# Jon, Ted, anyone... how about a Bimmerfest East?



## scottn2retro (Mar 20, 2002)

GimpyMcFarlan said:


> *Columbus Oh to Utica NY, 512 miles. :yikes: I would love to attend one of these (the local CCA here sucks), but this is a little far for me.  *


Find some other 'festers nearby and caravan (like the Seattle people do). :thumbup:


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## OBS3SSION (Oct 1, 2002)

After the initial burst of excitement, this thread sure got quiet. Is it still end-of-month for Jon and Ted? :dunno:

Or am I just chomping at the bit to have a bimmerfest east? :angel:


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## TedW (Jan 13, 2003)

OBS3SSION said:


> *After the initial burst of excitement, this thread sure got quiet. Is it still end-of-month for Jon and Ted? :dunno:
> 
> Or am I just chomping at the bit to have a bimmerfest east? :angel: *


It really is. We're still squeezing deals into last month. I'm still up for the Bimmerfest east. If you want something to divert your attention: a little bird told me that BMWFS just introduced an even better lease deal on the 5 series.

Ted


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## Jon Shafer (Dec 15, 2001)

OBS3SSION said:


> *After the initial burst of excitement, this thread sure got quiet. Is it still end-of-month for Jon and Ted? :dunno:
> 
> Or am I just chomping at the bit to have a bimmerfest east? :angel: *


It still is month-end. I am battling payroll, inventory,
bonuses, schedules, ...etc.



Btw, a little birdie told me too that BMWFS is going to
be making the 1st (2) payments on CPOs during
the month of April, and that's no foolin'....

:thumbup:


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## GimpyMcFarlan (Aug 13, 2002)

scottn2retro said:


> *Find some other 'festers nearby and caravan (like the Seattle people do). :thumbup: *


Now THERE is a fine idea. :thumbup: A caravan would definitely make the long distance more fun. I'll bring this up at the new CCA gathering here.


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## Pete Teoh (Jan 27, 2002)

588.6 miles from Grand Rapids, MI... I might do it if I can get a caravan. :thumbup:


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## alee (Dec 19, 2001)

Pete Teoh said:


> *588.6 miles from Grand Rapids, MI... I might do it if I can get a caravan. :thumbup: *


I can't believe this is an enthusiast board... boo hoo... 588 miles for Bimmerfest East, I don't like to drive my car... boo hoo...


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## Pete Teoh (Jan 27, 2002)

alee said:


> *I can't believe this is an enthusiast board... boo hoo... 588 miles for Bimmerfest East, I don't like to drive my car... boo hoo...  *


  

I would love the drive... but I have to drive through Canada  or Ohio   . The other thing is, I sucked so much earlier this year that I'm out of vacation(suck) time. :banghead:

Hey, Ted, how about doing this over Labor Day weekend so I have an extra day off? :thumbup:


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## alee (Dec 19, 2001)

Pete Teoh said:


> *The other thing is, I sucked so much earlier this year that I'm out of vacation(suck) time. :banghead:*


*cough* *cough* so sick *cough* *cough* bimmerfest *cough* *cough* back in a week *cough* *cough* *cough*

I'm sure someone at the Fest is a doctor and can write you a "note".


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## vexed (Dec 22, 2001)

alee said:


> **cough* *cough* so sick *cough* *cough* bimmerfest *cough* *cough* back in a week *cough* *cough* *cough*
> 
> I'm sure someone at the Fest is a doctor and can write you a "note".  *


Maybe you can lend him some since you seem to have so much Isn't it bed time for you or are you in the throne room


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## Pete Teoh (Jan 27, 2002)

alee said:


> **cough* *cough* so sick *cough* *cough* bimmerfest *cough* *cough* back in a week *cough* *cough* *cough*
> 
> I'm sure someone at the Fest is a doctor and can write you a "note".  *


Good plan. Substitute suck time with sick time. :thumbup:


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## alee (Dec 19, 2001)

vexed said:


> *Maybe you can lend him some since you seem to have so much Isn't it bed time for you or are you in the throne room *


If I get too much sleep, I end up waking up halfway through the train ride, making the commute unbearable. I need to measure out only 4-5 hrs of sleep for this commute to work properly. 

Throne time was earlier. Unless you want me to eat another bran muffin and have another go at it...


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## vexed (Dec 22, 2001)

alee said:


> *If I get too much sleep, I end up waking up halfway through the train ride, making the commute unbearable. I need to measure out only 4-5 hrs of sleep for this commute to work properly.
> 
> Throne time was earlier. Unless you want me to eat another bran muffin and have another go at it... *


Have a baby and 4-5 hours is SOP No thanks on the bran muffin....:eeps:


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## OBS3SSION (Oct 1, 2002)

If you're out of vacation time, and you're out of sick time... call in dead!


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## elfhearse (Jul 25, 2002)

Labor Day is Homecoming 03 at Greer, SC. I going down for that again, but that's just the Z3 (+Z4) people. 

Getting there is half the fun... (or is it getting dirty??? God.. old Mr Bubble tune just popped into my head.. )


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## Dr. Phil (Dec 19, 2001)

alee said:


> **cough* *cough* so sick *cough* *cough* bimmerfest *cough* *cough* back in a week *cough* *cough* *cough*
> 
> I'm sure someone at the Fest is a doctor and can write you a "note".  *


:rofl:

I feel ill myself


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## alee (Dec 19, 2001)

DougDogs said:


> *speaking of which..how many miles have you driven your car in the last 6 months  *


500-600 miles.


