# Audi ED forum?



## AggieKnight (Dec 26, 2008)

A friend of mine is interested in doing an ED for am S6. 

Anyone know of an Audi forum similar to this?

Googling came up relatively empty. 

Thanks!


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## cwsqbm (Aug 4, 2004)

AggieKnight said:


> A friend of mine is interested in doing an ED for am S6.
> 
> Anyone know of an Audi forum similar to this?
> 
> ...


Nothing as good as here of course, but there are few sites that pop up just by googling "Audi European Delivery", such as this faq.

Once you have the car, driving in Europe is the same regardless of car brand, and it looks like even many of the drop off sites are the same.


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## 1985mb (Apr 2, 2008)

Audizine and Audiworld used to be popular forums when I owned an Audi. I do not recall much ED discussion but you can search each one and decide for yourself


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## dkreidel (Aug 24, 2005)

Let me know if you have any specific questions on an Audi ED - did one of my own and went with a friend to pick up his RS6.


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## rmorin49 (Jan 7, 2007)

There are a couple but they are pretty pathetic. Very little activity and very little feedback from recent deliveries. I wanted to do an Audi ED but after trying to negotiate with 5 or 6 dealers, I gave up. Ended up having my local dealer find a car that met my specs and had it trucked down from NJ to MD. Bought it for $250 under US invoice. This is lower than the ED price as I believe you will not do better than 5% under US MSRP. Audi does not seem to want to support EDs.


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## SD ///M4 (Jan 24, 2011)

Last year I talked to an Audi dealer about ED delivery on an S4 (I was actually just killing time). Audi doesn't discount ED vehicles, in fact you used to pay more, and they require you to pay the VAT in advance. Some dealers hold your check, others cash it and issue you another check after your car is returned to the US. Bottom line, your money is tied up for months. After I mentioned BMW ED, he looked very discouraged, said Audi ED isn't nearly as good as BMW, and that they get hardly anyone that does it because it's just not worth it.


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## dandanio (Jun 20, 2008)

Hey Aggie,

If your friend is serious about the ED on an Audi, let me know. The website mentioned above was created and is maintained by Peter, my very good personal friend, he did an ED on a Q5 in 2011. Let me know what he needs to know and I will forward those Q's to Peter, he will gladly respond.

Dan

Ps. Nice reading you again, buddy.


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## HerrK (Jan 9, 2010)

We're looking into an Audi ED on a Q5 TDI this fall, once they begin US production/sales. So I'd also be interested in any fester's thoughts and recommendations for dealers in the SoCal and/or San Diego area who have done an Audi ED. Thanks!


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## basiluf (Dec 16, 2010)

I'm also contemplating a Audi ED for 2014, either a S6 or SQ5. Unfortunately it doesn't look like finding a great deal will be anywhere as easy as it will with BMW again. It's a shame.

Here is a good trip report on an Audi ED, even though it's over a year old now.

http://prw.prehiti.net/2011s4/S4_European_Delivery/The_Start.html

Audi ED "forum"

http://forums.audiworld.com/forumdisplay.php?s=&daysprune=&f=124


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## dkreidel (Aug 24, 2005)

SD Z4MR said:


> Some dealers hold your check, others cash it and issue you another check after your car is returned to the US. * Bottom line, your money is tied up for months.* After I mentioned BMW ED, he looked very discouraged, said Audi ED isn't nearly as good as BMW, and that they get hardly anyone that does it because it's just not worth it.


My Audi ED experience was a very good one, and the dealer held my VAT check so no funds were "tied up for months."

I received about 9% off US MSRP on the S6; a pretty good deal on a specialty car. Audi provides airport transportation and 1 nights lodging at the Kempinski, so I'm not sure how Audi is an inferior program :dunno:

You do need to be able to negotiate well as (at that time) there was no hard ED pricing structure. I'm planning another Audi ED in December '13


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## rmorin49 (Jan 7, 2007)

dkreidel said:


> My Audi ED experience was a very good one, and the dealer held my VAT check so no funds were "tied up for months."
> 
> I received about 9% off US MSRP on the S6; a pretty good deal on a specialty car. Audi provides airport transportation and 1 nights lodging at the Kempinski, so I'm not sure how Audi is an inferior program :dunno:
> 
> You do need to be able to negotiate well as (at that time) there was no hard ED pricing structure. I'm planning another Audi ED in December '13


My hat's off to you if you were able to get a 9% discount on an Audi ED. I was unable to find a middle Atlantic dealer that would do any better than about 5%. If anyone can recommend a dealer on the east coast I am all ears.


