# How much should I offer for ED M3?



## Bimmer Love (Aug 30, 2011)

Hello Everyone - long time reader, first time poster here 

I am looking to purchase a 2012 M3 Coupe via European Delivery. I am paying cash (no financing/leasing) and will need to put in my order by the end of the week so that I can confirm a production slot that coincides with a previously planned trip to Germany. 

My M3 will have the following options: 
Metallic Paint
ZPP Premium Package (Black Novillo Leather/Sycamore Trim)
Double Clutch Transmission
Sat Radio
Enhanced Premium Sound
Heated Seats

As of now, my client advisor has offered me $1000 off the European Delivery price. Is this a good discount or should I press for more? I haven't been able to find much on the internet in regards to ED invoice pricing for 2012 M3. They have also asked for $599 in Dealer Fees and another $210 in "Non Tax Fees" - do these amounts seem reasonable? I am in South Florida and whilst shopping around, it seems these fees can vary quite a bit among dealers.

I am sure you all hate when people ask this as I'm sure you get it ALL.THE.TIME - but this gal would really appreciate your help! Upon realizing that it's time for me to upgrade the 'ol (but beloved) E46, I went from nearly driving off in an X35d for "eco reasons" and then searching for a 335 vert, finally saying to myself that I should just get what it is that I have really been lusting for all these years (M3). I'm rather overwhelmed with numbers on all these cars and honestly am starting to confuse my facts, so again, I'd really appreciate your help. I hate rushing through this, but I can't think of anything better than ending my trip to Germany with a visit to BMW Welt to pick up my new car!


----------



## dunderhi (Dec 10, 2006)

Follow the Bimmerfest ED Wiki link near the top of thread list for info. There are Sponsors on this forum that can help. Adrian in Atlanta has a solid rep here. I always tell folks to shoot for the Wiki's $500-1200 over ED invoice (including fees).


----------



## Bimmer Love (Aug 30, 2011)

dunderhi said:


> Follow the Bimmerfest ED Wiki link near the top of thread list for info. There are Sponsors on this forum that can help. Adrian in Atlanta has a solid rep here. I always tell folks to shoot for the Wiki's $500-1200 over ED invoice (including fees).


Someone else over in the M3 forum recommended him as well so I'll try to get in touch with him tomorrow. Should I mention that I found him through Bimmerfest?


----------



## CarSwami (Oct 2, 2005)

Yes, please let him know you heard about him on Bimmerfest! Adrian will take good care of you. He gets rave reviews here on Bimmerfest.


----------



## Technic (Jun 24, 2002)

Bimmer Love said:


> Hello Everyone - long time reader, first time poster here
> 
> I am looking to purchase a 2012 M3 Coupe via European Delivery. I am paying cash (no financing/leasing) and will need to put in my order by the end of the week so that I can confirm a production slot that coincides with a previously planned trip to Germany.
> 
> ...


Vista BMW in Coconut Creek sells M3 at $1000 over ED invoice (about $7000 below MSRP). Contact Lino Menendes if you want to stay local.


----------



## Bimmer Love (Aug 30, 2011)

Technic said:


> Vista BMW in Coconut Creek sells M3 at $1000 over ED invoice (about $7000 below MSRP). Contact Lino Menendes if you want to stay local.


I have heard so many not so good things about customer service issues at Vista but I'll definitely give him a call as well. Is Lino also a sponsor of this board?


----------



## SD ///M4 (Jan 24, 2011)

Bimmer Love said:


> I am in South Florida...


Why not just put "South Florida" instead of "USA" as your location in your profile? It would make it a lot easier for future reference.


----------



## Bimmer Love (Aug 30, 2011)

SD 335is said:


> Why not just put "South Florida" instead of "USA" as your location in your profile? It would make it a lot easier for future reference.


I was trying to be mysterious.


----------



## AggieKnight (Dec 26, 2008)

Bimmer Love said:


> I was trying to be mysterious.


A bimmer lover AND mysterious?

:yikes::yikes::yikes::yikes:

You can also use http://www.bmwconfig.com/ to figure out how much you should be offering.


----------



## admranger (Dec 24, 2005)

I am very pleased with my dealings with Greg Poland at Pacific BMW in Glendale, CA. You could do a Performance Center Delivery in Greenville, SC so the commute home would be easier! 

Greg's price for me was in the ballpark of what others have mentioned.