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## Siphus (Apr 3, 2003)

w00t, i went to bimmerfest east last year, the one hosted by MOTIVOnline... it was nice as hell, sooo many bmws, ahhh... loved it, ive heard rumors on dtmpower.net that they are still negotiating some things, and that they dont know if they are gonna do it again... although they have the past few years on the east coast... i'll keep everyone posted incase "ted" ( Hi ! ) decides to back out


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## TedW (Jan 13, 2003)

Siphus said:


> *w00t, i went to bimmerfest east last year, the one hosted by MOTIVOnline... it was nice as hell, sooo many bmws, ahhh... loved it, ive heard rumors on dtmpower.net that they are still negotiating some things, and that they dont know if they are gonna do it again... although they have the past few years on the east coast... i'll keep everyone posted incase "ted" ( Hi ! ) decides to back out *


Hello,

I would be very interested in speaking with you and others about an event. As soon as I know what people expect and want I can start planning. I wish that I had attended one of these, but since I can't change that now I'll have to rely on the knowledge of others here.

Ted


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## loubct (Sep 20, 2002)

Siphus said:


> *w00t, i went to bimmerfest east last year, the one hosted by MOTIVOnline... it was nice as hell, sooo many bmws, ahhh... loved it, ive heard rumors on dtmpower.net that they are still negotiating some things, and that they dont know if they are gonna do it again... although they have the past few years on the east coast... i'll keep everyone posted incase "ted" ( Hi ! ) decides to back out *


Where was it held (city/state). I sure would be interested in attending if anywhere near CT.


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## TedW (Jan 13, 2003)

loubct said:


> *Where was it held (city/state). I sure would be interested in attending if anywhere near CT. *


Hi Lou,

Look at the whole thread. We're working on bringing it to Utica.

Ted


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## alee (Dec 19, 2001)

Not saying Utica is a bad idea (I'll go to pretty much any Bimmerfest East!), but since we're on the East coast, could something be done maybe at BMW NA HQ in Woodcliff Lake, NJ? Much larger facilities to work with assuming BMW NA has any interest in such an event.

And of course, there's also the factory in SC.


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## Ack (Mar 16, 2002)

I'm in for a Bimmerfest East! Less than 200 miles from Barfalo to Utica. Its right around the corner from 3seriesbimmer.


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## loubct (Sep 20, 2002)

TedW said:


> *Hi Lou,
> 
> Look at the whole thread. We're working on bringing it to Utica.
> 
> Ted *


Hi Ted,

I didn't notice your mention of Utica above. I came in on page 2 of the thread. Utica sounds great to me.

By the way, as of today my car has been completed and is awaiting transport. Who is going to keep it company until I get there in 5 weeks?


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## TedW (Jan 13, 2003)

loubct said:


> *Hi Ted,
> 
> I didn't notice your mention of Utica above. I came in on page 2 of the thread. Utica sounds great to me.
> 
> By the way, as of today my car has been completed and is awaiting transport. Who is going to keep it company until I get there in 5 weeks? *


I think they rent it out to tourists until you pick it up.

Seriously though. They always sandbag dates so that they have time to take care of any production problems without disrupting your delivery date.

Ted


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## GimpyMcFarlan (Aug 13, 2002)

Pete Teoh said:


> *588.6 miles from Grand Rapids, MI... I might do it if I can get a caravan. :thumbup: *


Hi Pete,
Count me in on that caravan. I would be happy to meet up with you in Ohio somewhere. :thumbup:


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## OBS3SSION (Oct 1, 2002)

TedW said:


> *Hello,
> 
> I would be very interested in speaking with you and others about an event. As soon as I know what people expect and want I can start planning. I wish that I had attended one of these, but since I can't change that now I'll have to rely on the knowledge of others here.
> 
> Ted *


Ted,

Here are my thoughts on the proposed Bimmerfest East... I would think we should plan an event as similar to Bimmerfest as possible. If we try to one-up the other event, or make it completely different, there may be discontent. My intentions would be to simply offer the same event on the east coast for those of us who can't justify or make the trip to California.

That said, I would think we are going to need Jon and some of the Bimmerfest attendees to help us out. No, we don't need them to plan Bimmerfest East for us, but if they can give us the framework (general layout and itinerary of the event, some contacts, etc.) and some guidance, then us east-coasters can do the work to put this together.

Not having been to a Bimmerfest before, I'm making some assumptions here. But as far as I know, Bimmerfest consists of the following:

Event Registration/Ticket Sales
A Bigass Gathering of BMWs
Raffle
Seminars/Tech Sessions
Road Rally/Group Drive
Sponsor/Vendor Displays and Booths
Benefits Charity
Group Rates on Lodging

I may be missing some items, but that is the kind of info we'll need. Of the list above, I've organized all of that except the seminars for the "Big Huge 2002" event I held last year.

Some other items I'm uncertain about is if there is entertainment, lunch/food availability and some other odds and ends. Again, I'm hoping Jon or some others will give us a bullet list of items we'll need to organize.

I'm looking forward to this event, even though it is in the earliest of the beginning stages. And like I said above, I'll be more than willing to help make this all happen.


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## TedW (Jan 13, 2003)

Thanks for taking the initiative. That's exactly what I was looking for. I'm sure after April 12th the event will be fresh in everyones mind and Jon might even be able to offer some insight. I have the location and can easily set up group rates for the local hotels. Once we have a little help I think we can pull this off.