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## SD ///M4 (Jan 24, 2011)

dkreidel said:


> My Audi ED experience was a very good one, and the dealer held my VAT check so no funds were "tied up for months."
> 
> I received about 9% off US MSRP on the S6; a pretty good deal on a specialty car. Audi provides airport transportation and 1 nights lodging at the Kempinski, so I'm not sure how Audi is an inferior program :dunno:
> 
> You do need to be able to negotiate well as (at that time) there was no hard ED pricing structure. I'm planning another Audi ED in December '13


I relayed my experience with a particular dealer and everything I relayed was what I got from the dealer. Like I said, I was wasting time, had no serious intent to buy, so there was no need for "negotiation'. As in everything else in life, YMMV, and yours did. Since you buy new cars every six months, or less, you obviously have way more experience with this than most people, so your experiences are not necessarily what most other people can expect.


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## dkreidel (Aug 24, 2005)

rmorin49 said:


> I was unable to find a middle Atlantic dealer that would do any better than about 5%. If anyone can recommend a dealer on the east coast I am all ears.


-5% is where the SoCal Audi dealers want to begin and end too; the R8 will be through the Bozeman MT dealer**. A couple of Washington State Audi dealers are also pretty easy to work with but I have no knowledge or experience with East Coast dealers.

** No sales tax in MT


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## Ucla95 (Jul 23, 2004)

Good friend just came back from an Audi ED and loved it. And I've been to the Audi Forum and it's a great place to visit. The key is to negotiate. You should be able to get about 8-9% off MSRP - but I think many dealers will stand at the standard 5%.


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## dkreidel (Aug 24, 2005)

SD Z4MR said:


> I relayed my experience with a particular dealer and everything I relayed was what I got from the dealer. Like I said, I was wasting time, had no serious intent to buy, so there was no need for "negotiation'. As in everything else in life, YMMV, and yours did. Since you buy new cars every six months, or less, you obviously have way more experience with this than most people, so your experiences are not necessarily what most other people can expect.


As many on this board know and learned the hard way, the key to a great BMW ED experience is selecting a dealer and CA that are knowledgeable and experienced in the process. The Audi ED process is similar in that it requires the same level of expertise and savvy, except there are fewer Audi Ingolstadt deliveries so it makes sense there are fewer experienced and willing Audi dealers. I respectfully suggest you may have been talking to one of the many Audi dealers who 1) aren't that experienced and 2) don't really care to become experts. One doesn't have to look too hard to find BMW CA's who don't promote ED's; to characterize Audi's program on the off-hand comments by one dealer is unfair to 'festers who may be considering this option.

Dick


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## cha777 (Sep 19, 2006)

So that begs the question, which Audi dealerships (specific sales people) should one go to for an Audi ED where you can get 8-9% off MSRP and they only hold the check? I did better ordering my S5 Cab than trying to do the ED though the ED would have been better. I've heard that there is high deductible for Audi's in-Europe insurance unlike BMW's 0 deductible.


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## dkreidel (Aug 24, 2005)

cha777 said:


> So that begs the question, which Audi dealerships (specific sales people) should one go to for an Audi ED where you can get 8-9% off MSRP and they only hold the check? I did better ordering my S5 Cab than trying to do the ED though the ED would have been better. I've heard that there is high deductible for Audi's in-Europe insurance unlike BMW's 0 deductible.


What part of the US are you in?

S5 cab :thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:


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## cha777 (Sep 19, 2006)

dkreidel said:


> What part of the US are you in?
> 
> S5 cab :thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:


Southeast for now, but moving to the Northeast in suburban Philadelphia.

The S5 Cab was great....until I crashed it :bawling: The repaired car just didn't have the allure and moving to the Northeast, though quattro is awesome, made me switch back over to a BMW SUV.


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## Tanning machine (Feb 21, 2002)

dkreidel said:


> My Audi ED experience was a very good one, and the dealer held my VAT check so no funds were "tied up for months."


I assume the dealer told you this in advance, and committed to not cashing the check, yes?


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## valeram (Oct 18, 2006)

As it was mentioned earlier, there is no set ED pricing for Audi as compared to BMW. It is all a matter of negotiating with the dealers. I was planning to do an Audi ED delivery last year. You have to negotiate the price with the Audi dealers. So it is more of great timing and patience not to mention a great negotiation skills. Unlike BMW ED, you negotiate your price against the ED price not the US delivered price. Didn't pursue the Audi ED and instead will do a 2013 M3 May ED.


