# Keep 335d or get 535d?



## A8540TDI (Jan 2, 2011)

My 335d is nearing lease end and I'm in a dilemma! The new 328d is somewhat underwhelming - the steering is not the greatest either, so I struck it off my list and tried the 535d. With the 8 speed it feels just as potent as the 335d, but is a car with a completely different character and, although they are offering me a good deal , I just can't seem to work up much enthusiasm for it. I'm realizing the the E90 335d is hard to beat as a drivers diesel! Only the Audi A7 TDI comes close, but at a hefty price penalty. The residual on my d is above market value but I hope there is room for negotiation if I decide to buy. Has anyone out there made the switch from 335d to 535d? If yes, I'd love to hear your comments on your experience.


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## Pat_X5 (Aug 23, 2008)

I was in the same spot.
The 328d was a chevy cruze in disguise.
The 535d is very nice, very plush but very soft on the ride with the numb EPS.
Even with the dynamic handling option, it still does not handle, track and accelerate as well as the 335d.
After test driving all the competition too (Audi, Merc, Cadillac, Volvo), I was very sad to see the 335d go away...

In the end, I got the last of the hydraulic steering X5 diesel and I am VERY happy!
Something about the feel of the road and circumferntial forces that makes driving fun!

Keep the 335d or get an E70 if there are any left.....


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## GreekboyD (Jan 25, 2012)

Why not look at the A6 TDI? Weighs less and even faster than the A7 TDI.

0-60 in 5.5 secs.


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## kanar200 (Feb 15, 2011)

audi.de

A6 Limousine
3.0 TDI clean diesel
180 kW (245 PS)

Beschleunigung 0-100 km/h : 6,2 s


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## GreekboyD (Jan 25, 2012)

audi.ca has it at 5.7 secs

Seen various other sites having it between 5.3 - 5.5 secs.


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## untdrums (Apr 22, 2013)

I drove a 535d a few months ago and while it was more comfortable, spacious and had a lot of great shiny new options (updated iDrive, HUD, adjustable damping system, etc), it was not nearly as engaging or enjoyable to drive as the 335d. The engine and transmission combo is smoother than ours and the cabin or hood seems more insulated from the engine noise. However, the steering and driving dynamics convinced me to stay with the 335d for a while.


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## A8540TDI (Jan 2, 2011)

So the A6 has about the same performance as the 335d/535d, but driving is more than 0-60. I drove the A7 and liked it, and given that the A6 is identical mechanically, it should drive the same way, I'll check it out. Don't too care for the gaping maw Audi sees fit to burden the front of all it's models with and the rest of the styling is rather bland. I prefer the styling of BMW's but fear the company is abandoning it's roots as primarily a drivers car! Pity. More and more, I think I may drive the 335d until the wheels fall off!


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## GreekboyD (Jan 25, 2012)

A8540TDI said:


> So the A6 has about the same performance as the 335d/535d, but driving is more than 0-60. I drove the A7 and liked it, and given that the A6 is identical mechanically, it should drive the same way, I'll check it out. Don't too care for the gaping maw Audi sees fit to burden the front of all it's models with and the rest of the styling is rather bland. I prefer the styling of BMW's but fear the company is abandoning it's roots as primarily a drivers car! Pity. More and more, I think I may drive the 335d until the wheels fall off!


I'm not feeling the look of the new Bimmers at all so far. I've heard that the A6 TDI provides better mpg than the 535d but IMO it's still way too early to believe that as a fact.


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## tonyspumoni (May 23, 2010)

If you like your 335d there are quite a few on Autotrader with low miles. 35k for a top shelf 2011 335d with lots of warranty left or just about half of what you would pay to buy a 535d. No idea tho how that would compare to a 535d lease.

I am definitey thinking about those Audi TDIs as well. Performance wise they sound on paper like a good replacement for the 335d but they look plain to my eye and several friends with A4s could not wait to get rid of them owing to very poor quality builds and lots of issues.


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## quasimodem (Nov 9, 2011)

It's a shame BMW couldnt continue the availability of the e9x series well into the production of the f3x series. Then maybe they would have no excuse for discontinuing the 335d in the U.S. since the e90 335d had passed all those "expensive" U.S. certifications and whatnot. I dont suggest anybody here go to the German BMW website and see what is available there.