Thanks again,


Ted


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## Pete Teoh (Jan 27, 2002)

GimpyMcFarlan said:


> *Hi Pete,
> Count me in on that caravan. I would be happy to meet up with you in Ohio somewhere. :thumbup: *


Cool... I think the drive through Ontario is shorter, but I'd have to deal with immigration twice, so Ohio is probably the way to go. :thumbup:


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## scottn2retro (Mar 20, 2002)

We'll give you a run down of everything that happens this year and in the approximate order it happened in.

Based on last year it kind of went like this:

In the morning before lunch, the event is kind of like one of those show events. People arrive (sometimes in big caravans getting to the event) and BMWs are placed on every open space of real estate. There are vendor cars and displays, some DIY type demos in and around the dealer showroom where people get to walk around checking them out as well as milling around the parking lot checking out all the nice owners cars.

Then lunch.

After lunch, it's time for awards, raffles, etc. and then a group photo of everyone in front of the dealership.

After that a huge road rally of all the cars in a rural setting.

That night, for the hard core, is party time in some of the town's night spots.


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## Siphus (Apr 3, 2003)

wuts up, ok... so i dont know too much about how it worked, but i'll break it down for u

Last years Bimmerfest East was held in brooklyn NY, at an old ass air field... there was a smaller meeting i attended before hand, then a bigger one, then we all drove up, (from NJ) we met up with others outside of the air field, everyone drove in, and there were a few tuners set up already, and everyone got their show cars ready, normal ticket holders had to wait til later in the day... show started, few diff contests, Djs, food, and all the cars were lined up, Dados car was there too, after the Gumball ( messy ) so yeah... it lasted a while, and god damn was it hot.. here is a post that was written up afterwards:

http://www.dtmpower.net/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=51545&highlight=bimmerfest


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## Pete Teoh (Jan 27, 2002)

alee said:


> *Not saying Utica is a bad idea (I'll go to pretty much any Bimmerfest East!), but since we're on the East coast, could something be done maybe at BMW NA HQ in Woodcliff Lake, NJ? Much larger facilities to work with assuming BMW NA has any interest in such an event.
> 
> And of course, there's also the factory in SC. *


Hmm.. It would be awesome to get BMW NA's sponsorship of this. SC would work too... I might actually be moved down to NC by then. :thumbup:


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## scottn2retro (Mar 20, 2002)

Pete Teoh said:


> *Hmm.. It would be awesome to get BMW NA's sponsorship of this. SC would work too... I might actually be moved down to NC by then. :thumbup: *


BMW already has the Z car Homecoming in SC in the fall, so I doubt they would be interested in another event. BMWNA might be worth thinking about, but if a dealer is sponsoring the event, they would probably want it there.

Siphus - do you think some of the vendors, participants, etc. would be interested in being at this kind of event?


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## OBS3SSION (Oct 1, 2002)

It sounds to me like we are all set on the location. If Ted's dealership is willing to host, then why turn it down? I know finding a location was the biggest headache when planning the Big Huge... and here we've been handed a location even before the event is "official"!

Central NY may not be the most ideal location for everyone, but no single location will qualify. Personally, I think Santa Barbara is a horrible location!  Utica is within a good distance for almost all of the most populous north-east locations, plus we should be able to get some Canada folk as well as mid-west people.


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## Siphus (Apr 3, 2003)

heh, your guess is as good as mine... i have gotten notice that Bimmerfest East IS happening again this year, i think this will be the 5th year, so looks like the east coast has 2 bimmerfests this year


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## scottn2retro (Mar 20, 2002)

Siphus said:


> *heh, your guess is as good as mine... i have gotten notice that Bimmerfest East IS happening again this year, i think this will be the 5th year, so looks like the east coast has 2 bimmerfests this year  *


In past years, since there was no dealer sponsored/Bimmerfest organized event on the East Coast, Mark and Tim (the owners of the Bimmerfest domain name) gave permission to other groups to borrow the name for their event.

If Ted and Carbone BMW are going to put on a dealership sponsored/Bimmerfest organized event, they may not want other events to borrow the name.


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## Siphus (Apr 3, 2003)

well... the plans have already been made.. :-\ maybe one will be called Bimmerfest EAST and the Teds just Bimmerfest? lol... i dunno, they are both gonna kick ass tho


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## TedW (Jan 13, 2003)

Siphus said:


> *well... the plans have already been made.. :-\ maybe one will be called Bimmerfest EAST and the Teds just Bimmerfest? lol... i dunno, they are both gonna kick ass tho *


How about Bimmereast?:dunno:

Ted


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## alee (Dec 19, 2001)

TedW said:


> *How about Bimmereast?:dunno:*


TedFest sounds good. :thumbup: 

I think just called it "The Official Bimmerfest East", or just Bimmerfest.


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## TedW (Jan 13, 2003)

alee said:


> *TedFest sounds good. :thumbup:
> 
> :rofl:*


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## Jon Shafer (Dec 15, 2001)

alee said:


> *TedFest sounds good. :thumbup:
> 
> I think just called it "The Official Bimmerfest East", or just Bimmerfest. *


Yeah; just "Bimmerfest".

There won't be any confusion...


I am serious; just drop the file name extension.

Bimmerfest.

I gave the organizers of Bimmerfest East permission
to use the name in spirit of community.

I'd actually love to see a "circuit" of events across
the country...


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## tdc (Apr 6, 2003)

Jon Shafer said:


> *There is an event/group that goes by www.bimmerfesteast.com .
> Back in 2000 I gave them permission to use the name for their
> event. So far I have seen or heard nothing about an event
> to be sanctioned by them in 2003.
> ...