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

Personally, I'd work out a deal on an Audi if I wanted an Audi. I may even give up doing ED. One nice thing about the Audi ED program is drop offs in London and Madrid.

Just from reading the Audi site, it seems that the pricing model for Audi is similar to BMW? Meaning a discount off MSRP, and a corresponding discount off Invoice for the dealer? If I look at the BMWUSA site, the way pricing is represented is very similar. Is it a matter of allocations? What am I missing?

In some ways, to me a lot of what Audi is doing now is where BMW was say 10 years ago with their ED program (and Bimmerfest with its community). Perhaps we'll see this mature in the next few years? An ED program is sometimes not just made by the manufacturer, but often by the owner community with tips, trip recommendations etc.

Just getting a BMW because pricing negotiations seem easier just doesn't make sense in my opinion.


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## basiluf (Dec 16, 2010)

chrischeung said:


> Personally, I'd work out a deal on an Audi if I wanted an Audi. I may even give up doing ED.
> 
> Just getting a BMW because pricing negotiations seem easier just doesn't make sense in my opinion.


Not essentially easier, but a much better deal. For those of us who lease, the deals on BMWs are far superior. I personally prefer an A6 over a 5 series, but if I can lease a similar 5 series for $200 month less, than that is what I would go for.

Of course the only German SUV you can do ED's on are the Audi's, so it's a moot point there.


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

basiluf said:


> Not essentially easier, but a much better deal.


OK - are you mixing in preferential BMW lease rates? Or is that difference exclusively due to the BMW ED program being better than the Audi ED program?

Did you factor in any Audi incentives into those calculations? Can you break that $200 down? Could a shrewd negotiator, and an aggressive dealer, bridge that gap, and by how much?

I've honestly never considered an Audi in the last 10 years, so I've never seriously run any accurate numbers. But the latest S6 seems to be a better compromise as being more exciting than a 550i (more power and added 4WD), without the over the top performance (and pricing) of the M5 for me personally. Definitely worth a test drive at the least.


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## basiluf (Dec 16, 2010)

chrischeung said:


> OK - are you mixing in preferential BMW lease rates? Or is that difference exclusively due to the BMW ED program being better than the Audi ED program?
> 
> Did you factor in any Audi incentives into those calculations? Can you break that $200 down? Could a shrewd negotiator, and an aggressive dealer, bridge that gap, and by how much?


It was just a random figure thrown out there based on past experiences. My wife was also interested in an A5 convertible, and the payments were more than the M3 convertible which had an MSRP $25k higher.

I will not know for sure how it currently works until we start the process the end of this year.


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## dkreidel (Aug 24, 2005)

Tanning machine said:


> I assume the dealer told you this in advance, and committed to not cashing the check, yes?


Yes, but I was familiar and trusted by them so it was of no economic concern to me.


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## dkreidel (Aug 24, 2005)

basiluf said:


> Not essentially easier, but a much better deal. For those of us who lease, the deals on BMWs are far superior. I personally prefer an A6 over a 5 series, but if I can lease a similar 5 series for $200 month less, than that is what I would go for.
> 
> Of course the only German SUV you can do ED's on are the Audi's, so it's a moot point there.


Audi lease residuals are notoriously poor.


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

The thing which excites me, or gets me going, about Audi, is that they are growing faster than BMW in the US (18.5% vs 13% growth). Are they getting that from Benz, Lexus? But the way they are doing it is also important - focusing on their core products. Whereas BMW seems to be tapping out in their core products, and needing to go niche for greater share and sales. Say Audi's are more expensive comparatively speaking - where would they be if they suddenly decided to get serious and really increase their dealer network and sales targets? What they are doing now may be really great for the bottom line (lower residuals), and they aren't getting harmed by it (it seems). But say that growth begins to trail off a little, and they are forced to be more competitive?

Annecdotlaly, it seems like a lot more 'Festers are considering Audis, or have just purchased an Audi as a second/third car as far as I can tell (like the S4 and Q5). It seems that folks used to like Audis because of their Quattro capabilities. It's now moving where they are liking them in addition to that. I think it all ends up being better for consumers.


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## basiluf (Dec 16, 2010)

chrischeung said:


> Say Audi's are more expensive comparatively speaking - where would they be if they suddenly decided to get serious and really* increase their dealer network and sales targets?*


That's the biggest problem here in Orlando. The closest dealership to downtown Orlando is 25 miles away. If you are in one of the more affluent areas in SW Orlando, it increases to 35 miles. That's a 45 minute drive in non-rush hour traffic. Dropping your car off/picking up your car before and after work would be a serious pain. For comparison, there are 2 BMW dealerships and 3 Mercedes Benz dealerships in this same area.