----------



## wmo168 (Mar 26, 2009)

I am in South Florida, and never trust local dealer with dealer fees and crazy add on, if you willing to travel, ED with Adrian is the best.. which is where I got my M3 from.


----------



## necromancer (Sep 7, 2010)

Don't sweat the out of town stuff. Atlanta isn't too far and neither is the Performance Center. DO PCD REDELIVERY ESPECIALLY WITH M CARS!

Sent from my DROIDX using Bimmer


----------



## jhall1957 (May 31, 2006)

Dang, if your getting it for $1,000 under ED price, I won't even bother to look elsewhere. Besides, your local dealer will likely wash it often for you and your more likely to get a loaner when you get service, and don't you want to keep those dollars in the local economy as much as you can?

The ED price is already a good discount and while the fees my be a pain, it's a small price to pay to have the commitment of your local dealer.

Trust me, I've had many cars and it NEVER hurts to have a local "friend" in the business!


----------



## Bimmer Love (Aug 30, 2011)

AggieKnight said:


> A bimmer lover AND mysterious?
> 
> :yikes::yikes::yikes::yikes:


You say that like it's a bad thing!


----------



## Bimmer Love (Aug 30, 2011)

jhall1957 said:


> Dang, if your getting it for $1,000 under ED price, I won't even bother to look elsewhere. Besides, your local dealer will likely wash it often for you and your more likely to get a loaner when you get service, and don't you want to keep those dollars in the local economy as much as you can?
> 
> The ED price is already a good discount and while the fees my be a pain, it's a small price to pay to have the commitment of your local dealer.
> 
> Trust me, I've had many cars and it NEVER hurts to have a local "friend" in the business!


Everyone on here acts like "only $1000 under ED" price is kids stuff.


----------



## jhall1957 (May 31, 2006)

Bimmer Love said:


> Everyone on here acts like "only $1000 under ED" price is kids stuff.


I know. I ordered a 1M and I was happy to let the dealership make $1,000 over the ED price because they are good to me 9They made me first on the allocation list without deposit, in front of some other big buyers).

$1,000 under ED price is pretty good!

I'm a BIG believer in having a good relationship with your local dealership and if they pop with a number like $1,000 under without too much pressure on your part, they sound like a place I'd do business!


----------



## 335i (Feb 23, 2007)

Bimmer Love said:


> Everyone on here acts like "only $1000 under ED" price is kids stuff.


Troof.

I'm on my 3rd BMW, (2 of them ED's) and have done $1000 over invoice on all 3. Very attainable. :thumbup:


----------



## Technic (Jun 24, 2002)

Bimmer Love said:


> I have heard so many not so good things about customer service issues at Vista but I'll definitely give him a call as well. Is Lino also a sponsor of this board?


Lino is not a sponsor of this board -that I know of.

What I do know is that he's working with my salesperson -David Aviles in Northwest BMW in Maryland- in coordinating a Courtesy Delivery to Vista BMW once my ED M3 arrives at the VPC. David sells at a flat $500 over ED invoice and Lino charges a $250 fee for the Courtesy Delivery. So my total cost is $750 over ED invoice.

Why I did not go with Lino in the first place? Because of my past experience with Vista BMW (excellent experience and price on a 2002 330i, lousy experience trying to buy a 2004 M3 and a 2008 M3 from them), so I did not even bother to contact them for this order. But once I read about Courtesy Delivery, and because they are my servicing dealer, I asked my service friends who can help me out in sales with this Courtesy Delivery.

After talking with Lino then all was set in 10 minutes and he told me about the $1000 over ED invoice "just in case I know of any other person looking for ED".


----------



## 97X (Sep 19, 2007)

Bimmer Love said:


> Everyone on here acts like "only $1000 under ED" price is kids stuff.


That's because negotiating DOWN from list price is never advantageous. Instead, you should be negotiating UP from invoice price. All of the sponsors, including those mentioned in this thread, will offer you ED invoice price PLUS X, where X usually equals $500 to $1000.

There is a substantial difference between $1000 over invoice and $1000 under list. Spend some time reading other posts and going through the Wiki - you'll see what we mean.