Hey Jon, all you needed to do was drop me an e-mail if you were wondering what was up for this year. 

I know it's nothing like Bimmerfest.com, but we do what we can with our limited resources. 

And since there's all this speculation that we're not doing anything, here's the official press release to dispel those rumours:

http://www.bimmerfesteast.com/pressrelease.htm​
If anyone has questions you can e-mail them to [email protected]. Thanks!


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## LarryN (Dec 24, 2001)

How the heck did I miss this thread? I'm in Ted! :thumbup: Maybe some of the near to Boston guys can caravan. Mapquest says 298 miles for me, 4 Hrs 58 minutes from Utica. 

How's the accommodations and apre Fest scene in wild and crazy Utica?


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## OBS3SSION (Oct 1, 2002)

Erm... so does anyone else see a problem now? I'd hate to see two events stepping on each other's toes. Both a "Bimmerfest East" and a "Bimmerfest" in the east in late summer, and in the same region.

So, I'd hate to give up on an east coast Bimmerfest, but it also looks like Bimmerfest East is a well-planned event as well. Should be consider delaying an east coast Bimmerfest to coincide with next spring's west coast Bimmerfest? (Maybe we could simulcast the events with webcams or something...) Or should we look at having an east coast Bimmerfest later/earlier this year so as not to be so close to Bimmerfest East? Or just say blast it... the events are different enough... who cares if they are within a month or two of each other?

My only fear is that people will skip one to go to the other (only having time to go to one), therefore detracting from both. Then again, maybe I'm just overanalyzing all this. :dunno:


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## LarryN (Dec 24, 2001)

OBS3SSION said:


> *My only fear is that people will skip one to go to the other (only having time to go to one), therefore detracting from both. Then again, maybe I'm just overanalyzing all this. :dunno: *


I somewhat agree with this. However, one appears to be more of a tunerfest, and the other an enthusiast event. I, for one, would be much less inclined to attend a tuner, fanatics-like, based event.

I think that the naming alone is enough to cause confusion though. People could potentially attend thinking that the event is sponsored by Bimmerfest, when it's really not.


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## TedW (Jan 13, 2003)

OBS3SSION said:


> *Erm... so does anyone else see a problem now? I'd hate to see two events stepping on each other's toes. Both a "Bimmerfest East" and a "Bimmerfest" in the east in late summer, and in the same region.
> 
> So, I'd hate to give up on an east coast Bimmerfest, but it also looks like Bimmerfest East is a well-planned event as well. Should be consider delaying an east coast Bimmerfest to coincide with next spring's west coast Bimmerfest? (Maybe we could simulcast the events with webcams or something...) Or should we look at having an east coast Bimmerfest later/earlier this year so as not to be so close to Bimmerfest East? Or just say blast it... the events are different enough... who cares if they are within a month or two of each other?
> 
> My only fear is that people will skip one to go to the other (only having time to go to one), therefore detracting from both. Then again, maybe I'm just overanalyzing all this. :dunno: *


I definatly do not want to step on any toes. If a bimmerfest East has already been planned I would bow out gracefully. My intention was to help the people on the East coast have an event. If an event already exists, and we know now that it does, I think that waiting until next spring to have an event that will coincide with the official bimmerfest is an excellent idea. I apoligize to the planners of bimmerfest east for triing to steal their thunder. That was not my intention.:angel:

Ted


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## scottn2retro (Mar 20, 2002)

TedW said:


> *If an event already exists, and we know now that it does, I think that waiting until next spring to have an event that will coincide with the official bimmerfest is an excellent idea.
> Ted *


I like this idea. Along with Jon's idea, eventually what if there were Bimmerfests in regions all around the country all on the same day?


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## tdc (Apr 6, 2003)

TedW said:


> *I definatly do not want to step on any toes. If a bimmerfest East has already been planned I would bow out gracefully. My intention was to help the people on the East coast have an event. If an event already exists, and we know now that it does, I think that waiting until next spring to have an event that will coincide with the official bimmerfest is an excellent idea. I apoligize to the planners of bimmerfest east for triing to steal their thunder. That was not my intention.:angel:
> 
> Ted *


Ted, no one on our staff felt as if you were trying to steal our "thunder" so to speak. It is only by the graciousness of Jon Shafer that a Bimmerfest East even exists. So no need to feel that way at all.

As for the concerns that BFE is more of a "tuner" show, that is true of past events. This year's event will still include and welcome those that highly modify their BMWs but with the event being staged at Lime Rock and in conjunction with BMWNA's Vintage Festival, we are hoping that more 'enthusiasts' (even though I believe we're all enthusiasts that are just cut from a different thread) will join us and enjoy the event.

In fact, last year, our concours division had the largest showing out of all of the show categories and we gave out over $1500 worth of prizes to the winner provided by Sirius Satellite Radio.

Please feel free to contact us if you'd like to work together or have any questions! [email protected]


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## scottn2retro (Mar 20, 2002)

tdc - It looks like this event will be much better that what I've heard/seen from past years. :thumbup:


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## Jon Shafer (Dec 15, 2001)

*I don't want to start a war, but... (Bimmerfest East)*

I don't want to start a war, but I really think that we here
are within our rights to proclaim that any Bimmerfest 
Event that we decide to sanction anywhere is entirely 
at our discretion...

