# Fiancee considering the purchase of a 3-series - need advice



## speedemn (Nov 21, 2004)

Hi there,

My fiancee is considering the purchase of a 3-series sedan between 2002 to the brand new 2005 model. However, I wanted to get some advice and recommendations from current owners and enthusiasts. I am hoping that you can answer some questions for me.

Most likely she will be going for the 325 or 330. The 320 just seemed to lack some of the options that should be standard on a car of this class and it seemed as though it would cost more to add those options to make it equal to a 325 at least (minus the stronger motor of the 325). She will be getting a manual transmission.

1) Is there any advantage to going with a later model 325/330... were there any note-worthy changes between the years of 02-05 that would make the later model a better buy?

2) In terms of ongoing maintenance and upkeep, how expensive (or not) is it, to own one of these cars? 

3) In terms of little maintanance and repairs that might crop up later in the life of this car, is it something that DIY car guy like me can handle or will I have to run to the dealership, everytime something goes wrong, because of the car being too "unique" and not like any other car to work on?

If I can think of any more questions I will post more later; if any of my questions need clarification please feel free to ask. I want to be able to get a clear understanding of what I/she would be getting in to.

Thanks for your time, all.


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## dev (Dec 23, 2003)

> 1) Is there any advantage to going with a later model 325/330... were there any note-worthy changes between the years of 02-05 that would make the later model a better buy?


I bought a later model (2003 330i in 2004) because then you have the car under full warranty and free maintenance for a longer time period.

Other than that reason, there are some smaller differences between those model years. I think there are differences between what came as standard features versus what were options.


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## pony_trekker (May 26, 2003)

speedemn said:


> Hi there,
> 
> My fiancee is considering the purchase of a 3-series sedan between 2002 to the brand new 2005 model. However, I wanted to get some advice and recommendations from current owners and enthusiasts. I am hoping that you can answer some questions for me.
> 
> ...


1. There are little things (bluetooth, etc.) but the models are essentially the same 2002 to 2005.

2. Within warranty --not expensive at all. Just about everything except gas is free w/in 1st 50k miles. Plenty of odd little problems, thermostat, window regulators, ignition coils creep up.

3. The cars are fairly easy to repair for DIYers unlike FWD japanese cars, which have so much crap stuffed in there you can't wiggle a socket wrench.


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## commander_crash (Jun 10, 2004)

the big things that stick out in my mind are that newer models like 2003,2004, and 2005 have BMW Assist which is handy for a lot of things. Other than that - the new car warranty is definitely worth the extra cash - every once in a while something big breaks and it's nice to have it fully covered. I also enjoy knowing exactly where the car has been and how hard its been driven.


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## speedemn (Nov 21, 2004)

Thanks for all the advice so far. 

I will have to ask my local dealer what the warranty options are - price/coverage/duration/etc. Reason being - if it would cost me $2000 for example, to have coverage for another 2 years (if I am buying a car that is 2 years old) then it might not be worth my while to pay that - unless it comes with free maintenance too... it is a question of spending that money all up front or MAYBE having to spend it over an extended period of time. The final purchase price of the car will have to have that worked into it or something.

But if the amenities inside the car are pretty standard through those years, then that eliminates one worry of having to search for this option and that, which may or may not be available in a certain year.

She should be satisfied with the motor of a 325, but if we can get a good deal on a used 330 then we might just get that... from what I have seen these cars depreciate 20% - 25% in the first year and then about 10%-15% over the next year. Is that a fair estimation?


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## schreck (Jul 29, 2004)

speedemn said:


> Thanks for all the advice so far.
> 
> I will have to ask my local dealer what the warranty options are - price/coverage/duration/etc. Reason being - if it would cost me $2000 for example, to have coverage for another 2 years (if I am buying a car that is 2 years old) then it might not be worth my while to pay that - unless it comes with free maintenance too... it is a question of spending that money all up front or MAYBE having to spend it over an extended period of time. The final purchase price of the car will have to have that worked into it or something.
> 
> ...


Not even close.


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## speedemn (Nov 21, 2004)

schreck said:


> Not even close.


What would be a fairer estimation then?

I just went by prices in the classifieds in Ontario, Canada.


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## jerrykdc (May 6, 2003)

*325 does not have resale value that 330 does.*

It's been my experience that a 325 does not have the resale vaule that a 330 does but that can be to your advantage if you buy one a year or two old. The certified program makes a used one very attractive from a dealer and you can extend the maintenace out to 6 years 100K for about $1,000. This means that you will have no maintenance costs and little chance for any major expenses for a long time. Should be great buys on 05 in the spring when E90 comes out.


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## jan325xi (Sep 28, 2004)

Let me give you a female (and very practical female) take on your fiance's purchase (and I am an ex-Ontarioite as well). I recently purchased a 2005 325xi. It was originally my intent to buy a used 2002. After alot of research, I found the difference in price was not huge between the used models and the new models - some of the reasons for this was the used models had more options and often options that I was not interested in. I believed that the new warranty was worth the difference. The options I was not interested in was the sports package - which seemed to be on alot of the used cars. The main problem I had with the sport model was the tires - not practical for the winter etc - (the guys are probably groaning right now). I liked the leather seats but it was not a big deal for me - I went with the vinyl - looks good, lasts longer, les maintenance and will likely not impact resale (saved some bucks here). It seemed like I was only looking at a few thousand dollars difference.

