

I took about 120 pictures while fishing, most of them pretty boring.

The start-up time for the camera is instantaneous - light years faster than the 10D.

The write speed to the card is simply amazing, allowing you to keep on shooting. It is nice to be able to use the speed of my 40X Pretec CF card.

The frame rate (5 fps) is accurate and actually it is quite easy to accidentally take 2-4 pictures without even meaning to.

The 9 point AF is awesome and intuitive. And when using L glass, it is again, very fast.

The camera deals with salt water spray very well. :eeps: 

A few dislikes:

The shutter is loud - it sounds like someone is getting slapped in the face!

The door covering the CF slot is thinner and seems like it would be very easy to break off.

The battery grip is not as good as the 10D version, however, it is nice to be able to use AA batteries when you have no where to charge the bricks.

Some have had repeated problems with the 20D locking up - I had no such problems. I even tried to replicate the situations that have caused others this lock up problem (changing lenses with the camera on, letting the camera go to "sleep mode" and then start shooting a burst) - nothing happened.

Anyway, I am very pleased with the camera, and I look forward to having some time to play around with it, customize it, get my hands on the new SpeedLite 580EX flash, and to get some more time shooting with it.

BTW, B&H has the SanDisk Ultra II 2 GB CF cards now for $190 + shipping!


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## JPinTO (Dec 20, 2001)

Good review Patrick.

THe 20D shames the 10D in performance. I've taken over 1000 pics with it and, it's the equivalent of upgrading from a 320i to an M3. The 10D was good for it's time, the 20D is fantastic in performance. All my 10D frustrations are nonexistant with the 20D. Bravo, Canon.

Mine locked up once due to some combo of swapping lens & CF while it was powered on, but popping the battery reset it. I tried to make it happen and couldn't ... then one time it did. But, you can recover from the lockup faster than the 10D can power on.

Thanks for the 2Gb tip... CF cards are dropping insanely fast. I still cringe at what I paid for a Lexar 1Gb CF 12 months ago. Arrgh.


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## rost12 (Dec 22, 2001)

My biggest gripe with 10D is the relative lack of megapixels... Is there a noticeable improvement in this area?


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## JPinTO (Dec 20, 2001)

rost12 said:


> My biggest gripe with 10D is the relative lack of megapixels... Is there a noticeable improvement in this area?


6MP to 8MP.... a 30% improvement. It's a noticable improvement (perhaps improvement is a strong word... the file sizes are sure bigger) I never really had much issue with 6mp.

How big are you printing that it is an issue?


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## Cliff (Apr 19, 2002)

JPinTO said:


> How big are you printing that it is an issue?


No kidding, since I have 16x20" prints from 6MP jpeg originals that are fine for my purposes. If you need a really huge file for printing, check out Genuine Fractals.


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## JPinTO (Dec 20, 2001)

The place where I see the 8mp improvement is when I'm using a wide angle lens (17mm) and want to crop something small from the center. There's more resolution to work with, so you can do some aggressive cropping.


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

JPinTO said:


> The place where I see the 8mp improvement is when I'm using a wide angle lens (17mm) and want to crop something small from the center. There's more resolution to work with, so you can do some aggressive cropping.


Are you shooting RAW and Large JPEG?

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## Cliff (Apr 19, 2002)

JPinTO said:


> The place where I see the 8mp improvement is when I'm using a wide angle lens (17mm) and want to crop something small from the center. There's more resolution to work with, so you can do some aggressive cropping.


Wouldn't it be easier to use the right lens when composing the shot?


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## ·clyde· (Dec 26, 2001)

Cliff3 said:


> Wouldn't it be easier to use the right lens when composing the shot?


 You wrote the words out of my fingers. 

OTOH, that is sometimes easier said than done. Depends on the lens, location and subject.


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## Cliff (Apr 19, 2002)

·clyde· said:


> OTOH, that is sometimes easier said than done. Depends on the lens, location and subject.


Since Canon doesn't have a 17mm prime, then we're probably talking the 17-40 zoom. Twisting that ring to 40mm will solve a lot of field of view issues.


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## JPinTO (Dec 20, 2001)

Patrick 520iAT said:


> Are you shooting RAW and Large JPEG?
> 
> .


Max jpeg.


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## JPinTO (Dec 20, 2001)

Cliff3 said:


> Wouldn't it be easier to use the right lens when composing the shot?


LOL! Hadn't thought of that!

My primary subject is a 2 year old... so the only right lens is a 15-400mm L lens... and isn't more than 6" long and can't weigh more than 1 lb. Let me know when one comes out for less than $1k.