----------



## jhall1957 (May 31, 2006)

97X said:


> That's because negotiating DOWN from list price is never advantageous. Instead, you should be negotiating UP from invoice price. All of the sponsors, including those mentioned in this thread, will offer you ED invoice price PLUS X, where X usually equals $500 to $1000.
> 
> There is a substantial difference between $1000 over invoice and $1000 under list. Spend some time reading other posts and going through the Wiki - you'll see what we mean.


Dang, another "german" attitude, Kidding you! But really I think all of us that have done ED or two assume that we are talking ED pricing at invoice. The OP never stated whether she was talking list (MSRP) or invoice but I figured since she said she had been a "long time reader" she knew to look for invoice pricing on a ED.

The "German" thing is about the fact that a lot of people reaad this forum and seem to wait for a chance to "JUMP" on another poster for either mis-speaking (typing?) or asking for info before "searching the Wiki"! My personal feeling is if a post or thread makes you less then happy, don't read it but surely don't post some short, pointed answer. Everyone here is either looking to learn or looking to share info.


----------



## Technic (Jun 24, 2002)

jhall1957 said:


> Gosh, I'm glad I could throw abit of gas on this flame!
> 
> BTW, good job on saving the $3,000! I think that is a well done job and I'm glad the forum helped you save that! Remember, I'm the guy defending your asking a basic question before reading the Wiki. Next time I'll just say, "Read the Wiki!" LOL
> 
> ...


I don't drink coffee... that's the problem.


----------



## jhall1957 (May 31, 2006)

Technic said:


> I don't drink coffee... that's the problem.


Ok, time to start then!

Funny, I don't either, maybe that explains alot about both of us!


----------



## 3ismagic# (Mar 17, 2011)

AggieKnight said:


> The process is pretty straightforward:
> 1. Use BMWConfig.com to "build" your BMW. Ensure that you select "European Delivery Munich Pickup" on the dropdown.
> 2. *Take the Invoice Total and add $500 - $1K to define your target price.*


This is spot-on for non-M cars where ED sales do not come out of dealer allocation.
You might expect to pay more than this for an E92 M3 ED. Perhaps those who have done E92 M3 ED can comment.

A lot of folks here did E93 M3 ED over the summer because of a smoking lease deal but I imagine that dealers don't sell through their yearly E93 M3 allocations anyway and were perfectly happy to unload them. This may not be true for E92 M3.


----------



## Technic (Jun 24, 2002)

3ismagic# said:


> This is spot-on for non-M cars where ED sales do not come out of dealer allocation.
> You might expect to pay more than this for an E92 M3 ED. Perhaps those who have done E92 M3 ED can comment.
> 
> A lot of folks here did E93 M3 ED over the summer because of a smoking lease deal but I imagine that dealers don't sell through their yearly E93 M3 allocations anyway and were perfectly happy to unload them. This may not be true for E92 M3.


It has applied to all ED M3 as well since about 02/09.


----------



## M FUNF (Apr 2, 2008)

3ismagic# said:


> This is spot-on for non-M cars where ED sales do not come out of dealer allocation.
> You might expect to pay more than this for an E92 M3 ED. Perhaps those who have done E92 M3 ED can comment.
> 
> A lot of folks here did E93 M3 ED over the summer because of a smoking lease deal but I imagine that dealers don't sell through their yearly E93 M3 allocations anyway and were perfectly happy to unload them. This may not be true for E92 M3.


BS meter just got pegged off scale High!!! :yikes:  M cars do not come out of the dealer allocation and have not for several years.


----------



## 3ismagic# (Mar 17, 2011)

My bad.


----------



## basiluf (Dec 16, 2010)

pharding said:


> You should consider Josh Douglas at Elmhurst (IL) BMW. It is the top rated BMW dealership in the Chicago area. Josh has great pricing and he is extremely dependable. He has done many BMW Euro Delivery deals here. The dealership in general is much better to deal with on the sale than others here.


I used him for mine and I live in Orlando. Well worth it too.


----------



## Bimmer Love (Aug 30, 2011)

basiluf said:


> I used him for mine and I live in Orlando. Well worth it too.


Fields = Dislike Button ?


----------



## basiluf (Dec 16, 2010)

Bimmer Love said:


> Fields = Dislike Button ?


Fields=Burned down

just kidding

But seriously, I went to their South Orlando dealership and the sales person said Fields doesn't do ED, and he confirmed with their management that they don't at all of their dealerships. Then I went to the Winter Park location and they said they do ED, but why would I want to do that when they have the car I want in stock?

