# Which is fast 0-60mph 325i manual or automatic



## vimal (Aug 16, 2004)

Hi,

Which is faster having quick pickup speed. say 0-60 mph?
A 325i with manual or 325i with automatic?

I say manual but my friends say automatic.


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## Nick325xiT 5spd (Dec 24, 2001)

manual. by at least a second if you're good.


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## elmalloc (Dec 7, 2003)

Case closed, now if you're talking about the Benz SLK350 with 7 speed automatic - you may have something else on your hands.


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## KwlAznKid (Nov 22, 2004)

mannual for sure.


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## drmwvr (Feb 21, 2003)

Manual


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## HW (Dec 24, 2001)

i've driven courtesy 325 slushies by far my manual 323 is faster. i can't actually make it leap whereas the slushies feel lethargic.


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## Moderato (Nov 24, 2003)

If you know how to drive it, the manual will be faster.


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## Mr. The Edge (Dec 19, 2001)

neither is fast


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## wag-zhp (Apr 8, 2004)

Same body, stock rear end gears (final drive), and same engine the manual should always be faster. But only if you know how to drive a manual. If you don't know how to launch from a standstill or you miss a shift the automatic will have a chance to win. Note that a correct launch requires either tire spin or clutch slipage. Hardly anyone performs a correct drag strip stile launch during the course of normal street driving. If they did they would be replacing either tires or clutches at an alarming rate.

From a rolling start, the automatic can actually make it a pretty close contest. If the manual driver doesn't have the car in the correct gear they will either have to shift to a more appropriate gear, or they will have to wait for the engine to get into its power band. Either will take time, maybe as much as several seconds. The automatic will jump to the correct gear as soon as the go pedal is stomped to the floor. In this case the skill of the manual driver is what can make the most difference.

If both cars are driven by competent drivers, the manual will be about .5 seconds faster to 60 and in the 1/4 mile.


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## Fifty_Cent (Sep 17, 2003)

wag-zhp said:


> Same body, stock rear end gears (final drive), and same engine the manual should always be faster. But only if you know how to drive a manual. If you don't know how to launch from a standstill or you miss a shift the automatic will have a chance to win. Note that a correct launch requires either tire spin or clutch slipage. Hardly anyone performs a correct drag strip stile launch during the course of normal street driving. If they did they would be replacing either tires or clutches at an alarming rate.
> 
> From a rolling start, the automatic can actually make it a pretty close contest. If the manual driver doesn't have the car in the correct gear they will either have to shift to a more appropriate gear, or they will have to wait for the engine to get into its power band. Either will take time, maybe as much as several seconds. The automatic will jump to the correct gear as soon as the go pedal is stomped to the floor. In this case the skill of the manual driver is what can make the most difference.
> 
> If both cars are driven by competent drivers, the manual will be about .5 seconds faster to 60 and in the 1/4 mile.


Manual when (and if) you know how to drop gears fast. If you dont, the auto.


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## cwsqbm (Aug 4, 2004)

atyclb said:


> neither is fast


Yes, but one of the two is quicker.


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## flashinthepan (Jul 25, 2003)

atyclb said:


> neither is fast


 :rofl: I was thinking the same. Bad bad bad !!


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## andy_thomas (Oct 7, 2002)

flashinthepan said:


> :rofl: I was thinking the same. Bad bad bad !!


When the original 325i came out, was that "fast"? Most seemed to think so. The E46 325i has similar, or better, acceleration. So how come this car is not regarded as "fast"? :dunno:


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## HW (Dec 24, 2001)

andy_thomas said:


> When the original 325i came out, was that "fast"? Most seemed to think so. The E46 325i has similar, or better, acceleration. So how come this car is not regarded as "fast"? :dunno:


it had more hp and higher torque perhaps at the expense of emissions also the original 325i was significantly lighter and not the pig that it is today.


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## FenPhen (Jan 13, 2004)

andy_thomas said:


> When the original 325i came out, was that "fast"? Most seemed to think so. The E46 325i has similar, or better, acceleration. So how come this car is not regarded as "fast"? :dunno:


"Fast" isn't objective/absolute, and evolves over time. "Faster" can be objective/absolute.

BMW's published 0-60 time for a manual E46 325i is 7.1 s and 8.1 for the Step. A stock (U.S.) E30 M3 has 0-60 times as high as 7.6 s.


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## flashinthepan (Jul 25, 2003)

FenPhen said:


> "Fast" isn't objective/absolute, and evolves over time. "Faster" can be objective/absolute.
> 
> BMW's published 0-60 time for a manual E46 325i is 7.1 s and 8.1 for the Step. A stock (U.S.) E30 M3 has 0-60 times as high as 7.6 s.


