# need something more practical, Jetta TDI Sportwagen? WRX?



## Chris90 (Apr 7, 2003)

With 1st baby on the way, we're thinking of getting something more roomy than my 330i or my wife's WRX sedan. 

I wanted a GTI 5 door but seeing it in person the trunk is tiny, like 1 ft deep. The Jetta TDI sportwagen in the showroom seemed more suitable - it's kinda ugly but I like German cars and it's only like $25k. 

A new WRX hatch is also an option, but the trunk's not that big.


----------



## brkf (May 26, 2003)

Why do you need such a big trunk?

We've had our A3 (essentially a GTI with a deeper trunk) since before our son was born. It's never been short on space for him or the few things kids really need. My e90 had a ton of space - far more than we ever needed for him. Really, only my Cooper was too small.


----------



## AzNMpower32 (Oct 23, 2005)

The Golf TDI or the GTI (same car essentially) are a good size but I'm not sure what you're trying to fit in there.

The Jetta Sportwagen (which is actually a Golf Wagen in other markets) is also a good choice, especially the TDI. I see lots of them and for good reason.


----------



## Carraway (Sep 16, 2010)

Other than those, what about the Audi A4 Avant or Acura TSX Sportwagon? Another, less expensive option would be a Mazda 3 or Mazdaspeed 3 five door. Given your location, I'm going to guess you have a few Subaru Outbacks around, as well. Maybe even Subaru Legacy Wagons?


----------



## Chris90 (Apr 7, 2003)

Carraway said:


> Other than those, what about the Audi A4 Avant or Acura TSX Sportwagon? Another, less expensive option would be a Mazda 3 or Mazdaspeed 3 five door. Given your location, I'm going to guess you have a few Subaru Outbacks around, as well. Maybe even Subaru Legacy Wagons?


Audis are too expensive and never liked Mazdas when i drive them. Legacy is nice but maybe a little big.


----------



## 02BMW530 (Nov 19, 2010)

530i? Very nice size trunk, a blast to drive and very well equipped, low mileage E39s go for 50-75% of what you'll pay for a new car. 


Sent from my iPhone using BimmerApp


----------



## Chris90 (Apr 7, 2003)

02BMW530 said:


> 530i? Very nice size trunk, a blast to drive and very well equipped, low mileage E39s go for 50-75% of what you'll pay for a new car.


Very tempting, but if we keep the 330i, which is probably what we'll do, we won't go that way. Factoring maintenance in, they're still more expensive than something like a Jetta wagon. My wife wants a hatch too.


----------



## Chris90 (Apr 7, 2003)

blueguydotcom said:


> Why do you need such a big trunk?


We'll probably often have the baby and my father in law, who's gonna be sitting, so with that tiny trunk it probably is too small.


----------



## 02BMW530 (Nov 19, 2010)

Chris90 said:


> Very tempting, but if we keep the 330i, which is probably what we'll do, we won't go that way. Factoring maintenance in, they're still more expensive than something like a Jetta wagon. My wife wants a hatch too.


I respect that. To me, one BMW is doable, two is bleeding the piggy bank.

My vote is for the Golf TDi - nearly GTI in it's ways but with 45 mpg. I'm a bit confused about your trunk assessment, my neighbor's 130 lb lab mix jumps in and out of it with no problems. The whole car shakes like a bronco when he does it, but that's not the cars fault!

What about the Matrix? The GT is pretty nice.

Sent from my iPhone using BimmerApp


----------



## Chris90 (Apr 7, 2003)

02BMW530 said:


> I respect that. To me, one BMW is doable, two is bleeding the piggy bank.
> 
> My vote is for the Golf TDi - nearly GTI in it's ways but with 45 mpg. I'm a bit confused about your trunk assessment, my neighbor's 130 lb lab mix jumps in and out of it with no problems. The whole car shakes like a bronco when he does it, but that's not the cars fault!
> 
> What about the Matrix? The GT is pretty nice.