IF my calculations are correct, I received $6k under ED MSRP on our deal and did the Performance Center Redelivery which was well worth it.

2011 M3 convertible
non-metallic paint
leather is standard
convenience package
M-DCT transmission
US MSRP $75,425
Selling price $64,170

ED MSRP $75,425 x .93= 70,145

70,145-64,170= $5975 below ED MSRP


----------



## jhall1957 (May 31, 2006)

It's crazy that the CA's at these dealerships don't get it! But my understanding is it does take them longer to get paid for selling a ED car and alot of sales folks have a shorter term view of sales and revenue, I guess?

Commission now vs. A loyal customer for life? That's a easy one for me! But then I've been in sales for a LONG time!


----------



## BimwadM3 (Apr 11, 2011)

If you don't buy local, be sure to work out the courtesy delivery issue with the deal. There are some other threads here where some got into real trouble about delivery of the car from one dealer to another. Local is a good thing from a lot of perspectives, if you can work the deal.


----------



## Bimmer Love (Aug 30, 2011)

Can you do both a courtesy delivery AND performance delivery?


----------



## Technic (Jun 24, 2002)

Bimmer Love said:


> Can you do both a courtesy delivery AND performance delivery?


Courtesy Delivery is transporting your car from the VPC to your local dealer without stopping in between -of course, assuming that your local dealer was not your selling dealer. Anything else involves an arrangement with a private transport company -either by you or by your selling dealer/PCD.


----------



## Bimmer Love (Aug 30, 2011)

Technic said:


> Courtesy Delivery is transporting your car from the VPC to your local dealer without stopping in between -of course, assuming that your local dealer was not your selling dealer. Anything else involves an arrangement with a private transport company -either by you or by your selling dealer/PCD.


That's what I figured - that if you wanted the car to be shipped, you had to arrange for it yourself through a third party shipping company.


----------



## BimwadM3 (Apr 11, 2011)

BimmerLove, check out the thread initiated by AJS2005 "Euro delivery redelivery nightmare" (I foudn it on p. 2 with an 8/22/11 date). As was said above, with courtesy delivery BMW sends the car directly to a local dealer, even though you bought it from a non-local dealer. AJS2005 wound up having to do 3rd party shipping and it caused some issues. 

If you do PDC, you don't have to worry about courtesy delivery. The dealer from whom you buy should work out the scheduling to have the car go to the Performance Center rather than a dealer. And the experience is terrific, well worth the time. We did it last Friday for our 335is and it was a hugely fun day. BMW treats you even better there than they do in Europe: track events on tires you don't pay for, the opportunity to ride in a "Ring Taxi" M5, free transportation from airport to hotel, free hotel, free dinner and breakfast, free lunch during class, and a full tank of gas. And doing it with an M3 would be even better. What's not to love?


----------



## Bimmer Love (Aug 30, 2011)

BimwadM3 said:


> BimmerLove, check out the thread initiated by AJS2005 "Euro delivery redelivery nightmare" (I foudn it on p. 2 with an 8/22/11 date). As was said above, with courtesy delivery BMW sends the car directly to a local dealer, even though you bought it from a non-local dealer. AJS2005 wound up having to do 3rd party shipping and it caused some issues.
> 
> If you do PDC, you don't have to worry about courtesy delivery. The dealer from whom you buy should work out the scheduling to have the car go to the Performance Center rather than a dealer. And the experience is terrific, well worth the time. We did it last Friday for our 335is and it was a hugely fun day. BMW treats you even better there than they do in Europe: track events on tires you don't pay for, the opportunity to ride in a "Ring Taxi" M5, free transportation from airport to hotel, free hotel, free dinner and breakfast, free lunch during class, and a full tank of gas. And doing it with an M3 would be even better. What's not to love?


The potential for having to drive home in snow and ice - neither of which I have ANY experience driving in. :thumbdwn:


----------



## AggieKnight (Dec 26, 2008)

Maybe I'm old school, but while I'm OK with buying a car remotely, I want to pick it up at the dealer and shake the hand of the CA that made it all possible. 

Also...if there are any delivery problems with the car, you're probably much more likely to get assistance from the person who sold you the car than a dealer who has no skin in the game.

Or PCD. That's what I'm doing for my F10 next year.


----------



## Bimmer Love (Aug 30, 2011)

OK OK...PCD it is! :thumbup:


----------