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## JPinTO (Dec 20, 2001)

Cliff3 said:


> Since Canon doesn't have a 17mm prime, then we're probably talking the 17-40 zoom. Twisting that ring to 40mm will solve a lot of field of view issues.


Yes, the 17-40L. But when you should have a 200mm on the body for the shot... you can only get when you can get. These little guys can run!


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## Cliff (Apr 19, 2002)

JPinTO said:


> LOL! Hadn't thought of that!
> 
> My primary subject is a 2 year old... so the only right lens is a 15-400mm L lens... and isn't more than 6" long and can't weigh more than 1 lb. Let me know when one comes out for less than $1k.


Alternatively, buy a 28-200 for $350 (US) and figure it solves 95% of your problems getting snapshots of your kid.


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## rost12 (Dec 22, 2001)

JPinTO said:


> How big are you printing that it is an issue?


You can never have too many pixels  Letter sized prints come out okay if I don't crop. But I do occasionally feel that there's not enough resolution to make a high quality 1280x1024 image... guess it's me


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## rost12 (Dec 22, 2001)

Cliff3 said:


> Wouldn't it be easier to use the right lens when composing the shot?


Doesn't always work out that way. I rarely get the composition I want without doing some cropping. And even the ones I do get right (IMHO, at least), there's always room to tweak and perfect. The joy of digital 

And then when there's only one shot to work with... and it sucks... gotta do the best with what you have, like with this one.


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

Cliff3 said:


> Alternatively, buy a 28-200 for $350 (US) and figure it solves 95% of your problems getting snapshots of your kid.


But that is not *L*  glass.



And probably not short enough with 1.6 X crop factor of the 20D. Nice compact lens anyway.

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## JPinTO (Dec 20, 2001)

Yah... you really need <20mm at the wide end with the 1.6 multiplier.

Also, without IS, the 200 end is pretty useless.... I should have specified that in my "wish list". 

The new 17-85 EFS lens would be an improvement in range but it's pricey for what it is, IMO. The extra cropping ability of the 8mp 20D gets you pretty much the same with my existing 17-40.


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## rost12 (Dec 22, 2001)

What kind of post-processing do you all 10/20D users use? Any workflows? :dunno:


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

Here is a good site for checking out lenses:

http://www.photozone.de/2Equipment/easytxt.htm

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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

JPinTO said:


> Thanks for the 2Gb tip... CF cards are dropping insanely fast. I still cringe at what I paid for a Lexar 1Gb CF 12 months ago. Arrgh.


Well, if the 2 GB card isn't big enough for any RAW shooters, there is always this coming soon:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/09/30/8gb_flash_card/



One thing that made me laugh in that article is that the price is the same in either USD or EUR! I think that I will by mine with the old Greenback.

:eeps:

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## Alex Baumann (Dec 19, 2001)

Patrick 520iAT said:


> One thing that made me laugh in that article is that the price is the same in either USD or EUR! I think that I will by mine with the old Greenback.
> 
> :eeps:
> 
> .


Typical Euro crap. It means 20% markup in Europe :tsk:


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

Alex Baumann said:


> Typical Euro crap. It means 20% markup in Europe :tsk:


Yep. $959 USD = 773 EUR ... today.

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## rost12 (Dec 22, 2001)

rost12 said:


> What kind of post-processing do you all 10/20D users use? Any workflows? :dunno:


? :dunno:


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

I try to use PS sometimes, but I am not any good with it.  

But then again, I just take really good pictures to begin with.  


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## ///ACS330Ci (Dec 5, 2003)

My 20D is finally on the way


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

Did you order the battery grip as well?


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## ///ACS330Ci (Dec 5, 2003)

Patrick 520iAT said:


> Did you order the battery grip as well?


Yes, with 2 extra Power-2000 ACD-674 Lithium-Ion batteries (1500 mAh) and Canon E1 hand strap (I have one on all my EOS cameras, they're awesome) 

Plus 2GB Lexar 80x CompactFlash card


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

It sounds like you will be ready! :thumbup: 

What glass do you have to go with that?


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## ///ACS330Ci (Dec 5, 2003)

I still have all my stuff that I use with my EOS 1N RS and my EOS D30. As far as lenses, I have a combination of Canon and Sigma lenses. Some of the Canon lenses are just too expensive for me to justify for my "hobby" and I have found the Sigma lenses to be a good alternative.

What are you using?


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

I have 17-40, 50 1.8, 24-70 2.8 IS and 70-200 2.8 IS + the 1.4X Extender.

I would like to find 200 1.8 but that is not so easy.