Is that with the seats down or up? The 2 door actually has a bigger trunk than 4 door too.

I'd love a GTI but just worried about the trunk space.

No Matrix, trying to avoid buying Japanese. Only considering buying a Subaru cause my wife loves her WRX. At least the Jetta wagon is made in Tennessee.


----------



## 02BMW530 (Nov 19, 2010)

Chris90 said:


> Is that with the seats down or up? The 2 door actually has a bigger trunk than 4 door too.
> 
> I'd love a GTI but just worried about the trunk space.
> 
> No Matrix, trying to avoid buying Japanese. Only considering buying a Subaru cause my wife loves her WRX. At least the Jetta wagon is made in Tennessee.


2 door, seats up (the three of them sit in it too). They say they're comfortable in it and the one usually stuck in the back is about 6' 5" and 275 well built Brazillian pounds. We go to the gym together and benches about 600, he's a beast.

Unless your father-in-law is Chris Farley, he should be alright, just a small hassle of the in-and-out.

Sent from my iPhone using BimmerApp


----------



## 6 Brit (Jan 19, 2009)

blueguydotcom said:


> *Why do you need such a big trunk*?
> 
> We've had our A3 (essentially a GTI with a deeper trunk) since before our son was born. It's never been short on space for him or the few things kids really need. My e90 had a ton of space - far more than we ever needed for him. Really, only my Cooper was too small.


to put the baby in duh...

I like both. I personally would get a WRX but the jetta is probably safer, for the baby.

My dad has the TDI jetta wagon and LOVES it.


----------



## Chris90 (Apr 7, 2003)

02BMW530 said:


> 2 door, seats up (the three of them sit in it too). They say they're comfortable in it and the one usually stuck in the back is about 6' 5" and 275 well built Brazillian pounds. We go to the gym together and benches about 600, he's a beast.
> 
> Unless your father-in-law is Chris Farley, he should be alright, just a small hassle of the in-and-out.


Interesting, I'll check it out, they had only the 3 door last time.

There's plenty room in the rear, it's just the trunk space with seats folded up I'm worried about.


----------



## jatbeni (May 28, 2010)

The Jetta SportWagen TDI seems like an excellent choice. I test drove one, before I got the 128i... quite likes it. 

I love hatchbacks and wagons too, and I would get the SportWagen over the Golf TDI for one major reason. The SportWagen had the leatherette option which is missing in the Golf TDI. The Golf TDI for some reason only comes with the fabric seats, with no other option available. May prove useful in keeping it clean, specially with the baby. 

And you can always put that extra space to good use. Not to mention the wonderful panoramic moon-roof.


----------



## Chris90 (Apr 7, 2003)

jatbeni said:


> The Jetta SportWagen TDI seems like an excellent choice. I test drove one, before I got the 128i... quite likes it.
> 
> I love hatchbacks and wagons too, and I would get the SportWagen over the Golf TDI for one major reason. The SportWagen had the leatherette option which is missing in the Golf TDI. The Golf TDI for some reason only comes with the fabric seats, with no other option available. May prove useful in keeping it clean, specially with the baby.
> 
> And you can always put that extra space to good use. Not to mention the wonderful panoramic moon-roof.


How does the Jetta drive compared to the 128? I've driven a 2008 GTI and thought it was great, in normal commuter driving it felt a lot like my 330i.

I'm not a big fan of our 2002 WRX, though my wife loves it. When you're flogging it, I love it, but when driving like a normal person, it's very econobox, with clunky shifter too. A blast in the snow, but here in Mass winters, mostly you drive on salt, not much actual snow.

For this reason I'm wary of getting another WRX - I hear they've lost a lot of driving involvement.


----------



## AndrewZ (Feb 1, 2006)

Jetta Wagon TDI FTW!