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## A8540TDI (Jan 2, 2011)

I don't see why they could not offer an F30 335d with the exact same engine and transmission as the 535d - an engine already certified in the USA. When it comes to diesel, we really get shortchanged over our German counterparts!


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## 335dFan (Nov 8, 2012)

A8540TDI said:


> I don't see why they could not offer an F30 335d with the exact same engine and transmission as the 535d - an engine already certified in the USA. When it comes to diesel, we really get shortchanged over our German counterparts!


Imagine if they offered three diesel options for the 3-, 5-, and 7-series: 2.0L, 3.0L as in the 535d, and 3.0L as in the M550D. Eureka! Bonanza!

P.S. I guess I shouldn't leave out the other "newer" series either.


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## GreekboyD (Jan 25, 2012)

I know some people have an allegiance to certain brands when it comes to cars and other items alike. I personally don't. I'm a diesel guy first and foremost so I'll cross shop them all when that time comes. I try to explain that to some of my buddies who claim I'm a "Bimmer" guy merely because I own one. Don't get me wrong. I love my 335d but there is nothing keeping me chained to BMW and BMW only when looking for another vehicle in 2-3 years. 

My D is still under warranty, totally paid off and has only 45,000 kms on it so I'm in no rush to get rid of it especially considering the money I've put into the suspension upgrades, etc.


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## 335dFan (Nov 8, 2012)

GreekboyD said:


> I know some people have an allegiance to certain brands when it comes to cars and other items alike. I personally don't. I'm a diesel guy first and foremost so I'll cross shop them all when that time comes. I try to explain that to some of my buddies who claim I'm a "Bimmer" guy merely because I own one. Don't get me wrong. I love my 335d but there is nothing keeping me chained to BMW and BMW only when looking for another vehicle in 2-3 years.
> 
> My D is still under warranty, totally paid off and has only 45,000 kms on it so I'm in no rush to get rid of it especially considering the money I've put into the suspension upgrades, etc.


Ditto


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## F32Fleet (Jul 14, 2010)

A8540TDI said:


> I don't see why they could not offer an F30 335d with the exact same engine and transmission as the 535d - an engine already certified in the USA. When it comes to diesel, we really get shortchanged over our German counterparts!


You never know. BMW wasn't supposed to bring the 1 series to the US either.Supposedly


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## stevehecht (Apr 13, 2007)

OP--

You might want to consider getting a tuning box for the 328d, that's what I'm planning on doing. Or ECU mapping but I don't want to worry about having a hassle with the dealership if the engine malfunctions for some reason. Tuning bozes will give you anywhere from 20-40% more hp and lbs/ft for a lot less than the difference between an A6 TDi and the 328d.


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## d geek (Nov 26, 2008)

A8540TDI said:


> I don't see why they could not offer an F30 335d with the exact same engine and transmission as the 535d - an engine already certified in the USA. When it comes to diesel, we really get shortchanged over our German counterparts!


They need to certify the drivetrain on every chassis, so there are costs associated with that.

I think we are seeing a careful rollout of diesel models. Diesel is one important component of reaching the very aggressive CAFE goals for auto mfrs. Over the next few years as fuel prices go up diesel will become more viable for this market. My suggestion is to be patient and enjoy what is available today :thumbup:


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## quasimodem (Nov 9, 2011)

GreekboyD said:


> I know some people have an allegiance to certain brands when it comes to cars and other items alike. I personally don't. I'm a diesel guy first and foremost so I'll cross shop them all when that time comes. I try to explain that to some of my buddies who claim I'm a "Bimmer" guy merely because I own one. Don't get me wrong. I love my 335d but there is nothing keeping me chained to BMW and BMW only when looking for another vehicle in 2-3 years.
> 
> My D is still under warranty, totally paid off and has only 45,000 kms on it so I'm in no rush to get rid of it especially considering the money I've put into the suspension upgrades, etc.


I am a DIY guy, I like to do as much as I can myself. So that means it is best to stick with what I know best and probably have spare parts for. Because of this, it makes sense to stick with the same engine, maybe even car, as much as I can. It is not necessarily "allegiance", it is practicality and cost reduction. A poor analogy but, if you buy a Canon camera and the only maker of lenses for it is Canon, do you go out and by Nikon lenses because you dont have allegiance to a brand?