At the very least, should MOTIV ask for permission again?
:dunno:

Here is the opening page from the very first incarnation of 
Bimmerfest.com:









The following is the text of what appeared on the opening page
of Bimmerfesteast.com up until the past week:

"Bimmerfest was the brainchild of Jon Shafer at Cutter Motors of Santa Barbara, CA. It was a gathering of BMW enthusiasts to celebrate our shared love of the Ultimate Driving Machine. The first event was held at Cutter Motors in the Spring of 2000. Jon Shafer continues to hold Bimmerfest West at Cutter Motors. BMW enthusiasts not being relegated to only the West coast, a few people here on the East decided to have our own version of Bimmerfest. After receiving Jon's blessing in using his coined phrase, we set upon getting the East Coast Bimmerfest in motion.

Summer 2000 - In its inaugural year, the East Coast Bimmerfest gathered over 100 cars and as many people in a small parking lot in Rutgers University. Overall, it was a huge success for something that was merely supposed to be small meet.

Summer 2001 - East Coast Bimmerfest is renamed Bimmerfest East. Nearly 200 cars showed with double that amount in spectators. A full show was implemented with three categories along with a Best of Show trophy. Vendors set up booths to show off their wares and interact with many of their existing customers. Attendees weathered torrential rains throughout the afternoon to show the true grit of the BMW enthusiast. Even with the imperfect weather, the word on the street was that Bimmerfest East 2001 was a huge success.

For 2002, many changes have taken place in order to continue our quest in becoming the PREMIERE event for BMW enthusiasts on the East coast. More categories have been added to the show. More prizes are being awarded. More media coverage is slotted for this year. However, one thing has not changed and never will - BimmerFest East is for BMW enthusiasts and by enthusiasts."


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## Pete Teoh (Jan 27, 2002)

Did you reserve the right to revoke the "Bimmerfest" moniker? It might still cause some "bad blood" though... the last thing anyone needs. Personally I would prefer a less mod-oriented Bimmerfest in the East. It's really your choice, Jon. You own the concept.


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## Jon Shafer (Dec 15, 2001)

Back when all of this started, and I first spoke with Ashe, 
and later Tom Chang, I never figured or foresaw that any 
of this would ever be an issue. Revocability never came up...

Personally, I feel that the spirit of The 'Fest really is community.
I 'm definitely not a selfish person. It pleases me to know that
others have embraced this spirit and concept. At this time
I have no plans of asking them to cease and desist from
using the name. The truth is it's flattering. Being a car
salesman (o.k. I'm not really a "salesman") doesn't hold 
that many intrinsic rewards. Especially for creativity.
Bimmerfest is the one creative expression or outlet
that I've had in my career...

I do not want anyone here to feel uneasy about discussing
possible future events because of what another (outside)
group such as MOTIV might think. I got this sense from 
scanning the other recent thread here.


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## Pete Teoh (Jan 27, 2002)

I don't know how far along MOTIV is with their preparations for Bimmerfeast East 2003. I'd say that if they already have people/events signed up it might be best to let them use the name for another event, and just notify them that you have the intention of using the name for your own or another group's event next year. That way they won't have to re-do any planning they have done so far, and they are aware that they may not be able to use the name again next year. Also, they can start planning on changing the name of their event for 2004.


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## OBS3SSION (Oct 1, 2002)

Well, since I both started the Bimmerfest (East) thread, and then later commented about the possible conflict with the other show, Bimmerfest East... here's my take:

It's obvious that many members of Bimmerfest.com are not into the "extreme" modification of their cars. For the most part, we do only slight enhancements or accessories. We feel enthusiastic about driving the car as-is. The event known as Bimmerfest East seems to cater more to enthusiast who enjoys the more visual and extreme style of modification. Nothing wrong with this at all. Just different tastes.

I think its great in the spirit of community that Jon has allowed another group to use the Bimmerfest name in planning an event. In that same spirit, Jon should let MOTIV continue to use the name at least through the end of this year because they already have plans in motion for this year's show. Whether or not Jon wants to let them use the name beyond that is up to him.

From what I can gather, Bimmerfest.com has grown substantially over the past 3 years. I think that the "club" can now support not only a Bimmerfest in California, but in other parts of the country as well. In fact, Jon has stated how great it would be for a series of Bimmerfests to take place around the country. Unfortunately, having another show sharing the Bimmerfest name will only lead to confusion.

So... what to do about MOTIV and "Bimmerfest East"? Well, here are some suggestions:
Ask that MOTIV no longer use the name "Bimmerfest" after this year, and either hold off until next year to create an east-coast Bimmerfest or have an east coast Bimmerfest this year anyway, but risk confusion between the two events.
Ask MOTIV to help create a Bimmerfest in conjunction with Bimmerfest.com, thus ending the possibility of confusion between the two events, and allowing both groups to get their event.
Don't do anything about MOTIV using the name "Bimmerfest" at all. Let them do what they want, and create whatever events they want. But go ahead and create an event for members of Bimmerfest.com and the community and just make a point to call it the "Official Bimmerfest" or something like that.

I generally try to be politically correct and the "nice guy" whenever I can. However, I probably go to far with it too often. It was mentioned in the other thread that we weren't stepping on anyone's toes... so maybe we don't need to tread lightly after all. One thing for certain; it seems that members of Bimmerfest.com are certainly interested in an east coast Bimmerfest, but are not interested in going to Bimmerfest East.

I say lets have an east coast Bimmerfest anyway... starting this year. Either make it a separate (official) event and hold it at Ted's dealership in NY, or work with MOTIV to convert Bimmerfest East into the east coast Bimmerfest held at Lime Rock Park. I think its early enough to do either.


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## jw (Dec 21, 2001)

Has "bimmerfest" been registered as a trademark?