----------



## jatbeni (May 28, 2010)

I owned a 2003 GTI VR6 - and like that car, the Jetta drove a little front heavy, with a greater propensity to let the nose do the leading, than say - the 128i. But still well planted - and not too different than the Golf. Mind you, this was a test drive in suburban Chicago - which is quite flat. And the diesel equipped test car was quite precious to the dealership - they almost wanted a premium for it - so my test drive was a little short. 

I wanted one, because I quite liked the engine for its combination of fuel economy and flat power delivery. So that would be the highlight to focus on... 

Overall, I think the Jetta SportWagen is the best use of that 2.0 TDI - you get pretty good quality for not too much money. And, I believe that it is still based somewhat on the Golf - rather than the cheaper new Jetta.


----------



## asindc (Mar 9, 2005)

How about a MINI Countryman? It is in the Bimmer family (heck, it's basically a MINI-styled BMW) and would definitely solve the cargo space issue. The Countrymen that are arriving in the U.S. now have just two bucket seats in the back, but the word is that bench back seats (already available in Europe) will be available here later this year.


----------



## Chris90 (Apr 7, 2003)

Golf 5 door trunk picture (those front seats are the R's $5200 optional Recaros).










Man, I want the R. Wonder how it compares to the ZHP.


----------



## Chris90 (Apr 7, 2003)

asindc said:


> How about a MINI Countryman? It is in the Bimmer family (heck, it's basically a MINI-styled BMW) and would definitely solve the cargo space issue. The Countrymen that are arriving in the U.S. now have just two bucket seats in the back, but the word is that bench back seats (already available in Europe) will be available here later this year.


Yeah, I saw some in Germany last year. Downside is it's very expensive, $30k+ with AWD and some decent options. Never really liked the retro styling of the Minis either, and I don't like how the newer gen drives nearly as much as the 1st gen.


----------



## Chris90 (Apr 7, 2003)

RicN said:


> what about used lexus ES or GS?


meh


----------



## AzNMpower32 (Oct 23, 2005)

RicN said:


> what about used lexus ES or GS?


A luxury appliance and nothing else more. It's about as dull as a car can get.


----------



## RicN (Dec 23, 2002)

Chris90 said:


> meh


you might not like the lexus but your wife, coming from a WRX, will appreciate the big trunk and roomy interior. it's quiet and feels luxurious inside. these cars can be had for very good prices. I don't own any lexus but rode in 3 of my friends ES/GS and I liked it. If I were married and had kids and were looking for a roomy sedans, the lexus ES/GS would be my choice for relatively good price compared to more expensive german cars.


----------



## equ (Aug 11, 2004)

Test drive a TDI. I drove a golf TDI and it's great, I wouldn't even call it soft, certainly not for northeast roads. It's one of those rare cars that is 'just right'. Not luxo but really spot on.

If we didn't already have a '10 a4, we would buy one yesterday for girlfriend's commute.


----------



## Chris90 (Apr 7, 2003)

RicN said:


> you might not like the lexus but your wife, coming from a WRX, will appreciate the big trunk and roomy interior. it's quiet and feels luxurious inside. these cars can be had for very good prices. I don't own any lexus but rode in 3 of my friends ES/GS and I liked it. If I were married and had kids and were looking for a roomy sedans, the lexus ES/GS would be my choice for relatively good price compared to more expensive german cars.


My wife won't buy an automatic. And the WRX drives completely different from those cars, even an IS. It's much more raw and sporty, heavy clutch etc. I do like the GS, but it's probably too big for us as well.



equ said:


> Test drive a TDI. I drove a golf TDI and it's great, I wouldn't even call it soft, certainly not for northeast roads. It's one of those rare cars that is 'just right'. Not luxo but really spot on.


I imagine the Jetta TDI sportwagen isn't quite as fun as a Golf TDI, but we will test drive it. I think I'd buy the GTI if buying Golf, just cause it's got a great engine. The regular Jetta Sportwagen has kind of a crappy engine.


----------



## Griffoun (Jan 19, 2006)

No SUV for you?

