# Swiss Speeding Ticket - Please Help!



## DavidF30 (May 1, 2012)

Hi Bimmerfesters!!!

Thanks to many of you, I enjoyed my ED with long, beautiful drives and breathtaking sceneries. I dropped-off my F30 335i on June 26th. Fast forward 5 weeks...I get a mail from Europe. I could see through the envelope window that it said something about Police Cantonale. I opened it, and voila....a speeding ticket from Switzerland.

Now, before I went for my ED, I had read a lot of posts here about Switzerland and their radar detectors. In addition, I also got a lot of warnings and instructions on how Switzerland is FULL of automatic radar detectors from the BMW delivery person in Munich. So, even before I entered Switzerland, I made sure I was well under the speed limit :angel:. Moreover, while I was driving towards Geneva, which was my last stop in my tour and also my drop-off city...I was a little low on gas. I didn't want to fill up my tank before I had it dropped off, so I switched to Eco-Pro and was driving in the last lane at very slow speeds.

But, the ticket says that I was driving at 122 kmph (*76 mph*) which is 22 kmph over the speed limit of 100 kmph, on the way to Geneva, on the Autoroute Lausanne near Crissier. The speed was recorded by an unmanned automatic radar camera. The fine....a whooping 208 Euros. That's *$260*!!! 

Now, I'm not a guy who tries to avoid the law or to ignore it! But, in this case...I really DO NOT want to pay!! I mean, *I know* I was under the speed limit. I know that, because I was in a brand new car that was not yet broken in and never crossed 4000 rpm. I know that, because I was in the last lane driving very slow....so slow that I felt that it was the longest drive ever. I mean, there was an old car with a trailer in front of me, for crying out loud!! Moreover, like I said before, I was low on gas and was driving on Eco-Pro's suggested range of *56 - 69 mph*. And, to top it all off, a lot of cars went past me in the other lane(s), so I definitely was going slower than the traffic. So, how on EARTH did I get this ticket???? :dunno:  :bawling:

The part of the ticket that says something about foreign drivers is as follows:



> Ausländische Fahrer
> Wenn die Busse nicht bezahlt worden ist, oder wenn Sie diesen brief nicht beantworten, riskieren Sie, auf schweizerischem Boden interpelliert zu werden, zwecks Einziehung des betreffenden Betrages, oder zwecks identifikation des Fahrers im Hinblick auf gerichtliche Folgen. Für den Grenzgänger könnte im weiteren eine Intervention am Arbeitsplatz stattfinden.


Google Translation:


> Foreign Drivers
> If the bus has not been paid, or if you do not answer this letter, you risk being interrogated on Swiss soil, to secure recovery of that amount, or for the purpose of identification of the driver in terms of legal consequences. For other commuters, intervention could take place in the workplace.


Now, I went through a *LOT* of posts about this in the forums. Almost all of them seem to have answers based on assumptions, so there doesn't seem to be a concrete answer.

Now, my questions are simply just these three:

1. Since I'm never going back to Switzerland (never, means never ), do I have to fear anything? (Anything at all...)

2. Can the Swiss hire collection agencies here to retrieve the money without having access to my SSN? (All they have access to is my Name, Passport Number, and Address)

3. When I renew my passport (it's happening this December), and get a new passport number, and then use it to enter Europe in a couple of years, do the Swiss get notified about it? (FYI, I will not be taking the old passport with me, and I already checked that all new passports get a new passport number that does not have any connection to the old passport number.)

Once again, I thank you all in advance for your valuable time and efforts in helping me out.


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## southpole12 (Jan 10, 2009)

DavidF30 said:


> Hi Bimmerfesters!!!
> 
> Thanks to many of you, I enjoyed my ED with long, beautiful drives and breathtaking sceneries. I dropped-off my F30 335i on June 26th. Fast forward 5 weeks...I get a mail from Europe. I could see through the envelope window that it said something about Police Cantonale. I opened it, and voila....a speeding ticket from Switzerland.
> 
> ...


I am the same way. I am curious to the answer of your question as I saw a couple of flashes driving through switzerland and I was going a little over the speed limit. Those cameras are ridiculous!! I am not paying that even if they send me a ticket.