Absolutely agree, the 325i actually feels pretty snappy for its HP rating. Anyone in a 50k car can be considered slow, if compared to say something like an Enzo. Just be carefull some of the new Maxima's, Acura's even some Accords and a few other Japanese Family sedans will more than likely roast your goose.

Butto answer your real question Manual wins.


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## andy_thomas (Oct 7, 2002)

flashinthepan said:


> Absolutely agree, the 325i actually feels pretty snappy for its HP rating. Anyone in a 50k car can be considered slow, if compared to say something like an Enzo.


A 325i is still "fast", if you've never driven anything that fast. As you say, it's relative. I recently took a long drive to Rockingham race circuit in a 325i auto (with 193 bhp but a longer final drive than you'll find in 325s outside of Europe) and was still the fastest thing on A-roads and motorways - with the sole exception of a Golf R32, which under sustained, full-throttle acceleration (judging by the driver's peak rpm shifts, which were clearly audible) put steady, but slow, distance between us.


> Just be carefull some of the new Maxima's, Acura's even some Accords and a few other Japanese Family sedans will more than likely roast your goose.


Not round this neck of of the woods. Nissan last sold a big car here in the nineties, the only posh Honda is a Legend (last year's private sales: 7) and the quickest Accord available has a 2.3 litre four-pot. Still, even that would roast my goose, assuming no bends were involved


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## flashinthepan (Jul 25, 2003)

andy_thomas said:


> A 325i is still "fast", if you've never driven anything that fast. As you say, it's relative. I recently took a long drive to Rockingham race circuit in a 325i auto (with 193 bhp but a longer final drive than you'll find in 325s outside of Europe) and was still the fastest thing on A-roads and motorways - with the sole exception of a Golf R32, which under sustained, full-throttle acceleration (judging by the driver's peak rpm shifts, which were clearly audible) put steady, but slow, distance between us.
> 
> Not round this neck of of the woods. Nissan last sold a big car here in the nineties, the only posh Honda is a Legend (last year's private sales: 7) and the quickest Accord available has a 2.3 litre four-pot. Still, even that would roast my goose, assuming no bends were involved


Hi Andy !

I hear in London it cost major $$$$ to do anything ? 
BTW I love all the 3 series cars. :thumbup:


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## Memphis10 (Aug 21, 2003)

*Manual or Auto*

I believe that the manual is faster only if you can drive well. It is very easy to drive fast in an auto - just mash the accelerator. The 7.1s 0-60 time that BMW reports is on track that is driven by a professional driver. Average drivers can't make that kind of 0-60 time. I have raced with automatic drivers and people even in Honda accords get past me when I am in the first 2 gears. In a recent road and track comparison test BMW 325 was the third fastest when pitted against Saab 9-3, Jag X type, Lexus IS 330, AcuraTL and the Infinity G35. A 184 HP 325 can still beat the 225 hp Lexus just because you can launch the BMW much more aggresively. However, the 5 - 60 mph timing in the 325 is bad compared with the lexus. Now all you Schumachers out there, can you give your 2 cents on how to launch the car faster.


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## andy_thomas (Oct 7, 2002)

flashinthepan said:


> Hi Andy !
> 
> I hear in London it cost major $$$$ to do anything ?
> BTW I love all the 3 series cars. :thumbup:


Yup, for modifying parts are reasonably cheap but fitment generally costs the earth - labour rates here are sky-high as a result of a housing boom that's been booming since the mid-90s, and everyone's jacking up their rates to service their debts. It means that weekend shade-tree mechanics like me can earn few extra quid fixing people's lightbulbs .

On the big-bang-per-buck front, none of the volume manufacturers make medium/big-sized cars available here any more. They keep pricing them too high, right next to the Germans, and people keep not buying them (despite their undoubted superiority in terms of reliability). None of them seem to pay much attention to economic theory, either, so rather than price them lower, Ford, Toyota, Honda, GM and Nissan have all pulled their biggest cars from the price lists in recent years.


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## norihaga (Aug 25, 2004)

andy_thomas said:


> Yup, for modifying parts are reasonably cheap but fitment generally costs the earth - labour rates here are sky-high as a result of a housing boom that's been booming since the mid-90s, and everyone's jacking up their rates to service their debts. It means that weekend shade-tree mechanics like me can earn few extra quid fixing people's lightbulbs .
> 
> On the big-bang-per-buck front, none of the volume manufacturers make medium/big-sized cars available here any more. They keep pricing them too high, right next to the Germans, and people keep not buying them (despite their undoubted superiority in terms of reliability). None of them seem to pay much attention to economic theory, either, so rather than price them lower, Ford, Toyota, Honda, GM and Nissan have all pulled their biggest cars from the price lists in recent years.