Japanese:
Lexus CT200h
http://www.lexus.com/models/CTh/

European, other than VW:
BMW 550i GT
MB R-Class
Volvo C30


----------



## AzNMpower32 (Oct 23, 2005)

Chris90 said:


> I imagine the Jetta TDI sportwagen isn't quite as fun as a Golf TDI, but we will test drive it. I think I'd buy the GTI if buying Golf, just cause it's got a great engine. The regular Jetta Sportwagen has kind of a crappy engine.


I don't know why VW still uses the archaic 5 cylinder engine on base models. It must be REALLY cheap to produce or something because it's an old design that hasn't been used in rest of the world for ages and certainly isn't as efficient as the DI 4-cylinders used elsewhere. TDI is the only way to go for the Jetta/Golf wagon/Golf.

My parents are nudging me towards replacing my X3 and I'm kind of in the same boat, thinking about the VW Golf TDI. The problem is, VW watered it down in a few ways and I'd be super-tempted to modify it to European specs, like adding the parking lights and rear foglights. That's time, money, and a whole lot of effort I don't want to go through again, since I did that already with my X3, and was a PITA.  (But it'll drive me nuts if I don't tweak it either!)

Plus, the X3 is so fun in the bends and the engine sounds so sweet. It just "feels" more exciting. But my parents probably just care about the potential upcoming repair bills........:tsk:


----------



## Andrew*Debbie (Jul 2, 2004)

If you don't want the Subaru, or a Countryman you are mostly left with the German cars. 

Mazda 3??? I haven't driven one since 2007 but they were worth a look back then.


Countryman is a new platform. In the UK it is aimed squarely at the Golf segment. Too bad they aren't offering the diesels in the US. If you play around with the options you might be able to get one in your price range :dunno: We sat in one a last month. Real back seat. Real big compared to MINI Hatch. Really don't want one.

Too bad a Clubman won't work for you. Price and fuel economy are what you are looking for. Downside is the FWD and annoying switches / radio controls. 

With petrol at £1.35/litre and rising we LIKE our Cooper  But it isn't a BMW


----------



## Chris90 (Apr 7, 2003)

I do like the Countryman but my wife doesn't. She does like the X3 (used), but not sure it's big enough to justify the cost. 

If we go SUV we'd probably go CRV or Ford Escape, rather than the more expensive ones. I'd rather get something cheaper that we won't care about getting dirty or beating on, and save the car money for fun cars, like a used Cayman someday.


----------



## Andrew*Debbie (Jul 2, 2004)

Chris90 said:


> I'd rather get something cheaper that we won't care about getting dirty or beating on, and save the car money for fun cars, like a used Cayman someday.


Thats a good plan. We bought a 5 year old Vauxhall Combo van to haul the dogs around and generally get dirty. The van is powered by a 1.25L Fiat diesel engine. It is slow and has the driving dynamics of a stale marshmallow but it is cheap to run.

The MINI is our 'nice' car.


----------



## Chris90 (Apr 7, 2003)

Andrew*Debbie said:


> Thats a good plan. We bought a 5 year old Vauxhall Combo van to haul the dogs around and generally get dirty. The van is powered by a 1.25L Fiat diesel engine. It is slow and has the driving dynamics of a stale marshmallow but it is really cheap to run.


We don't have dogs, but the cats barfed a few times (each) in the Subaru.


----------



## Griffoun (Jan 19, 2006)

Chris90 said:


> I do like the Countryman but my wife doesn't. She does like the X3 (used), but not sure it's big enough to justify the cost.
> 
> If we go SUV we'd probably go CRV or Ford Escape, rather than the more expensive ones. I'd rather get something cheaper that we won't care about getting dirty or beating on, and save the car money for fun cars, like a used Cayman someday.


My Honda Fit got beat up by kids pretty well, do I'd skip the lux cars as kid hauler. Also, you'll regret having a stick-shift for kid hauler too.


----------



## MCSL (Jan 30, 2005)

Ford Focus SE Road Test

"The new Ford Focus is the best small car for sale in America today."