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## akthorp (Jun 16, 2012)

208€ sounds like a lot but I bet the next letter you get it will be doubled- that's what happened to me. I don't how anyone can say they will NEVER go back to Switzerland. I would hate to go through life as an exile from anyplace so I would pay it. But I don't think they can do anything if you don't pay it and you don't return to Switzerland.


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## maxeaus (Jul 8, 2012)

"Foreign Drivers
If the bus has not been paid, or if you do not answer this letter, you risk being interrogated on Swiss soil, to secure recovery of that amount, or for the purpose of identification of the driver in terms of legal consequences. For other commuters, intervention could take place in the workplace. "

Sounds like they will come to your workplace and do a rendition on you or something. :rofl:


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## maxeaus (Jul 8, 2012)

.


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## tarf (Jun 5, 2009)

Here's a previous thread on the issue. I'm not sure that you will find a definitive answer as to what to do. http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=467721


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## The Swede (Feb 20, 2011)

I don't know if the Swiss can collect the fine in America. 

But, EU + Switzerland cooperates when it comes to unpaid fines and taxes. So if you don't pay the fine your name will be on a list of tax/fine dodgers. Then immigration will arrest you when you are trying to enter and not release you until you can pay up (often in cash on place so that you cannot stop the transaction through your bank afterwards). They show no mercy at al. In Europe the policy is strict, you pay your fines and that's that. 

Does that sound like a nice start on your Holliday/business trip? 

Secondly, I met a Canadian guy when I was on exchange in the US. He skipped paying a fine he got the last week in Denmark when he worked there on a gas/oil-project. Some years later he was offered a job at the OPEC headquarter in Vienna, but was denied a working visa because of the fine he hadn't paied to Denmark. Not that nice.


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## AggieKnight (Dec 26, 2008)

I think $260 is a small price to pay for not dealing with current and future ramifications. Today the Swiss may not be able to touch you unless you step on their soil, but that doesn't mean that someday they won't be able to in the future, and I suspect the price would adjust considerably.


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## achopra (Jun 27, 2012)

What I want to know is how does Top Gear get away with driving like maniacs in the Switzerland ?


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## mason (Jun 8, 2006)

First, why a Switzerland ticket in ***8364;? Shouldn't it be in CHF? Second, is it possible that you had entered a different speed limit zone and you didn't know about it?


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## mason (Jun 8, 2006)

achopra said:


> What I want to know is how does Top Gear get away with driving like maniacs in the Switzerland ?


Some places have no camera. In some places, they have the authority to close the road for them to film. Of course, they wouldn't tell you.


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## petriej (Jul 29, 2010)

My German friend says the German in your quote is so bad it couldn't be an official letter. Ignore it I guess?


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## chrischeung (Sep 1, 2002)

Did they include a photo of your car? Are there any other cars or trucks in the photo?


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## DavidF30 (May 1, 2012)

Hi everyone,

Thank you all for your replies.



tarf said:


> Here's a previous thread on the issue. I'm not sure that you will find a definitive answer as to what to do. http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=467721


Thank you, *tarf*. But, like I said, I went through several posts on the forums regarding this and this was one of them. Some of the replies in that thread says that the Swiss could hire a collection agency in the US. Which is why I had posed the question in my post asking:
Can the Swiss hire collection agencies here to retrieve the money without having access to my *SSN*? (All they have access to is my Name, Passport Number, and Address)



mason said:


> First, why a Switzerland ticket in ***8364;? Shouldn't it be in CHF? Second, is it possible that you had entered a different speed limit zone and you didn't know about it?


Thank you, *mason*. The ticket has options to pay in CHF as well as in Euros. As for the speed limit zone, I was travelling well under the general traffic speeds, so no matter what the zone was, I couldn't have gone over the speed limit since almost everyone follows the speed limit, and I was going slower than everyone! 



The Swede said:


> EU + Switzerland cooperates when it comes to unpaid fines and taxes. So if you don't pay the fine your name will be on a list of tax/fine dodgers......Secondly, I met a Canadian guy when I was on exchange in the US. He skipped paying a fine he got the last week in Denmark when he worked there on a gas/oil-project.....Not that nice.