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## GreekboyD (Jan 25, 2012)

quasimodem said:


> I am a DIY guy, I like to do as much as I can myself. So that means it is best to stick with what I know best and probably have spare parts for. Because of this, it makes sense to stick with the same engine, maybe even car, as much as I can. It is not necessarily "allegiance", it is practicality and cost reduction. A poor analogy but, if you buy a Canon camera and the only maker of lenses for it is Canon, do you go out and by Nikon lenses because you dont have allegiance to a brand?


I totally agree with you. Everyone is different and there is no "one" correct answer or way to look at things.


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## FredoinSF (Nov 29, 2009)

I'm a BMW junky - I'm on number 10 or 12 by now. I stray every once in a while but always end up flipping the non BMW's really fast with the exception of the R53 MINI. 

Like Quasimodem, I am DIY type of guy (lighter and lighter DIY as I get older though), I know where to shop for parts, and I have a BMW / MINI Independent shop in the East Bay whom I trust. Best of all, one of the guys there recently bought an X5d with much higher miles than mine for his wife, so he will be doing the beta testing for diagnosis and repair on his car rather than mine. 

As to the OP's question, I would probably keep the 335d if I were in that situation. I drove a 535i last summer along with a friend who was car shopping and was completely underwhelmed, particularly given the 65k sticker. There was nothing special about that car, it felt like a bloated Lexus ES330. The current style of the 5 is also way too close to the 3. I have a really hard time telling them apart from the rear. Another sign of age?? :bawling:


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## Pat_X5 (Aug 23, 2008)

FredoinSF said:


> .... The current style of the 5 is also way too close to the 3. I have a really hard time telling them apart from the rear. Another sign of age?? :bawling:


:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:


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## quasimodem (Nov 9, 2011)

FredoinSF said:


> I'm a BMW junky - I'm on number 10 or 12 by now. I stray every once in a while but always end up flipping the non BMW's really fast with the exception of the R53 MINI.
> 
> Like Quasimodem, I am DIY type of guy (lighter and lighter DIY as I get older though), I know where to shop for parts, and I have a BMW / MINI Independent shop in the East Bay whom I trust. Best of all, one of the guys there recently bought an X5d with much higher miles than mine for his wife, so he will be doing the beta testing for diagnosis and repair on his car rather than mine.
> 
> As to the OP's question, I would probably keep the 335d if I were in that situation. I drove a 535i last summer along with a friend who was car shopping and was completely underwhelmed, particularly given the 65k sticker. There was nothing special about that car, it felt like a bloated Lexus ES330. The current style of the 5 is also way too close to the 3. I have a really hard time telling them apart from the rear. Another sign of age?? :bawling:


It looks like now, the only choice is to buy it in Europe and import a BMW diesel 3 series. But you would need a letter from the manufacturer saying it satisfies US regulations. Or you pay $$$$ to have it upgraded by a qualified entity to conform to US regs. Now if the emissions in Europe tighten up like I have heard, maybe this wont be so hard. I don't know if the new 3er Diesels have a similar SCR system on our US 335ds. If they do, well you just need a boatload of Euros and pay for shipping and import tax, and it is possible. I don't have a boatload of Euros so this is not an option. 

Edit: on researching the issue of diesel emissions I found this article http://www.bbc.com/autos/story/20130109-why-do-americans-not-*****diesels. It appears that in 2015 Euro diesel emissions may be close to our emissions requirements. If BMW just simplifies the emissions equipment and uses the same SCR system on US cars and EU cars, maybe it wont be hard to "domesticate" newer European diesels.


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## Pierre Louis (Oct 23, 2011)

Uh, the Affordable Car Act says that if you like your 335d, you can keep it! (no matter the carbon buildup, :roundelEF, EGR, XYZ issues!)