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...ocus_se_hatchback_manual-short_take_road_test


----------



## brkf (May 26, 2003)

Griffoun said:


> My Honda Fit got beat up by kids pretty well, do I'd skip the lux cars as kid hauler. Also, you'll regret having a stick-shift for kid hauler too.


Why? I had two manuals with my kid. My bro-in-law's only had manuals with his 8 year. For what reason is a manual a bad idea with a kid?


----------



## too tall (Jul 10, 2010)

MCSL said:


> Ford Focus SE Road Test
> 
> "The new Ford Focus is the best small car for sale in America today."
> 
> http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...ocus_se_hatchback_manual-short_take_road_test


From an enthusiast viewpoint, the VW GTI trumps the Ford Focus in the FWD class.


----------



## eazy (Aug 20, 2002)

too tall said:


> From an enthusiast viewpoint, the VW GTI trumps the Ford Focus in the FWD class.


the regular focus and the gti are in a different class. However the upcoming focus ST is going to be a competitor to the GTI


----------



## brkf (May 26, 2003)

eazy said:


> the regular focus and the gti are in a different class. However the upcoming focus ST is going to be a competitor to the GTI


Yeah, with the Focus SE ringing in around 20k with a sport package, it's not exactly positioned to fight the GTI. Now an ST (with an ecoboost turbo) poised to battle the aging GTI...yeah a case can probably be made.

One thing, the new Jetta is severely decontented from the last gen. I wonder if the next gen GTI will suffer the same fate?


----------



## AzNMpower32 (Oct 23, 2005)

blueguydotcom said:


> Yeah, with the Focus SE ringing in around 20k with a sport package, it's not exactly positioned to fight the GTI. Now an ST (with an ecoboost turbo) poised to battle the aging GTI...yeah a case can probably be made.
> 
> One thing, the new Jetta is severely decontented from the last gen. I wonder if the next gen GTI will suffer the same fate?


Probably not. The Jetta is intended to be a volume-seller for the masses. The Golf/GTI are more niche models.

The problem with the Jetta and Passat was that while they were supposed to be volume players for VW America, they were too expensive and "specialised" compared to other cars like the Hondas, Toyotas, Fords, etc....The solution was to do what average car-shopping Americans care about: lower the price.

Rule #1 for selling a car in the US: Water it down as much as possible.

On the other hand, your GTI/Golf driver does not want a midsize sedan washing machine. He/she wants a European hatchback. He/she will notice the lack of independent rear suspension, proper interior padding, and missing details. Then again, there are relatively few of these here. And since the main market for these cars is in Europe and not here, there's probably not much decontenting in the future.

That said, VW royally f-ed up the packaging structure for the 2012 Golf TDI. Enough to turn me away for the time being. :thumbdwn:


----------



## too tall (Jul 10, 2010)

Get a 3 series wagon, new, CPO, or out of warranty. That's what I did after trying the Mini, WRX and Audi A3 in between E46s. There is nothing that compares with driving a car that has near 50/50 weight distribution. You will be happy every time you drive.


----------



## eazy (Aug 20, 2002)

AzNMpower32 said:


> Probably not. The Jetta is intended to be a volume-seller for the masses. The Golf/GTI are more niche models.
> 
> The problem with the Jetta and Passat was that while they were supposed to be volume players for VW America, they were too expensive and "specialised" compared to other cars like the Hondas, Toyotas, Fords, etc....The solution was to do what average car-shopping Americans care about: lower the price.
> 
> ...


That not true it seems VW did not learn their lesson 30 years ago when they started to build the rabbit in PA. VW is going to end paying the price in the long by making the jetta crappy. Chevy and Ford are having success in the compact class by moving their cars more upmarket. 
in Europe the Golf and the Focus are the only cars in its class that have a independent rear suspension, other cars like the C4, 308, Astra, & megane have a non independent torsion beam suspension.

I do not think the new Passat is going to be a big Sales success since it looks too much like a camry.


----------