AggieKnight said:


> Today the Swiss may not be able to touch you unless you step on their soil, but that doesn't mean that someday they won't be able to in the future, and I suspect the price would adjust considerably.


Thank you *The Swede* and *AggieKnight*. I understand these risks, but again, like I mentioned in my question 3 (below), I will be having a new passport by the time I visit Europe again .
When I renew my passport (it's happening this December), and get *a new passport number*, and then use it to enter Europe in a couple of years, do the Swiss get notified about it? (FYI, I will not be taking the old passport with me, and I already checked that all new passports get a new passport number that does not have any connection to the old passport number.)



petriej said:


> My German friend says the German in your quote is so bad it couldn't be an official letter. Ignore it I guess?


Thank you, *petriej*. Oh my...really?!?? I was under the impression that the Swiss German was old German and so it sounded weird. But, are you sure in saying that this is not proper grammatical German?? Coz, now I'm thinking that I could be in some kind of a scam!!! uch: Any thoughts on this, guys?



chrischeung said:


> Did they include a photo of your car? Are there any other cars or trucks in the photo?


Thank you, *chrischeung*. No, they haven't included a photo. Should I have gotten one?? If so, this makes me think all the more that this could be a scam!!! :irate:

The part that says about how to pay is as follows (translated):



> Fill out payment form in the post office, CCP 10-10820-7 (please specify number spi/************)
> Payment bank: etat de vaud, gendarmerie Vaudois, Lausanne - IBAN: - CH600 # # # # # # swift: POFICHBEXXX postfinance, à CH-3013 berne, North Ring 8 - ref obligatories SPI # # # # # # #
> radar-office
> 
> ...


I'm thinking of calling them (hoping that they can speak English) and also emailing them in French and German (using Google Translate), just to make sure that this ticket is authentic.

As for my three questions from my first post, any help on those guys? Really looking forward to hearing from you all...

Thank you, all once again, for your time and efforts. I truly appreciate it.


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## petriej (Jul 29, 2010)

I will ask him again with this new detail. I'd hate for you to lose over $200 to a scam. On the other hand, I'd hate for you to be banned from Switzerland for the same.


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## Jon90 (May 28, 2006)

The chance that it's a fake seems awfully, awfully small to me-- but certainly worth checking into, for sure. You could even try that email address: [email protected] and ask for confirmation of some type.

Assuming it -is- real, I'd be firmly in the camp that you should just pay it and get it over with unless you feel certain you'll never drive in Europe again-- and whom amongst us would ever want to think like _that_?!


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## bubear99 (Aug 23, 2011)

I doubt Interpol will come knocking on your door for one speeding ticket. Did the letter arrive via certified mail? If not, how can they prove you received it? I was in Europe three years ago, and received a letter, in German, that might have been a ticket. I can't say for sure because my German is limited to ordering a beer and asking for the toilet. My thought was that if it was important, they should have sent a letter in English. Was I supposed to track down someone to interpret it for me? With all the issues related to terrorism, drug smuggling, human trafficking, etc..., I can't imagine that border agents are tasked with tracking tourists with an outstanding ticket or two.


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## Olin (May 14, 2003)

petriej said:


> My German friend says the German in your quote is so bad it couldn't be an official letter. Ignore it I guess?


Your friend is wrong!  The Swiss have a pretty weird community language and words that no German would use. 
This is not a scam. If you are unsure, just check the address and send them an email so that they can confirm the authenticity of this letter.


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## pharding (Mar 14, 2004)

I would just pay it. The downside of not being able to return to Switzerland is not worth the cost of the fine.


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## SD ///M4 (Jan 24, 2011)

This situation has come up before and has been discussed here before.

One anecdote from a previous discussion was about someone who disregarded a ticket that was received in Switzerland. Some time later he got a job offer in Zurich. When he landed and showed his passport he was denied entry. Despite his offer to pay the fine, he was still denied entry. He had to get an apartment in France and commute to his job. Of course, if he were to get stopped by the Swiss police, he would have been taken to jail immediately.

I can't vouch for the authenticity of this information, but something to keep in mind. Never is a long, long time.


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