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## alee (Dec 19, 2001)

I think it would be a shame to tell MOTIV to change their event name, esp. since by all indications, they appear to be quite organized and they are making an effort to recognize those responsible for Bimmerfest.

Even if Jon succeeds in asking them to stop using the name, it will no doubt cause a bit of tension, and that walks in the face of what bimmerfest.com is about.

My suggestions:

1. Jon you must trademark the name Bimmerfest. Bimmerfest should be a registered trademark of Cutter Motors if you want to avoid any future rights issues. It is a pretty strong mark, and I don't think there will be many problems.

2. All events that use the Bimmerfest name should be licensed through Jon and Cutter once you start the trademark process. Protect yourself now, so you don't have aggravations later.

3. There is room for multiple Bimmerfest events across the US. The MOTIV event is more of a Tuner event, but is still in the same spirit of Bimmerfest, so let them use the name Bimmerfest. What I would do is ask them to distinguish themselves as a tuner event. "MOTIV/Bimmerfest, a MOTIV sponsored Tuner Event".

4. The first East Coast Bimmerfest (the TedFest/Carbone one) should be called just "Bimmerfest" to keep the mark strong.

I think MOTIV is willing to work with you, and possibly even share the domain with you for the TedFest/Carbone event. These events are not damaging to the Bimmerfest name and all promote the same idea that you started, to bring all the enthusiasts together in 1 place. 

By the same token, I think if MOTIV stepped up to the plate and wanted to sponsor and offer a MOTIV/Bimmerfest West coast tuner meet (and not asking anything of you other than to use the name and asking you to be a guest), you should consider this an honor, not a badge of shame.


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## JPinTO (Dec 20, 2001)

As alee said, If the name "bimmerfest" is important then it needs to be trademarked and then the tm needs to be enforced.

But it's easy enough to use alternate names like "beemerfest", "bimmerfeast" or "bimmerpalooza".


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## Jon Shafer (Dec 15, 2001)

All other issues aside, I will continue to grant permission
for the use of the name Bimmerfest to MOTIV, or any other
group such as Ted's at this time. At least through the year
2003...  Bimmerfest East, whether Ashe's or Tom Chang's
(MOTIV's) versions is a worthwhile event. It sounds like
they are working very hard to put on the very best event
possible. At the very least, they are maintaining the spirit 
of what we originally set out to do...

As far as the "Rice v. Slightly Modified v. Stock" discussion
goes, here are my personal feelings. If it's got a freaking
Roundel on it (this would include some or all of Jimmy540i.com's
so-called "nightmares"), it's "Officially Welcomed to The 'Fest".
Okay, so most of the active posting members population here
(but for the few "serious" racers that have recently joined us),
would be categorized as "minimal-to-moderate" on the 
modification scale. That doesn't matter. We should not discriminate. 
We are all BMW Enthusiasts, period.

I little rice is good for everyone's diet and health.

Everyone's got a home here.

The event, the board, we take all comers, 'cept for, say
spammers and trolls.


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## scottn2retro (Mar 20, 2002)

A lot of good points by all.

My thoughts:

Performance IX already own the domain name www.bimmerfest.com but it probably wouldn't be a bad idea to copyright bimmerfest as well. I like the idea of people getting permission to use the name for their event so Jon/Mark/Tim could have at least a little control over what kind of events get to call themselves 'bimmerfest'.

I have no problem with other events out there being associated with bimmerfest - especially if they're good events - but I think bimmerfest.com should get some recognition/exposure from the events. I see in the announcement at the top of the thread e46fanatics.com and DTM.net with links, but no bimmerfest.com.

If events out there are going to use the bimmerfest name, then I'd like to see bimmerfest.com get some props.


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## TedW (Jan 13, 2003)

One thing is for sure: Per Jon's advice I will use simply "bimmerfest". As to when the event happens(this fall or next spring), that's still up in the air right now. I fear, as do others on this board, that having two east coast events around the same time might diminish attendance at one or both. I'm wide open to suggestions. Ultimatly the decision rests on the members of this board. 



Ted


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## Pete Teoh (Jan 27, 2002)

So are we having a Bimmerfest this Fall on the East Coast?

Hmm... BimmerFall? Bimmerfest-Fall? :dunno:


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## OBS3SSION (Oct 1, 2002)

:thumbup: Yeah, yeah, yeah :thumbup:

Based on the comments made in this and other threads, it seems that most people on Bimmerfest.com would prefer to have an event geared more to our tastes. And if those attending Bimmefrfest East are of a different type of enthusiast, then we shouldn't see too much conflict between the events.


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## Pete Teoh (Jan 27, 2002)

OBS3SSION said:


> *:thumbup: Yeah, yeah, yeah :thumbup:
> 
> Based on the comments made in this and other threads, it seems that most people on Bimmerfest.com would prefer to have an event geared more to our tastes. And if those attending Bimmefrfest East are of a different type of enthusiast, then we shouldn't see too much conflict between the events. *


I'll be there even if I have to call in dead to work.


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## OBS3SSION (Oct 1, 2002)

So... are we going to do a Bimmerfest on the east coast this fall? The more I think about it, the more I think we should.

Let's just make sure the Bimmerfest is not on the same day or weekend as any other event, such as Bimmerfest East, and we should be okay. If a person can only attend one event, they will go to the one that they'd prefer to go to anyway. As far as I'm concerned, I'll try to go to both. :thumbup:


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## CRASHDAKOTA (May 30, 2002)

*Limerock Is a great Place to have an event and..............*

I think Motiv did a very smart move by having this years event there. Personally I am very excited on going to it, not only for the car show but also the racing they will have there also. I also think it is a more centralized location (rather than middle New York State) and will pull more of a croud from the middle atlantic states.