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## Popoemt (Aug 9, 2012)

*Spiel*



cha777 said:


> So that begs the question, which Audi dealerships (specific sales people) should one go to for an Audi ED where you can get 8-9% off MSRP and they only hold the check? I did better ordering my S5 Cab than trying to do the ED though the ED would have been better. I've heard that there is high deductible for Audi's in-Europe insurance unlike BMW's 0 deductible.


The Audi ED insurance is a $1000 (Euros), deductible. I am in the bay area and I was told the 3 dealers in my area don't know much, the dealer I was at did not like ED as they got "burned" before (I don't remember how, something about a customer ordering and backing out before they had to sign?) so the finance manager was the only one who would do an ED, and even then they were giving me the, "you can just buy one off the lot for cheaper" spiel , V/r, Tim


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## cha777 (Sep 19, 2006)

chrischeung said:


> The thing which excites me, or gets me going, about Audi, is that they are growing faster than BMW in the US (18.5% vs 13% growth). Are they getting that from Benz, Lexus? But the way they are doing it is also important - focusing on their core products. Whereas BMW seems to be tapping out in their core products, and needing to go niche for greater share and sales. Say Audi's are more expensive comparatively speaking - where would they be if they suddenly decided to get serious and really increase their dealer network and sales targets? What they are doing now may be really great for the bottom line (lower residuals), and they aren't getting harmed by it (it seems). But say that growth begins to trail off a little, and they are forced to be more competitive?
> 
> Annecdotlaly, it seems like a lot more 'Festers are considering Audis, or have just purchased an Audi as a second/third car as far as I can tell (like the S4 and Q5). It seems that folks used to like Audis because of their Quattro capabilities. It's now moving where they are liking them in addition to that. I think it all ends up being better for consumers.


Former Audi USA Chief Johan De Nysschen had some sort of policy/philosphy to (if I may paraphrase) make sure that they customers they are capturing are customers who will have worked hard to EARN an Audi; to be proud of their purchase and view it as a reflection of their hard work. He did not want to run the type of company that pushed their product out there for market share and volume-based profits.

I have corresponded with Audi corporate regarding their rigid ED policies and they basically told me to F-off, ED is privilege and not a right and if I wanted to buy an Audi all I would get would be the 5% and the dealer would have to take the VAT.

I got a near 60% residual because I got a 2012 in July 2011 when the residuals were at the highest. A perk of Audi is that if you buy the Audicare prepaid maintainence, the residual is increased by 1% which offsets the cost (usually $900-1100) of the Audicare and with the right car, can further lower your monthly payments by a few bucks.

Lastly, Audi's residuals change for the level of car. For example, a maximally optioned 335i has the same residual as a base 335i. For Audi, the entry level (Premium) has a higher residual than the mid-level grade (Premium Plus) which in turn has a higher residual than the most option-heavy grade (Prestige). So when comparing moderately or maximally equipped S5 vs 335i, the BMW will win on residual almost every time.


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

cha777 said:


> I have corresponded with Audi corporate regarding their rigid ED policies and they basically told me to F-off, ED is privilege and not a right and if I wanted to buy an Audi all I would get would be the 5% and the dealer would have to take the VAT.


That is consistent. The Audi program looks pretty comprehensive, if you take away any financial considerations and risks. Meaning - Audi have made everything about their ED program around the experience (hotel, limo transfers). Look at their site - http://www.audiusa.com/us/brand/en/exp/european_delivery.html - how far do you have to go into it before you see mention of the savings? It's pretty obscure (hint: it's in Detailed Information - like a footnote). So I think they don't want to promote savings as a selling point.

Now contrast that to BMW - http://www.bmwusa.com/Standard/Cont...tent/Explore/Experience/EuropeanDelivery.aspx. Step 1 is "Order your BMW and Save". So clearly BMW wants to appeal to your purse strings. They'll gladly cut out some of the fringe benefits, but will counter by taking financial risks, and being more upfront on savings.

I definitely think BMW's objectives with their ED program are achieved, perhaps at some expense to their dealerships (lower bonuses). Pure speculation on Audi - perhaps they don't want to upset their dealership network as much by transferring more profit to clients? It's more for "dyed in the wool" Audi fans than the casual purchaser.

Memo to Audi - read this thread, implement, see sales volume fly. No guarantees on margins.


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## cwsqbm (Aug 4, 2004)

cha777 said:


> Former Audi USA Chief Johan De Nysschen had some sort of policy/philosphy to (if I may paraphrase) make sure that they customers they are capturing are customers who will have worked hard to EARN an Audi; to be proud of their purchase and view it as a reflection of their hard work. He did not want to run the type of company that pushed their product out there for market share and volume-based profits.