What was important to me was the Xenon headlights and all wheel drive - if I was still in Toronto I probably wouldn't go for the Xenon's but in the rural areas where deer are jumping out everywhere - I need them. I also like the all wheel drive. Rear wheel drive (in my opinion) is just not great in the winter without changing tires. The 325 has ample power - I don't think she would be dissapointed and unless speed is a huge issue - it doesn't seem worth the difference in price

Anyway...some food for thought. Some of us ladies are a tad bit more practical than you guys and I thought your fiance may have some of these same traits.


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## norihaga (Aug 25, 2004)

speedemn said:


> Hi there,
> 
> My fiancee is considering the purchase of a 3-series sedan between 2002 to the brand new 2005 model. However, I wanted to get some advice and recommendations from current owners and enthusiasts. I am hoping that you can answer some questions for me.
> 
> ...


Hm, your fiancee prefers manual gearboxes? Geez, something else you Canadians have over us... 

1. There was a facelift for 2003 onwards - might as well get an '03. Note that BMW makes rolling "under the skin" changes to its cars, so an early production car in a given model year may be different from a later one. Arguably better to buy a late-production car than an early one.

2. BMW dealers in the states have on-demand access to a centralized database that stores each car's maintenance records when work has been performed by any networked BMW dealer. When looking at used cars, make sure you get them to give you a print-out of this, and write down the meaning of the service codes at the bottom. Make the service department write it down for you so they can't give you a dishonest account of what the codes mean. That will give you some idea if you're looking at a "problem car".

The 3-series has a "self-adjusting" clutch which engages very high (c. halfway through the lever's travel) even from the factory. This makes it tough to tell how the clutch was treated by the last owner, so you should pay very careful attention to the used stick-shifts and try to pick out evidence that the clutch is grabbing, chattering or otherwise on its way out. It will not be obvious the way it would in a Japanese car. Best thing is to have her drive a brand new demo car, and then hop in the used ones, so she can see what the new clutch should feel like.

As far as costs, while the evidence here is anecdotal, most would agree, I think, that our cars have less issues than (at least older) Audis, and certainly VWs, but more and more expensive problems than most Japanese cars. Do searches on "control arms", brakes and window regulators for some examples. I would _not_ describe the out-of-warranty costs on either maintenance or breakdowns as minor, unless you are lucky in your choice of car, and don't do many miles. Owning this car may be an expensive experience if you're out of the main factory warranty.

Be aware that if the Canadian pre-owned warranty is like our US one, there are many exclusions. If you are familiar with Japanese cars, this may not seem like a problem, until you realize that most of the problems that are likely to occur have been excluded!

3. Many basic things can be done DIY, and many are even easier than on a FWD car, as someone else already noted. E.g., if you want to do an oil change, the filter housing is on TOP of the engine, not on the sump, so if you buy a vacuum-type oil extractor, you can do an oil change without lifting the car or touching the sump plug! Similarly, plug changes are likely to be as easy as an i4 Camry. But any problem to do with the drive-by-wire system (yes, they exist!) or the electronics you will probably need to go to the dealer - unless you're a mechanic and an electrical engineer.


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## norihaga (Aug 25, 2004)

speedemn said:


> Thanks for all the advice so far.
> 
> I will have to ask my local dealer what the warranty options are - price/coverage/duration/etc. Reason being - if it would cost me $2000 for example, to have coverage for another 2 years (if I am buying a car that is 2 years old) then it might not be worth my while to pay that - unless it comes with free maintenance too... it is a question of spending that money all up front or MAYBE having to spend it over an extended period of time. The final purchase price of the car will have to have that worked into it or something.
> 
> ...


The 325 is actually an excellent motor with a stick shift.

Please note again, I don't know what the extended BMW warranties are like in Canada, but the US one has MANY exclusions that keep out common and costly failure items. A car with meaningful original factory warranty left is a very good idea.


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## jan325xi (Sep 28, 2004)

Forgot to mention that my 325 XI is also a stick (hmm...is this really only a Canadian girl thing) I love it and no concerns at all with power!


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## norihaga (Aug 25, 2004)

jan325xi said:


> Forgot to mention that my 325 XI is also a stick (hmm...is this really only a Canadian girl thing) I love it and no concerns at all with power!


Over here I think everyone learns to drive in an automatic. My completely unscientific survey of friends, colleagues, acquaintences and family members says that men and women under 30, but especially women, no longer know how to drive a stick.

This is, of course, nobody's business but theirs, but does lead to the minor irritation for myself and stick-owning friends of having one's girlfriend or spouse whining about being unable to drive the car.

I don't know about Canada, but in Britain the highger gas prices, VAT on new cars, and lower per capita income mean that people would much rather not pay for the auto box and the reduced gas mileage.


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## FenPhen (Jan 13, 2004)

norihaga said:


> This is, of course, nobody's business but theirs, but does lead to the minor irritation for myself and stick-owning friends of having one's girlfriend or spouse whining about being unable to drive the car.


If you treat your car like a second girlfriend (the way you clean it, park it, try to avoid potholes and tailing people for stone chips), this isn't really a bad thing.


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