Look on the bright side, youse guyses get to drive the Clio 182, new GTI, or even old 205 GTIs ( very  ), and can get grey import JDM cars. Plus many excellent circuits offering tons of track days.


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## F1Crazy (Dec 11, 2002)

Memphis10 said:


> I believe that the manual is faster only if you can drive well. It is very easy to drive fast in an auto - just mash the accelerator. The 7.1s 0-60 time that BMW reports is on track that is driven by a professional driver. Average drivers can't make that kind of 0-60 time. I have raced with automatic drivers and people even in Honda accords get past me when I am in the first 2 gears. In a recent road and track comparison test BMW 325 was the third fastest when pitted against Saab 9-3, Jag X type, Lexus IS 330, AcuraTL and the Infinity G35. A 184 HP 325 can still beat the 225 hp Lexus just because you can launch the BMW much more aggresively. However, the 5 - 60 mph timing in the 325 is bad compared with the lexus. Now all you Schumachers out there, can you give your 2 cents on how to launch the car faster.


There are tons of threads on launching the car quickly but the general rule was explained in one of the above posts - higher revs and either drop clutch and try to control the wheelspin or slip the clutch, all depends on the car. On 325i turn DSC off, first gear , get revs up to at least 3,500 and slip the clutch while getting on throttle, there won't be much wheelspin, it's easy to control with throttle but pretty much push the pedal to the metal. That should take you up to speed but at the drag strip there are more aggressive launch techniques, not car friendly though. More powerful cars, especially the ones with lots of torque require more finesse since dropping the clutch will result in wild burnout. One of the easiest cars to launch that I've driven is STi. You pretty much get the revs up to 4-5K and drop the clutch and mash the throttle, car rockets off the line with very little wheelspin.


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## andy_thomas (Oct 7, 2002)

norihaga said:


> Look on the bright side, youse guyses get to drive the Clio 182, new GTI, or even old 205 GTIs ( very  ), and can get grey import JDM cars. Plus many excellent circuits offering tons of track days.


There is a lot of fun stuff here, yes - a nice by-product of having lot of airfields we don't need any more .

The Clio Cup is building a reputation as a bit of a giant-killer. It costs pin money, goes as fast as a 330i (0-100 in 16 sec) and on many tracks is quite able to keep up with an Elise without biting you in the arse if you overdo it.


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## nate (Dec 24, 2001)

Nick325xiT 5spd said:


> manual. by at least a second if you're good.


werd


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## FenPhen (Jan 13, 2004)

andy_thomas said:


> There is a lot of fun stuff here, yes - a nice by-product of having lot of airfields we don't need any more .


I noticed that from watching Top Gear and Fifth Gear.  Lucky.


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## allaboutme (Dec 22, 2003)

andy_thomas said:


> There is a lot of fun stuff here, yes - a nice by-product of having lot of airfields we don't need any more .
> 
> The Clio Cup is building a reputation as a bit of a giant-killer. It costs pin money, goes as fast as a 330i (0-100 in 16 sec) and on many tracks is quite able to keep up with an Elise without biting you in the arse if you overdo it.


Andy, when you say quid, is that your equivilent of our buck. A buck here is really just a dollar. Is a quid just your slang for a pound. My curiosity stems from watching too much Top Gear.


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## Wallenrod (Nov 25, 2003)

325i (or Ci) feels fantastic in manual. It's a great and fast car. Steptronic makes it much more boring/slower. In a 330i this difference is less obvious. I actually think that 325i is one of the best deals on the US sedan market. If only the price difference/feature saturation wasn't so close for the 330i - I would be driving a manual 325i. 
Then again the first E46 I drove was a 323i and I loved it - these cars can be had now for about 14K which seems like a steal.


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## andy_thomas (Oct 7, 2002)

allaboutme said:


> Andy, when you say quid, is that your equivilent of our buck. A buck here is really just a dollar. Is a quid just your slang for a pound. My curiosity stems from watching too much Top Gear.


Correct. It's either from the Latin (quid pro quo), or possibly a derivation of a Celtic colloqualism. Unlike "buck" it is never pluralised (so "a quid", "fifty quid", etc.). I think the only time it's found in the typographical plural is in the expression "quids in", meaning "in profit".


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