For Audi, that makes sense. If you can't afford an A3, A4, A6, Q5 or Q7, they'll happily sell you a Golf, Jetta, Passat, Tiguan, or Touareg through VW. BMW doesn't have that problem/advantage. The MINI brand isn't really a substitute for someone wanting a 3 or 5 series.

Which brand is better is subject fanboys will never agree on. For me, neither ED program has enough pluses or minuses relative to the competition to sway which car I'd be buying. What car I'd end up driving for the next X years is more important than the details of a two week vacation or a little extra savings.


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## AggieKnight (Dec 26, 2008)

cwsqbm said:


> Which brand is better is subject fanboys will never agree on. For me, neither ED program has enough pluses or minuses relative to the competition to sway which car I'd be buying. What car I'd end up driving for the next X years is more important than the details of a two week vacation or a little extra savings.


Well said.


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

cwsqbm said:


> For Audi, that makes sense. If you can't afford an A3, A4, A6, Q5 or Q7, they'll happily sell you a Golf, Jetta, Passat, Tiguan, or Touareg through VW. BMW doesn't have that problem/advantage. The MINI brand isn't really a substitute for someone wanting a 3 or 5 series.


They can also sell you a Skoda, Seat, Lamborghini, Bentley, or Porsche. I think they've done very well with their overall portfolio - no real stinkers in there. That's my argument with focussing each brand on their core offerings. BMW have needed to go niche - GT, SUVs, coupes of every flavor etc.


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## M FUNF (Apr 2, 2008)

I considered an Audi the last time I did an ED (S5) but the dealer is so hard to deal with, and of no help or interest in doing an ED. I simply went where I got good service before and after the sale and an experienced ED staff. I truly enjoyed the A6 we had as a children's car as did my wife when we were allowed to drive it, but working with the dealer on service was always problematic. I finally just took the car to an independent when the car needed service, however both children had great experiences with local dealers both in the Twin City area for my daughter and in Michigan when my son had the car, so some are good and some are not. If I were serious about buying an Audi I would either have to go to Fargo, or Minneapolis to find a dealership that is easy to work with --- too much hassle and still warranty service would be local, not good. It appears the attitude starts at the top with Audi and floats downhill, the low man on the totem pole is the customer who has had to work and aspire to an Audi, Hey Audi it is just a car....


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## cwsqbm (Aug 4, 2004)

chrischeung said:


> They can also sell you a Skoda, Seat, Lamborghini, Bentley, or Porsche. I think they've done very well with their overall portfolio - no real stinkers in there. That's my argument with focussing each brand on their core offerings. BMW have needed to go niche - GT, SUVs, coupes of every flavor etc.


(1) No, they won't sell me a Skoda or SEAT here in the USA. 

(2) Lamborghini, Bentley, and Porsche aren't for those that can't afford an Audi. Besides, we're talking about North American marketing here, which has its own unique aspects.

Does it matter whether they are all in one brand, or spread across many brands inside a corporate group? Its just marketing, which matters to guys trying to maximize profits, but not to me as a driver.

What this really points out is that BMW is still an independent (with MINI and Rolls for a little flavor), unlike the full-range manufacturers of like Toyota, GM, FIAT, Ford, VW, etc.


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

cwsqbm said:


> Does it matter whether they are all in one brand, or spread across many brands inside a corporate group? Its just marketing, which matters to guys trying to maximize profits, but not to me as a driver.
> 
> What this really points out is that BMW is still an independent (with MINI and Rolls for a little flavor), unlike the full-range manufacturers of like Toyota, GM, FIAT, Ford, VW, etc.


I think it does. I think VW has a better positioned portfolio than BMW and can capture more of the market. They can also better direct product at specific market segments in more countries. BMW recognizes that as well by having Mini and Rolls Royce. I'm admiring VW not just as a driver, but from really overall aspects. Honestly, which market or cars are really failing for them? BMW has recently become more things to more people in more countries, so have lost some of that edginess. They need to make a car that appeals to the Chinese, to Lexus buyers, to environmentalists etc. VW's answer - the Lamborghini Aventador. BMW - i8 hybrid. Just my opinion.

What does independent really mean? What's the definition? Privately held? Market cap? Production volume? They both look similar to me in terms of management and capital structure. I wouldn't say that BMW (or VW) had much more independence than the other in any areas of the automotive business. I've heard BMW being called that years ago - but not recently. Does it still apply? Am I missing something?