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## DZeckhausen (Mar 11, 2003)

Pete Teoh said:


> *So are we having a Bimmerfest this Fall on the East Coast?
> 
> Hmm... BimmerFall? Bimmerfest-Fall? :dunno: *


 If we do, I'll be glad to help out with the organizing and a few of the events. For example, I would be more than happy to put on a CDV clinic for the few remaining E39s that still have them. And I could do a brake bleeding seminar or a how-to session on changing your own pads and rotors. I could even do a demo install of a big brake kit.


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## RKT BMR (Sep 7, 2002)

Jon, alee gives some very good advice vis a vis the bimmerfest name. It's evolved to the point that there really is a trademark logo (upper left corner, on my hat, on the XL shirt Scott's going to get for me, etc. etc. etc.), and should be protected. This doesn't imply nazi-like control -- just protection.

I really appreciate your attitude about all this too. While heavily riced bimmers are definitely not my taste, I'm totally with you -- they're enthusiasts too, brothers and sisters, and are welcome.

Ad for the east coast rendition that Ted is trying to put together, I don't think the pent-up enthusiasm of our board buds could be kept contained if they had to wait until next year, so getting something together for late fall is probably a good idea.

However, if something is planned for '04 on the east coast, you and Ted should try really hard to have them occur on the same day. This would really bring the virtual community together, as we shared stories, pictures, etc. on the board after the events, and no one would feel left out. Also, we could do some cool stuff with webcams between the two events.

Finally, as great a job as you've been doing, perhaps it's time to form some sort of virtual steering committee from the bimmerfest.com community to help plan, organize, and execute the events. Mostly for the up-front stuff... You still have to be the host and MC 

That's my nickel...


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## car_for_mom (Jul 15, 2002)

I *loved* the laid-back, friendly, helpful atmosphere of Bimmerfest 2003 held at Cutter - Karl Bimmer is pretty much as the factory made him (plus 6-CD changer), and at the stage of life I'm in - serious mods are out (oh, wouldn't I like to roll up to Chino Hills High School to pick up my oldest in a *serious* car (can't you just see the 16 and 17 year olds drooling?  )

The biggest feature of Bimmerfest at Cutter is actually getting to meet the people that post, and being able to share our mutual enthusiasm regarding Bimmers.

I agree that there needs to be an event emphasizing community, which includes information on tuning, detailing and modification.

BTW, Jon (looks around to see if Don Crevier is listening :rofl: ) - I have been recommending you to prospective Bimmer buyers, and posted to the C&D Forum that Cutter BMW is *the* place to buy in SoCal, especially from Jon Shafer! (Don't forget to save a 330 ZHP for me in five years! :bigpimp: )


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## tdc (Apr 6, 2003)

Nuts. I wrote this long reply and then when I hit Post, it didn't go through.

Ok, so here's my second attempt...

Since I can't seem to e-mail or PM Jon through the forum, I will address the issue here to him and for everyone else.

I'm sorry that somewhere along the line people felt as if I was trying to infringe upon the "Bimmerfest" entity. I think Jon has adequately showed that I have done everything I can to give him the proper credit for starting Bimmerfest. But allow me to refer you all to the November 2002 issue of Performance BMW where it states, "Bimmerfest founder Jon Shafer and his dedicated crew at Cutter Motors gave us the latest installment on the west coast of the US (PBMW 8/02), which was followed a few months later by Bimmerfest East 2002, which you see here in all its glory." I've made it a point to make sure that everyone I speak to and any written article says that Jon is the creator of Bimmerfest.

Now, regarding the URLs, one thing you should all realize is that there is quite the history behind these URLs. Rather then hashing it out again, let's just leave it as PerformanceIX owning bimmerfest.com.

As for another group of people saying our event isn't the "real" Bimmerfest East, I find that disrespectful in many ways. One, I was given permission to use the name for the event. I think it's come quite a long way from what it was and we plan on only making it better (however subjective that term may be). Two, we've worked extremely hard to make our event what it is today and to say that it is not a "real" event is a slap in the face. Over 1000 people enjoyed our "fake" Bimmerfest East last year and I can safely say that at least that many will enjoy this year's as well.

Now, if Jon decides to not let us use the name in the future, so be it. It would be unfortunate since I believe this site is built upon "community" and as Jon stated revoking the privilege would go against that idiom. I, for one, would rather see an event where EVERYONE can feel comfortable and enjoy each other's pride and joy, whether it be bone stock or insanely modified. In previous threads regarding this subject, I have offered to work together in the future. No one has contacted me in that respect. I still hold high hopes that someone will indeed take me up on the offer and contact me at [email protected] to see how we can combine efforts to bring enthusiasts on the east coast the best Bimmerfest possible.

In any case, I have no say whether or not other people decide to put together another event on the east coast. All I can do is continue doing what I've been doing for the past 3 years and provide enthusiasts with an event geared solely for the BMW marque. Whether it be called Bimmerfest East or something else, it will still be an event for the BMW enthusiast by the BMW enthusiast.


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## Jon Shafer (Dec 15, 2001)

Tom!

What's up????

How are you?

Long time no talk.

Email me any time [email protected].

Heck, call me toll-free (800)676-1595.