Actually, I am not sure why I have any of this equipment. I have not been photographing anything latey.  


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## ///ACS330Ci (Dec 5, 2003)

Patrick 520iAT said:


> I have 17-40, 50 1.8, 24-70 2.8 IS and 70-200 2.8 IS + the 1.4X Extender.
> 
> I would like to find 200 1.8 but that is not so easy.
> 
> ...


All Canon lenses? Wow ... must be nice 

You should just get out and use it! I started taking my D30 with me everytime I go to the Nordschleife now and have really enjoyed taking pics when I'm not driving. Just do it!

BTW, this helped me justify my upgrade to the 20D


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

Yeah, I got sort of addicted to buying L glass - I am a L-coholic, as they say.

I really enjoy your pictures from the Ring. I would be inspired to photograph if I had the opportunity to go there.

I shot a wedding for a friend this summer (with the 10D), and the result did not please me at all. Since then, I have been a bit annoyed with photography ...


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## Alex Baumann (Dec 19, 2001)

Patrick 520iAT said:


> I shot a wedding for a friend this summer (with the 10D), and the result did not please me at all. Since then, I have been a bit annoyed with photography ....


Was that before or after Vodka  :eeps:


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

Alex Baumann said:


> Was that before or after Vodka  :eeps:


LOL. I was actually paid to be the photographer (huge mistake IMHO). There was no drinks for me ... but the groom passed out at about 23.30. 

.


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## Alex Baumann (Dec 19, 2001)

Patrick 520iAT said:


> LOL. I was actually paid to be the photographer (huge mistake IMHO). There was no drinks for me ... but the groom passed out at about 23.30.
> 
> .


:bustingup :bustingup

Note to self : never hire Patrick for wedding photography


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## Patrick (Dec 23, 2001)

Alex Baumann said:


> :bustingup :bustingup
> 
> Note to self : never hire Patrick for wedding photography


No worries there - I already made this note to myself:

NEVER agree to shoot another wedding. EVER.



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## JetBlack330i (Feb 8, 2002)

·clyde· said:


> Or get it what does the best job of meeting your needs on a given day at your price point and live with it until there is another product that meets your needs better at a price point that you're willing to live with and take your lumps whne it happens.


If Walmart doesn't sell it, you don't need it.


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## ///ACS330Ci (Dec 5, 2003)

Patrick 520iAT said:


> Yeah, I got sort of addicted to buying L glass - I am a L-coholic, as they say.


LOL



Patrick 520iAT said:


> I really enjoy your pictures from the Ring. I would be inspired to photograph if I had the opportunity to go there.
> 
> I shot a wedding for a friend this summer (with the 10D), and the result did not please me at all. Since then, I have been a bit annoyed with photography ...


I totally understand. My enthusiasm for my photography has had it's ups and downs through the years too. It always comes back though ... sometimes yopu just need something to spark it back into life


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## ///ACS330Ci (Dec 5, 2003)

Patrick 520iAT said:


> No worries there - I already made this note to myself:
> 
> NEVER agree to shoot another wedding. EVER.


At one stage I actually went out and bought everything I needed to shoot weddings thinking it would be a good way to pay for my habit.  Then I remembered some of the stuff I went through working as a portrait photographer years ago ... people trying to pay with sex and drugs... LOL, or the ones who would complain that they didn't look like the pictures ... like the camera lies!  That's when I decided to stick to subjects that don't give verbal feedback.


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## gojira-san (Mar 1, 2004)

Patrick 520iAT said:


> No worries there - I already made this note to myself:
> 
> NEVER agree to shoot another wedding. EVER.


Good for you! For a while I worked freelance for a local wedding photographer. The PIA weddings and the PIA owner of the studio made me drop out of it after about a year.

The worst (and last) wedding was one where the bride (at the last minute) wanted a picture of both families (probably about 50 people) but she didn't wanted it taken until later in the day. I pleaded with her to do it ASAP at the reception but no. You know what happened... everyone got drunk, there was a fight, a visit by the police... and so when I actually got to take the picture, not everyone was in it, some people were looking pretty disheveled and PO'ed... lol the bride hated the picture when she saw the proofs. The owner of the studio was PO'ed with me since he didn't make enough money on it... that was when I gave him the :flipoff:

I can laugh about it now!


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## JetBlack330i (Feb 8, 2002)

This brings up memories...
Growing up in my parents' house, there was this "club" on the same street. Very often there was a wedding party there. I recall many fights, many taking out to the streets and involving police.
Why is it that weddings so often involve fights? Isn't it supposed to be a celebration?


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