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## dkreidel (Aug 24, 2005)

I realize this wouldn't be very convenient for most of you but Roger Jobs Porsche/Audi/MB in Bellingham WA has a lot of expereince with ED and is a great dealer to work with. BUT--- the cars will be re-delivered to Bellingham WA as the concept of a funded courtesy delivery doesn't exist in the P/Audi world 

I've bought a 997 C2S, a 997 TT and a S6 from Roger Jobs and have nothing but good things to say about their operation.


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## Popoemt (Aug 9, 2012)

basiluf said:


> That's the biggest problem here in Orlando. The closest dealership to downtown Orlando is 25 miles away. If you are in one of the more affluent areas in SW Orlando, it increases to 35 miles. That's a 45 minute drive in non-rush hour traffic. Dropping your car off/picking up your car before and after work would be a serious pain. For comparison, there are 2 BMW dealerships and 3 Mercedes Benz dealerships in this same area.


I have "heard" if you're in the market for an A8 (S8), they'll do a pick-up of your car, and drop off a demo A8, while your car is being serviced (that is out here in the SF Bay Area though), it'd never hurt to ask though!


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## MB330 (Oct 18, 2005)

basiluf said:


> I'm also contemplating a Audi ED for 2014, either a S6 or SQ5. Unfortunately it doesn't look like finding a great deal will be anywhere as easy as it will with BMW again. It's a shame.
> 
> Here is a good trip report on an Audi ED, even though it's over a year old now.
> 
> ...


I follow AUDI ED forum for the last few years and as many sad there - there are not so much activities compare to Bimmerfest ED.
And I think biggest issue with AUDI ED is Audi dealerships.
I leave in LA and no one in my area can recommend good ED salesperson or I meat the one that I would like to have business with. No good price information and paying 19% VAT tax upfront - make me rethinking about hole ED process with Audi.


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## MonkeyCMonkeyDo (Jun 9, 2012)

The problem with Audi numbers are the piss poor residuals. When I was shopping I looked at the a6 and the s4 and the residual was at 48% compared to 60% for the BMW. When spec'd to almost the same price the monthly payment difference was enormous. And with the added benefit of ED, the BMW was a no brainer for me. Unlike many people on this forum I am not tied to the brand. I am tied to the car that I think is the best looking and gives me the best driving experience for the price I want to pay. In this case BMW won, three years down the line who knows.


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## pilotman (Feb 2, 2006)

see, I thought the problem with Audi wasn't the piss poor residuals, but the fact that BMWs are inherently better in almost every way.

I still hear that the A4 is nothing more than a Passat rofl; the service/dealership experience is terrible, they are FWD based and can never handle as well as the "ultimate driving Machine", etc. etc.

Why any of you BMW fan boys would ever consider an Audi (or, gasp, a Benzo) is beyond me....

: popcorn:


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## MB330 (Oct 18, 2005)

pilotman said:


> see, I thought the problem with Audi wasn't the piss poor residuals, but the fact that BMWs are inherently better in almost every way.
> 
> I still hear that the A4 is nothing more than a Passat rofl; the service/dealership experience is terrible, they are FWD based and can never handle as well as the "ultimate driving Machine", etc. etc.
> 
> ...


:hi:
If I remember - you replace your BMW with non BMW car after your ED (were we miss each other by few days).


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## M FUNF (Apr 2, 2008)

pilotman said:


> Why any of you BMW fan boys would ever consider an Audi (or, gasp, a Benzo) is beyond me....
> 
> : popcorn:


Maybe because my C63 is more grins per mile than the M5 ever was. Sometimes I drink white wine and sometimes I drink red, and then occasionally prefer Irish whiskey as opposed to Scotch.. Oh, and the C63 has more useable power when you want it.:thumbup:


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## rmorin49 (Jan 7, 2007)

pilotman said:


> see, I thought the problem with Audi wasn't the piss poor residuals, but the fact that BMWs are inherently better in almost every way.
> 
> I still hear that the A4 is nothing more than a Passat rofl; the service/dealership experience is terrible, they are FWD based and can never handle as well as the "ultimate driving Machine", etc. etc.
> 
> ...


Not true. The A4 can be had as a front driver, but they are also available with Quattro, Audi's AWD system. The Passat is a FWD based car that I believe can also be equipped with 4Motion, VW's version of AWD. However, I do not believe they are built on the same platform. I've driven BMWs for over 30 years and decided to try an Audi. So far I am very pleased with my A4. No, it does not drive like a BMW but it is a very nicely balanced car and the interior is first class. I considered an ED but it just didn't make economic sense.