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## floydarogers (Oct 11, 2010)

FredoinSF said:


> ... The current style of the 5 is also way too close to the 3. I have a really hard time telling them apart from the rear. Another sign of age?? :bawling:


Just want to point out that you have it backwards: the F10 came out before the F30 - it's the 3-series that looks too much like the 5. 



quasimodem said:


> ... But you would need a letter from the manufacturer saying it satisfies US regulations. Or you pay $$$$ to have it upgraded by a qualified entity to conform to US regs...


Unfortunately, there is more than just emissions: lights, airbags, other little nitty bits. If you look on the TSA (customs & immigration) you can find the requirements related to this. It's so onerous and costly that no-one does this.:thumbdwn:


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## piredon (Aug 12, 2013)

I'm a fan of the 535d (I have one). But agree that it's nothing like the E90. Then again, neither is the F30. If the E39 was the peak for the 5 series I'm thinking the E90 was probably the peak for the 3 series. In terms of pure driving enjoyment, you're going to go downhill with the newer models.

That being said, the F10 has a much higher level of material quality, it's quieter, more comfortable and a bit larger. It's just as fast in a straight line, just as efficient, ultimately just as capable as the 335d with the right suspension options (either the 704 option on the M-Sport package or the Dynamic Handling Package DHP if you go AWD). But it's a lot more expensive, feels a lot larger, and ultimately is not as much fun. 

The thing that sucks is you will find it very hard to find an F10 on the lot with either the 704 suspension or the DHP (select sport or sport+ mode for the right suspension settings). So getting a test drive of the best setup is very hard to do. I took the plunge, wanted AWD so got DHP. I think in sport mode, it's very good. Steering could use work but suspension is spot on for a sport sedan. Firm but comfortable, and almost no body roll.

I like the compromise between luxury and sport in the 535d, but many others do not. But a lightly used 335d might be your best option if you like the size, feel, fuel economy and price of your current car. There isn't anything that can match it across the board.


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## F32Fleet (Jul 14, 2010)

piredon said:


> I'm a fan of the 535d (I have one). But agree that it's nothing like the E90. Then again, neither is the F30. If the E39 was the peak for the 5 series I'm thinking the E90 was probably the peak for the 3 series. In terms of pure driving enjoyment, you're going to go downhill with the newer models.
> 
> That being said, the F10 has a much higher level of material quality, it's quieter, more comfortable and a bit larger. It's just as fast in a straight line, just as efficient, ultimately just as capable as the 335d with the right suspension options (either the 704 option on the M-Sport package or the Dynamic Handling Package DHP if you go AWD). But it's a lot more expensive, feels a lot larger, and ultimately is not as much fun.
> 
> ...


Makes perfect sense. Back in '06 it was suggested that the e90 fit between e39/e46. The New 5 is probably about as big as the 7 from two generations ago.


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## cas (Nov 22, 2006)

*535d*

I drove the 535d. I also had a335 d 2011. The 535d is nice but needs more horsepower and torque to compete with the 335d.


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## piredon (Aug 12, 2013)

cas said:


> I drove the 535d. I also had a335 d 2011. The 535d is nice but needs more horsepower and torque to compete with the 335d.


Its actually just as fast. It's just so quiet and isolated that it doesn't feel like it. You also need to use sport mode for the right throttle response or it feels even slower. Stupid and complicated, yes, but that's the way BMW is heading these days.

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## mud8541 (Jun 11, 2014)

*Love my 535d*

Just moved up from the 335d last month. I, too, was torn. The reviews of the 535d weren't exactly bowling me over...especially the commentary regarding the steering. And I have to say the steering does feel a bit odd. And reading up a bit it seems that the rear wheels assist in steering a bit? Can anyone confirm that? Sometimes at the end of a gentle curve it feels like I have to push the steering back to center when the road straightens out. Strange.

But steering notwithstanding, the newer m-sport package actually improves the suspension (it's not just a face lift) and in sport/+ modes the car feels great. No, it doesn't feel quite as zippy as the 3 did (regardless of what the stats say). But it's surprisingly sticky in the corners and sounds delicious when you punch it.

Overall, I'm tickled pink.  The joys of the new toys has outweighed the more visceral experience of the 3. Paddle shifters, rear parking camera, the auto start/stop at lights, etc, etc. And my kids are more comfy in the back seat (when the lateral Gs aren't draining the blood from their heads). 

Now if we can just get a JBD that works on this thing...


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