My buddy Matt (Russell) at BMWNA and I were just talking about you.
(it's all good)

Anyway, I hope that you were able to capture the real
essence or "gist" of what I was trying to say when I started
this thread (in response to another one).

I'm off tomorrow, but if you'd like to chat Thursday,
PLEASE don't hesitate to call me.

If you get my voicemail, kindly leave me your number,
and I will gladly return your call.

Standing by,
--Jon


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## Jon Shafer (Dec 15, 2001)

What if we teamed up with MOTIV to support The East Coast event??


:dunno: 


Microeconomic Theory: cooperation is better than competition.


:str8pimpi 


Maybe we should consider it...


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## LarryN (Dec 24, 2001)

Jon Shafer said:


> *What if we teamed up with MOTIV to support The East Coast event??
> 
> :dunno:
> 
> ...


Hi Jon,

I'd definitelty consider it, but I'd want to go to the eastcost event to:

- Meet festers from here
- Hang with them, check out their rides
- Check out some vendors stuff (demos, installs)
- Go for an organized run
- Have a few beers afterwards (kick back)

I don't think I'd go if the group that would have definitely gone out to Ted's, wouldn't go to the MOTIV event. OTOH, I'd hate to see the "Tedfest" turn into a lame duck event that there would only be 15 car at. Actually, strike that... I'd more want to hang with 15 other festers from here, than be one of three at the MOTIV event. I not sure if Ted (or the dealership he works for) would be insterested in hosting an event like this for a small crowd, if it played out that way (which I doubt it would).

I think I know one of your thoughts of this potentially creating an "us against them" relationship with the good MOTIV folks. I would never want to see that happen. We are all BMW enthusiast, just choosing to express it in a different way. The reason I was hoping it would be a separate event is based on the theme of the bimmerfesteast website, and pics of their previous events.

So, I'd have to see who would go to the MOTIV event before I made up my mind, I guess. Kind of a lemming response, but for me it's the truth. It would certainly be easier to host one event, pooling resources though. What do you say guys... would you go?


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## tdc (Apr 6, 2003)

Don't worry about it becoming an "us vs. them" issue. That won't happen.

I fully understand that there are different types of enthusiasts, just like there are different types of people. I suppose I'm one of the few people that can enjoy all kinds of BMWs - extremely modified ones, pristine stock ones, immaculate concours level models, concept models, and race-modified BMWs as well. The majority seem to fall within one or the other, maybe two at most.

So I don't see any reason why another event designed for the bimmerfest.com demographic couldn't be organized if that demographic is just dead set against coming to our event. And like I said, I'll be more than happy to help out in any way I can. As long as it doesn't conflict with our Bimmerfest East, I'd love to attend that one as well!


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## tdc (Apr 6, 2003)

Hey DougDogs...thanks for the comments!

We are planning a massive advertising campaign this year for the pure fact it is being held at Lime Rock Park.


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## scottn2retro (Mar 20, 2002)

Hi tdc -

I thought from the description of your event this year that it sounded like a great event that I think could appeal to quite a few B'fest.com members (especially with the growth of the site recently). If I were on the East Coast, I'd be interested.

My only contention from the other thread was I'd like to see bimmerfest.com get some exposure. You certainly give credit to Jon and the event Bimmerfest, but when I saw the old announcement on the other thread, other than the fine print at the bottom, it seemed possible to go to a Bimmerfest and not even be aware there is a bimmerfest.com.


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## Jon Shafer (Dec 15, 2001)

I cannot speak for Mark or Tim, but maybe it is time to consider a
"strategic alliance"?

:angel:


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## tdc (Apr 6, 2003)

scottn2retro said:


> *My only contention from the other thread was I'd like to see bimmerfest.com get some exposure. You certainly give credit to Jon and the event Bimmerfest, but when I saw the old announcement on the other thread, other than the fine print at the bottom, it seemed possible to go to a Bimmerfest and not even be aware there is a bimmerfest.com. *


Perhaps I am missing something but can you explain to me why Bimmerfest.com should receive credit for Bimmerfest East?


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## alee (Dec 19, 2001)

___lk___ said:


> *hope u got a spare $100,000 laying around.. the search alone will probably cost half that.  *


WRONG. Bzzzt. Go back under your bridge you evil troll. :tsk:


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## TedW (Jan 13, 2003)

Shouldn't someone start a vote?:dunno: Since I started posting and sponsoring this board I've become familiar with many of you who welcome my comments and help. I would love to meet everyone and I'm most concerned about who would come to either event. There has to be a solution that will please most, if not all of us. I am fully willing to work with MOTIV as long as the mass of this board will attend. As I said before, what I do or not do in the way of any event is up to the members of this board.




Ted


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## Mike 325xi (Dec 19, 2001)

___lk___ said:


> *hope u got a spare $100,000 laying around.. the search alone will probably cost half that.  *


I see that a long absence from the board hasn't made you any more pleasant. :tsk:


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## Dr. Phil (Dec 19, 2001)

alee said:


> *You must go. Alex is like Halley's Comet... if you miss this chance, it won't happen for another 75 years.  *


:lmao: :bustingup

I see the need for a dedicated server just for the Alexfest Tour pictures.  :thumbup:


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## tgravo2 (Dec 7, 2002)

Dr. Phil said:


> *Give in to the temptation :angel: If you show you can drive my car :amish: :fruit: :drive: :str8pimpi *


Phil, that's just making me want to go more!


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## scottn2retro (Mar 20, 2002)

*Here's the Scoop . . .*

Here's the Bimmerfest East 2003 Forum here:

Bimmerfest East 2003


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