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## HerrK (Jan 9, 2010)

Well thought I would revive this old thread for the heck of it, as in general the Audi ED forums are pretty benign. So some information for those of you considering alternatives. We finally pulled the trigger on a Q5 TDI for the wife. She wanted an X3 size vehicle, so we considered all the comparable alternatives but in the end the Audi won out for a few main factors: recent reviews, reliability, our test drive comparisons, TDI option - the engine is a torque monster @ 428 ft-lbs, and last but not least was ED availability (FrauK was born in the Vaterland and so we have another opportunity to vist the many relatives).

We have our confirmed "Commission Number", Audi parlance for BMW's "Production order" for our 2014 Q5 TDI Premium Plus, Cuvée Silver over Pistachio Beige, Walnut Brown Inlays, MMI Nav, & B&O Sound. Planning for a 9 May pickup and we'll be in country for 17 days. The dealer negotiations were relatively painless @ Escondido Audi. The Audi ED paperwork is certainly less rigorous than BMW. Some of this is in direct relation to the VAT. We received our Eurpoean Delivery Welcome Package from Audi the other day. Audi is most definetly up on BMW for the welcome package contents. Audi Logo items; Real Metal Chrome Luggage Name Tag, Leather Trip Diary, Carbon Fiber Pen, Travel Coffe Cup, & Silk Scarf in Audi Silver & Red (wifes favorite).

From my point of view of the two ED programs and I don't really consider all the lease rate banter, as we buy our cars, and tend to keep them in the family for 7-10 yrs.

*Pro's *
1. Audi pays for a night @ Kempinski or a couple locations in Ingolstadt.
2. Free Audi pickup limo from Franz Josef, or in our case Kempinski to Ingolstadt.
3. We have already received our scheduled "Start of Production Date" (31 March) so no guessing, calling the dealer, or checking the Web site - as compared to the BMW system.

*Con's*
1. Not fond of the VAT Payment (due before pickup, at vehicle payment/financing) but not a deal breaker in our opinion. Refunded on return to states and presentation of vehicle return.
2. Not thrilled with Audi not confirming delivery date until the vehicle completes production. Early April in our case now knowing our "Start of Production" date well in advance. In speaking with the gal at Audi ED delivery, BMW could learn from their prompt and friendly ED customer service, she was quite clear our requested delivery date was no problem. 
3. The Audi ED discount was not as deep as BMW's ED, but then again a comparably equiped X3 (gas) version, with ED discount, would come in at about the same price as our Q5 TDI so I'm OK with our negotiated price and we get Diesel on top of it!
4. Audi ED Insurance carries a $1K deductible. Otherwise extension periods are comparably priced.

ED anticipation begins again!


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## basiluf (Dec 16, 2010)

Thanks for the writeup! I also love Audi, but my recent attempt at doing ED for an S4 failed as the dealers I contacted say they do not go below the 5% ED discount. Another local problem I had is for some reason the only Audi dealership in the Orlando area is 45 minutes from my home in awful traffic. I will pass 3 Mercedes Benz and 2 BMW dealerships before I even get to the Audi dealership. 

The new X3 is coming with a diesel option, but it will only be the 2.0 version found in the 328d, meaning it is not performance oriented like the Audi's diesel is. Plus, you can't do ED on the X3 because they're assembled in South Carolina. Even with that, I would still place the Q5 at the top of the class, especially the TDI version. Excellent choice. The Porsche Macan should also be an interesting choice, but I don't believe Porsche gives any ED discount. 

Have fun on your delivery and please post a report of the delivery process when complete.


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## shawn757 (Nov 1, 2008)

dkreidel said:


> My Audi ED experience was a very good one, and the dealer held my VAT check so no funds were "tied up for months."
> 
> I received about 9% off US MSRP on the S6; a pretty good deal on a specialty car. Audi provides airport transportation and 1 nights lodging at the Kempinski, so I'm not sure how Audi is an inferior program :dunno:
> 
> You do need to be able to negotiate well as (at that time) there was no hard ED pricing structure. I'm planning another Audi ED in December '13


If you don't mind can you let me know who this dealer is? Is he in California?


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## dkreidel (Aug 24, 2005)

^^^ Audi Mission Viejo. I have a friend that got an astounding Audi ED deal at McKenna in Norwalk, but I'm not a fan of them

dk


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## shawn757 (Nov 1, 2008)

dkreidel said:


> ^^^ Audi Mission Viejo. I have a friend that got an astounding Audi ED deal at McKenna in Norwalk, but I'm not a fan of them
> 
> dk


McKenna Audi gave your friend a better ED deal than the 9%?


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## FastMarkA (Apr 21, 2008)

Having done both myself, I can't say one is better than the other.

IMO, Audi really crushes BMW with the A8 pick up at MUC and free night of accommodation. 

The Welt bling is cool, but after all, it's just a building. I'd rather be pampered, personally.

Speaking of which, Audi has real restaurants at the Audi Forum instead of a lounge. While a nice touch, I think in both cases, I'm there to get a car (which I can drive to a truly nice restaurant). 

The Audi VAT thing does suck.

Both have great cars and great experiences.


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## MB330 (Oct 18, 2005)

Got this e-mail last month


> Bryan Webster
> Jan 20
> 
> to me
> ...


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## Gluhwein (Aug 21, 2011)

If Audi offered the S1 Sportback as an European Delivery product, I'd be on a plan tonight. That is awesome news regarding the VAT. Now we have some competition.


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## HerrK (Jan 9, 2010)

Delivery of the wife's new Q5 at Ingolstadt on Friday. Certainly the Audi Forum is not as architecturally pleasing as the Welt. Although, I had always thought the food and drink offerings at the Welt premium lounge were special, it is quite pale in comparison to the spread of food available, free of charge, all day long at Audi. A really minor cool thing they do is they sprinkle the Audi ring emblem with chocolate on top of your cappuccino foam. Nice museum and store. If your on ED tour it's worth a stop for any car enthusiast. Touring Germany, France, and Switzerland for the next couple of weeks on cheap diesel fuel. Cranked it up to 120 mph on the autobahn spinning over at a leisurely 2700 rpm. The 3.0 liter TDI is such a torque monster @ 425 ft-lbs. Quiet and steady as a rock, just as you would expect out of any German luxury vehicle.


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## MB330 (Oct 18, 2005)

Congratulation! :thumbup:


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## FastMarkA (Apr 21, 2008)

Cool! Yeah, Audi certainly does a better job of fattening/inebriating its ED buyers than BMW. (Did you stop by their little wine bar?)

Enjoy the trip.


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## CarSwami (Oct 2, 2005)

HerrK said:


> Well thought I would revive this old thread for the heck of it, as in general the Audi ED forums are pretty benign. So some information for those of you considering alternatives. We finally pulled the trigger on a Q5 TDI for the wife. She wanted an X3 size vehicle, so we considered all the comparable alternatives but in the end the Audi won out for a few main factors: recent reviews, reliability, our test drive comparisons, TDI option - the engine is a torque monster @ 428 ft-lbs, and last but not least was ED availability (FrauK was born in the Vaterland and so we have another opportunity to vist the many relatives).
> 
> We have our confirmed "Commission Number", Audi parlance for BMW's "Production order" for our 2014 Q5 TDI Premium Plus, Cuvée Silver over Pistachio Beige, Walnut Brown Inlays, MMI Nav, & B&O Sound. Planning for a 9 May pickup and we'll be in country for 17 days. The dealer negotiations were relatively painless @ Escondido Audi. The Audi ED paperwork is certainly less rigorous than BMW. Some of this is in direct relation to the VAT. We received our Eurpoean Delivery Welcome Package from Audi the other day. Audi is most definetly up on BMW for the welcome package contents. Audi Logo items; Real Metal Chrome Luggage Name Tag, Leather Trip Diary, Carbon Fiber Pen, Travel Coffe Cup, & Silk Scarf in Audi Silver & Red (wifes favorite).
> 
> ...


I hope that you and FrauK are having a great time doing the Audi ED. I hope that you will post a summary of your experiences when you return because there are a few of us who want to purchase an SUV and are considering the Audi line-up in addition to BMW's.

Also, can you clarify how much in advance you received confirmation of your delivery date? I ask this question because I normally like to get my airline tickets well in advance of my travel date since I use airline miles to get the tickets.


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## Gluhwein (Aug 21, 2011)

I was really, really thinking about switching brands but now that I know they only discount the MSRP by "up to 5%" on European Delivery, why bother?


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## MB330 (Oct 18, 2005)

Gluhwein said:


> I was really, really thinking about switching brands but now that I know they only discount the MSRP by "up to 5%" on European Delivery, why bother?


Because you not doing ED for the money - you doing this for experience.


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## dandanio (Jun 20, 2008)

MB330 said:


> Because you not doing ED for the money - you doing this for experience.


I am surprised MB330 you still have strength and determination to explain the aforementioned to all the wanna-be trolls here.


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